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  • Originally posted by sucahyo View Post
    I see. Thanks.

    How about electricity that do not heat up my battery vs the one that do heat it up. Is that the same electricity with different property or the one that do not heat the battery up is not electricity?




    BTW, I think there is missunderstanding about the heating nichrome, I was meant to say:
    Can you try to put the nichrome wire in the oven or burn it to red, cool it down and then see if it still attracted to magnet?

    I ask because I once has a couple of nickel bolt that attracted to magnet that will no longer did after I burn them.
    Ah, now I understand your question regarding the Nichrome. From what I recall, tempered Nickle loses it's permeability. Special annealing processes are used to produce alloys like HY-Mu-80. This Chart shows how the temperature of the material during the annealing affects the permeability of the material. While you probably did not get anywhere near those temperatures, it is still possible that your bolts cooled much too quickly and now the domains are polycrystalline. This could be bad also if you intend to use your bolts for stress applications as they are probably more like glass now rather than elastic metal - harder to shear and bend, but more brittle.

    Annealed materials are much more lined up in flexible layers. This is important if you want a soft magnetic material to be responsive to H fields.

    As regards the strange heating you have witnessed. I have a personal theory that Bedini's chargers interact with a little known particle I call a positrino. The positrino is exactly like a neutrino in every aspect except it has a positive charge. They are smaller than an electron. In my theory, these entrapped particles orbit the electrons as they orbit the nucleus the way the Moon orbits the Earth as the Earth orbits the Sun. In a balanced matrix of copper wire coils or the lead plates, the normal material will be heavier by that amount if I am correct. These positrinos can create odd charge flow characteristics and can even cause a battery to not charge properly and cause wires to exhibit strange impedance to current flow. But if they are slapped around by large magnetic interference, the positrinos can be caused to collide with the electron which alters its energy level and releases an IR photon. It is just a hunch, but I think it may explain why Bedini's chargers have what is said to be a negative electricity - because they liberate the positrinos in a way that they become a reverse charge flow. I also have another theory that states that the vacuum will give up electrons to balance an electromagnetic equation that demands them. I have even published a test to prove that theory, but no one has taken me up on it - it's a simple test which I have published on multiple forums and shared with certain research personnel, but it is very fringe science and I am waiting for our lab to get finished before I do the test.

    Apart from those two non-classical explanations, there is a classical explanation for your heat. Your battery material may be polarized and have a higher resistance in one direction as compared to the other. Also, your charge current may be less than your discharge current for a given time interval. Or your time interval may have a greater duty cycle during the discharge cycle. I think there is a battery thread with good information regarding the thermodynamics of the lead acid batteries - did you start that thread?

    "Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The Doctor

    Comment


    • Thanks for the explanation .


      I still not sure what actually make the cold electricity, some say it trasmit outside the wire, yet it still obey diode and capacitor. Some say it require attention to geometry, and yet I still get it with my chaotic implementation.

      The unique feature of radiant charger is it produce stable power. If the load have high resistance, the current flow is low. If the load have low resistance, the current flow is high.

      On some circuit the input current do not have relation with output current. Most circuit consume more on heavier load, others consume less on heavier load.

      It seems to require sharp signal, but never without current.

      Yes I start lead acid thread, but still don't understand cold charging. This is cold electrolysis too...

      Comment


      • Cold Electricity

        Hi Sucahyo,

        Here is a PDF on the subject of Cold Electricity which you may have read already, but I put it up again:

        http://www.intalek.com/Index/Project...lectricity.pdf

        As we have shown in this thread electric current is a movement of electric charges from one place to another and we know from experiments that this does not have to be confined to conductors but can be represented by the actions as small as single electrons or as large or larger than solar winds.

        When using electrical potential to do work in electronic or electromagnetic devices we are well familiar with the conversion of that electric potential to heat (often associated with IR Radiant Energy) where the work is performed by resistive means. But this does not always have to be the case. The only reason that thermal energy is produced in these systems is because the conversion from one form of energy to the other is not efficient and the Conservation of Energy demands that the excess be dissipated by some means.

        What is 'cold'? It is a relative term. If we were to deal with absolutes, like this chart shows, we would quickly find that 'cold' is another way of saying 'not hot'. In crystal growth we call the solidification of the liquid 'freezing' but if you touched that solid at it's freeze temperature, it would melt the skin off of your bones . So when we speak of 'cold electricity' we are relating it to what we consider cold relative to our environment. If 300K is considered normal room temperature for many applications, then hotter would be above 300K and colder would be below 300K.

        If the circuit material is at room temperature and under normal electrical use a resistor increases in temperature as voltage is dropped across it, then we consider this normal in conventional terms. But if for some reason the resistor drops in temperature then we would recognize this as abnormal. Electrical currents that produce this abnormal effect are considered to be 'Cold Electricity'. The action is related to the thermoelectric effect which often is referenced as Thomson Effect, Seebeck Effect and Peltier Effect.

        In reality, these effects are just variants of photoelectric reactions where electromagnetic energy is exchanged for electric energy at the atomic level. When the conditions support the absorption of IR or even a material conversion of molecular kinetic energy to more conductive state (like ionized plasma) the temperature of the material can drop while the electrical current is increased. This can lead to conditions where the conductive medium is colder than room temperature as a result of the applied electrical potential. Such is the case with Peltier Cells which are very common now in fan-less computer cooling systems.

        It is beyond the scope of this post to delve into the subatomic interactions between current flow and potential energy exchange that allow some forms of electricity to heat up the material while other forms cool it down. But it is sufficient to state that these different forms are recognized by science and even exploited where beneficial.

        "Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The Doctor

        Comment


        • Thanks. I don't think I can conclude anything from the document lol.

          Do it explain why same charging current that flow to the same wire can be made different only by switching it different way?

          300mA charging and heat up vs 300mA charging and no heat. Same coil, same transistor, same source. And the only difference is the controlling circuitry.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by sucahyo View Post
            Thanks. I don't think I can conclude anything from the document lol.

            Do it explain why same charging current that flow to the same wire can be made different only by switching it different way?

            300mA charging and heat up vs 300mA charging and no heat. Same coil, same transistor, same source. And the only difference is the controlling circuitry.
            I don't have time at the moment to properly address this - but I will do my best to come back to it.

            For now, I think you will relate well to something you work with everyday - networking. Power over Ethernet (PoE) systems make use of the Superposition Theorem in separating currents of different types.

            Also, spend a little time researching why higher frequency components are smaller in size for the same power relationships. There is a very sound reason that Tesla chose 60Hz instead of 50Hz and it is tied more to natural resources than to Schumann phasing.

            The answer to your question is contained in those to things working together.

            Cheers,

            "Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The Doctor

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Harvey View Post
              The answer to your question is contained in those to things working together.
              Thank you, but my question relate to what cause the difference of output. Both use coil collpase current to charge. Both circuit work at any range of frequency, maybe at any duty cycle too, and yet one hot charging and other cold charging.

              Coil collapse current charging can produce hot charging and cold charging. I think the difference is the key everyone after...

              Comment


              • Originally posted by sucahyo View Post
                Thank you, but my question relate to what cause the difference of output. Both use coil collpase current to charge. Both circuit work at any range of frequency, maybe at any duty cycle too, and yet one hot charging and other cold charging.

                Coil collapse current charging can produce hot charging and cold charging. I think the difference is the key everyone after...
                Sorry I did not get back here - I did forget this thread for a while

                Without all of the specifics regarding your application I could only give general causes for your events but I assure you these events or within the framework of known science.

                There are several factors that do come to mind that may be related to your results:

                Joule Heating

                Flux Walking (See pg. 4-6)

                Capacitor Power Dissipation (See Equation Six)

                Dielectric Heating

                dI/dt and Transconductance

                and just about any factor of voltage, current or frequency that can result in a variable resistance in the materials conducting or inducting the energy involved.

                So while it may seem strange to some that a sine wave passing through a MOSFET at the same current produces way more heat in the device compared to a square wave, it really is expected because of how the resistance (or conductance) of the device behaves in linear modes.

                Consider that the electrolytes in batteries can behave in similar ways. There is a firm reason why car batteries have ratings with "Cold" Cranking Amps.

                So it stands to reason the inverse is true as well.

                Hope this helps
                "Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The Doctor

                Comment


                • Thank you. Thanks for the link too.

                  Unfortunately the document do not explain why 400mA out of radiant oscillator do not heat up battery and yet 400mA out of DC charger heat the battery considerably. My radiant circuit use FWBR, and I suspect the output should be closer to stable DC then pulsed DC because after the spike passing by the conventional DC stepped in.

                  I just remembered my experiment that putting capacitor in parallel with charged battery will change cold charging to hot charging even with less charging current. reconfirm this again just now. The equation 5 describe capacitor dissipation and yet I observe heat at the battery instead?


                  Is there dielectric cooling?


                  BTW, is it normal for 1.5Amp current to melt the coil enamel while at the same time charging a battery?


                  In Radiant circuit an increase of input current may increase both output voltage and output current.





                  How do you measure COP of an SLA? case:
                  YouTube - 2 minutes charging for 3 minutes of power
                  Last edited by sucahyo; 05-21-2010, 09:50 AM.

                  Comment


                  • I am looking further on Electro static, and some things i wonder about.
                    When you touch a surface what is electric charged like a Screen, isnt it like,
                    that you 'destroy' a grid at this place, when you decharge it?
                    Like, it had build up a crystalline Structur around or above the surface, or at both Sides, just at one side inverted?

                    Inverted, because, when you look at a Generator or a half Sine Wave, there is a Mountain and a Hole at one Wave.
                    So actually, when a Magnet pass a Coil, only one Pole creates a Montain, or a Push, and the other the Hole.

                    Further, when you charge a thick Wire Coil with 12V certain amount of pulsed Current, ie, 12v 10mA
                    you will get lower Spikes from it, as with a Coil with thin wire.
                    Even when you would have more Material at the thicker Coil.
                    It seems like, as if you trow a certain Amount of Energy into the Coil, and it takes a certain Time, till the a) Energy is sproaded from one end to the other End of the Coil and the coil is evenly saturated,
                    b) the Coil did create the EM Field around, like the Electrostatic field, but its actually a new created crystalline Grid, what is around the Wire,
                    but at overview from all this little Magnets, it forms to a new big Magnet near the Wire.

                    Therfor Jbignes5 maybe has a Point with his Crystal Theorie,
                    but it looks more like, it is for the magentic Event what runs in this Structure and with this pattern,
                    but not for the Source of Potential Movement.


                    Btw, where do you think you have the Peak from a Coil, when a Magnet moves inside.
                    When the Poles from the Magnet are even to the Coil or when the Poles are across the Wire, 90°. || or -|.
                    I know it allready
                    Last edited by Joit; 06-27-2010, 08:07 PM.
                    Theorizer are like High Voltage. A lot hot Air with no Power behind but they are the dead of applied Work and Ideas.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Joit View Post
                      I am looking further on Electro static, and some things i wonder about.
                      When you touch a surface what is electric charged like a Screen, isnt it like,
                      that you 'destroy' a grid at this place, when you decharge it?
                      Like, it had build up a crystalline Structur around or above the surface, or at both Sides, just at one side inverted?

                      Inverted, because, when you look at a Generator or a half Sine Wave, there is a Mountain and a Hole at one Wave.
                      So actually, when a Magnet pass a Coil, only one Pole creates a Montain, or a Push, and the other the Hole.

                      Further, when you charge a thick Wire Coil with 12V certain amount of pulsed Current, ie, 12v 10mA
                      you will get lower Spikes from it, as with a Coil with thin wire.
                      Even when you would have more Material at the thicker Coil.
                      It seems like, as if you trow a certain Amount of Energy into the Coil, and it takes a certain Time, till the a) Energy is sproaded from one end to the other End of the Coil and the coil is evenly saturated,
                      b) the Coil did create the EM Field around, like the Electrostatic field, but its actually a new created crystalline Grid, what is around the Wire,
                      but at overview from all this little Magnets, it forms to a new big Magnet near the Wire.

                      Therfor Jbignes5 maybe has a Point with his Crystal Theorie,
                      but it looks more like, it is for the magentic Event what runs in this Structure and with this pattern,
                      but not for the Source of Potential Movement.


                      Btw, where do you think you have the Peak from a Coil, when a Magnet moves inside.
                      When the Poles from the Magnet are even to the Coil or when the Poles are across the Wire, 90°. || or -|.
                      I know it allready

                      Hi Joit,

                      Thanks for the post - sorry for the delay in response, things have been a bit busy in other respects.

                      Let us take your example of a grid charged to a certain voltage. The entire grid equally distributes the charge over its surface and if it is shaped as a sphere, all of the charge will be outside. The surface normals of the electric will all be pointing 90° perpendicular to the the grid at all locations. So if the grid was made of round wire for example, the field will point away from the surface of any of the wires 360° around the wire, like from the center of wire outward (for positive charge) everywhere. So the entire grid is a single charge.

                      Now you, having a different charge voltage, touch the grid and the charge of the grid rushes to equalize over the new conductive surface it has come in contact with. So current flows while the charges are being distributed. Once everything is balanced, charges stop moving and current drops to zero. So nothing is really inverted or destroyed, only distributed over a different area which changes the density and that in turn changes the voltage. So, if your grid was charged with 100 Coulombs and measured 100V to ground and then you touch it knowing that your body is zero volts charged relative to ground, then after touching it you measure the grid and it is only 50V, then you know that 1/2 the charge was transferred to your body. Since 1 Coulomb = 1F * 1V, the grid must be 1 Farad. So you know my example is not real but only for an exaggerated example easy to view otherwise it would suggest that some person could have a 1F skin capacity

                      So what about an inverted sine wave? It is reference dependent. If your sine wave was all negative voltage, peak to peak -1V to -11V then it has a 10V difference between peaks, but they are all negative. The same if they are positive 1V to 11V, then you still have a 10V difference but it is all positive. But if we put our reference in the center, so that peak to peak it is 5V to -5V, then we still have a 10V difference, but the power is alternating positive and negative. So it only matters where we put our reference, which way the current flows. In the first example, it is a little to a lot backwards current cycling up and down, in the second example it is a little to a lot forward current cycling up and down, and in the last example, it is a continuous forward and backward current (alternating current i.e. AC). So the point is, unless we are discussing absolute charge, the reference is arbitrary. It is like hills and valleys on top of a mountain range verses hills and valleys in the bottom of the ocean, or hills above water and valleys below water.

                      Now when a single magnet pole (imagine the end of a 40 foot magnet) passes a coil, the voltage increases when it gets closer because the magnetic field density increases the closer it gets. But, just as the pole gets as close as it can the voltage rapidly drops to zero, then as the magnet begins to move away from the coil, because the density is very high, the voltage flips to a high peak in the opposite direction which becomes less and less the farther it moves away. So a single pole produces a dual polarity wave because we move toward and away from the coil. Now, the polarity of the magnet determines what polarity the voltage will be as it approaches and retreats from the coil. So if you turn that 40 foot magnet around and repeat the exact same test, the voltages will be reversed, but will still be dual polarity.

                      Next you mention dissipating 120mw of power in a thick wire compared to a thin wire. And you mention that your test show bigger spikes from the thinner wire. There are many variables here that would need to be checked like inductance, frequency and resistance before we could discuss this part. But, since the power is the same, then the current must be the same and this means the impedance is the same. But we could be trading resistance for inductive reactance and it is the inductance that plays the bigger role in the BEMF spikes (if that is the spike you were referring to).

                      Regarding your last question regarding the EMF produced in a coil and the orientation of the magnet we have the following formula to consider:



                      This states that magnetic flux = Magnetic Vector B times the Coil Loop Area times the Cosine of the angle between the Coil Loop's 'surface normal' and the Magnetic Vector B.

                      That is step one,

                      Then we use Φm to become ΦB in this formula:


                      Which states that the EMF = Number of Coil Turns Times the change in magnetic flux divided by the change in time.

                      So what does this mean then? As the angle of the magnet changes, the closer to 90° to the coil's surface normal, the closer the factor gets to zero because cosine (90) = 0. So, if you have a coil and a magnet, align the B of the magnet so it would go into the center of the coil (parallel) and that would be 0° for maximum flux. Turn the magnet perpendicular to the coil and that would be 90° for no flux.

                      See Faraday's law of induction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia for more information on this.

                      I have not read JBignes5 Crystal Theory so I cannot comment on it.

                      I hope I answered your questions
                      "Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The Doctor

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Harvey View Post
                        Hi Joit,

                        Thanks for the post - sorry for the delay in response, things have been a bit busy in other respects.
                        Ack i hate it when it happens, but my PC turned off, as i had 3/4 from the Answer,
                        but short again,
                        Well Np, when it takes a while, i dont have the Time also all time.
                        Here is the Post from Jbignes5
                        I agree that the Charge, or Static field at a surface will build up like a Sphere
                        But anyhow it looks like, this pattern, what are build there are made with interaction with the Enviroment, or from the Current,what runs through the Coil, or both.
                        Interesting, that Glass seems to hold the charge better then other Metals.
                        At the German page is another Picture from the Crystals, what are Tetraeder.
                        Well Aluminum can hold the charge for a while also, but its not so obviously.
                        What i remeber, when i touch a charged glass surface,
                        then it leaves a empty place, it is not like a fluid, what fills up the areas,
                        and its like a Structure, what release 'Potential' when you destroy it.

                        For the Magnet, i may did draw it a bit wrong, as i wrote, when the Magnet turns inside the Coil.
                        |-| or |I|.
                        It is right, when you pass a Magnet beside at top or bottom from the Coil,
                        that it has the Peak at the Moment, when the Magnet is in the Middle.
                        But when the Magnet is at the Middle from the Coil inside, then the Peak is, when the Poles are 90° to the Coil.
                        Assume, you connect at bottom from a Coil Minus and at top from the Coil Plus with a Diode,
                        then you will have a positive Potential or flow when the Magnet is ie. with the N pole left Side,
                        and a negative, when the N Pole is at the Right side.
                        The lowest peak will be, when the Poles face to the End of the Coil.

                        Its is different to that, what the Books show you, that you need to move the Magnet trough the Coil, even when it is there 'only an Example'.
                        So it actually shows, you have at one Pole a negative Potential like a drag or the inner side of a cup
                        and at the other Side a positive 'Push'. A rectifier is in that Way kinda of a Switch, what only catch the Push side.
                        But the other Side from the Magnet, the Drag, or cap-inside is also needed,
                        to fill the circulation again. But mainly only one Pole pushes, and one only receive.
                        Reminds very much at a Pump, just need the Ways to optimize it.

                        Sorry, that this is now more short, what i had, but i dont wanna start over
                        Theorizer are like High Voltage. A lot hot Air with no Power behind but they are the dead of applied Work and Ideas.

                        Comment


                        • HI.

                          There is one truth in physics and that is that it is essentially simple. I have found that the more 'obtuse' a presentation becomes, the more flawed it is. These threads are read by contributors who 'grapple' with concepts of physics - first assuming that it is complex. It is NOT. I think one should limit one's observations to facts. And it is possibly harmful to misrepresent physics at all. Nowhere in or out of mainstream - is there any evidence that a neutron could 'absorb' an electron.

                          Power Plant Developers
                          Power Plant Developers

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Angelinabv View Post
                            HI.

                            There is one truth in physics and that is that it is essentially simple. I have found that the more 'obtuse' a presentation becomes, the more flawed it is. These threads are read by contributors who 'grapple' with concepts of physics - first assuming that it is complex. It is NOT. I think one should limit one's observations to facts. And it is possibly harmful to misrepresent physics at all. Nowhere in or out of mainstream - is there any evidence that a neutron could 'absorb' an electron. . .

                            I'm not sure where you thought you read anything here that alluded to a neutron absorbing an electron but there is some discussion here regarding Protons capturing electrons.

                            When a Proton captures and Electron the electrical charges cancel out and impact energy releases a Neutrino. What is left behind is an electrically neutral particle we call a Neutron.

                            See Electron capture - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia for more information.

                            Cheers,

                            Last edited by Harvey; 07-02-2010, 12:01 AM.
                            "Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The Doctor

                            Comment


                            • Hi Joit,

                              I'm not sure where the discussion is heading with regards to crystals but I have always been fascinated with Carbon's ability to form so many structures with so many properties just by changing the temperature and pressure associated with the crystal growth process.

                              Here is a short link to one of the structures (A4) of transparent carbon:
                              The Diamond (A4) Crystal Structure

                              I have enjoyed the topic of crystallization my whole life but was especially exposed to it when employed by Crystal Specialties Inc. When I worked there, I had many conversations with the lead Scientist and I actually learned quite a bit from him. The company moved and was later sold and he later went to work at a University Research facility but I recall our conversations fondly.

                              It was at the facility in Monrovia that I had my first experience of seeing energy and matter transformations which to this day I don't know precisely what was happening. I was experimenting with a hydrogen gas flame and pure quartz crystal delivered to us from Coors in Colorado. I found that if I heated the quartz to a certain point, it would begin to get small crystalline bubble formations on the surface. I began moving the flame around in a figure eight formation to help regulate the temperature at just that value so as to maximize the bubble effect. To my surprise, the bubbles began to grow on top of the bubbles and I was able to build up a string of them about an inch long, well disassociated from the surface of the quartz. I concluded that the quartz had provided some type of crystalline seed structure for the hydrocarbons of the flame to grow off of, so they were like macro sized Buckey Balls but they were not completely spherical, instead they were like half spheres sitting on top of other half spheres of different radii. The light refraction of the growth reminded me of Opal and was surprisingly durable.

                              I was trying to learn to weld glass so I could be of help on the Indium Phosphide project and the event was nothing more than a curiosity to me. At that time I was certain that the world already had the answers to such things I was only in need of learning what the others had discovered so I dismissed the event expecting that if there was any importance to it that it would have been revealed by others better educated than I.

                              Now . . . about the electrical current

                              When a conductor experiences a change in magnetic flux, that change results in a voltage in the conductor.

                              If the conductor is a closed loop, then that voltage will cause a current to flow through the loop.

                              The angle at which the B vector intersects the loop area determines the flux. If the plane that the loop lays in is parallel with the plane that the B vector lays in, the flux will be zero. The surface normal of the loop is orthogonal to the plane that the loop lays in. The angle theta in my previous post, relates the B vector to the surface normal which is 90° orthogonal to the loop plane.

                              So,
                              Loop Plane parallel to B vector = zero flux
                              Loop Surface Normal 90° to B vector = zero flux

                              Both of those are saying the same thing - they represent the same configuration described in two different ways.

                              Let's say you draw a circle on the ground, and in the middle of this circle you plant corn. The circle is the loop, the surface of the ground is the plane the loop lays in and the corn is growing normal to that surface. If your magnetic field is horizontal (90° to the corn) then you have zero flux. Only when the magnetic field is vertical does it penetrate the surface and this is the definition of flux i.e. the density penetrating a surface. So, if you lay some wire in the circle and you stand in the middle of the corn field with your magnet on your head pointing at the sky, then the other pole is pointing at the earth and if you jump up and down a current will flow in the wire. But if you turn the magnet sideways pointing at the horizons and you jump up and down, no current will flow in the wire. Why jump? Because the magnetic flux is less the farther from the magnet and jumping up and down moves the magnet up and down and gives a change in flux at the loop when the magnet is vertical, or parallel with the corn i.e. Theta = 0°.

                              But wait, there is another way! You can put the magnet on your head pointing to the sky and the ground, and you can run from your house to the barn because the corn field is in between. And now as you get near the loop, it sees flux approaching and getting more dense, increasing, so there is a change in flux and thus a current flows. Ah . . . but something happens when you reach the center of the circle, now the flux is maximum density but now it is decreasing as you pass through the center. And this causes a flip in the current and it starts flowing the other direction as you leave the loop and run to the barn.

                              Now, you get to thinking and you say hey, there is a well in the middle of my corn field and so you attach a magnet to the wind mill so that it moves up and down in the well - above the surface and below and you get some current there from the wind.

                              Then you say hey, wait, my wind mill has at least 20 blades, why not attach a magnet to each one and as each passes the wire it will make current more frequently. This works ok too.

                              And then you say to yourself; 'that magnetic field reaches out some distance I'll put a stack of loops there and then get more current, a little from each loop. And then you wonder . . . what if I take the end of one loop and attach it to the next and now you have many windings of a coil and the current is the same in all, but the voltage stacks up.

                              Now the thing about the B vector of the permanent magnet is that it is not straight. The only place it is straight is at the surface of the pole because it is always orthogonal to the surface it penetrates. But after that, it begins a curved journey back to the other pole. The higher the density, the smaller the curve. There is a specific reason for that, but I am not going to address it in this thread. This curvature, means that the B vector will actually be in the opposite direction on the outside halfway between the poles than it is at the poles. So if your magnet field is pointing up at both poles, it will be pointing down on the sides at the equatorial line between the poles. And everywhere else it is on a constant change between these two directions depending on the distance along the path.

                              Imagine you have a special Zeppelin and it always lines up so that the nose tracks the magnetic B vector first and the tail follows the same path. You start off at Antartica on the magnetic pole and you look out your front window and see the constellations Octans and Mensa because the nose of your craft is pointing straight up! This is because the geological South Pole is really a North Pole magnet . So you hit your thrusters and off you go and your craft begins a journey where it gets more and more horizontal so that when you are near the equator your craft is level. But as you approach the North Pole, the nose of your craft begins to dip down at the earth and eventually, at the magnetic pole, you are looking at the ground through your front window.

                              Ok, that was a simple trip on a very big magnet, but they are all like that, big or small. The only thing that makes it very different is the ratio between the pole separation distance (thickness or length of the magnet) and the diameter at the equator (width or diameter of the magnet). This ratio governs the elliptical nature of the magnet toroid field and that is a subject for another thread.

                              "Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The Doctor

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Harvey View Post
                                Hi Joit,

                                I'm not sure where the discussion is heading with regards to crystals but I have always been fascinated with Carbon's ability to form so many structures with so many properties just by changing the temperature and pressure associated with the crystal growth process.
                                Hi Harvey, good that you are still back, dont play with the Girls, when they are only nasty.

                                And sorry for delay, i am mostly lazy, when i will have to make Videos,
                                But here you got it. Video

                                Well heading to where with the Crystals? Hum, dont know, it was only a Idea,
                                because a magnetic field has anyhow such strange Forms sometimes, how it do build out.
                                But i think i will keep it in mind, when i look at a magnetic Field.

                                But mainly my Point was about the properties from the Poles, and they act different.
                                And you can see also, that the Flux do the highest induction, when it is 90° to the Coil.
                                When the Magnets would turn continously you have the Peak also when the Magnets are at 90° to the Coil.
                                I agree with you also, that our magnetic Northpole is actually at our geographical South pole,
                                and it seems for me, that this Northpole is the one, what pushes out too.
                                So i think the that the part is actually right, when someone says, the Lines come from the Northpole out,
                                there is only a mess all time to declare which Pole where is.
                                Theorizer are like High Voltage. A lot hot Air with no Power behind but they are the dead of applied Work and Ideas.

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