My proposed explanation for the great pyramids.

[ANTIQUER]

Hi HairBear;

Is not an alien force already among us?" - Ronald Reagan

This is taken out of context. The alien force is warfare. Here is the paragraph this is taken from;

*Cannot swords be turned to plowshares? Can we and all nations not live in peace? In our obsession with antagonisms of the moment, we often forget how much unites all the members of humanity. Perhaps we need some outside, universal threat to make us recognize this common bond. I occasionally think how quickly our differences worldwide would vanish if we were facing an alien threat from outside this world. And yet, I ask you, is not an alien force already among us? What could be more alien to the universal aspirations of our peoples than war and the threat of war?
o Address to United Nations General Assembly, (1987-09-21)

Ronald Reagan - Wikiquote

Al

[CaptainScat]

Hi HairBear;



This is taken out of context. The alien force is warfare. Here is the paragraph this is taken from;



Ronald Reagan - Wikiquote

Al

LOL al, i think you took hairbear's quote and removed the context...
he originally said this:
"I occasionally think how quickly our differences worldwide would vanish if we were facing an alien threat from outside this world. And yet, I ask. Is not an alien force already among us?" - Ronald Reagan

I occasionally think how quickly our differences worldwide would vanish if we were facing an alien threat from outside this world.
did you miss that part? this sentence is the main point hairbear was making, not the one you chose to quote.

cherry picking is what it's called when you pick and choose the parts that suit your argument...

[Stealth]

Mankind has made great strides in engineering and building of structures all over the world. The Romans and Greeks, both were highly technological advanced in their timeframe. But neither could achieve the degree of accuracy or build an actual pyramid of that scale. We today cnnot set the top blocks on the pyramid, even with the largest cranes in the world. Sure, we have built larger structures using steel and concrete, but not with stones that size. The problems don't just involve lifting the blocks into place, but transportation across the desert sand, floating down the nile,moving across the desert sand again, before reaching their destination. Even with our modern machinery, we can't build one on that scale. We can't set the stones with that precision, and we can't cut the stones with that precision. A major contractor from the US visited the great pyramids at Giza, He studied the cut stones, especially the surcoughagus, and determined that it had been cut at a rate far faster than anything we could attempt using our current saw technology,by the saw marks on the stone. It is truly a mystery.Good Luck. Stealth

[ANTIQUER]

Hi CaptainScat;


1. The fact that he quotes The Book of Enoch as a source in the fashion he did implies that he believes Enoch to be the author as the author of the book or books states. If not he is free to say so.

2. The quote from "Enoch" as posted deals with angels as being real. So does the Bible. That is what the discussion is about, not your personal beliefs, or mine either for that matter.

3. Jesus confirmed their existence in Matt. 22:30 and Mk. 12:25 as spiritual beings. That is considered an authoritative source, not to mention the other verses from biblical sources, all of whom are more credible than the so-called "Book of Enoch" authors.

Learning to read and write has never gotten in the way of learning. What they choose to believe of what they read or hear is the problem.

As much as I and others enjoy these discussions I think we are getting to far afield from the topic of this thread.So if any one wishes to continue in this vein I think they should start a new thread to do so.

Al

[ANTIQUER]

Hi CaptainScat;

cherry picking is what it's called when you pick and choose the parts that suit your argument.

I did not cherry pick anything,I posted his entire quote and the Wiki site where you can check it. It's obvious to anyone who can read that the first two sentences are the subject of his statement; "Cannot swords be turned to plowshares? Can we and all nations not live in peace?". An alien invasion was only an idea that he used as an example of a common cause that would unite the people of Earth resulting in no more war, not that an invasion by ET was coming or that aliens from outer space are among us.

The last sentence makes it clear that the "alien force" is the idea of war between nations which is alien to the wish for peace expressed by most people.

Al

[Schpankme]

Jesus confirmed their existence in Matt. 22:30 and Mk. 12:25 as spiritual beings. That is considered an authoritative source

For, as has been well said, "Faith is not knowledge, no more than that three is four, but eminently contained in it; so that he that knows, believes, and something more; but he that believes many times does not know -- nay, if he doth barely and merely believe, he doth never know." The same critical cleric at another place said: "Still less was it ever intended that men should so prostitute their reason, as to believe with infallible faith what they are unable to prove with infallible arguments." (Chillingworth, Religion of Protestants, pp. 66, 412.)

"What profit has not that fable of Christ brought us!" - Pope Leo X. (December 11, 1475 – December 01, 1521) was Pope from 1513 to his death.

1440, Johannes Gutenberg invents printing press process.
1450, Legal documents indicate that Gutenberg begins printing the Bible. It was in this year that Gutenberg entered into a partnership with Johann Fust who lent him money to finance the production of a Bible.

It is matter of fact, that for some 1600 years of this Era there was but one "True Church" of Christ; and that Church claims with conscious pride the origin and authorship of all the New Testament Books, out of its own Holy bosom, by its own canonized Saints. The New Testament Books are, therefore, distinctively Catholic documents. That Church, therefore, -- if these its credentials and documents are forgeries, -- as from its own records -- itself forged all the Books of the New Testament and all the documents of religious dogma and propaganda, and did itself perpetrate all the pious frauds, and is their chief beneficiary. All the other Christian sects, however, are sprung or severed from the original One True Church; -- "all other forms of the Christian religion . . . originated by secession from the True Church, ... and their founders ... were externally members of the Church." (CE. vii, 367.)

All these Protestant sects, therefore, with full knowledge of the guilty facts and partakers in the frauds, found their claim to Divinity -- and priestly emoluments -- upon and through those tainted titles, and thus yet fully share the guilt as accomplices after the fact. The "Reformed" Sects, on breaking away from the old Monopoly of Forgery, appropriated the least clumsy and more plausible of the pious Counterfeit of Christianity, and for the centuries since have industriously and knowingly been engaged in passing the stolen counterfeit upon their own unsuspecting flocks; they are therefore equally guilty with the original Forgers of the Faith. - Joseph Wheless

- Schpankme

[sucahyo]

Can anyone here post the quote from Bible which mention Egypt? What is the nationality of messenger like Moses, Solomon, Jesus, etc. Do they talk with ancient egypt language? Do they ever have war with ancient egypt etc.

If ayone has book link on King Solomon technology or sound/song I would really appreciate it. But I believe that King Solomon do not write magic books.

[ANTIQUER]

Hi Stealth;

Largest tower crane in the World - 100 tons at 100 meter radius

Still think we couldn't do it?
Two of these placed on opposite sides of the base would lift the heavier stones into place. Then helicopters could easily lift the smaller stones used above 200 ft. and place them. Stepped scaffolding would allow workmen space to stand and work. The casing stones would be applied from the top down as the Egyptians did it.

To quarry the sarcophagus is not that difficult. Nowadays they use wire blades with carbide or diamond coatings which are hundreds of feet long. They leave practically no marks to grind out. The core would be removed in much the same manner as the Egyptians did it, but using modern drills. This is done on the quarry site before removing it, to cut down on the weight. Then transport it to the site you wish to grind and polish it, again using modern grinders and polishers.

The only real problems are the money and the will to do it. Cheops and Khufu did not have those problems, or OSHA looking over their shoulder accompanied by a bevy of lawyers looking for workman comp. claims. etc. etc.

Any expert who says this can't be done today simply means no one is set up to do it on a production basis and has no incentive to do so as there is no other use for the tech. and it would be too expensive for them to set up for one-time use. But it can be done.

If we can put men in space, build the Verrazzano Narrows suspension bridge in N.Y., the Hoover dam, the huge dam complex in Holland, etc., we can certainly build a tall pile of tight-fitting rocks.

Al

[ANTIQUER]

Schpankme;

As I said to CaptainScat this is not the thread to discuss matters relating to faith or personal belief in that area. Start another thread or revive an older one such as "Bible" and I will gladly discuss it with you or anyone.

Al

[CaptainScat]

Hi CaptainScat;


1. The fact that he quotes The Book of Enoch as a source in the fashion he did implies that he believes Enoch to be the author as the author of the book or books states. If not he is free to say so.

2. The quote from "Enoch" as posted deals with angels as being real. So does the Bible. That is what the discussion is about, not your personal beliefs, or mine either for that matter.

3. Jesus confirmed their existence in Matt. 22:30 and Mk. 12:25 as spiritual beings. That is considered an authoritative source, not to mention the other verses from biblical sources, all of whom are more credible than the so-called "Book of Enoch" authors.

Learning to read and write has never gotten in the way of learning. What they choose to believe of what they read or hear is the problem.

As much as I and others enjoy these discussions I think we are getting to far afield from the topic of this thread.So if any one wishes to continue in this vein I think they should start a new thread to do so.

Al

1. i think you are misunderstanding his beliefs. i read hair's post and nowhere did it give me the idea that he believed enoch was the author. why didn't you just ask him?

2. the book of enoch is a literary device, just like the bible, nothing more.

3. jesus is not an authoritative source except to those that believe in him. the bible is not an authoritative source. it is a literary device. you can't prove with any veracity that jesus ever existed...

i agree, what jesus or the bible claims about fantastical creatures has no bearing on the pyramids, which is why i am refuting that whole idea.

[ANTIQUER]

Hi sucahyo;

Can anyone here post the quote from Bible which mention Egypt? What is the nationality of messenger like Moses, Solomon, Jesus, etc. Do they talk with ancient egypt language? Do they ever have war with ancient egypt etc.

Gen. 2:6-10

And there went a man of the house of Levi, and took to wife a daughter of Levi. 2 And the woman conceived , and bare a son: and when she saw him that he was a goodly child, she hid him three months. 3 And when she could not longer hide him, she took for him an ark of bulrushes, and daubed it with slime and with pitch, and put the child therein; and she laid it in the flags by the river's brink. 4 And his sister stood afar off, to wit what would be done to him. 5 And the daughter of Pharaoh came down to wash herself at the river; and her maidens walked along by the river's side; and when she saw the ark among the flags, she sent her maid to fetch it. 6 And when she had opened it, she saw the child: and, behold, the babe wept . And she had compassion on him, and said , This is one of the Hebrews' children. 7 Then said his sister to Pharaoh's daughter, Shall I go and call to thee a nurse of the Hebrew women, that she may nurse the child for thee? 8 And Pharaoh's daughter said to her, Go . And the maid went and called the child's mother. 9 And Pharaoh's daughter said unto her, Take this child away , and nurse it for me, and I will give thee thy wages. And the woman took the child, and nursed it. 10 And the child grew , and she brought him unto Pharaoh's daughter, and he became her son. And she called his name Moses;

Vs. 11

And it came to pass in those days, when Moses was grown , that he went out unto his brethren, and looked on their burdens: and he spied an Egyptian smiting an Hebrew, one of his brethren.

So Moses was a Hebrew, as were Solomon and Jesus, who was also a descent of David. Their descendants are the modern day Israelis.

Ex. 5:1

And afterward Moses and Aaron went in , and told Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Let my people go , that they may hold a feast unto me in the wilderness. 2 And Pharaoh said , Who is the LORD, that I should obey his voice to let Israel go ? I know not the LORD, neither will I let Israel go . 3 And they said , The God of the Hebrews hath met with us: let us go , we pray thee, three days' journey into the desert, and sacrifice unto the LORD our God; lest he fall upon us with pestilence, or with the sword. 4 And the king of Egypt said unto them, Wherefore do ye, Moses and Aaron, let the people from their works? get you unto your burdens. 5 And Pharaoh said ,...

There are more conversations between Moses, Aaron and Pharaoh and mentions of Egypt through chapter 14. You can read them here:

Exodus 5 "And afterward Moses and Aaron went in ,..." KJV - Online Bible Study

6 For the Lord had made the host of the Syrians to hear a noise of chariots, and a noise of horses, even the noise of a great host: and they said one to another, Lo, the king of Israel hath hired against us the kings of the Hittites, and the kings of the Egyptians, to come upon us.

Jer. 46:25

25 The LORD of hosts, the God of Israel, saith ; Behold, I will punish the multitude of No, and Pharaoh, and Egypt, with their gods, and their kings; even Pharaoh, and all them that trust in him: 26 And I will deliver them into the hand of those that seek their lives,

Eze. 32:31-32

Pharaoh shall see them, and shall be comforted over all his multitude, even Pharaoh and all his army slain by the sword, saith the Lord GOD. 32 For I have caused my terror in the land of the living: and he shall be laid in the midst of the uncircumcised with them that are slain with the sword, even Pharaoh and all his multitude, saith the Lord GOD.

These are just a sample,there are hundreds more. You can find them by looking in Strong's Exhaustive Concordance under applicable words like Egypt, Pharaoh, Kings, etc.

Read Bible Concordances Online

Some are harder to find as they just mention a battle but only name an Egyptian or ally in the battle, not the pharaoh involved. There are also Egyptian steles which mention their battles with Hebrews like this one;

Merneptah Stele - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

At least one more has been found recently that mentions the Egyptians long-time enemy, the House of David.

But I believe that King Solomon do not write magic books.

Sorry,I'm not sure what you mean here; "magic books"?

Al

[CaptainScat]

Schpankme;

As I said to CaptainScat this is not the thread to discuss matters relating to faith or personal belief in that area. Start another thread or revive an older one such as "Bible" and I will gladly discuss it with you or anyone.

Al

that's interesting, you quote jesus and the bible as factual and authoritative, and when someone post quotes from others that logically disagree with that you want them to start a new thread? i think you shouldn't quote jesus or the bible as an authoritative source if you don't want to discuss your faith or beliefs...

and regarding your 100 ton crane, expain how the trilithon at baalbek was put into place then? each one is 70 feet long, 14 feet high, 10 feet thick, and weigh around 800 tons, and what of the 1200 ton stone that is still left in the quarry. how did they move those stones from the quarry over the mountain to the building site at baalbek? with a 100 ton crane?

Baalbek Stone of the Pregnant Woman: Unbelievably Massive Stone in the Quarry Near Baalbek, Lebanon

[HairBear]

Al, do you really believe humans are the only self conscious entities to walk this planet let alone the universe? Your writings reek of ego with a tinge of doubt. I find it strange that a man can have faith in a higher power without ever seeing it, but, yet discount all other possibilities with little thought. You say this thread is not about religion or faith and at the same time using it as an argumentative basis.

Can you confirm Jesus' confirmation. Can you in any way confirm Jesus was a real person? It seems that just before Jesus there was another god known as Mithras (or Mithra). Mithras, oddly enough, has the same birthdate as Jesus, but some 600 years earlier! Not only that, but he was also born of a virgin, with a few shepherds present. Mithras, a traveling teacher and master, had 12 disciples as he performed miracles. Just like Jesus, Mithras was buried in a tomb, died, and after three days was resurrected and rose again!

Before Mithras there was Krishna in India, circa 1200 BC. Krishna was born of the Virgin Mother Devaki after being visited by spirits to announce the impending birth of an immaculately conceived child who is God’s Sun and the “son of God.” His birth was attended by wise men, as well as shepherds. Krishna was presented at birth with frankincense, myrrh, and gold. Krishna worked miracles, restored sight, cast out devils, and raised the dead.

Horus goes back to Egypt circa 3000 BC. Horus was born of the virgin Isis-Meri on December 25 in a cave/manger with his birth being announced by a star in the East and attended by three wise men. In the catacombs at Rome are pictures of the baby Horus being held by the virgin mother Isis. Horus taught in the temple when he was a child. He was baptized when he was 30 years old by “Anup the Baptizer.” Horus performed miracles and raised a man named El-Azar-us, from the dead. Not only did Horus walk on water, he was also crucified, buried in a tomb, and then resurrected.

More? Attis, Adonis, Nimrod, the list goes on... Is it we never learn from our own past, or is ignorance truly bliss?

[CaptainScat]

speaking of nimrod... according to legend, the temple of jupiter baal whose base contains the trilithon, was rebuilt (it was destroyed by the great deluge) by a race of giants under the direction of nimrod, son of ham and grandson of noah. the giants cut and transported the massive stones in the trilithon

[ANTIQUER]

Hi Schpankme;

Was the Great Pyramid, then erected before the invention of hieroglyphics, and previous to the birth of the Egyptian religion? Time may yet prove that the upper chambers of the Pyramid were a sealed mystery before the establishment of the Egyptian empire. In the light if the secret philosophy of the Egyptian initiates, W.W. Harmon, by a series of extremely complicated yet exact mathematical calculations; determines that the first ceremonial of the Pyramid was performed 68,973 years ago on the occasion when the star Vega for the first time sent its ray down the descending passage into the pit. The actual building of the Pyramid was accomplished in the period of from ten to fifteen years immediately preceding this date.

I don't know who W.W. Harmon is and can find no mention of him, but that is the most ridiculous theory I have yet seen. How can anyone believe that any building would survive for almost 70,000 years? And who was performing the "ritual ceremonies"?

These are the significant earthquakes in the area that we know of in just the last 1200 years.

Date Assoc Addl
EQ
Info Earthquake Location Earthquake Parameters Earthquake Effects Photos
Focal
Depth Mag MMI Int Deaths Injuries Damage Houses
Destroyed Houses
Damaged
Year Mo Dy Hr Mn Sec Tsu Vol Name Latitude Longitude Num De Num De $Mill De Num De Num De
885 11 27 * EGYPT: AL-QAHIRAH (CAIRO) 30.000 31.100 10 1000 3 3 3 3
1070 2 25 * EGYPT: AL-QAHIRAH (CAIRO); ISRAEL: JERUSALEM 30.000 31.100 2
1211 6 15 * EGYPT: AL-QAHIRAH (CAIRO) 30.500 31.300 3
1303 8 8 Tsu * EGYPT: LIBYAN SEA 30.000 31.000 9 3 3 3 3
1754 9 2 * EGYPT: AL-QAHIRAH (CAIRO) 30.800 31.000 40000 4 3
1847 8 7 * EGYPT: AL-FAYYUM, CAIRO 29.500 30.500 11 185 3 4 4 4072 4 4072 4
1879 7 11 18 Tsu * EGYPT: GULF OF SUEZ 29.000 33.000 5.9
1992 10 12 13 9 55.5 * EGYPT: CAIRO 29.778 31.144 22 5.3 545 3 6512 4 1200.000 4 9350 4 9350 4
2002 8 24 20 1 18.3 * EGYPT: CAIRO

Significant Earthquake

I believe it was the one in 1303 a.d. that shook the Great Pyramid so hard it loosened the casing stones and cracked some core stones, as revealed by the 1992 Upuaut robot. No way could it survive natural forces for 70,000 years, especially in an earthquake zone.
The Giza Plateau may even have been underwater then as the pyramids and the Sphinx are built on an old sea bed.

Al