How to turn plastic waste into diesel fuel cheaply

[Beyond Biodiesel]

Nice Design BeyondBiodiesel, how deep is the probe going in the reactor, and where did you find them?

I find my thermocouples on eBay. I purchase them to match compression fittings that I can purchase locally.

Most of these type of shielded thermocouples come in metric sizes, but I cannot buy metric compression fittings locally, so I search for the harder to find and more expensive 1/16" (1.6mm) shielded thermocouples. I buy 1/8" National Pipe Thread (tapered fitting) to 1/16" compression adapters, then I drill them out with a 1/16Th drill bit so that the shielded thermocouple can slide through it. There are 1/8" National Pipe Thread (tapered fitting) ports on the lids of the pressure cookers I use for retort and condenser traps.

I am interested in the temperature of the liquid at the bottom of the retort, and each of my condensers, so the I slide the cap and ferrule onto the TC, then slide the TC through the 1/8" National Pipe Thread (tapered fitting) to 1/16" compression adapter down to just an inch (2.5cm) above the bottom of the retort or condenser, then I tighten the nut on the compression fitting.

[fox32]

Thank you Excalibur,for yet another insightfull post! That's the kind of probe i wanted to use, but i had no idea that they are grounded or ungrounded, so you saved me some money. Also, now i can really see that the insulation is really important, i can see a flaw in my reactor design as i don't have enough room and support to insulate the top plate,but i'm working on it. Maybe pour some clay on it.

As for the bottom layer, i'd say it is like some white powder, like chalk, very fine, that is disturbed very easely. it doesn't appear to be any water. It may be some impurities from my condenser(old barrel).

Nice Design BeyondBiodiesel, how deep is the probe going in the reactor, and where did you find them?

[Beyond Biodiesel]

I really want some tipe of probe that i can screw into the reactor etc.

I use compression fitting adapters to insert my TC probes through, which screw into tapered plumbing fittings. See photo below

[jonathan]

pyrolysis oil

thanks excalibur when l find that little fuel it was very sunny day so tempreture was higher.l will buy that k-type props and try modified my burner for more heat

[Excalibur]

Fox32
Please check, is the bottom layer of distillate, water??

[Excalibur]

Hello guys, here are the results from my first run, took a while, and it started to drip fuel when i had the courage to turn up the burner(still testing the welds and connections, it gave me the creeps).

Also, for anyone else who is using GPL(gas) don't turn on the gas without flame,nor for a little time, it will acumulate on the flue stack, and make a loud terrifing flashbang-like sound, and blow the flue away. Happened to me.

I only had one thermomether, with a thermocouple exactly like the one from Excalibur's post above, and this is my problem, how do you managed to insert that into the reactor, i put it inside a pipe welded into the reactor, but this way i get the temperature of that steel pipe, not directly of the vapours inside, and i can't control the process well.
I was also thinking to buy that type oh temperature sensor the one with screw, and 2 m long cable, but i can't find any that would resist more than 400c, nor on aliexpress,dhl or ebay. Also why you dismiss that kind of thermic probe, is not reliable?
I really want some tipe of probe that i can screw into the reactor etc.


When this was produced my thermomether read 340 c(reactor), but i think that the temperature inside the reactor was greater.

I also noticed 3 different layers of distilate so my reaflux may not work good. I weighted 100 ml from top layer and got 80 grams.

Congrats on the first attempt. You got a result. Now you need a few tweaks. All part of the learning process.
Yes, the first time can be "hair raising" when you realize just how much heat has to be applied. Also you begin to appreciate the value of good insulation.
Yes, those gas explosions can give you quite a fright!
Thermocouple probes: I hollow a bolt, drilling from the head end, stopping short of drilling right through. The part of the bolt that protrudes into the chamber has the threads removed and thinned to the desired wall thickness. A copper washer is used to seal. The TC probe uses a fiberglass insulation which breaks down with heat so my long term plan is to get a simple ceramic insert for the bolt. There are two types of TC: grounded and non-grounded. The probe meter in the Ebay link doesn't care which type it uses. Other digital LCD displays like the bright red ones I use, require non-grounded only. This TC on Ebay is K type (EGT), has a good range to 1250°C and is non-grounded so will work on any meter. It might be a good choice.
80grams per 100ml equates to .800SG which is a bit light for diesel. There may be too much refluxing, the system is not up to working temperature or light fractions were boiling off early.
Hope this helps.

thanks excalibur l do another test today l test my tempretures with meter like gun my lower side of retort was 316 degrees c and upper side of reflux 90 degrees c so l have tempreture proplem l bye tempreture props

Temperatures are low. The retort is below cracking temperature so even if some light weight fraction was coming off as vapor, the low reflux temperature would likely recycle it back to the retort. Either you need more heat and/or better insulation. And you really need k-type thermocouple probes on both vessels.
A note about insulation. I was at a scrap metal yard on Friday. I bought some steel pipe. Then I noticed an old boiler. I asked about the kaowool insulation and was told to take it away for free. I got 4 square meters else it would have been dumped. Wear a dust mask if you recycle this kind of thing. It was really dusty!

[jonathan]

pyrolysis oil

thanks excalibur l do another test today l test my tempretures with meter like gun my lower side of retort was 316 degrees c and upper side of reflux 90 degrees c so l have tempreture proplem l bye tempreture props

[fox32]

Hello guys, here are the results from my first run, took a while, and it started to drip fuel when i had the courage to turn up the burner(still testing the welds and connections, it gave me the creeps).

Also, for anyone else who is using GPL(gas) don't turn on the gas without flame,nor for a little time, it will acumulate on the flue stack, and make a loud terrifing flashbang-like sound, and blow the flue away. Happened to me.

I only had one thermomether, with a thermocouple exactly like the one from Excalibur's post above, and this is my problem, how do you managed to insert that into the reactor, i put it inside a pipe welded into the reactor, but this way i get the temperature of that steel pipe, not directly of the vapours inside, and i can't control the process well.
I was also thinking to buy that type oh temperature sensor the one with screw, and 2 m long cable, but i can't find any that would resist more than 400c, nor on aliexpress,dhl or ebay. Also why you dismiss that kind of thermic probe, is not reliable?
I really want some tipe of probe that i can screw into the reactor etc.


When this was produced my thermomether read 340 c(reactor), but i think that the temperature inside the reactor was greater.

I also noticed 3 different layers of distilate so my reaflux may not work good. I weighted 100 ml from top layer and got 80 grams.
All the best!


flash
DSCF8258.JPG

no flash
DSCF8259.JPG

[Samott]

I don’t know temperature, because mensuration was bed, retort is 240 C and reflux 70 C. I will buy an athor thermometer.
Thank you the answers.

[Excalibur]

thanks excalibur maybe tempreture proplem i will check my tempretures next time.are this probs good?.l meant i dont want to use blind hole.thanks
RTD PT100-K Temperature Sensor 2m Cable Stainless Probe 100mm 2 Wires T5 | eBay

I agree with BB. Use a k-type thermocouple for the retort and reflux. My first one I bought: one like this unit on ebay. It worked well. Has two probes.

Samott, what temperatures were the retort and reflux? The reflux temperature may be too high.

[Beyond Biodiesel]

thanks excalibur maybe tempreture proplem i will check my tempretures next time.are this probs good?.l meant i dont want to use blind hole.thanks
RTD PT100-K Temperature Sensor 2m Cable Stainless Probe 100mm 2 Wires T5 | eBay

An RTD is not the sensor to use for the range that pyrolysis occurs. It is better to use a type K TC (thermocouple).

Hi!
I use waste oil, with pp. I get one forte liter fuel liquid, then installation rough-hewn vibration so I stopped. The end I get so far a bit fuel in the first condenser but it was plastic granulous . In the second condenser was “clear” fuel. Now the first condenser it be full of plastic (: Why?

The reflux column was empty.

Thanks for the photos, they help diagnose your problems. It sounds to me like all is good, but cracking is marginal. Do you know your retort temperature? Thermal cracking occurs at 400c.

Are you using a catalyst? If not then if you add one, then you will get better results. If you can not buy zeolite, then just add a cup of ash to every 4L of liquid to be cracked.

[Hoddamdg11]

Archives


I have gone through all the posts up to page 110 , broken them up into 15 categories and saved them as MSWord tables as my aide memoir.
It’s now a big ask to get people to read all the posts from the beginning, which is not all that helpful anyway if your memory is getting as bad as mine has over the last few years.
Many of the early posts have lots of useful information, notably Jetijs details of his early electrically heated setup as well as the evolution of plastic pyrolysis, as recent contributions mainly involve Waste Motor Oil as a raw material, with lots on continuous feed.
I have seen the same questions get asked repeatedly, again and again and again, so hopefully to avoid this I would like to make the posts available to members of the forum at a nominal cost but am not sure how to approach this. I have limited download per month, so emailing is out, I don’t have a website, so all I can think of is to copy them onto DVD’s or memory sticks and post them – Australia Post is pretty good but I don’t know about others. There is also the problem of covering my expenditure, say in the region of $10-$20 and how to get it. No amount of money could repay me for the time spent on this, so it’s not a business proposition - more a labour of love, and to say thank you to all the contributors.
What do the moderators think of this proposal? Is it Legal?
Any ideas, comments, suggestions or criticisms are welcome. I can be contacted by email: tremanag@hotmail.com
Regards
John

[Samott]

Hi!
I use waste oil, with pp. I get one forte liter fuel liquid, then installation rough-hewn vibration so I stopped. The end I get so far a bit fuel in the first condenser but it was plastic granulous . In the second condenser was “clear” fuel. Now the first condenser it be full of plastic (: Why?

Here is some picture:
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[IMG]
A képet a Képfeltöltés.hu tárolja. Képfeltöltés.hu - korlátlan ingyen tárhely képeidnek, regisztráció nélkül[/IMG]



A képet a Képfeltöltés.hu tárolja. Képfeltöltés.hu - korlátlan ingyen tárhely képeidnek, regisztráció nélkül

The reflux column was empty.

[jonathan]

retort problem

thanks excalibur maybe tempreture proplem i will check my tempretures next time.are this probs good?.l meant i dont want to use blind hole.thanks
RTD PT100-K Temperature Sensor 2m Cable Stainless Probe 100mm 2 Wires T5 | eBay

[Excalibur]

Good thoughts about retort level devices. Also continuous feed into near empty retort vs feed into liquid at a maintained level. Great food for thought!

My thoughts on feeding to empty retort is that very tight control of temperature and feed would be crucial. Feeding to a maintained level gives more of a buffer. Both approaches would work. I'm using the latter otherwise I'd have built the retort much smaller. For me a level indicator is a key piece. I hope to try another level indicator prototype within the next few weeks.

Samott, as fox32 says, it sounds as though you don't have any reflux or you had boil-over. Please post some good, clear photos so the problem can be identified.

Jonathan, Initial bubbling at around 100°C can be water vapor making steam. WMO can be a mixture of different oils, kero, petrol etc, each with its' their own boiling point. The lighter fractions start to boil early. If you haven't got any thermocouples, then you need to get some. Otherwise you are blind to what the reactor and reflux temperature is.
If your fuel ignites then it will have a volatile content. If you want stable diesel, then you need to hold it at enough temperature to evaporate the volatile off. These volatiles can be condensed in a separate condenser. Again temperature sensors on these condensers is worthwhile to refine the product.