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Today, I was talking to an electrical contractor, who told me a story about what happened to him a while back. He was wiring a new apartment complex, and had run the wiring through the walls and installed the boxes for the outlets, but had not tied the wiring together yet. Just wiring and boxes without the recepticles. A thunder storm came up and he quit and went into the basement where the breaker box was located. He was standing there talking to the plumber, who was also working installing the plumbing. He said he heard a sizzling noise and went to investigate. Knowing there was no electricity in the building, he didn't know what it was. The wiring had acumulated static electricity and had burned streaks across the boxes where they were in.He said he was lucky nt to have been working on them at the time. If that much electricity can be harnessed with the correct setup, we could all create our own electricity. Simply wire our houses and install a converter. Has anyone done any experiments using ungrounded wiring as a collector?Good Luck. Stealth
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Last edited by Stealth; 04-17-2010, 08:41 PM. -
I have been an electrician most of my life. This would have been a commercial building. The service panel had to be installed in order to run home runs which means the ground rod is usually installed at the same time. This sounds more like a lighting surge through the ground or in close proximity to the building. The metal conduit would have conducted the surge to the metal boxes and any wires touching or close to the box would arc. If it was truly electrostatic it would be on the surface of the metal conduit and not the insulated wire. That would be a major electrostatic charge inside of a building with that much arc to burn boxes. A close lighting strike itself will surge through insulated wire connected or not. -
If the wiring was run and ungrounded, lighting strikes even 30 miles away can cause large electromagnetic energy to pass through those wires. In this case, the wires would act as antennas. In this state, wood framing and plastic boxes are used in apartment complexes.
The question then has to do with the discharge path. Why are there streaks on the boxes? Even if charged particles were to sweep by, charging the plastic differently than the wire, I don't see streaks happening. To cause streaks, the wire must have moved and this indicates some serious amperage to get it to flex.
Perhaps there was an elevation differential where the atmosphere was at one voltage say 30 feet high and the panel was grounded. In this case, if a potential of several hundred or thousand volts existed, then it could have arc'd in the panel to the loose ends and each wire in the upper floors would have been streamers for the current flow.
I could see this happening if the apartment was on a hill and a charged cloud was low enough to sweep by.
Here is another story for you. One of my buddies is a fishing guide. One day on the lake some very dark low clouds moved in. But fishing was good and his client did not want to leave. He urged him to go, but they stayed another 15 minutes. That was when the fishing lures flew out of the water and headed for the sky. My buddy quickly cut the lines and headed for the shore. When they looked back over their shoulder, lightning hit that area they were fishing in. Static or no static, natures electricity is not something to tangle with bare handed.
"Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The DoctorComment
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Harvey,Originally posted by Harvey View Post
I'm interested in knowing how 'nature' converts Static Electricity to Electromagnetic energy.
How does Lightning Strikes produce "electromagnetic energy" ?
Schpankme
“The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.” -- Mark TwainComment
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EMP (Electro-Magnetic Pulse)
The E2 component of the pulse has many similarities to the electromagnetic pulses produced by lightning. Because of the similarities to lightning-caused pulses and the widespread use of lightning protection technology, the E2 pulse is generally considered to be the easiest to protect against.
"Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The DoctorComment
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Harvey,Originally posted by Harvey View Post
You just made the perfect argument on WHY people should NOT use "Wikipedia" for FACTUAL information without seeking another source for confirmation.
Lightning is an electrostatic event (dielectric) NOT an electromagnetic pulse.
Schpankme
"...dielectric lines of force must terminate on conductors." -- Eric DollardComment
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Not necessarily. An arc can produce streaks.To cause streaks, the wire must have moved
I just cant see a plain electrostatic buildup inside a building of that magnitude on the insulated wire at all, regardless of metal or plastic.
Still according to physicist Richard Feynman a vertical electric field at 100 volts per meter does exists in the air. At 2 meters its 200 volts. At 3 meters its 300 volts and so on. This electric field is everywhere in the earth's atmosphere and can even penetrate inside most buildings.
Electronic Field Disburbance, page 2 - The Hobby Corner Imagineering E-ZineComment
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Lightning
@Schpankme
Where is your proof that lightning does not produce an EMP? While the build up of an electrostatic charge is a dielectric effect the discharge of a lightning bolt very definitely causes an EMP.
CarrollJust because someone disagrees with you does NOT make them your enemy. We can disagree without attacking someone.Comment
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Comment
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Lightning and EMP.
Hi all,
Isn't the lightning EMP that activates a coherer to indicate a lightning storm is near?
Gakken was making a remote controled car kit that was activated with a piezo HV pulse and a coherer to recieve the signal and power the unit.
I would say that lightning does produce an EMP.
Take care,
MichelComment
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The next time I talk to him I will get more detailed information. I would like to set up an experiment to harness this electrostatic energy and convert it. Maybe if I can duplicate his layout, I can get some charge, and then from there go forward to more powerful energetic charge. It was acting like an antenna, I'm sure of that. Good Luck. StealthComment
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I am curious about this. Were the boxes with the burn marks on an exterior or interior wall? Was conduit or romex used? Was any portion of the boxes made up? Were all wires affected or just one? Was the air dry or humid? What floor was affected?The next time I talk to him I will get more detailed information
I have tested a bare #14 wire before for voltage around Fl lights on a wooden bench. The ballast can induce a charge into the wire which would be an antenna effect. The voltage will climb a little over time and level off. Turn the Fl lights out and the voltage drops.
Bench Observation of Em fieldsComment
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Hi Schpankme,
Schpankme
The answer is through plasma.Harvey,
I'm interested in knowing how 'nature' converts Static Electricity to Electromagnetic energy.
How does Lightning Strikes produce "electromagnetic energy" ?
Take care,
MichelComment
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just your 19th relativistic "runaway" breakdown
>How does Lightning Strikes produce "electromagnetic energy" ?
Runaway Breakdown and the Mysteries of Lightning, Physics Today, May 2005.
Cosmic rays have been implicated in the triggering of electrical breakdown in lightning. It has been proposed that essentially all lightning is triggered through a relativistic process, "runaway breakdown", seeded by cosmic ray secondaries. Subsequent development of the lightning discharge then occurs through "conventional breakdown" mechanisms.Comment
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"Amy Pond, there is something you need to understand, and someday your life may depend on it: I am definitely a madman with a box." ~The DoctorComment
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