Garry Stanley Pulse Motor

[Turion]

Oh, if you could only see my basement "cave". 10x12, with all the woodworking and auto tools from my previous 632 square feet of work space crammed into it. PLUS. it has all my builds, since I never take one apart. I was into restoring old Triumph autos, until I got divorced and then lost my job. Now I hang out in my little basement shop and build strange devices.

Currently:
Matt Jones' pulse motor,
Gary Stanley Motor,
Kromrey converter
Watson device
.... all in various stages of completion.

I think I cleared a little space on the work bench just to take that picture or there would have been crap piled everywhere in the photo. The stuff you saw probably rolled off the top of the pile just as I was snapping the picture.

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, Hi turion, nice methods there for making your motor pieces. As far as the neo magnets being so close, as I said, they are in alternating polarity configuration so that's how they can be so close. I tested the motor and it performs a little better, though have not setup any flux backing yet, so the magnet fields are connecting through the air right now. Turion, I know you're working on watson device and I have replicated the effects that this web page describes.
http://www.totallyamped.net/adams/page10.html
this effect may be used in that watson device. What I found is that when i used a standard steel bolt and wrapped a coil on only half the bolt and rotated magnets past the far end of bolt core away from coil, that just like this guy found, when coil was loaded or short circuited, the motor input was the same as no load freewheeling past cores. Then I decided to put another magnet rotor, just like were doing here, on other side of coil/core which was very close to coil on other side and yet it still maintained the same lentz bending effect and I was able to get much more output that way. Here is a cad pic of the layout that worked well.
http://a.imageshack.us/img214/8779/dualrotor2.jpg
hope this helps, since I'm thinking about doing something with this again.
peace love light
Tyson

[Turion]

SkyWatcher,
Thanks for that. REALLY interesting stuff! The second link did not work though, so now I am chomping at the bit (as my grandma used to say) to see what it was you had for me.

[SkyWatcher]

Hi turion, ill repost that pic if that didnt work for you.

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, this bifilar coil used as a drive circuit is interesting, in that it reroutes the induced current from passing magnets in our favor.
http://a.imageshack.us/img14/719/bifilarcoils.jpg

In Fig 19 above, a single Bi-Filar wound coil is shown. One side of Winding A is connected directly to the positive of the supply while the other side is connected to ground via the Collector to Emitter junction of the controlling transistor Q1. Winding B has one side connected back to the positive of the supply via a diode (D1). The diode prevents it from receiving any input power directly from the supply and provides a return path for regenerative energy. The other side of winding B is connected to the negative (ground) of the supply. When the transistor turns on due to a pulse, the bi-filar coil acts briefly like a transformer. During the leading edge of the pulse, the current in winding A shown by the green arrow to the right of winding A, induces a BEMF into winding B. This BEMF normally arises within winding A, but is blocked by transistor Q1. However, the diode D1 is forward biased to the BEMF in winding B, and so current is allowed to pass in the direction as shown by the solid green arrow on the left of winding B. This BEMF current forms a loop * (see note at end of page) between winding B and winding A whilst transistor Q1 is turned on, and has the effect of maintaining a higher supply voltage to winding A by contributing recycled current (BEMF) in conjunction with the supply current to winding A. This in turn, translates to a slightly higher torque, with less total supply current required. Once the leading edge of the pulse passes, this transformer recycling effect disappears until the trailing edge of the pulse occurs. When the pulse collapses (the trailing edge), a CEMF is produced in the same direction as the preceding BEMF and it also is recycled. But its energy goes directly back into the supply as charge, because when Transistor Q1 turns off, there is no path through winding A for current to flow in a circulating loop. The CEMF direction is shown by the dashed green arrow to the left of winding B.
This coil arrangement is very simple and has a positive impact on total efficiency over a wide range of duty cycles. When using low impedance coils with a short "Timing Factor", duty cycles can go as high as 45 % before the dynamics change from a positive impact to a negative one. As mentioned previously, I'll discuss the term "Timing Factor" in more detail later. Next we'll look at a few more simple methods of capturing CEMF as regenerative energy. *Note from above* - "This BEMF current forms a loop between winding B and winding A" . This is a neat little trick! Especially when the statement is followed by "This in turn, translates to a slightly higher torque, with less total supply current required. " Lets examine these statements more closely. In a conventional DC motor as outlined already on page 2 with the following statement "In Fig 3 Circuit B above, a normal DC motor is connected to a supply and promptly increases its speed until it reaches top speed. As it does so, a BEMP arises which produces a BEMF. The BEMF is just like the Forward EMF (FEMF), in that there is a complete loop in the circuit for it to flow. It is never as strong as the FEMF and so the net current flow measured will always be in the direction of the supply current." When the BEMF arises in the DC motor to its maximum, then current draw will be at its minimum, due to the opposing EMF's, RPM will be at a maximum, and actual torque will be at a minimum! Don't take my word for it. Check out the torque characteristics of any Permanent Magnet DC motor. Their maximum torque is at Zero Rpm. (maximum Current draw!) Have you noticed that when you hook up a high speed Permanent Magnet DC motor without a load for just 5 minutes, they still get quite warm to hot. After thirty minutes of continuous running they are definitely hot. Think about the Forward and Back EMF fighting it out against each other in the coil wire. Forward Current wins after battling its way against this BEMF the whole time. So where do you think most of the heat is coming from! Is it just from driving current. No, not when the motor is free wheeling with zero load. Thats when the "apparent" supply current is at its lowest! Yet still they run hot. It's because two big opposing currents are playing "push the other guy", and only one is winning by a small amount!. The "apparent" low current we measure. The statement "This BEMF current forms a loop between winding B and winding A" reveals a wonderful trick of the circuit in Fig 19, whereby, an induced current which normally opposes the inducing current, is re directed to assist the current it normally opposes. In doing so it acts cohesively and unidirectionally, with the inducing current. A quick re-glance at Fig 19 above, shows both the supply current through winding A, and the CEMF from winding B (when followed around the circuit) wind up in the same direction through winding A. The currents are not fighting each other, they are mutually co-operating with each other!
Result - more torque, less supply current! less heat!

Maybe this of value, anyone try anything like this.
peace love light
Tyson

[Turion]

The link didn't work for me before, but it does now. Thanks.

[SkyWatcher]

Ok, i finally figured out what i've been doing wrong with these image posts. This should work.

peace love light
Tyson

[gyula]

ok let me try this another way forget about the windings take a coil and connect it to a meter perhaps one that reads amps so you can see the difference between current direction in this coil when you pass a magnet by it.
First try a north pole and then a south and note that the direction of induction changes for each pole relatively.

Now repeat this experiment again but this time use only a north pole but first test the end you have already tested and then test the other end

What you will find is that when a north pole passes the other end of the coil it reverses the flow in the coil just as having a south pole at the first end did.

if you now change the wires on this coil you can pass the north pole at the second end and get the same result as you started out with at the first end.
in order to achieve this you must now be causeing the induced flow in the coil to be traveling in the opposite direction though the function of the coil remains the same .
....snip

Hi Garry,

I have done the tests you suggested above and found you correctly described how the currents flow in the separate cases.
So to continue your way of thinking, if you use a second identical coil (with the same winding sense as the first) and you connect it to the first coil with changed wires, then the currents induced by magnet(s) in the two coils will work against each other indeed. You agree with this?

Now if you wish to use this coil pair connected in parallel like just described, and feed current into it from a battery via a switch, then you will have NSSN poles at the coil ends unless you turn mechanically the second coil back 180 degree to get NSNS poles as needed for your facing magnet pair. Agree with this? Please answer.

Now my problem is why you say this coil pair is Lenz-less? Because normal Lenz law works during the attract-in time while current is taken from the battery (Lenz manifests as an increased current draw if you load the shaft during the attract-in time). And the moment you switch the current off (at TDC), then it is true the coil pair will cancel each other's BEMFs BUT suppose you had only a single coil passing between the magnet pairs, it would surely pass through without any problem just like the coil pair would because you switched the current out, the single coil could not see a closed circuit any more, hence its BEMF could not retard rotor movement either (no current could flow due to BEMF due to the single coil's open circuit after the switch-off). (It is ok that the created high voltage spike in case of a single coil is unwanted but it is not an issue now.)

Thanks, Gyula

[woopy]

Hi all

just received the matos today

and now let's go for a hard work

good luck at all

Laurent

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, Hi woopy, nice work so far, I assume those steel plates already had those holes in them, or did you drill those. I hope it all goes together smoothly for you. I'm in a thinking stage right now.
peace love light
Tyson

[garrys]

Hi Garry,

I have done the tests you suggested above and found you correctly described how the currents flow in the separate cases.
So to continue your way of thinking, if you use a second identical coil (with the same winding sense as the first) and you connect it to the first coil with changed wires, then the currents induced by magnet(s) in the two coils will work against each other indeed. You agree with this?

Now if you wish to use this coil pair connected in parallel like just described, and feed current into it from a battery via a switch, then you will have NSSN poles at the coil ends unless you turn mechanically the second coil back 180 degree to get NSNS poles as needed for your facing magnet pair. Agree with this? Please answer.

Yes i agree with what you are sayoing here it is correct but im saying leave the coil turned and change the wires it creates the same poles now but it has in fact changed the end that is exposed to the flux field which thus causes the induced potential to be the other way around and counter the potential in the first ...can you understand this ?

Now my problem is why you say this coil pair is Lenz-less? Because normal Lenz law works during the attract-in time while current is taken from the battery (Lenz manifests as an increased current draw if you load the shaft during the attract-in time). And the moment you switch the current off (at TDC), then it is true the coil pair will cancel each other's BEMFs BUT suppose you had only a single coil passing between the magnet pairs, it would surely pass through without any problem just like the coil pair would because you switched the current out, the single coil could not see a closed circuit any more, hence its BEMF could not retard rotor movement either (no current could flow due to BEMF due to the single coil's open circuit after the switch-off). (It is ok that the created high voltage spike in case of a single coil is unwanted but it is not an issue now.)

Your understanding of lenz is incorrect.

Lenz is the reaction of the flux field of the coil acting in an equal and opposite direction to the incoming or exiting flux field, it acts on both equally so when a magnet approaches with a north pole the coil creates a north pole to repel the incoming magnet and on exit it creates a south pole to try and stop the magnet leaving.
These only occur as you say when the power is on in a normal motor since the flux field requires a closed circuit to have the current flow that creates the flux field and so it is true that a coil will pass a magnet with no lenz as long as it is an open circuit.

What you are missing here is that like a straight bit of wire that you might use to create a closed circuit on a single coil my coil pairs are in fact permanently connected as one coil is the closed circuit of the other ...in normal circumstances you would expect to find both lenz at its greatest possible strength on a closed coil and also extreme heat as the current has to be converted to something in the closed circuit coil and yet mine display neither heat nor resistance to travel through the magnet either on approach or exit

i hope this makes sense

Garry

Thanks, Gyula

opps my message was too short see in quote for replies

Garry

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, Hi woopy, hows that build coming along and if you did finish it already, i sure would like to know how it worked out, thanks.
peace love light
Tyson

[woopy]

Hi tyson

all the matos is here

but no excuse, i have to motivate me to find 2 or 3 days free and concentrate, to lathe all the coils than wound them and fix them to the rim and test. plus drill the magnet holders and fix them to the inner rim. And tune all this corrrectly

Yep and september is our most busy month

And in fact i am also involved in the leedskalnin PMH " Gravity vawe found", but it is much more easy to put the experiment in the freezeer, go to work and when you go back home, you can see the result.

So be patient,l i will do it anyway

@ Garry

any more info ?

Good luck at all


Laurent

[gyula]

Hi Folks,

I am still here though have become rather busy at work. Would like to do some more experiments with Garry's paralled coils so that I be prepared with practical details to understand what he has said lastly. Sorry for not answering him yet.

Gyula

[thaelin]

So I'm biting shoe strings here wondering how things are going. Just finished the 9" rotor set for mine. I am winding the coils now and simply glueing them to a seperator section. I had a chance to toy with the concept and so far, it is as stated. On the direction of the coil winds, take a pancake coil and then turn one around. Do the draw on clear plastic and shine a light through it. Done deal.

Ok, back to work

thay