Ethonol gets boost from a plant...

[theremart]

I thought I would try growing this here in florida just have 5 starts of it. Looking forward to see what happens.








In the largest field trial of its kind in the United States, researchers have determined that the giant perennial grass Miscanthus x giganteus outperforms current biofuels sources - by a lot. Using Miscanthus as a feedstock for ethanol production in the U.S. could significantly reduce the acreage dedicated to biofuels while meeting government biofuels production goals, the researchers report. Photos by Don Hamerman, L. Brian Stauffer, Andrew Leakey and the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign.

YouTube - Miscanthus can meet U.S. biofuels goal using less land than corn or switchgrass







From Webpedia

Miscanthus giganteus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Comparison to corn ethanol
Compared to other ethanol inputs, giant Miscanthus grass produces more mass overall, as well as more ethanol. For example, a typical acre of corn yields around 7.6 tons of input per acre and 756 gallons of ethanol. Giant Miscanthus is capable of producing up to 20 tons of biomass and 3,250 gallons of ethanol fuel.

[Matthew Jones]

We've been looking into Ethanol production. The biggest problem with biomass products is you have to buy the bacteria to break it down. Generally its modified bovine type but there are other.
The problem with buying that is you have to pay the owners. You can't cultivate it. And most of the time the bacteria is owned by Oil Companies. Exxon has alot. Dow Chemical, Shell.
And the bacteria is a primary cost right next to energy.

Ethanol from biomass is still more expensive than gas, makes you wonder why.

No one ever talks about sugar beat though. 30% sugar just add yeast and cook at 162 degrees. Of coarse you gotta have the still but...

Giant Sugar beats,
No not really but they get big and you can buy Arluene Seeds

Yeast isn't hard to cultivate either, Cheap to buy too.

Cheers
Matt

[bmlobo]

Good Day Everyone!!

Hi Everybody, Can you help me out and take a look at a blog site that I am working on. It is to do with Pulse motors and magnetic coils, Bedini Motors, and ideas on making systems work better. If you could take a moment and link to my site and comment I would greatly appreciate your input.



PULSE MOTOR, FREE ENERGY & OVER UNITY

Thank you all and take care.

Please comment

[theremart]

RE: sugar beets.

We've been looking into Ethanol production. The biggest problem with biomass products is you have to buy the bacteria to break it down. Generally its modified bovine type but there are other.
The problem with buying that is you have to pay the owners. You can't cultivate it. And most of the time the bacteria is owned by Oil Companies. Exxon has alot. Dow Chemical, Shell.
And the bacteria is a primary cost right next to energy.

Ethanol from biomass is still more expensive than gas, makes you wonder why.

No one ever talks about sugar beat though. 30% sugar just add yeast and cook at 162 degrees. Of coarse you gotta have the still but...

Giant Sugar beats,
No not really but they get big and you can buy Arluene Seeds

Yeast isn't hard to cultivate either, Cheap to buy too.

Cheers
Matt

Hi Matt

Thanks for the input. My goal is to get all my energy from 1/3 acre in some means. I have heard of sugar beets from the book "Alcohol can be a gas" but the book does not have sources of getting the plants. Think I will order some and give them a go, the best method I have learned from great gardeners is try all the varieties and find out what ones work best for you.

Cheers!

[Matthew Jones]

Ya beets look to be the deal. I haven't started them yet. I know your in Florida and this a great time of year to get some planted. You could get as much as 2-3 crops a year down there. The HOT HOT is out though you gotta grow in the cooler times of the year. You gotta find a pesticide that your comfortable with too. They are real susceptible to some bugs.

If you rely on the weather for water you can plant them 16" apart. If you have irrigation means you can plant them 12".

From what I have read when you brew them you'll have to double ferment. You add yeast 1 time, let it peter out. Distill. Then you can go back and re ferment for more yield. But there are drying techniques to pre extract the sugar. So you can make a perfect mix. The Department of energy has some info if you crawl around on there sight.

I have been working on a design for a still, and free fuel source. Of course you can use electric from the sun but I think I am going to press pellet from dried lawn clippings. Bermuda grass dries to 8 percent moisture easily. I gotta lot of Bermuda to burn and its carbon neutral fuel cause the stuff grows like weed in the summer.

We'll see it my experiment set for next fall.

Matt

[IndianaBoys]

Theremart,

Have you looked at Jatropha?

Grows well in Florida!

Diesel Engine Running On Plant Oil
YouTube - Diesel Engine Running On Plant Oil

Run a diesel engine car on plant oil.

This is a 1983 Mercedes-Benz 300SD that I purchased in 1992 for $8000. I drove my newborn daughter home from the hospital in it in 1996. Its odometer broke three years ago at 356,000 miles. It probably has 500,000 miles on it now, and it's still going strong.

Though I demonstrate Canola oil burning in this engine, I mainly use a similar, though non-edible, oil called jatropha that I grow in my back yard, at a cost of about 35 cents per gallon to produce. Canola (rapeseed) oil can be purchased in bulk for about $1.75 per gallon. On either oil, this car gets 40 to 45 miles per gallon versus about 27 miles per gallon on petroleum diesel.

These are the best cars for burning vegetable oil, because their iron blocks are more tolerant of hotter-burning plant oil than more delicate aluminum block engines in newer diesel cars.

IndianaBoys

[theremart]

RE: Free energy blog.

Hi Everybody, Can you help me out and take a look at a blog site that I am working on. It is to do with Pulse motors and magnetic coils, Bedini Motors, and ideas on making systems work better. If you could take a moment and link to my site and comment I would greatly appreciate your input.



PULSE MOTOR, FREE ENERGY & OVER UNITY

Thank you all and take care.

Please comment

Hi,

I suggest you start another thread here and list your topic, and your objectives, that way this thread will stay on topic.

Sounds like a very cool site, and ideas similar to what this site is all about.

Cheers!

[theremart]

RE: Jatropha.

Theremart,

Have you looked at Jatropha?

Grows well in Florida!

Diesel Engine Running On Plant Oil
YouTube - Diesel Engine Running On Plant Oil

Run a diesel engine car on plant oil.

This is a 1983 Mercedes-Benz 300SD that I purchased in 1992 for $8000. I drove my newborn daughter home from the hospital in it in 1996. Its odometer broke three years ago at 356,000 miles. It probably has 500,000 miles on it now, and it's still going strong.

Though I demonstrate Canola oil burning in this engine, I mainly use a similar, though non-edible, oil called jatropha that I grow in my back yard, at a cost of about 35 cents per gallon to produce. Canola (rapeseed) oil can be purchased in bulk for about $1.75 per gallon. On either oil, this car gets 40 to 45 miles per gallon versus about 27 miles per gallon on petroleum diesel.

These are the best cars for burning vegetable oil, because their iron blocks are more tolerant of hotter-burning plant oil than more delicate aluminum block engines in newer diesel cars.

IndianaBoys

Jatropha appeals to me alot. All you have to do is extract the oil, filter put in car done as I understand it.

The down side I saw was the 3 - 5 years it takes for the first harvest, but I am always looking at other means of getting from point A to B easier with the resources I have.

Can you tell me of someone in Florida doing this? I would like to visit an operation who has this in place, so I can see if it is viable for my needs.

Yes, I have found you have to match the engine to the fuel you are burning, Mercedes-Benz 300SD , is a remarkable car for this application.

I can't find used veggi oil down here, so looks like I will be making my own in some way.

So where did you get your Jatropha plants, and how do you process your oil before you put it in your car?

Thanks!

[IndianaBoys]

Theremart,

Years of "amateur" research lead me to the conclusion jatropha is a good selection.

Do not know of anyone personally or commercially doing this, just what the internet has provided.

Have visited ECHO (Educational Concerns For Hunger Organization) in the past and they have a great appropriate technology/demonstration farm:

ECHO :: Home

They may have a line on some plants.

IndianaBoys

[theremart]

RE: Echo.

Theremart,

Years of "amateur" research lead me to the conclusion jatropha is a good selection.

Do not know of anyone personally or commercially doing this, just what the internet has provided.

Have visited ECHO (Educational Concerns For Hunger Organization) in the past and they have a great appropriate technology/demonstration farm:

ECHO :: Home

They may have a line on some plants.

IndianaBoys

Thanks for the link,

I have been to Echo 2 times, and loved it. It is like an ocean of information there. I got my bamboo and kale from there, and tons of great information about growing plants in Florida.

But do tell me how you process your oil.

Thanks

[IndianaBoys]

But do tell me how you process your oil.

Thanks

Theremart,

Have not personally done anything with using oil to run an engine.

Moving in the direction of HHO but that has been quite an undertaking as car computer systems hold back any gains and Efie's don't quite do the trick. Believe will have similar problems incorporating vegetable oils in automobiles that are sensor equipped as well. Looking forward to someone cracking the car computer system so you can dial in any parameter you would like.

IndianaBoys

[citfta]

burning vegetable oil

Hi guys, Sorry to break the bad news guys but it is not that simple. Jatropha is an excellent oil to use for diesel engines. However it must first be converted to biodiesel if you don't want to destroy your engine. My son and I have been using biodiesel for over 6 years now. My son first started with straight used vegetable oil and the heat system that you have to add to your car to get the oil hot enough to go through the injection pump. After about 10,000 miles the engine was junk. He learned the hard way that straight vegetable oil has long molecule chains that will not burn completely. This leaves carbon in the cylinder which eventually builds up to destroy the engine. He has a friend who destroyed a very nice Mercedes engine just like the one in the video because he ran straight vegetable oil in it. The guy in the video never says he makes biodiesel from the plant oil so I don't know what he was running in his car. He does however made a statement in the comments that I am sure is false. He states he gets 40-45 miles per gallon on vegetable oil verses 27 on regular diesel. I have a Mercedes just like his except mine is an 84. I get slightly less milage on biodiesel than I do on regular diesel and so does everyone else that uses biodiesel. But my car runs smoother and doesn't smoke at all and the biodiesel I make myself costs me half as much as I would pay at the pump for regular diesel. By the way plant or vegetable oil can only be used in diesel engines. If the oil could be fermented in some way to make ethanol then it could be used in a gasoline engine. So the bottom line is if you want to use plants for fuel you will have to have a way to process it into biodiesel or ethanol. Since the process for making biodiesel is much simpler my son and I went that route. I hope this information will keep someone from destroying an expensive engine.

Good luck, Carroll

[theremart]

RE: Vegi oil straight a no no.

Hi guys, Sorry to break the bad news guys but it is not that simple. Jatropha is an excellent oil to use for diesel engines. However it must first be converted to biodiesel if you don't want to destroy your engine. My son and I have been using biodiesel for over 6 years now. My son first started with straight used vegetable oil and the heat system that you have to add to your car to get the oil hot enough to go through the injection pump. After about 10,000 miles the engine was junk. He learned the hard way that straight vegetable oil has long molecule chains that will not burn completely. This leaves carbon in the cylinder which eventually builds up to destroy the engine. He has a friend who destroyed a very nice Mercedes engine just like the one in the video because he ran straight vegetable oil in it. The guy in the video never says he makes biodiesel from the plant oil so I don't know what he was running in his car. He does however made a statement in the comments that I am sure is false. He states he gets 40-45 miles per gallon on vegetable oil verses 27 on regular diesel. I have a Mercedes just like his except mine is an 84. I get slightly less milage on biodiesel than I do on regular diesel and so does everyone else that uses biodiesel. But my car runs smoother and doesn't smoke at all and the biodiesel I make myself costs me half as much as I would pay at the pump for regular diesel. By the way plant or vegetable oil can only be used in diesel engines. If the oil could be fermented in some way to make ethanol then it could be used in a gasoline engine. So the bottom line is if you want to use plants for fuel you will have to have a way to process it into biodiesel or ethanol. Since the process for making biodiesel is much simpler my son and I went that route. I hope this information will keep someone from destroying an expensive engine.

Good luck, Carroll

Thanks for your input.

I know of one guy who is running it this way.

Another location has modified engines to run it straight.

YouTube - Jatropha Plant Winrock Succes Story self supporting village Ranidhera India posted by Gino Smit - Youmanitas Energy Farms Foundation


These are not car engines, and perhaps more forgiving than a car engine, but I am trying to get as simple as possible.

[ashtweth]

Matt, IndianaBoys and Mart, drop me an email please, i have an ethanol HEMP book given to us from donations (PDF)


Ash

[Matthew Jones]

I can't grow hemp in this state. We've looked into it. Narrow minded fools.

Matt