The Magnet Kicker Thread

[FRC]

Rounding the day off, by having some fun with this Hum Motor.

Not shown on the video, was an experiment just now, where the rotor will run by using a trigger coil from a disposable camera:

What kind of disposable camera was it ? What voltage did you use ? Was lthe
coil still hooked up to the camera circuit and running off that voltage ?

FRC

[Slider2732]

Hi FRC
It's a regular flash camera trigger coil, similar to those used by jonnydavro within his YouTube videos (Tesla tower and other exciter experiments).
I have a couple from Polaroid cameras and from my wife's old film based flash cameras.
Whether 4KV or 6KV i'm unsure, but it was on the work table and so was tried out.
The connections were to the two bottom inputs. The wire you see on the output is there from other experiments and not connected.
It sat directly in line with the power supply, which was the wall adapter and it was set at 6V, as was the Leedskalnin type PMH. Nothing else ran to it, just the 6V from the supply.
Above 6V it would start the rotor a bit easier, needing less tries of hand rotor spin ups to match the mains hum frequency and giving a stronger magnetic field, but would begin to get warm. 6V was a good balance for that one.

[Slider2732]

I did make a short video of it in action last night, but didn't upload.
With your questions being asked, i've uploaded it and hope it further helps with my reply

‪Camera trigger coil powered motor‬‏ - YouTube

[Mark]

I spent a little timing playing with the coil shorting. Unfortunately I do not see any advantage to coil shorting. You can collect a higher voltage but the overall power is lower (with my simple set up anyway).

Minoly were you using a core in your trigger coil? I just ran my set up on 24 volts while charging a 12 volt battery and still had no heat (just a little bit warmer the ambient). Which has me puzzled because almost every other time I've used 24 volts I always have heat! When jumping from 12 to 24 volts on the fly the rotor actually slowed down so I thought for sure the tranny would be hot but it wasn't. Amp draw was 120ma.

Mark

Here's something I dont understand. When I was running 24 volts and charging a 12 volt battery and not getting any heat I was using the SSG method with only 1 diode. Then I switched to a fwbr and a cap and my tranny started to heat up, and the rotor also started to speed up. Must be when using the single diode it was somehow limiting the current flow.

[Zooty]

Here's something I dont understand. When I was running 24 volts and charging a 12 volt battery and not getting any heat I was using the SSG method with only 1 diode. Then I switched to a fwbr and a cap and my tranny started to heat up, and the rotor also started to speed up. Must be when using the single diode it was somehow limiting the current flow.

when using fwbr across your coil and the input voltage is higher than the charging battery, your input pulse also charges the cap/battery as well as the flyback. Put a 24v battery on the output and it will run cool again

[minoly]

I spent a little timing playing with the coil shorting. Unfortunately I do not see any advantage to coil shorting. You can collect a higher voltage but the overall power is lower (with my simple set up anyway).

Minoly were you using a core in your trigger coil? I just ran my set up on 24 volts while charging a 12 volt battery and still had no heat (just a little bit warmer the ambient). Which has me puzzled because almost every other time I've used 24 volts I always have heat! When jumping from 12 to 24 volts on the fly the rotor actually slowed down so I thought for sure the tranny would be hot but it wasn't. Amp draw was 120ma.

Mark

Hi Mark,
no core in the trigger coil.
heated @ 12 volts to the point that it would burn if I left it w/ no resistance on the base. If I use JB's SSG method - one diode and charge a battery, the transistor does not heat up. Or, I can light a string of LED's w/ 30 3.6v in series emitter to collector - then the transistor will not heat up. I can not light the neon to save my life, I've switched out a couple of different neons - no luck. High voltage w/ little to no current. tonight I'm just going to leave a flooded 12v cell on it and see what happens.

Patrick

[FRC]

Thanks Slider2732

I did make a short video of it in action last night, but didn't upload.
With your questions being asked, i've uploaded it and hope it further helps with my reply

‪Camera trigger coil powered motor‬‏ - YouTube

Thanks Slider2732, your replies are very much appreciated.

George

[Shadesz]

Perhaps you can use this simple transistor switch method to short a generator coil on a Muller or Adams device? They seem to be getting an increase in RPM when shorting the coil or even putting them under load, so this switch may be just what they need.

[minoly]

Here's something I dont understand. When I was running 24 volts and charging a 12 volt battery and not getting any heat I was using the SSG method with only 1 diode. Then I switched to a fwbr and a cap and my tranny started to heat up, and the rotor also started to speed up. Must be when using the single diode it was somehow limiting the current flow.

Hi Mark,
I just want to speak to the coil shorting and most all these generator pick up coil configurations.
what we do with the energy after the magnet passes the core and just as it leaves the wire winds - IS everything. impedance is where it is at, placing a low impedance or no impedance device at the coil allows the wheel to spin at full potential - then take the energy that accumulates in that low impedance device and time dump it into your higher impedance device so we can use it. this is what JB has said all along - what Rod is doing on the other thread is quite a bit more.
this rule also applies to the charging battery on all of JB's stuff. low impedance device on charging side. this is why IMHO everyone who has used small AA's and sealed led acid batteries and other high impedance devices do not see the extra energy - I'm not saying this is what you are running into, this is just from my experiments here.

Patrick

[Mark]

Perhaps you can use this simple transistor switch method to short a generator coil on a Muller or Adams device? They seem to be getting an increase in RPM when shorting the coil or even putting them under load, so this switch may be just what they need.

I tried that and found no advantage to coil shorting, but would like others to try it and see if they get the same or different results.

[Mark]

Hi Mark,
I just want to speak to the coil shorting and most all these generator pick up coil configurations.
what we do with the energy after the magnet passes the core and just as it leaves the wire winds - IS everything. impedance is where it is at, placing a low impedance or no impedance device at the coil allows the wheel to spin at full potential - then take the energy that accumulates in that low impedance device and time dump it into your higher impedance device so we can use it. this is what JB has said all along - what Rod is doing on the other thread is quite a bit more.
this rule also applies to the charging battery on all of JB's stuff. low impedance device on charging side. this is why IMHO everyone who has used small AA's and sealed led acid batteries and other high impedance devices do not see the extra energy - I'm not saying this is what you are running into, this is just from my experiments here.

Patrick

I think we need to have a set up that takes the output and charges up 2 cap banks one at a time. A load can re run off one cap bank why the other is being charged. Then the load and charge bank swap so the load is never connected to the charging bank. I think this would be the simplest way without having to get the timing on the dump perfect but I may be wrong.

I seen a Bedini patent a while ago that showed a circuit for doing this I will have to try and locate it.

[Slider2732]

That's a great idea
In keeping completely with my own aims. A few cap methods were tried yesterday, with a 1N4148 in various places or 1N4007, but no doubt not in the way you mentioned.
What i'm wondering, with the cap idea and coil shorting does relate to what happened late last night and the point of the video below - I wonder if the 60Hz line ripple can be utilised for a known sinusoidal break point...the rotor always spins at the same speed, so the waves should be at exactly the same frequency all the time. Which, means that any shorting can be done in an exacting manner.

Now, where that relates to last night is a full on mad scientist experience
We had a lightning storm that came through. There was a power out for a second or two, then the lights and the rest came back on. The Hum Motor was still running
During filming, initially for a personal record, there was a second nearby strike and although briefer than the first, demonstrated very well how the lock of the rotation and decent bearing of the rotor didn't lead to a failure of the running.
So, what can be derived from that intervention by nature in such a cool way, is that a changed duty cycle can bring less 'on' time or can allow coil shorting, with no adverse effects on the running of the motor
Thank you nature !

Here's the video:

‪Lightning vs Hum Motor‬‏ - YouTube

Here's what came through:

[minoly]

I think we need to have a set up that takes the output and charges up 2 cap banks one at a time. A load can re run off one cap bank why the other is being charged. Then the load and charge bank swap so the load is never connected to the charging bank. I think this would be the simplest way without having to get the timing on the dump perfect but I may be wrong.

I seen a Bedini patent a while ago that showed a circuit for doing this I will have to try and locate it.

therein lays the conundrum - these machines, from my experience like to have high impedance on the front end. I would love to see that patent. I have most all books vids etc... maybe I'll go back through them. there is so much in there that I'm sure I missed it.

[Mark]

therein lays the conundrum - these machines, from my experience like to have high impedance on the front end. I would love to see that patent. I have most all books vids etc... maybe I'll go back through them. there is so much in there that I'm sure I missed it.

Found it! I asked JB about it quite a while ago and never got an answer. I believe its the circuitry that is used in the solar chargers or could be used in all of them, don't know just a guess.

I tried to find it on the net again so I could post a link but no luck yet. Anyways its US Patent 2003/0117111 A1. Not sure what the patent will say or show but I also have a schmatic with all the parts labeled on it too. Its refered to as DEVICE AND METHOD FOR PULSE CHARGING A BATTERY AND FOR DRIVING OTHER DEVICES WITH A PULSE.

[Slider2732]

Is there a chance he may have misunderstood your request ?
I know he's active on the Hutchison battery thread at the moment and seems the type of fellow to actively encourage actual builds and designs from people here.


I'm having a day off from plugging the soldering iron in tomorrow..i'll be 42
The answer to life the universe and everything...and perhaps solution energy.

Today though, I thought i'd get a few more wonderings out of the way with.
Would a transformer run as a power coil for the basic motor ?
How about the internals of a brushless R/C motor ?
Yep !

Here's the short video and a pic of one of the tested transformers.

Hum Motor - transformer + R/C motor powered - YouTube