Coil Shorting Techniques.

[Neight]

I would be happy to try anything you have in mind! getting some guidance here would be excellent!
I am using a regular SSG to drive the rotor, bifiler wound coil going into the SSG circuit and has a cap pulser on the output.
the coils and reed switch I have set up are completely independent of the rotor driver.
if you have ideas, just let me know, I would be happy to try them

thanks on the reply about the cap, I didn't think it was a 3F, but it was the only marking on the cap besides the negative lead mark
N8

[Zooty]

Ok, i'm glad you said you are using the standard SSG setup Im assuming you have the standard diode coming from the collector of your transistor to the cap pulser circuit input. Connect one of your separate coils that you was using for the shorting in series with the cap pulser. So basically one side of the coil connected to the diode and the other side to the cap pulser so the radiant spike has to go through this coil to get to the cap pulser. Position the coil against the wheel and you should get a speed up and still fill your cap. If it slows down then connect the coil the other way round instead. I briefly tried it on my window motor and the wheel sped up nicely while the input went down. The input may not go down on your setup but it wont go up either mainly because of the standard SSG circuit but none the less, a free gain in rpm is good because the coil shorting part will work even better with another separate coil.

[Zooty]

Sorry N8, i just remembered something. It may speed up with the coil either way round but one way will be better than the other. Basically, when the pulse fly's through the coil, it will generate a magnetic field in the core and depending on which way round it is connected should push the wheel if the coil is positioned above a magnet at the time. If the coil is connected the wrong way round, it will produce a south magnetic field and attract the rotor instead of push it BUT, if pulse happens in between 2 of the norths then it will repel the "virtual south" which does exist in between 2 norths. It's not as strong but it does work. You can also use the coil the wrong way round to attract an incoming north instead of pushing but my results doing this was not as good. I hope i haven't confused you.

[ZeropointEnergy]

switching idea

Ok found my video cord
I have been busy the last few days, and haven't had time to work on anything new, or any mods so nothing really new to report right now.
here is a link to my youtube channel. the top two videos are the ones I took of my coil shorting work.
the second video is short, since I got cut off
still getting settled in the new house, but I am itching to get working on my "new" workbench! it's like moving from a closet to a warehouse
once I get myself organized, it's back to work testing and will hopefully have some new stuff to add soon !

YouTube - ‪picturen8's Channel‬‏

enjoy the vids and thanks for watching
N8

Hey N8,

Nice clip, looks like you are getting some results and more importantly, learning about the shorting process. I was watching EFTV 7 and noticed how the window motors triggering is set up for the reed switch. (well my opinion) Seemed to have a biasing neo magnet on the same shaft as the rotor, that engages the reed switch on every rotation. This way you could gear the switching scaled up/down to obtain the peak voltage of the sine wave when the short occurs for highest voltage output

Regards
Zero

[Zooty]

Hey N8,

Nice clip, looks like you are getting some results and more importantly, learning about the shorting process. I was watching EFTV 7 and noticed how the window motors triggering is set up for the reed switch. (well my opinion) Seemed to have a biasing neo magnet on the same shaft as the rotor, that engages the reed switch on every rotation. This way you could gear the switching scaled up/down to obtain the peak voltage of the sine wave when the short occurs for highest voltage output

Regards
Zero

I had an alternative thought on this one, we know the primary circuit fires on every magnet so maybe we could use this signal with an opto to fire a separate fet or transistor to short a separate coil around the wheel. All we would need to do is position the coil for the AC peaks. Alternatively we could trigger a 555 in monostable mode which in turn would fire the fet but a 555 can be used to set the short duration too.

[Neight]

Sorry N8, i just remembered something. It may speed up with the coil either way round but one way will be better than the other. Basically, when the pulse fly's through the coil, it will generate a magnetic field in the core and depending on which way round it is connected should push the wheel if the coil is positioned above a magnet at the time. If the coil is connected the wrong way round, it will produce a south magnetic field and attract the rotor instead of push it BUT, if pulse happens in between 2 of the norths then it will repel the "virtual south" which does exist in between 2 norths. It's not as strong but it does work. You can also use the coil the wrong way round to attract an incoming north instead of pushing but my results doing this was not as good. I hope i haven't confused you.

Ok, I have been pretty busy today, but I did manage to do a little preliminary testing.
hooking up my small coils in series with the output diode of the SSG did give some results on just a quick test.
with no extra coils on it, my rotor got up to around 1333 RPM. with the small coil hooked up and oriented and placed correctly, the RPM went up close to 1370 RPM. I have not tried any gen coils around it yet, but I am sure if i can make a good shorting circuit and get my placement right, I should still be able to see the RPM boost from the coil on the SSG output.
thanks for the tip on that, and when I get some more results, I will make another video and post it up with everything I got.
I would like to try a 4 coil setup around my rotor.
1. the SSG drive/collection bifiler coil
2. the boost coil from the SSG output
3-4 would be a two coil shorting setup like I have been working with.
see if I can get them all in place around my rotor and just keep making progress

@ zero
I really like that idea, and it seems like it would be an efficient way to get the gen coils to short at the peaks
I have been wanting to build a window motor for some time now, but I don't have all the parts i need (mostly something to use as a rotor, and enough wire to wind the coils around it...)
this is just another reason I need to get myself moving on a new build that is a little better for testing. as you can see from my videos, my current setup is a little too small to really get to work with anything significant around the rotor besides a few very small coils.

going to do some testing tonight, and will hopefully have some results to post in the next few days (tomorrow is my daughters birthday, so tonight and tomorrow I wont be able to get a lot done, but I do have a few quick ideas I can try tonight and at least get myself started)

thanks for the tip on the output coil booster for the SSG, and I will let you know if i find anything interesting with it
N8

[ZeropointEnergy]

Peak timer/switch

I had an alternative thought on this one, we know the primary circuit fires on every magnet so maybe we could use this signal with an opto to fire a separate fet or transistor to short a separate coil around the wheel. All we would need to do is position the coil for the AC peaks. Alternatively we could trigger a 555 in monostable mode which in turn would fire the fet but a 555 can be used to set the short duration too.

Hey Zooty,

That is a great idea using the 555 timer x2, optocoupler, and fet to create the electrical switch to short coils at their AC peak.
Do you have a circuit drawn out for this?

Regards
Zero

[Zooty]

@Zero, I'm working on it as we speak

N8, thats great. I am assuming your pulsing coil is low resistance/inductance which is why you might not be getting a big increase in RPM. A bigger coil will give better results, also, a bifilar coil where the end of one coil is connected to the beginning of the other coil like 2 series coils triples the inductance giving even better results. Thanks for trying it out

By the way N8, does your separate coil have a core?

[Neight]

@Zero, I'm working on it as we speak

N8, thats great. I am assuming your pulsing coil is low resistance/inductance which is why you might not be getting a big increase in RPM. A bigger coil will give better results, also, a bifilar coil where the end of one coil is connected to the beginning of the other coil like 2 series coils triples the inductance giving even better results. Thanks for trying it out

By the way N8, does your separate coil have a core?

I am very interesting in the 555 timer circuit as well. I do have one that I can use, and depending on the rest of the components, I may be able to try that out as well

the coil I was using does have a core, they are short nails, and it seems to work well. I have a few pieces of ferrite I want to use, but none of them are small enough to fit in the bobbin core I have.

the two small coils I have wound up so far are 2.0Ω and 1.9Ω resistance, though I don't know how to find the inductance of them.

I do have a bifiler coil I can use, it is much bigger, though I don't have a core for it. I did happen to find (by very happy coincidence, in the basement of the house I just moved into) a salt shaker full of iron filings. I am going to buy some two part epoxy and attempt to make my own ferrite core for it and see what happens

last night turned out to not be my night. I zapped myself a few times being careless. had a long day and I was pretty tired, and after the 2nd zap, I decided I needed to just read and watch some videos

I will be trying some stuff tonight though, and will be much more careful

thanks for the suggestions and I will keep posting my results

N8

[Zooty]

Well, i am about to cut a new stand and frame for my window motor. This time it will have an adjustable coil so i can change the distance from the coil. I am going to add the booster coil and upload a vid if all goes well then ill finish the 555 and upload that one too. Try your bifilar coil with some loose metal in the core, just make sure the magnet side is blocked off You'll be surprised at the result. There is another thing you will discover with this coil in series. If you put a rectifier across it, you'll get another HV pulse from the collapse of the first pulse

[ZeropointEnergy]

Inductance

I am very interesting in the 555 timer circuit as well. I do have one that I can use, and depending on the rest of the components, I may be able to try that out as well

the coil I was using does have a core, they are short nails, and it seems to work well. I have a few pieces of ferrite I want to use, but none of them are small enough to fit in the bobbin core I have.

the two small coils I have wound up so far are 2.0Ω and 1.9Ω resistance, though I don't know how to find the inductance of them.

I do have a bifiler coil I can use, it is much bigger, though I don't have a core for it. I did happen to find (by very happy coincidence, in the basement of the house I just moved into) a salt shaker full of iron filings. I am going to buy some two part epoxy and attempt to make my own ferrite core for it and see what happens

last night turned out to not be my night. I zapped myself a few times being careless. had a long day and I was pretty tired, and after the 2nd zap, I decided I needed to just read and watch some videos

I will be trying some stuff tonight though, and will be much more careful

thanks for the suggestions and I will keep posting my results

N8

Hey N8,

Math is the only way I can find the inductance of the coil,

L = N^2 x A x u / l

where:

L = inductance, in henrys (H)
N = number of turns
A = Cross sectional area, in square meters (m^2)
u = Permeabilty
l = Length of core in meters (m)

The 3 main materials I use in coil and their pereabilities are,

Air or Vacuum = 1.26 x 10^-6
Machine Steel = 5.65 x 10^-4
Transformer Iron = 6.9 x 10^-3

Ferrite was not in my table for my textbook,
you can find online though I'm sure

Will give you an example, plus I usually draw them so can
mark all the variables down.

Example: Nickel Core,
thus: u = 6.28 x 10^-5
N = 5 turns
A = 0.01m^2
l = 0.001m

Therefore,

L = 5^2 x 0.01 x (6.28 x 10^-5) / 0.001

= 15.7mH.

Hope this helps you out bro and I had the equations on hand to calculate the
generator coil I wound, but will add mild steel electrodes now and thus will
change a variable.
Bifilar coils is a different equation, will have to look that one up

Regards
Zero

[ZeropointEnergy]

Carefull with coils:P

I am very interesting in the 555 timer circuit as well. I do have one that I can use, and depending on the rest of the components, I may be able to try that out as well

the coil I was using does have a core, they are short nails, and it seems to work well. I have a few pieces of ferrite I want to use, but none of them are small enough to fit in the bobbin core I have.

the two small coils I have wound up so far are 2.0Ω and 1.9Ω resistance, though I don't know how to find the inductance of them.

I do have a bifiler coil I can use, it is much bigger, though I don't have a core for it. I did happen to find (by very happy coincidence, in the basement of the house I just moved into) a salt shaker full of iron filings. I am going to buy some two part epoxy and attempt to make my own ferrite core for it and see what happens

last night turned out to not be my night. I zapped myself a few times being careless. had a long day and I was pretty tired, and after the 2nd zap, I decided I needed to just read and watch some videos

I will be trying some stuff tonight though, and will be much more careful

thanks for the suggestions and I will keep posting my results

N8

Hey N8,

I didn't mention that other night when finished 850 turn bifilar coil for
new SSG, I thought add meter to it and see what happens when I place it 90
degrees from current SSG's rotor. (could'nt help myself)
The coil was obtaining 5-7V (used #23 winding) and when hooked up a FWBR to a 100V/10uF cap it charged in 10 seconds or so.

Now it gets funny, I placed coil close to induce more energy and the rotor sucked in the coil and the electrodes protruding damaged the tape on my rotor, so I thought.
After finished cycle and examined closer it appears that I broke the epoxy bond on a magnet.
( was afraid of that , the SSG has been running smooth and did'nt want to change anything on rotor)

Found the positive to all this, the epoxy bond that broke was the only amount I didnt weigh and was less mass then the other 3, so can do it
again after finishing this 20th cycle first , so taped it back on for last test. (is safe still had them all taped on before used epoxy and lasted)

Regards
Zero

[ZeropointEnergy]

Coils inductance

Well, i am about to cut a new stand and frame for my window motor. This time it will have an adjustable coil so i can change the distance from the coil. I am going to add the booster coil and upload a vid if all goes well then ill finish the 555 and upload that one too. Try your bifilar coil with some loose metal in the core, just make sure the magnet side is blocked off You'll be surprised at the result. There is another thing you will discover with this coil in series. If you put a rectifier across it, you'll get another HV pulse from the collapse of the first pulse

Hey,

I'll look on your channel to see if you added any new clips and the new circuit.
I was playing around with a few coils and found that on my set up the coils
achieve greater induced voltage with a bore 19mm or less.(and over 400 turns)
I'm not sure if the inductance is too high now with the welding rods as core,
or add another coil in series to catch the extra spike as the field collapses
with a FWBR.

Was thinking a trifilar coil to hook up in parallel to cut the inductance by a
factor of 3 so can use 0.4mm copper wire, or keep testing coils in series
with new variables.

I'm not having much success with my coils when I use them for shorting,
though provide amazing results when use them for Impulse tech .

Regards
Zero

[kEhYo77]

Hi.

I've decided to give this thread a go as I finally started to work on this coil shorting technique.

I will be using ArduinoUNO micro-controller for this purpose.



I've just finished putting together the coil shorting module part and some testing should follow soon.



This module is capable of driving many parallel MOSFETs or IGBTs.
Peak driver current is 9A. I've got really good IGBTs right now and paralleling them might not be necessery
as it all comes down to low resistance of the shorting "contact" according to Ismael. IGBTs are better in that respect.
My thoughts on this is the dv/dt switching time plays even more important role than the really low resistance.
With this config I am able to short ends of a coil with a potential difference of 1000V with 25ns rise/fall time.
I will be doing the shorting at peaks multiple times with a freely adjustable time window starting at any given point on a sine wave.
Easy to implement when you are dealing with constant frequency using some zero crossing detection circuit triggering hardware interrupt on Arduino...



Here is a bit of code I came up with for the module to do the shorting.

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
//                                                  COIL SHORTING v1.0 by kEhYo77@gmail.com                                                           //
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

const int plsPin = 5;                                 // dedicated pin for using hardware counter to measure triggering frequency
const int csmPin = 10;                                // signal pin output to control COIL SHORTING MODULE (CSM)
const int int0Pin = 2;                                // dedicated pin for using hardware interrupt 0
const int delayPot = 1;                               // potentiometer for setting the delay period befor the shorting starts to occure
const int countPot = 2;                               // potentiometer for setting the number of shorting pulses per trigger event
const int pulsePot = 3;                               // potentiometer for setting the pulse widtch of shorting event
const int bemfPot = 4;                                // potentiometer for setting the period to collect BEMF from the shorting event
unsigned int count;                                   // variable used by the hardware timer function
unsigned int shtDelay = 0;                            // time window delaying shorting sequence after zero crossing detection trigger
unsigned int shtPulse = 0;                            // time window for coil shorting pulse width (CMS ON)
unsigned int shtBEMF = 0;                             // time window for BEMF recovery from shorting the coil (CMS OFF)
unsigned int shtCount = 0;                            // number of shorting events per trigger, numer of shorts
unsigned int frequency = 0;                           // zoro crossing detector triggering frequency from the hardware counter
volatile boolean pulseON = false;                     // variable that can be changed from within the interrupt function

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// INITIALISATION ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

void setup() {
  pinMode(csmPin, OUTPUT);                            // prepering output pin for coil shorting module ON/OFF controll
  digitalWrite(csmPin, LOW);                          // CSM is OFF which means that the coil has 'OPEN' ends
  pinMode(plsPin, INPUT);                             // prepering the pin for input
  digitalWrite(plsPin, HIGH);                         // hardware counter setup for counting input pulses
  pinMode(int0Pin, INPUT);                            // prepering the pin for input to trigger hardware interrupt 0
  bitClear(ADCSRA,ADPS0);                             //  \
  bitClear(ADCSRA,ADPS1);                             //   } running analog pot inputs with higher than normal speed clock (set prescale to 16)
  bitSet(ADCSRA,ADPS2);                               //  /
  TCCR1A=0;                                           // reset timer/counter control register & starting the clock counting pulses from pin 5 input
  getCount();                                         // getting the value from the hardware trigger counter on pin 5
  attachInterrupt(0, trigger, RISING);                // enables INT0 interrupt on Pin 2 input to execute CSM turn ON/OFF cycle
  Serial.begin(115200);                               // send and receive through USB serial port at 9600 baud rate
}

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// MAIN  LOOP //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

void loop() {
  if (millis()%1000==0) {                             // executed when a realtime clock reaches full second (every second)
    frequency = getCount();                           // triggering frequency readout from the hardware counter
    shtDelay = analogRead(delayPot);                  // setting the delay time window (1024 us maximum)
    shtCount = analogRead(countPot)/128;              // setting the number of pulses (8 times maximum)
    shtPulse = analogRead(pulsePot)/16;               // setting the pulse width of a coil shorting event (64 us maximum)
    shtBEMF = analogRead(bemfPot)/8;                  // setting the time window for BEMF recovery (128 us maximum)
  }
  if (millis()%3000==0) {                             // executed every 3 seconds
    Serial.print("pulseCOUNT: ");
    Serial.println(shtCount);                         // prints the shorting pulse count in the Arduino's serial monitor
    Serial.print("pulseWIDTH: ");
    Serial.println(shtPulse);                         // prints the shorting pulse width
    Serial.print("windowBEMF: ");
    Serial.println(shtBEMF);                          // prints the shorting pulse width for BEMF recovery
    Serial.print("tFREQUENCY: ");
    Serial.println(frequency);                        // prints the triggering frequency
    Serial.println("");
  }
}

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// End of the MAIN LOOP /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

void trigger() {                                      // function executed at trigger event
  if (shtPulse!=0 && shtBEMF!=0 && shtCount!=0) {     // do the shorting when every pot's value is bigger than 0
    if (shtDelay!=0) {
      for (int k=0; k<<shtDelay; k++){                // time delay before the shorting event
        bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);                  // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
        bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);                  // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
      }
    }
    for (int j=1; j<=shtCount; j++){                  // do the shorting X times
       for (int i=0; i<=10; i++){                     // do the coil shorting, output goes HIGH
          bitSet(PORTB, csmPin - 8);                  // the quickest way to turn the output pin HIGH
            for (int x=0; x<=shtPulse; x++) {
              bitSet(PORTB, csmPin - 8);              // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
              bitSet(PORTB, csmPin - 8);              // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
            }
          bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);                // output goes LOW for a period of BEMF recovery value
            for (int x=0; x<=shtBEMF; x++) {
              bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);            // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
              bitClear(PORTB, csmPin - 8);            // 'blank' function costing 0,5 us delay time
            }
       }
    }
  }
  pulseON = true;                                     // sets the variable to indicate that there was a shorting pulse sequence
}

unsigned long getCount()  {                           // returns the current count of pulses from pin 5, resets the count, and starts counting again
  TCCR1B = 0;                                         // Gate Off / Counter Tn stopped
  count = TCNT1;
  TCNT1 = 0;
  bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS12);                               // Counter Clock source is external pin
  bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS11);                               // Clock on rising edge
  bitSet(TCCR1B ,CS10);                               // you can clear this bit for falling edge
  return count;
}

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////  The END  //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

kEhYo

[aaron5120]

Hi KehYo77,
I realized about your latest results from the coil shorting circuit, and would like to replicate your discovery. Can you post some scope shots of the coil shorting waveforms in order to have a better idea of the output voltage and current phase relations.
I have a dual channel DSO scope and arbitrary function generator, so if you are pleased, I can build the Arduino controlled circuit at your spec.
Aaron5120