Tesla's Magnifying Transmitter "Replications"

[dR-Green]

Nice work and info on those coils Farmhand

The way I see the spark gap method is basically pulsing the coil with relatively huge impulses, which I think in itself has its purposes/uses. Have you seen Peter's Free Energy Secrets Of Cold Electricity video? The things he quotes from the book "Secrets Of Cold War Technology" (I think that's the title) is fascinating. I've never thought about the waveform, just the big impulses. How would you go about looking at it with a scope?

I have no doubt that there's a loss with the gap, but this is what I've noticed so far and attempted to share on video but failed due to interference: Based only on the existing setup with 1360pF capacitance and nothing tuned, shorter gap distance apparently transfers more 'current' if that's the proper word to use indicated by brighter fluorescent glow, but a lower voltage indicated by shorter and denser streamers. A bigger gap distance allows less current indicated by a dimmer fluorescent, but the voltage seems to be doubled if not more indicated by the streamers that are twice the length but much thinner. They are much bigger bangs at such a low frequency than the buzzing of wasps at a higher frequency. Also input current seems to be lowest at smaller or bigger gap distances, a mid-sized gap can draw 4-8 times more current in my setup. (Unless it's affecting the meter in other ways). [edit] Also since the update below, there's some random "popping" going on with a bigger gap. I guess an analogy as far as the sound goes is similar to a car backfiring in between the regular consistency of the engine. I don't know what it is yet, but they sound impressive at least

So I'm thinking there must be a balance one can get here somewhere, and why it might be especially useful to have a closer gap but very abrupt and big impulses.

As far as scalar waves go, as far as I know you need flat spiral coils to do that I think over unity will require a lot of precise and specific tuning, you'll have to build your coils specifically for a certain frequency source you're trying to get into resonance with. I think Peter mentions "quarter wavelength of the source" for this kind of purpose.

I've just been testing out the new opto anyway. Much better results. Now it's turning off properly until I get to more than double the frequency of before. This also means that for my voltage in, I'm getting a much better voltage out of the flyback because it's now actually going between 0 and the + voltage. So all in all I'm getting about the same output from 6v as I was with 12v input before

Out of curiosity I also connected the scope to the bottom end of the 2nd coil that's still not connected to anything. The scope changed to the 1kV range and it was clicking away because of the auto range, and changed to 300v range before I quickly disconnected it because I think it's 600v max and I don't want to pop it So it looks like the other coil must be receiving over 100v (otherwise it'll be 100v range not 300v), it will ark a tiny bit, and it lights a fluorescent to a pretty decent brightness.

[Farmhand]

I'm not saying a spark gap is no good as such, just that the higher voltages will be more difficult to contain and so forth. Jl Naudins waveform looks good and he used a spark gap apparently, so it must be possible. Do you have any Neo's to blow out the spark ? Or a vacuum cleaner ? Apparently quenching the spark is good.

Not sure about the Scalar stuff I try to just see what happens, spiral coils are good though and I think there is an element of a cone shape in the magnifyer design aswell with the two different diameter secondary coils.

The more differnent things we all try the better and share and compare results, I like to follow side tracks every now then when I'm distracted by something i see. I'm easily distracted.

To see the waveform of the transmitter Just hang the scope probe in the air from a string or similar about a foot away from the terminal of the transmitter just clip the ground of the scope to the lead near the base of the probe, you might need to adjust the scope to a finer or coarser range to see it.

Try not to actually connect the scope to the secondary though.

Cheers

[dR-Green]

There is very cool stuff in this thread. I'm just starting out.

You can check my progress here > Tesla Wireless Power Transmission - YouTube

Cheers,
Vince

Nice looking setup you have there

[dR-Green]

I'm not saying a spark gap is no good as such, just that the higher voltages will be more difficult to contain and so forth. Jl Naudins waveform looks good and he used a spark gap apparently, so it must be possible. Do you have any Neo's to blow out the spark ? Or a vacuum cleaner ? Apparently quenching the spark is good.

Not sure about the Scalar stuff I try to just see what happens, spiral coils are good though and I think there is an element of a cone shape in the magnifyer design aswell with the two different diameter secondary coils.

The more differnent things we all try the better and share and compare results, I like to follow side tracks every now then when I'm distracted by something i see. I'm easily distracted.

To see the waveform of the transmitter Just hang the scope probe in the air from a string or similar about a foot away from the terminal of the transmitter just clip the ground of the scope to the lead near the base of the probe, you might need to adjust the scope to a finer or coarser range to see it.

Try not to actually connect the scope to the secondary though.

Cheers

Yes putting a magnet in there is on the cards, thanks

That's what I like about this thread, we're all off doing our own things but basically doing the same thing Saves us individually a lot of time I suppose and we find things out we never thought of trying or never would try and all that sort of stuff Although to be fair I haven't really got started yet, just been getting to grips with the whole thing while trying not to get zapped I'm just getting excited from actually doing and seeing this stuff in real life and seeing small improvements by making changes and learning about it all etc.

Anyway I think I'll leave testing the waveform until tomorrow, 6am now Thanks

[7imix]

dr green check out the Stingo driving a car ignition coil as a higher frequency spark gap driver. since the frequency is tunable with a potentiometer you can adjust the distance of the gap and then adjust the frequency to get different modes of plasma in the spark gap.

It's really easy to build, just two transistors and a couple of resistors and potentiometers and diodes.

Use the "test circuit" and put the spark gap across the secondary of the ignition coil:

http://energeticforum.com/renewable-...y-charger.html

A driver with a lower frequency can drive a secondary into resonance at a higher frequency. If the inductance and capacitance are balanced the coil can start to build energy and "ring up" to it's full voltage slowly over time. The waveform is the opposite of a damped oscillation.

Here's a video of me measuring stingo:

Stingo Spark Gap Measurements - YouTube

clear footage of different modes of plasma

Stingo circuit replication - Arc and Spark - YouTube

stingo can also be used to drive a flyback instead of a car coil.

[7imix]

Farmhand, that looks AMAZING! I want to build one as soon as I can! Moving into my new place the weekend after this coming weekend, so will be able to start building again after that.

You should try coaxial cable for your primaries. Use the outer shielding wire. Also, another thing to try is to match the surface areas of the primary and the secondary (according to Dollard). A simpler method is simply to match the weight of the primary and secondary. Weigh the secondary, weigh another identical pvc form, subtract, weigh the primary to match.

One can calculate the surface area of various diameters of wire with Wolfram Alpha, and then calculate how long a wire of another diameter would have to be to match the surface area (also with Wolfram Alpha)

One other thing to try is putting space between the turns on a secondary. This will reduce the capacitance of the secondary. I think one could run fishing line of the same gauge as the secondary. This could help a lot to reduce the resonant frequency.

[Farmhand]

Farmhand, that looks AMAZING! I want to build one as soon as I can! Moving into my new place the weekend after this coming weekend, so will be able to start building again after that.

You should try coaxial cable for your primaries. Use the outer shielding wire. Also, another thing to try is to match the surface areas of the primary and the secondary (according to Dollard). A simpler method is simply to match the weight of the primary and secondary. Weigh the secondary, weigh another identical pvc form, subtract, weigh the primary to match.

One can calculate the surface area of various diameters of wire with Wolfram Alpha, and then calculate how long a wire of another diameter would have to be to match the surface area (also with Wolfram Alpha)

One other thing to try is putting space between the turns on a secondary. This will reduce the capacitance of the secondary. I think one could run fishing line of the same gauge as the secondary. This could help a lot to reduce the resonant frequency.

Haha yeah it does look kinda cool, it can be like a pair of Magnifyers stuck together base to base and output from one primary with the fluro too, or if the coils are pulsed in series ( it does work both ways ) it can be a low voltage Don Smith if you rectify the two ends as one AC and the center tap as the other with no fluro, or it can light the fluro between the ends and output from the center tap as one AC and the ground as the other.

Actually it works a lot of different ways, but I did manage to wind it for zero output and zero input like i did with the converter.

I'm still having a bit of trouble holding back the current and hot mosfets, I think the problem is that even though they are only switching 20 volts they are seeing big transients if there is no load to take them, I'm not panicing yet because not being resonant won't help either because of the spiking, with a sinewave the power is more usable to the fluro too and it will light better aswell as not being so harsh on the componants.

I agree I need to make better primaries and I would like to be able to charge the two primary circuits in multiple and discharge them in series. But that would make the calculations more difficult.

Like in this patent.
NIKOLA TKSLA - Google Patents

Determining the correct primary length is difficult for me because I get confused with all the numbers. And make mistakes. But i will try.
I'll get a weight if I can but they don't weigh much.

Going by length could you work it out for me ? Or at least tell me if I get it right ?

There is 198 turns on each and the former is 94mm the wire is 0.5mm enameled wire. I'll have a fumble with the nubers and see what happens, probably a headache.


It would be ideal to space the secondary turns like you say and pulse the coils at the required frequency say 2 Mhz, with a micro or function generator, but I'm not keen on spacing the secondary because that will reduce the self inductace aswell won't it ? Which will require a higher frequency but that would improve the Q I think. I am adding capacitance to the secondary anyway to reduce the resonant frequency, I think the fluro adds capacitance so you may well be onto something. And if it doesn't reduce the self inductance i will definately think about doing that.

Cheers

P.S. Hey what about if I take away the metal fluro holders and replace them with wooden ones that have resonator coils wound on them, these "extra" resonator coil "B's" would be in series with the two ends or tops but going upwards on the wooden supports, then the terminals would be at the ends of those.

It might also be cool to use two conical coils base to base instead of helical coils

EDIT: I just checked the coils with a neon and the neon is brihtest sbout halfway along the coils, so I'm probably way under half the frequency I need.
Time for the function generator, I hope i don't fry it.

..

[dR-Green]

dr green check out the Stingo driving a car ignition coil as a higher frequency spark gap driver. since the frequency is tunable with a potentiometer you can adjust the distance of the gap and then adjust the frequency to get different modes of plasma in the spark gap.

It's really easy to build, just two transistors and a couple of resistors and potentiometers and diodes.

Use the "test circuit" and put the spark gap across the secondary of the ignition coil:

Stingo Solid State Battery Charger

A driver with a lower frequency can drive a secondary into resonance at a higher frequency. If the inductance and capacitance are balanced the coil can start to build energy and "ring up" to it's full voltage slowly over time. The waveform is the opposite of a damped oscillation.

Here's a video of me measuring stingo:

Stingo Spark Gap Measurements - YouTube

clear footage of different modes of plasma

Stingo circuit replication - Arc and Spark - YouTube

stingo can also be used to drive a flyback instead of a car coil.

Ah, that sounds good. Thanks for the suggestion. Can't a similar thing be done with the 555 though? I'm still not too familiar with that circuit yet, I must have only played with it for 5-10 mins since putting in the new opto. I noticed during the "popping" I was talking about, the pops make a different colour to the constant spark.

Also if someone could maybe confirm this, I read somewhere that flybacks tend to burn out if you push them into resonance? I still haven't got an ignition coil yet. Would you believe that all the mechanics garages and car supplies shops around here don't sell ignition coils

On that note, does anyone know how to make a HV transformer or know of a good web source for info of wire thickness ratios and current and all that?

[dR-Green]

It might also be cool to use two conical coils base to base instead of helical coils

I've always wondered about Fibonacci conical coils... But things might get quite big using those ratios. And also another idea with 2 windings, to resemble the two different direction Fibonacci spirals of pine cones and other such things. Or a double helix spiral/vortex as made observable in a whirlpool.

"Energy is primary, the physical form is the secondary effect."

"Comprehend and copy Nature." - Viktor Schauberger

[dR-Green]

I now have a strong magnet under the spark gap. Now I can't have the gap too big, and I certainly can't have it so big that it won't ark, without the neon across the emitter and collector coming on. I've also changed from 2N3055 to BUX81 transistors. They have lower gain so now I'm using less current. The output doesn't seem to be quite as good at the same settings, but it looks like I'll have a bit more control over the amount of current I'm using this way so it seems to be good for experimenting with. I was starting to get problems of the PSU getting overloaded and cutting out every 2 mins which was becoming a nuisance. Something has also changed in that when I expect the spark gap to "stall" and stop arcing according to what I've gotten used to so far, I can continue to widen the gap and it keeps on going, the limit now is the emitter to collector neon coming on This change is due to the different transistors.

[c_henriques]

Hi Henriques, I'm using solid state methods to drive the transmitter. I can't get a sine wave with a spark gap and the erratic nature of the spark gap in my opinion causes a scratchy irregular waveform.

I don't think Tesla used a spark gap for his magnifying transmitter but I think he did for other wireless transmission device's. One of the problems i found was trying to use a scope to see the waveform in real time while using the spark gap. With solid state transmitter switching the waveform is a very smooth sine wave so tuning to full resonance is fairly easy as Vince showed in his video, Thanks Vince .

I think with a spark gap the coils can be rung like a bell but looser coupling is required for higher voltages and so forth, much more difficult to tune. And still the waveform at the terminal may be scratchy looking and cause leaking.

A smooth sine wave at the terminal will give less propensity for the energy to leak out in voltage spikes kind of thing.

I can't give much help for transmitting using a spark gap to drive the transmitter unfortunately. I think the spark gap induces losses not only at the gap itself but also in the terminal and wires because of the scratchyness or erratic voltage spikes there. I could be wrong and I welcome somebody to show me a sine wave from a spark gapped device in operation.

I think at the end Tesla had finally realised a reliable method to convey his currents directly from the Alternator to Excite the Primary of the transmitter.
Thereby delivering a sine wave to the primary with no switching or spark gap and eliminating the losses there. He mentions this in his work on Alternating Currents.

He mentions that when constructed correctly a Magnifying Transmitter primary can be excited by waveforms of any character and a sine wave will result. However the devil is in the detail, a "smooth" sine wave is much better than a scratchy looking one.

My Transmitter waveform.
https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=32a91...1259&sc=photos

Jl Naudin does suggest that he can get a fairly smooth Sine wave with a spark gap here on this page.
The Tesla Magnifying Transmitter

I can't do it yet though.

Cheers

HI Farmhand,

thanks for the reply

I agree with you, however I am a student and not have the resources to obtain material for researches as an oscilloscope, so do not interest me very much to have a clear waveform without noise.
I make the adjustment based on the power output, for example by placing a lamp

I know this is one very rude to do, but I'm just a beginner

as you said, what worries me most are the losses in spark gap

when I started I thought I'd make completely solid state, but many pioneers like Gray, Tesla, Smith, Kapandze ... succeeded even with the losses in the spark gap so I do not care much for it

I've been following your work, congratulations

best regards,
Henriques

[dR-Green]

For anyone interested in the flat spiral coils, I have some updates.

After some experimentation, I think the final number of turns is going to be 23.5. I found the difference between 23.5 and 24.5 to be quite significant and worth making note of. The last 1.5 turns in the 24.5 turn configuration weren't 2 turns on top of each other, and that seems to have quite a big effect.

Here are some pictures taken after the modification. Testing a 240v 15w incandescent bulb. I have a problem with a bigger spark gap, when the bulb starts to get brighter, in that the bulb holder is arcing inside, so this is as far as I got so far. Also worth noting is that connecting the fluorescent has no effect whatsoever on the brightness of the incandescent bulb, nothing perceivable by my eyes at least. The circuit is drawing maybe 800mA-2A, it's not easy to tell 9v input.

[edit] This setup includes the magnet in the spark gap, and BUX81 transistors.

Also the webcam seems to work fine taking still images, but it doesn't like recording video while the circuit is running

[Farmhand]

Cool stuff dR, Incandescants don't like HV much they just plasma up. When you take current from the Coil "C" or the "few turns coil" of the receiver the oven bulb should work well. I like normal fluro's for HV not cfl's but it would be good to light up some regular bulbs.

Those spiral coils look awesome !

I've got something else to show soon too, this thread has lots to look at.
But we need some more humor. I think I tuned in to a resonable harmonic or something with the dual coils setup, I have a couple of video's and a few picture's, circuit diagrams and such. One proposed circuit looks promising.

Cheers

[Farmhand]

Ok Guys, I've done a replication of this anchient Egyptian wall patent


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Here's the device


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Here's the depiction I made of the replication.


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Here's the video of the replication atempt. Darn video camera keeps adjusting itself to compensate for pointing it at the lights, so unfortunately the lights sometimes seem dimmer than they are.
Dendera Lighting - Tesla Coils.wmv - YouTube

And this video I shot a couple of days ago. (this video might not work for a day or so.)
Dualing Coils.wmv - YouTube

Ok enough humor. Sorry. See in the video there is current on the center tap . I got a scratchy looking wave on the scope. I attached some neons to the top of the fluro supports so it looks like the Tesla patent drawings.

I need to do more adjustments and i'll probably wind some coils about 300 turns and 150 mm diameter 0.5mm wire later.

I've got some circuit drawings here, some parts to the circuit which are final and a theoretical/concept circuit drawing or two. Everyone is free to use any circuit or part of circuit I "of mine" post except to try to keep it from anyone else.

This is the circuit I used in the first video.


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And this is another way it can be used.


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THis link shows a Tesla circuit he used with the coil in the next link.
http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/9...oilcircuit.jpg

Tesla coil in oil.
http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/2546/londoncoil.jpg

THis is the voltage double circuit I'm using.


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This is the coils which go right after the voltage doubler.


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And so here is the circuit I'm keen on building to tight specs. It might just work, and could be thought of as a you know what type of arrangement.


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I think this patent has coils we can use for these setups.
NIKOLA TESLA - Google Patents

And this one is just cool.
NIKOLA TKSLA - Google Patents

Cheers

[dR-Green]

That's awesome. The beatnik depiction of the lightbringers is keeping things up to date

I'm just starting to watch the first video now. That picture looks pretty good so far

When you take current from the Coil "C" or the "few turns coil" of the receiver the oven bulb should work well. I like normal fluro's for HV not cfl's but it would be good to light up some regular bulbs.

I'm trying to duplicate Eric Dollard's experiment. In the video he lights a filament bulb with 1 wire. But the "output" there is the ground connection, so I need to tinker a bit more and clear my desk to get a proper experimental setup on the go.

With the old setup I managed to get the filament to glow VERY dim with 1 wire, but that was from the central connection of the coil, not the grounded end. So I dunno.

What kind of output are you getting from your coils? Could you power a spark gap with it? I'd like to try connecting the helical coil output through a spark gap into the flat spiral coil, but to do that with my current setup first I'll have to make another spark gap.

I think I already mentioned I tried a CFL with 1 wire on the central connection of the spiral coil before. The circuit of the CFL outputs an even higher voltage from the other wire. It also seemed to want to draw a bigger ark towards it than a normal fluorescent did.

[edit] The spiral coil also draws more current than the helical coil, but there's a lot less copper on it. So I think bigger diameters could be the way to go.

[edit again] I'm just watching Eric Dollard's video again for the first time since attempting anything myself, looks like I didn't pay attention before and I've been testing things (the bulb) wrong