Muller generator replication by Romerouk

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, hi elias, thanks for making those tests.
I wonder If this only applies to permanent magnet to permanent magnet interactions.
Reason I say this is because with my dual rotor air coil pulse motor, it seemed to have pretty much the same torque and speed when in repulsion or attraction.

Maybe in a coil pulse motor, it could be because the permanent magnet field permeates the coil, even in repulsion and so gives a different result from a strictly permanent magnet interaction, which does not allow such permeating of the fields. Just a few thoughts and my observations.
peace love light
tyson

[elias]

Hi folks, hi elias, thanks for making those tests.
I wonder If this only applies to permanent magnet to permanent magnet interactions.
Reason I say this is because with my dual rotor air coil pulse motor, it seemed to have pretty much the same torque and speed when in repulsion or attraction.

Maybe in a coil pulse motor, it could be because the permanent magnet field permeates the coil, even in repulsion and so gives a different result from a strictly permanent magnet interaction, which does not allow such permeating of the fields. Just a few thoughts and my observations.
peace love light
tyson

I can not elaborate on that. Maybe to see any noticeable effect you need to use cores in you coils, and of course that would inject a sticking problem, which is eliminated by the muller design. Any way I don't know more than I have observed, that is what experimentation is all about. I predicted that the Attraction power should be about 1.618 times the repulsion power, and guess what, the calculator gravityblock posted gives pull and push forces which are approximately related to each other by the Golden Mean (1.618). You can see it on this website by yourself:

Pull And Push Between 2 Rect Magnets

[gravityblock]

Correlated Magnetic Research (CMR)!

This is going to change everything you ever thought you knew about magnetism. Watch this video on "Multi-Level Magnetism" very carefully.

The video shows that the near-field repulsive force is stronger than the near-field attractive force, while the far-field attractive force is stronger than the far-field repulsive force. The reverse can be achieved also. In addition to the near and far fields, there is a shortest path. At the "zero point" there is an equal repel and attractive force. This can be seen where the magnets are repelling each other, while they are also attracting each other. Also, note how they were able to dynamically change the "zero point" in real time. As you can see, the repel force between the magnets is equal in strength to the attractive force between the magnets under the right conditions. If they're not equal in strength between the magnets, then it's because some of it's strength is elsewhere and it's field isn't totally concentrated between the magnets, but there's an equal net force still present.

Reference Links:

Video Gallery on Correlated Magnets.
Correlated Magnetics
Coding Theory.
Correlation Theory.

Spend two hours researching this site, and your view on magnetism will be much different. Some of the links above has a "next" and "previous" button to navigate through the presentation. The correlated magnets can also be done with two arrays or with multiple electromagnets.

GB

[toranarod]

todays experiment

The test results for today

coil inductance 11 mH

Motor RPM 2300

frequency off main generator coils 280 Hz

wired in a capacitor to make an LC circuit from the generator coils and was able to boost output voltage to 160 volts

[toranarod]

I would like to make one important observation.

The Muller motor has been a very worth while experiment OU or no OU
I have learned Much from it and it will take weeks of testing before I have concluded all my test results. the more testing I do the more testing I find I can do.

Every body who builds pulse motors should build one of theses.

I will do a Video its going to be the only way now to share what i have seen.

cheers

[totoalas]

Proposed Muller gen coil mag set up

Hi to all
Hope somebody can comment on my set up before i fix my coil

thanks

totoalas




Muller Gen Coil magnet set up.doc

[pault]

This is going to change everything you ever thought you knew about magnetism.
...GB

Yes, fascinating!

Reminded me of this video. Watch what happens at the end. Is this a cheap example of correlation?

YouTube - ‪431 magnets and a little levitation‬‏

pt

[hadcat]

It is nice to know they are now doing this with neos.
It is not a new discovery at all though. We did this already in 1981 or so. Pretolite/Autolite motor model shop used this same thing using magnetic transfer.

Easy to do using laminations and pins of aluminum, brass and copper. Seems to work better just using patterns in carbon steel with .062 pins pressed in of the different materials. Makes a better magnetic parallel too!

Wonder how they patented this since it has been used in industry since the 80's?

[minoly]

This is going to change everything you ever thought you knew about magnetism. Watch this video on "Multi-Level Magnetism" very carefully.

The video shows that the near-field repulsive force is stronger than the near-field attractive force, while the far-field attractive force is stronger than the far-field repulsive force. The reverse can be achieved also. In addition to the near and far fields, there is a shortest path. At the "zero point" there is an equal repel and attractive force. This can be seen where the magnets are repelling each other, while they are also attracting each other. Also, note how they were able to dynamically change the "zero point" in real time. As you can see, the repel force between the magnets is equal in strength to the attractive force between the magnets under the right conditions. If they're not equal in strength between the magnets, then it's because some of it's strength is elsewhere and it's field isn't totally concentrated between the magnets, but there's an equal net force still present.

Reference Links:

Video Gallery on Correlated Magnets.
Correlated Magnetics
Coding Theory.
Correlation Theory.

Spend two hours researching this site, and your view on magnetism will be much different. Some of the links above has a "next" and "previous" button to navigate through the presentation. The correlated magnets can also be done with two arrays or with multiple electromagnets.

GB

are they just manipulating polarity but the basic forces are still intact?

YouTube - ‪Магнитная яма Николаева из 6 магнитов.m2ts‬‏

the more I think about how Romero manipulated the dynamo to speed up, it reminds me of the Kromrey Converter as well as Ed S's work. the way the magnets on the end of the coils are configured, they are so strong, the fields could be wrapping completely around the coils. I wonder...

Lid-
do you have a "horse shoe" you could put one end at the top of each coil?

-----
I II coil
I ------rotor w/ magnets------
I II coil
-----

so this part is the "horse shoe":

-----
I
I
I
-----

the double II's are the coils
II

II

and the -'s is the rotor w/ magnets

------

you would have to experiment w/ placing magnets on the ends of the coil and your coil would have to have cores. the coils and cores would have to come in contact w/ the "horse shoe" all the way around making a C shape. this would basically be the Kromrey Converter inside out, without the need for the DC commutator.

hope it makes sense, I will complete myself when new magnets arrive this week. I just want to put it out there for anyone that can do the quick test...
looking for ways for this to speed up under load. of course I would like to know how Romero did it as well.

Patrick

[Lidmotor]

Horse shoe magnet on a Muller

are they just manipulating polarity but the basic forces are still intact?

YouTube - ‪Магнитная яма Николаева из 6 магнитов.m2ts‬‏

the more I think about how Romero manipulated the dynamo to speed up, it reminds me of the Kromrey Converter as well as Ed S's work. the way the magnets on the end of the coils are configured, they are so strong, the fields could be wrapping completely around the coils. I wonder...

Lid-
do you have a "horse shoe" you could put one end at the top of each coil?

-----
I II coil
I ------rotor w/ magnets------
I II coil
-----

so this part is the "horse shoe":

-----
I
I
I
-----

the double II's are the coils
II

II

and the -'s is the rotor w/ magnets

------

you would have to experiment w/ placing magnets on the ends of the coil and your coil would have to have cores. the coils and cores would have to come in contact w/ the "horse shoe" all the way around making a C shape. this would basically be the Kromrey Converter inside out, without the need for the DC commutator.

hope it makes sense, I will complete myself when new magnets arrive this week. I just want to put it out there for anyone that can do the quick test...
looking for ways for this to speed up under load. of course I would like to know how Romero did it as well.

Patrick

@Patrick
Back in December Woopy (Laurent) and a bunch of us worked with kinda this idea. We were studying Ed Leedskalnin's "permanent magnet holder". It is funny that you would ask me about it because I have been thinking about it also. I don't know if it would be of any benefit in this project. It gets away from the main topic of this thread but it is an interesting idea and I may try it on my testing setup. Here is a video that I made around Christmas showing the work that I did:

YouTube - ‪PMH Motor.ASF‬‏

@ Toranarod
Rod your statemant about this being a worthwhile project whether or not we find OU I totally agree with. I learned many things so far working with this thing. The interesting part is that very few people would have spent the time and money to build one of these IF the Romero Muller was known to be a hoax at the start. If he had explained HOW he did it at the very beginning, we all would have had a good laugh and moved on. Sometimes unexpected things happen along the way and it makes the journey worthwhile. No matter how this turns out we should thank him for that----BUT if someone gets one of these REALLY working then it changes the world. That would be a great big thank you.

@ All
I am still working with this and have a few things to share. The weekend just slowed me down. Family comes first. This hobby comes second.

Lidmotor

[hadcat]

Here is a group of 3 videos that explain Eds magnet.

YouTube - ‪Ed Leedskalnin 3‬‏

This one uses shims to show how this can be tuned.

YouTube - ‪Ed Leedskalnin Magnet 4‬‏

This one sums it all up.

YouTube - ‪Ed Leedskalnin Magnet 5‬‏

I wonder if you could light up both the forward light and the emf light just by shimming the magnet that is used in the first video,

Watch all 3 of these and I think everyone will get a better understanding of how to tune the coils.

I posted about this earlier on but it was passed by by most.

This is how you change the frequency and tune transformer coils...Shims.

[minoly]

Those are good videos - we've seen all - thanks :-), we made the same "u bolt" type motor using the Bedini Cole ckt as well. we have a small PMH that's been holding over 1Lb for some months now.

no no no... Sorry, what I propose is only similar due to the "locking" of the U shaped iron.

has anyone studied the Kromrey Converter? the Kromrey and JB's 3GT (the center re-gauging 10 coil part) both use a bit of Ed's PMH science. The Kromrey is a generator.

What I propose here is to use the "U" shaped iron to complete the C shape using the coil pairs.

I will attempt to attach a lame drawing below.
Sorry I did not want to distract from the learning of Romero's device, but this just popped into my head, and thought it would be a very simple experiment for anyone who already has the rotor and a couple of cores in place.
Unless my thought is way off base (wouldn't be the first time:-), this should effectively turn the Kromrey inside out, and we should get an increase in speed under load (without a whole lot of tuning). there are other ways to make the C shape for anyone who has watched JB's 3GT vids.

Patrick

[Joit]

Toranarod,
reading over there on OU.com, you have to much Heath at the Coils.
May try to move the Coils a bit away from the Rotor, since it seems, that the Magnets produce more Power in there, as they can handle, and you get losses, since you oversaturate the Coils?

[redrichie]

Ive been thinking the same thing also Minoly. Exactly that. It kind of reminds me about one of JB's patents. This is kind of what I was saying at the beginning of the thread. Very similar to ED's work. which in turn is similar to JB's work. Not that anyone is copying anything. But if its the type of system that works then they would be similar in many ways.
Ive been thinking of casting a few magnetite C type cores the way you drew em. I really think, thin acrylic tube that can be bent with a heat gun should suffice for the core form. wind coils. put over acrylic tube. bend to desired shape. stuff with as much magnetite/resin as possible.

[mikrovolt]

Another informative series :
zerofossilfuel #281 Muller Magnet motor dynamo&

In this video whoopie looks at the attraction mode:
YouTube - ‪romero-muller 2.wmv‬‏

I see the dark stuff (magnetic flux) going around not being absorbed by the copper
why does it prefer to travel with the disc and other magnets and how can it be
influenced to be attracted to the copper more ?