How to turn plastic waste into diesel fuel cheaply

[Excalibur]

hi you have make reflux and catalyst together?
if pipe to connect retort with reflux is 50 mm diameter, and terracotta is 50 mm ?? all vapor go inside of terracotta, and exit from other side, non have pression in side of retort?

When I use catalyst, it is put in the reflux. My connecting pipe between reflux and retort is 75mm. I install a stainless perforated plate to prevent catalyst falling into the retort or plugging the connecting pipe. It is positioned part way up the reflux. The terracotta is randomly broken into pieces so there is plenty of gaps when stacked inside the reflux. It gives the gases a kind of labyrinth. Take care that there is never a situation where the retort can accidentally build up pressure!
I hope this helps

[Col]

water absorbing crystals

I wrote an article about DIY water absorbing crystals. I'd tested them some time ago on vege oil with good results. See DIYDiesel blog on test equipment page.

Thanks Excalibur and Wheels. So I think it is safe to assume the Sodium Polyacrylate is inert as far as the hydrocarbons go and leaves no by-product. The product available in garden stores is as good as any other?

As for the crystals not absorbing suspended water - if the fuel were trickled through the crystals it should stand a good chance of absorbing suspended water. Does it take the water up quickly or does it need a longer contact time?

Thanks
Col

[David007]

hu

thanks i am in 40 page, i read all.
good job

[wheels]

Catalysts, Molecular Filters and "Black Magic"

From what I have read so far (I am up to page 75) there has been a lot of Dialogue re Catalysts that I suggest include a lot of confusion. For the Hydrocarbon Industry, Catalysts are simple in how they work, but it's complex in finding what works and how to make it work.
Don't confuse a Catalyst with a Molecular Filter. Which is very easy and I suggest that many of the Catalysts being used are working more as a Molecular Filter rather than acting in the realm of a Catalyst.
Firstly, we need to be clear on what it is that we are trying to achieve. In our case, it is turning the Paraffin into a more useable fuel, rather than have it solidify and make our Fuels difficult to use.

There are many different types of Zeolites. Zeolites are produced in Areas of high Geothermal activity. Volcanic Ashes held deep underground are etched by the Gasses dissolved in the Thermal Steams as they work their way through the Ground to the Surface. What in the Zeolite is determined by what is in the Volcanic Ash. Because Aluminium is a very abundant Mineral in the Earths Crust, Aluminium tends to be a dominant Mineral in the Zeolite and after it has been reacted by the Geothermal Steam, it is found as an Aluminium Silicate in the Zeolite. Other Minerals are also found making Zeolite a complex product. But most importantly, so Zeolites contain Rare Earth Elements and some contain none. This inclusion/exclusion is the important point to consider. We need a Zeolite with no Rare Earth Element. The resulting Catalytic reaction of such results in a Beta Scission Cracking reaction, which works upon high Molecular weight Paraffin's, Cracking such Parrifin to produces a lower molecular weight (= LMW) Olefin's plus a LMW Pariffin.
Such a reaction is endothermic. That means it requires the input of energy to make it happen. This Energy has to come from somewhere and will basically be robed from the Retort Gasses unless we apply heat from an element to the Catalyst. By robing the Gas of Heat energy, the Gasses will simply condense on the Catalyst and block it from contact and thus make it ineffective. In such a case, the Catalyst is now simply being a Filter and probably a poor one at that, with the heavier Hydrocarbons being dropped out and the Catalyst Vessel acting more like a Reflux than Catalyst.

Just as an aside, Zeolites that have Rare Earth Elements in them, tend to work as an Exothermic Reactant, which means it produces Heat. These reactions tend to produce Aromatics and more Coke left in the Vessel at the end of the reaction.

[David007]

Hi Wheels

What is the advantage of putting the scrubber / zeolite filter after the reflux? Could we avoid the cooling and re-heating of the vapour stream by keeping this process at the end? You could have as many scrubbers / zeolite filters as you have types of extracted fuel. After the diesel condenser you could pump the diesel and the sodium hydroxide through atomising injectors into a mixing chamber. Both liquids are in mist form and can emulsify to allow a complete reaction. A fuel sample can be taken and tested for acidification using IMBD's simple titration test. Once the fuel is known to not be acidic the water can be separated from the fuel by heat (90C is enough to displace the bulk of the water) and gravity, then by boiling to 120C to evaporate the remaining water, or some people may prefer a centrifuge. There are also those water absorbing beads / crystals that could take out the residue of the water. Does anyone know how effective these beads / crystals or corn starch filters are at removing trace amounts of water? I expect the zeolite will work just fine mixed into the liquid in powder form, then extracted afterwards, though clay can be difficult to filter out of water, is it difficult to filter out of fuel? This is duplicated for the kerosene and naptha fractions, and the bubbler remains at the gas exit too.

With a scrubber at the end rather than in the middle we don't have to heat back up to 380C again, maybe just 120C.

Comments anyone?

Col

i dont if you can help this video
Cracking a Hydrocarbon - YouTube

AQA core science cracking hydrocarbons - YouTube

i non have build still my "refinery"

[David007]

I wrote an article about DIY water absorbing crystals. I'd tested them some time ago on vege oil with good results. See DIYDiesel blog on test equipment page.

Good video, recommended.
Reflux area about 20% ~ 25% the size of retort.
I'm going to retest terracotta broken clay pots next run as catalyst. I used this earlier on with good results. Re piece size, I'd say whatever gives best exposed area so small but still able to be contained.

hi you have make reflux and catalyst together?
if pipe to connect retort with reflux is 50 mm diameter, and terracotta is 50 mm ?? all vapor go inside of terracotta, and exit from other side, non have pression in side of retort?

[wheels]

There are various type of scrubbers . I did fabricate a prototype and have taken extensive trials . Now I am thinking of continuous type pyrolysis .
There I am considering various options in designs . As earlier here on block our friends has suggested adding of Ca(OH)2 to input material which can reduce the acidity of fuel . I propose if we have hydrous Ca(OH)2 which comes in contact with cracked hydrocarbon gases inside retort this should serve the purpose on the issue of acidic nature of end fuel .

Hmmm, not so sure you want a Base in the Retort, because should any of it get carried up with the Hydrocarbon Gasses, it will then react with any Catalyst and firstly reduce Catalytic Conversion and secondly, neutralize or destroy the Catalyst itself and if you should be one that adds a Catalyst into the Retort as well, then the two are going to react and cancel each other out. I think you want any kind of Base placed after cracking has been carried out.

[wheels]

On the basis of the "open material" suiting heavy gases the pumice seems a good choice for diesel making. Is this likely the case?
In addition it's probably cheapest (or even free).

This is an area that in Practice, I am probably behind you guys with. But yes I would expect so.
Ha, I was also thinking you could probably take a drive to Taupo and pick the stuff up of the Lake Shore I might have to get you to send me down a heap

[ndsunil]

i am not sure what you mean by "Dry Scrubber".
But anyway, No.
We need as much room in the retort as we can get for plastic. We don't have the luxury of having huge Retorts. I think it is better to keep each process separate as it only adds to complications in the Retort along with difficulty in cleaning at the end of a run.

There are various type of scrubbers . I did fabricate a prototype and have taken extensive trials . Now I am thinking of continuous type pyrolysis .
There I am considering various options in designs . As earlier here on block our friends has suggested adding of Ca(OH)2 to input material which can reduce the acidity of fuel . I propose if we have hydrous Ca(OH)2 which comes in contact with cracked hydrocarbon gases inside retort this should serve the purpose on the issue of acidic nature of end fuel .

[Excalibur]

Make a note of which Pots you use. Terracotta is not a "same the world over" material. So you will find some may work better than others, depending on which country and where in that country it came from. The main catalyzing component in Terracotta is Aluminium oxide. The problem with Terracotta is that the pores or capillaries are very fine and so they will block easily and lose it's effectiveness quickly.
Pumice is a good catalyst also. Once again it is Aluminium oxide, but the material is far more "open" allowing the more of the heavy gasses to have contact with the surface.
Zeolite is a good catalyst and one particular type works like a super catalyst. but difficult to find. Basically, Zeolites have many different Chemicals in their make up and all work together as Hydrocarbon cracker by chemical reaction of the Bronsteds Lewis Acid/Base reaction. Basically the Acids provide a proton to the hydrocarbon and that releases a part of that chain. The Proton is gained back by the Base and donated back to the Acid to reform it, thus regenerating. Apart from the problem of the Carbon blocking up the fine pores of the Zeolite and stopping it from working, much like Terracotta.

On the basis of the "open material" suiting heavy gases the pumice seems a good choice for diesel making. Is this likely the case?
In addition it's probably cheapest (or even free).

[wheels]

I'm going to retest terracotta broken clay pots next run as catalyst. I used this earlier on with good results. Re piece size, I'd say whatever gives best exposed area so small but still able to be contained.

Make a note of which Pots you use. Terracotta is not a "same the world over" material. So you will find some may work better than others, depending on which country and where in that country it came from. The main catalyzing component in Terracotta is Aluminium oxide. The problem with Terracotta is that the pores or capillaries are very fine and so they will block easily and lose it's effectiveness quickly.
Pumice is a good catalyst also. Once again it is Aluminium oxide, but the material is far more "open" allowing the more of the heavy gasses to have contact with the surface.
Zeolite is a good catalyst and one particular type works like a super catalyst. but difficult to find. Basically, Zeolites have many different Chemicals in their make up and all work together as Hydrocarbon cracker by chemical reaction of the Bronsteds Lewis Acid/Base reaction. Basically the Acids provide a proton to the hydrocarbon and that releases a part of that chain. The Proton is gained back by the Base and donated back to the Acid to reform it, thus regenerating. Apart from the problem of the Carbon blocking up the fine pores of the Zeolite and stopping it from working, much like Terracotta.

[wheels]

@ WHEEL ,If we design the dry scrubber inside the retort , will it serve the purpose ?

i am not sure what you mean by "Dry Scrubber".
But anyway, No.
We need as much room in the retort as we can get for plastic. We don't have the luxury of having huge Retorts. I think it is better to keep each process separate as it only adds to complications in the Retort along with difficulty in cleaning at the end of a run.

[wheels]

"I wrote an article about DIY water absorbing crystals. I'd tested them some time ago on vege oil with good results. See DIYDiesel blog on test equipment page."
25yrs ago, I was selling a product in NZ called Fuel-Dri. It was what is now found as those crystals they use in Pot Plants to absorb and release water. The product was a much finer crystal and sealed in a Plastic Gauze, which was then placed in a plastic unit that had holes all over it. We had sizes from small enough for motor bike size tanks, Cars, Trucks and right up to underground storage tanks. the Crystals would absorb any water that settled to the bottom of the tank.
However, it did not absorb water that was suspended in fuels. The water had to settle out first and drop to the bottom of the Tank. Diesel was a difficult one to absorb water out of, due to the oil content insulating the crystal surface. It did work, just much slower.

[ndsunil]

The two would have to be separate. The reflux requires Heat close to the Heat of the Main reactor Vessel. In Large scale Refineries, in the Fractionating tower Water is heated to 460degC at the Bottom, but to do that you need huge pressure, like 1000PSI.

@ WHEEL ,If we design the dry scrubber inside the retort , will it serve the purpose ?

[Excalibur]

There are also those water absorbing beads / crystals that could take out the residue of the water. Does anyone know how effective these beads / crystals or corn starch filters are at removing trace amounts of water?

With a scrubber at the end rather than in the middle we don't have to heat back up to 380C again, maybe just 120C.

I wrote an article about DIY water absorbing crystals. I'd tested them some time ago on vege oil with good results. See DIYDiesel blog on test equipment page.

Crude Oil Distillation - YouTube

you can see all rellay process, in side of tower start abou 3: 17 min.

i build my retor abot 75 liter, iron 6 mm !

i like too too build, reflux but i not clear.... what have inside of it?
Stainless Steel potscrube= sphere????
what is diameter???
and glass sphere??
in the 1028 message us pumice stones in reflux tower + catalyst
what is the dimension of pumice stones? is all block, or small pieces?

Good video, recommended.
Reflux area about 20% ~ 25% the size of retort.
I'm going to retest terracotta broken clay pots next run as catalyst. I used this earlier on with good results. Re piece size, I'd say whatever gives best exposed area so small but still able to be contained.