N-Machine type devices? Why mot more?

[redrichie]

Ive been scouring this place and the internet. I cant seem to find out why more people are not using the homopolar, Faraday disk, N-Machine type generators. Is there a reason for this? Lets just say that the N-Machine is not over-unity but just really efficient. Cool, I can buy that, then why are we not utilizing them? Low Voltage high current...can that be put through a transformer, and then be utilized?
Ok so there is "drag" but not the cogging associated with coil generators we all use. Is this "drag" heavier than drag of a coil with a load applied?
Some questions that I cannot find answers to. Obviously size matters (old Faraday generator pictures that are huge) Is there a diameter/thickness of copper plate that is too small for a decent test. Im saying is the output of a plate 1 inch proportional to that of one 5 inches? Tesla said he improved the Faraday disk by adding a set of grooves. Does this really give the amperage a channel to flow through?
I cant find one decent Faraday disk replication that shows output. At least not any Amps, and hardly any that show Volts. Actually there aren't really that many replications at all. Is there a reason for this?
Materials. Can we use ceramic or neos for this? Or do should we use a high temp magnet such as Samarium Cobalt?
Does the shaft that the copper is supported by need to be brass or some other non-magnetic material or is steel allowed?
Sorry for all the questions, hope I can finally get some answers.

[Matthew Jones]

I think some of it is do to cost. To build a significant magnetic field around a peice of copper can cost good money.
A 12 x 12 peice of copper 3/4 inch thick can cost up to $400 to $500. Thats not including machining and polishing. And really for a long term running machine you should have it chromed or nickel plated on the edges and at the shaft. The shaft can be brass though.
Then the magnets aren't that expensive but you really want to set it up some flat disc magnets about the same size with hole you gonna pay at least $200 to $300 a peice.

That size should run real good but at best your looking about 3 -4 volt at 15 - 20 amp.

You can use other materials like stainless or aluminum but they don't work as well.

I looked into it for while. Debating the cost for an experiment. It just hasn't become worth it yet.
I was going to marry one to my Simple motor. The motor takes 12 volt 5 amp to run. The discharges can range but they step up no matter what. I was going to have them step up to 100 volt, which left next to no amperage. The rotation from the wheel would then drive a homopolar type setup. While the coils were discharging I was going to pull off the amperage from the homopolar and run it serial with the discharge from the coil. OverUnity if it ran.

But it just cost to much for the bet it might not perform as expected.

I have always wanted to see a good working model and try to figure how much torque they need to drive them.

Cheers
Matt

[redrichie]

Well any specs on the smaller quadrapole? Way smaller not requiring a 12 inch machined copper disk. Is the setup the same? is this the schematic? :
http://antigravitypower.tripod.com/F...y/depalma1.gif

Cant seem to find any data on this setup either.

[Matthew Jones]

Thats how they work. Thats the schematic. You'll need a diode on the output if your charging somthing up.
You can build one small and with aluminum. Your just not going to get the fullest potential. It will give you an idea of how it works though. Smaller copper is not as expensive. 1/4 inch by 3 or 4 inches wide. You can make somthing that size. You will have to polish the edges well as the carbon brushes will fall apart on a rough surface.

Depalma N1 This is a picture of 12 inch radius 1 inch thick disk same setup as you show. Large neo's on each side.

[gene gene]

Hi red,

I too have much interest here.

quote " The simplest machine for the mechanical extraction of electrical potentials is a rotating, magnetized, electrically conducting spiral." (Bruce DePalma)
found here- Notes on the Faraday Disc

more info- Bruce DePalma – N Machine, Free Energy, Self Sustaining Energy, Green Energy

Bruce E. DePalma: N-Machine (3 articles)

http://www.tewari.org/

PowerPedia:Bruce De Palma - PESWiki

Gene

[redrichie]

Received a good deal for a 6X6 cooper plate half inch thick. now to find a place to get it cut down to a disk.

[Matthew Jones]

Did you buy it? If so where what kinda prices.

Find a small machine shop that will take cash. You get better deal with cash. LOL

Matt

[ren]

Hi Matt and Red Richie,

It is my understanding that the large ring magnets are to be a single pole on one face?

I have two discs I salvaged from a VERY old AC generator, they have two whopping ring magnets on them, however, they are multipoled, 14 poles.

Any ideas if they would work? If they would you should keep an eye out for them, they could even be alnico???

Regards

[redrichie]

@ Matt. Ebay had some decent prices. One guy had what appears to be a few scrap pieces. I paid $30 including shipping for a 6X6X.5 piece. Going to use this piece for a Faraday disk experiment. If I get some good results I will pursue this idea further. But gotta start with the basics of it.

@gene. Any ideas if an electrically conducting spiral means an actual spiral or a spiral pattern cut into a flat disk as Tesla designed? I found a Faraday disk on youtube (I think the only one) a spanish speaking gentleman constructed one. His disk looks to only be made of copper of about 1/8 inches. If his video is true just by hand turning he is able to produce 13 Volts and it looks like about 25 Amps. This seems pretty significant to me.

@Ren. Hmm not sure about the multipole. Might be worth experimenting with, thats for sure. Would like to give it a shot once I get the disk cut.

And just a comment. Depalmas N-machine and Sunburst were huge machines. Well not terribly huge but impressive to say the least. I get the feeling that with the amount of output he was producing he had to make an attempt at a selfrunner of somekind. You cant tell me you spend thousands of dollars on a machine that produces what his show and not try this. Or Hell any other experiments or presentations cought on video. And on the entire vast internet there is only ONE SET (of a series of 18) videos!!!?? The lack of data and lack of video is making my spidey-sence tingle. And not aout Depalmas work. The series I did watch shows a lot of compassion, and hard work. Hard to find that to be an elaborate hoax. And to put your credentials on the line.

[redrichie]

@ Matt. Ebay had some decent prices. One guy had what appears to be a few scrap pieces. I paid $30 including shipping for a 6X6X.5 piece. Going to use this piece for a Faraday disk experiment. If I get some good results I will pursue this idea further. But gotta start with the basics of it.

@gene. Any ideas if an electrically conducting spiral means an actual spiral or a spiral pattern cut into a flat disk as Tesla designed? I found a Faraday disk on youtube (I think the only one) a spanish speaking gentleman constructed one. His disk looks to only be made of copper of about 1/8 inches. If his video is true just by hand turning he is able to produce 13 Volts and it looks like about 25 Amps. This seems pretty significant to me.

@Ren. Hmm not sure about the multipole. Might be worth experimenting with, thats for sure. Would like to give it a shot once I get the disk cut.

And just a comment. Depalmas N-machine and Sunburst were huge machines. Well not terribly huge but impressive to say the least. I get the feeling that with the amount of output he was producing he had to make an attempt at a selfrunner of somekind. You cant tell me you spend thousands of dollars on a machine that produces what his show and not try this. Or Hell any other experiments or presentations cought on video. And on the entire vast internet there is only ONE SET (of a series of 18) videos!!!?? The lack of data and lack of video is making my spidey-sence tingle. And not aout Depalmas work. The series I did watch shows a lot of compassion, and hard work. Hard to find that to be an elaborate hoax. And to put your credentials on the line.

[gene gene]

@ Redrichie, In rereading Depalma's notes, I believe (and I may well be wrong in this thinking) that his use of the word spiral is in reference to the path taken by the electrons & time energies. He latter states: "in general, the primitive machine is the rotating magnetized spiral." I read somewhere that homopolar generators are used for billet heating & welding, I think it was in the homopolar generator handbook. I would very much like to find more info on this use, and how the machines work, it may just make an efficient wind driven heater, it gets cold here in northern Wisconsin.

@ Ren, I find your multipoled ring magnets quite interesting. Could you post a pic, or sketch of them? If they are what I'm picturing in my mind, might they work well as a rotor in a N-Machine Motor? We have an old portable generator, about 8HP- B&S. Bad motor. Will take apart & see what the magnets look like & will post findings.

I have quite a few strong ring magnets (aprox- 3" X 1/2" with about a 1" hole) they are found in old microwave ovens in pairs. I am gathering parts for a build now and will try to post results.

Best to all here, Gene

[Matthew Jones]

Hi Matt and Red Richie,
It is my understanding that the large ring magnets are to be a single pole on one face?
I have two discs I salvaged from a VERY old AC generator, they have two whopping ring magnets on them, however, they are multipoled, 14 poles.
Any ideas if they would work? If they would you should keep an eye out for them, they could even be alnico???
Regards

It would be worth trying. If the poles line up and pull each other together then I don't see why you couldn't get a charge off of them. Positive is going to run out one brush negative out another. But then again you may get alot of heat.
If you can get your hands on a aluminum disc and try that might be a worth wild experiment. On possibility is you may get lower counter emf.

Matt

[ren]

@ Ren, I find your multipoled ring magnets quite interesting. Could you post a pic, or sketch of them? If they are what I'm picturing in my mind, might they work well as a rotor in a N-Machine Motor? We have an old portable generator, about 8HP- B&S. Bad motor. Will take apart & see what the magnets look like & will post findings.

Gene

Hi Gene,

This is the only pic I have of it (its at them bottom, with the aluminum plate/retainers.

There are some domino sized magnets stuck on the rotor, in a NSN config, to give you an idea of the pole dimensions. The ring is thicker than those magnets however (extends past the bottom of the dominos).

Its hard to see the magnet without removing the retainers, but it appears to be one solid ring, backed by steel plate.

When I get it back from my machinist I can take some other pics if you like.

Regards

[redrichie]

Has anyone else seen the videos that "dollar12" has posted on you tube? Very interesting. In the first lecture Depalma states that the Tewari replication was so successful that india switched one of its its nuclear power plants over to a N-machine type device in 1989. If true, of course I can not find anything about it anywhere. As well as the presentation to the United Nations or the US Senate. Weird that these videos are posted as of Jan of this year and not before.
@ Gene. There are 2 spirals engraved in his Copper disk. Both running in the same direction. Looks like about 5-6 turns.
Also I am pretty sure that Depalma did have a self running machine. He alluded to it and showed the build using a Faraday disk that was meant to power the run motor. Only he NEVER stated that he did make a self runner. He kind of just hinted to it.

[redrichie]

Tried an experiment today. I attempted to make a Faraday disk using 2, 1 inch neo cylinders, and a platter from a hard drive. Wiki says the platters are usually made from aluminum, so I figured it was worth a shot. I spun the disk using a power drill. No output from platter at any rotational speed. I had continuity from edge of platter to threaded rod axle. Magnets were N/S attracting each other. I placed one of my meter leads on edge of platter the other on the axle. tried AC and DC settings. Tried running drill in reverse even. No output. Unless anyone has any ideas on where I messed things up I assume platters are not good for this experiment.
I received my copper plate in today. Now to find a machine shop to turn it into a disk. Would anyone know of a ballpark estimate of what this may cost to get a 6 inch disk turned from a square flat piece of plate. I just dont like being ignorant when I get work done. To many shady individuals out there nowadays.