How to turn plastic waste into diesel fuel cheaply

[fibuslitero]

Catalyst

Thanks Congnghiah for your fantastic information.
I have read that an aluminum silicate compound is used by some of the companies that turn plastic into oil.
There are many formulas because each local producer has a standard but it can be writen as : x(SiO2) . y(Al2O3) .z(Na2O).
All the catalysts mentioned in this forum connect with this in some way.

Hello all
Last time I tested the catalyst of copyright france.
today, I have metakaolin composition similar to the structure of the catalytic copyright france
After I use metakaolin my community results are very encouraging. you can get the kaolin in your country trying to produce fuel from plastic. Special Imakebiodiesel architecture-is kaolin in my country, sources in the country are you have components similar to components of our country.

thanks

[Asad Farooqui]

Betonite clay -liquid phase

Asad, Ive no doubt if you add enough catalyst to the liquid phase it might have some effect but the gas phase is bound to be more efficient. In the example you quote it took 3 kilos of activated bentonite to process 1 kilo of plastic. That would be a very expensive way to produce fuel.

Hello ;
1) Did you try to run an engine with =WVO + WMO ratio 25/75 . I would request U to run it in an engine & let me know the result .

2) Bentonite clay is very cheap in my country.
NOTE : The ratio if one part bentonite clay to three parts waste plastic .
If U can activate the clay by placing it in a furnace for few hours it will reduce the reaction temp to 300 celcius & the residence time will also shortenup considerably, specially for PE .

In my country PE is very expensive, more than double the price of PP. So I didn't try this yet but I would like to ry it with PP, hope it works ??

[Asad Farooqui]

Your trial run

I will try at 300C. Are the other temps OK in your opinnion?

2. Reactor 370-400C
3. "Catalyst" (nothing inside yet) 300C
4. Condenser 150C
5. Condenser 80C
6. Condenser 20C

I suspect that my condensers are not big enough to cool down the gas therefore the gas goes through all the condensers and out the bubbler (it really bubbles a lot!). Perhaps I should modify them to have some plates in it thus leaving the gas more time to cool down?

On my first run (with two unheated condensers) I got plenty of liquid on the first condenser (still liquid after a week but denser) and about .250lt of an orange liquid (now is a bit darker but still looks good).

My last run: about a liter of brown liquid on the second condenser and a little bit of "clear" liquid on the third.

Hello AIGU :
Congradulations U are quite close, on the right track but over doing things .

You are super heating your condensors & not allowing the vapors to cool-down to convert into liquid. They are forced to remain in vapor form .

I would suggest for your first run shut down the HEATERS of all your condensors & reflux chamber & you will see you are collecting oil in almost every condensor .
First celebrate your first run.
In your second run fill the reflux chamber with any catalyst, ONLY than heat your condensor otherwise not.

NOTE : Try to weld all the joints, threaded joints with any sealant doesnot last longer. After few runs the threads used to leak & possibly can catch fire .

[aigu]

Hello AIGU :
Congradulations U are quite close, on the right track but over doing things .

You are super heating your condensors & not allowing the vapors to cool-down to convert into liquid. They are forced to remain in vapor form .

I would suggest for your first run shut down the HEATERS of all your condensors & reflux chamber & you will see you are collecting oil in almost every condensor .
First celebrate your first run.
In your second run fill the reflux chamber with any catalyst, ONLY than heat your condensor otherwise not.

NOTE : Try to weld all the joints, threaded joints with any sealant doesnot last longer. After few runs the threads used to leak & possibly can catch fire .

Thanks Asad, I will give it a try.

[Asad Farooqui]

Leakages

Todays great seat back.
I assembled the machine and filled water from Refluxer found slight leakage from top plate of Reactor and from the screw joint between Reactor and Refluxer now first have find solution for this. I think copper or Aluminum packing seal should work but it is available. I am also thinking to use paste used in engine packing I will work bt don't know about Temperature who much it can with stand.
please suggest any solution...

Hello Kris ;
Don't get upset ,It's part of the game . You have to learn from your mistakes, if you don't have this temperament than do something else .
I've studied almost all the big/small researcher's report who have PHD's & specialists of this field & almost everyone took about an year or so to devise a proper system .
[B]Even if U get success initially. This will be just a toy to toggle along your way to design a perfect system which can earn you something .
[/B]

I would say its very good U detect the leakages/flaws in the first runs .
Usually we get careless afterwords .

I have tried all types of sealants & NONE last many runs. The best thing would be to weld these spots again & if you have threaded joints (which is the worst thing to do), than weld THOROUGLY Again ALL your threaded joints .

Your third/last condensor should be placed in another tank about 4"-bigger in dia than the condensor & fill it with water even the upper lid of the condensor should be dipped in water.
When the vapors start to come in the condensor put some ICE in the water.
Than see the magic ....

Hello Aigu ;
You should also follow the above suggestions.
Note : The last condensor is for trapping gasoline fraction & if it doesnot get cold environment it will not liquify & will quickly pass through the bubbler .


STANDINGOUTSIDE ;
You are welcome Inside the forum. Now U don't have to stand outside.

The process diagram seems to be OK .
I would suggest you to follow the above recommendations given to KRIS also .
Don't forget the V-Groove Lid arrangement .

Wish You all the guys best of luck .

[islander]

did anyone already tried to make fuel from WVO ?

Imakebiodiesel should know about it. The natural oil also can be distillate, and very probably could be able to cracked at the time it is a the vapour stage.

Nobody do it, but why not ? maybe Have here a way to avoid buying alcool to make biodiesel, and also avoid to finish with a big quantity of glycerine.

It seems to me the petrol have huge chances to be some old fat from plants and beasts, right.

And if it could be done, why not imagine a process where the natural raw stuff, as oil palm seeds (a tree=300Kg of seeds by year) is directly used as the stock to feed the machine ?

after making them dry.

removing all the oils/volatile compounds witout even pressing the seeds. cracked and carefully redistilled to mix the good fuel for your car.

left parts (cokefied seeds) could be recovered as fuel for the process itself.

no more plastics, fill your car tank with the content of your field, without waste.

note : I know some will say why not directly use the oil : I did it for many years, now I clearly understand one thing : it works, but it's a terrific source for problem in your car, and the builder haven't designed it for that use. main problem is coke buildup reasulting from low temp burning. Only one motor has been done to use it, made by elsbett. So now I try to create a fuel very equivalent to the diesel. (evaporates at same temp than diesel, cokefaction no more than diesel does)

[fibuslitero]

To Islander

Islander:
We have used the vapours of WVO directly to the air intake of a small gasoline generator (gasoline, not diesel ) and it worked.The problem is keeping the pressure of the vapours but I think it can be solved with a bigger reactor.
As a matter of fact we have tested the gasoline generator with all kind of gases & vapours: WVO, WMO, plastics, coal, biomass..., and it works
At first we used the plastics setup but we found easier to use a steel drum with latching lid just heating the drum and obtaining the gas.
Once wvo gas was obtained the condensed wvo (and craked I understand) worked well in a big diesel engine.The problem as always is to have enough WVO to make several tests
We are going to try with various kind of seeds to use the obtained gas & vapours directly in the air intake and condense the oil for further tests in diesel engines.
This field is huge

Imakebiodiesel should know about it. The natural oil also can be distillate, and very probably could be able to cracked at the time it is a the vapour stage.

Nobody do it, but why not ? maybe Have here a way to avoid buying alcool to make biodiesel, and also avoid to finish with a big quantity of glycerine.

It seems to me the petrol have huge chances to be some old fat from plants and beasts, right.

And if it could be done, why not imagine a process where the natural raw stuff, as oil palm seeds (a tree=300Kg of seeds by year) is directly used as the stock to feed the machine ?

after making them dry.

removing all the oils/volatile compounds witout even pressing the seeds. cracked and carefully redistilled to mix the good fuel for your car.

left parts (cokefied seeds) could be recovered as fuel for the process itself.

no more plastics, fill your car tank with the content of your field, without waste.

note : I know some will say why not directly use the oil : I did it for many years, now I clearly understand one thing : it works, but it's a terrific source for problem in your car, and the builder haven't designed it for that use. main problem is coke buildup reasulting from low temp burning. Only one motor has been done to use it, made by elsbett. So now I try to create a fuel very equivalent to the diesel. (evaporates at same temp than diesel, cokefaction no more than diesel does)

[islander]

To flibustero

Hello, thanks for very interesting reports.

It seems to me the vegetable oil is likely more stable than our plastics etc, seems to me really need some treatment as predigesting by acids or bases, and catalytic cracking.

[blexus]

Basic Design components

Reactor – used to heat plastic and needs to be air tight with v grooved lid. Lime added to improve the quality? Approx 380 c seems to be the ideal temperature? Covered in insulating material to hold to temp.

Reflux column – first condenser used to break down the carbon chains. It is best located above the reactor so the heaviest chains fall back into the reactor. Clay seems to be the most ready available/cheapest material to use in the reflux to ensure the chains are broken correctly. Is it better to have the catalyst separate, if so why? If separate what is put into the reflux?

Condenser – container used to hold the fuel produced at the end of the cycle. Three needed 1)diesel, 2)petrol and 3)gases(partially filled with water to prevent the gas from flowing back into the system). Is it better to have all the condensers filled The bleast model seems to condense it in a container partially filled with water, why? Any advantage to doing that?

Heat source – either electricity or gas.
I am looking to design a system that produces 100 gallons of fuel per batch. Looking to product mainly diesel fuel and some petrol. Trying to get a clear understanding before I attempt to build this thing out.

Found this on youtube seems so much simpler like the bleast desktop model. Are the systems we are building over complicated? Thanks for the help
Homemade Plastic to Oil with a paint can in a BBQ - YouTube

[islander]

To blexus

Reflux column – first condenser used to break down the carbon chains. It is best located above the reactor so the heaviest chains fall back into the reactor. Clay seems to be the most ready available/cheapest material to use in the reflux to ensure the chains are broken correctly. Is it better to have the catalyst separate, if so why? If separate what is put into the reflux?

Condenser – container used to hold the fuel produced at the end of the cycle. Three needed 1)diesel, 2)petrol and 3)gases(partially filled with water to prevent the gas from flowing back into the system). Is it better to have all the condensers filled The bleast model seems to condense it in a container partially filled with water, why? Any advantage to doing that?

Reflux is a return to boiling reactor of a liquid condensate recovered after the thermal cracking/catalytic cracking, to get it, we have to maintain a temp at the reflux condenser at witch the diesel would not condensate, but the heavier oils will.

If you don't use catalyst yes you best get it close to reactor, keep it at quite high temperature. If you use caralyst, take care it wont get soaked by any condensate, so may be need to heat it electrically at process start.

Then after the catalyst container, put the reflux condenser maintained (cooled) at the right temp. I suggest air cooled with a thermostat and a air fan.

Catalyst : don't mind ! You gonna try ! just build a catalyst container, designed to have a slow and well distributed flow of gaz thru it, with an opening lid, a controlled themperature electric heater, then you can easily try/change the catalyst.

If you use catalyst container as a reflux tower, it's not good, as the 2 jobs are very different, and catalyst don't like to be liquid soaked, seems. Also have risk of coke forming in the catalyst.

The heavy oils has to cross the catalyst as gaseous, they will find there a chance to be broken into lighter gaseous, without any condensate.

After the catalyst, still have some heavy oils vapour, then send them to a reflux condenser and send them again to boiler reactor by gravity.

Final condenser : the use it to cool the gazeous flux, efficient one would not be a container, but an efficient condenser, that can bear the carbon dust found in the flux, I suggest an old oil radiator could be a good choice....

Water as a condencer at the end : for experimental uses only. You want a dry fuel. Even if will separate, but your fuel would suck a little amount of water and your car will not like.

[imakebiodiesel]

Asad, my car would not run on wvo or wvo or any mixture of the two. I only use very high quality biodiesel.
Vegetable oil is not a long chain hydrocarbon. The average hydro carbon length of a veg oil molecule is about 15, much the same as diesel fuel. So cracking is not necessary or useful. What is happening when you heat vegoil up to 3-400 degrees is distillation. The lightest, most volatile fractions of the oil escape as vapours and are condensed and collected. Intense heat does break the bond between the esters and the glycerol but this results in free fatty acids, not biodiesel.

[Alec]

Returning gas

Now that my reactor is properly isolated (with glass wool), I've got to much returning vapour.
Any ideas on how to store the vapour gas?
Thanks.
Alec.

[otpadnoulje]

Now that my reactor is properly isolated (with glass wool), I've got to much returning vapour.
Any ideas on how to store the vapour gas?
Thanks.
Alec.

Decrease reactor temperature, decrease amount of catalyst. Increase reflux temperature.



Slaughter a sheep!

[Alec]

Decrease reactor temperature, decrease amount of catalyst. Increase reflux temperature.



Slaughter a sheep!

Thanks.
Are you sure about the sheep. (LOL)

[imakebiodiesel]

During World War 2 in Europe many countries experienced severe fuel shortages and resorted to making syn gas to run buses and taxis on. The gas was stored in large bags mounted on the roof of the vehicle and was sometimes as large as the car itself. If you want to store the gas you get from plastic pyrolysis you could do the same. A large inflatable mattress would do the job. then when you want to use the gas place some boards and a heavy weight on top.
Storing gas has some obvious fire risks however and it would be safer to use the gas as it is produced.