Confirming the Delayed Lenz Effect

[wings]

OK i got the maths wrong before !

I'm sure it's right now but please check.

Using OUG's component values :

L : 0.01756
R1 : 19.2
R2 : 220

TC = L/(R1+R2)

TC = 0.01756/239.2 = 0.0734113712 mS

So, to beat the rise time the magnet must pass over the core very quickly.

Rotor diameter is 150mm, magnet diameter is 20mm so magnet centre point is 65mm from centre so the effective diameter is 130mm and our effective circumference (the travel line through the magnet's centre)is Pi x D = 408mm.

Let's say the magnet has to pass over the core in 0.07ms, so it must travel 10mm in 0.07ms.

So, how long does it take for one revolution ?

The circumference to travel is 408mm, so 408/10 = 40.8 and it will take 0.07 * 40.8 = 2.856 mS for one revolution.

How many revolutions is that per second ? One second divided by desired speed = 1000/2.856 = 350.140056022409.

And in RPM, 350.140056022409 * 60 = 21008.40336134454 RPM !

Please check my maths !

I have put it all into a spreadsheet :

lenzbend.xls

you have to add n° of magnets that reduce the rpm

[qvision]

I don't understand please explain.

[wings]

I don't understand please explain.

with 4 6 magnets the cycles are 4 6 each rotation then the RPM for one cycle is 1/4 , 1/6

[qvision]

wings i am speaking of just one magnet passing just one coil, all of the above maths is about one instance of a generator coil

[Allen Burgess]

Coil face.

@qvision

What's the diameter of your coil face compared to the diameter of your rotor magnets? Note that the diameter of my air core thread spool coil face is around the same size as my magnet spinner diameter in the demonstration device above. The thread spool wire wrap is tapering at the ends and bulgy in the middle.

Now take a close look at Thane's. Look at the oblong shape of the green tape wraped output coil at the forefront of Thane's generator. He shows you an egg shaped one faceing out. Notice that the coil face is not much larger then the coil core, and around the same size as his rotor magnets. I maintain the same kind of size proportion in my tiny "Lenz Delay Propulsion" demo device. These are critical factors, they can't be ignored and need to be worked into your formula.

[qvision]

Thanks for that Allen, i'll try it out.

[mbrownn]

I noticed something on some of these tests. Some of these circuits contain a regenerative path. Once a curtain motor speed has been reached you get an acceleration of the motor, this can be because the frequency required for the regenerative circuit has been reached. when this happens you get a pulse that is effectively 100% duty and the motor power will go up. This is an effect that can give an efficient pulse motor double the current that you are putting in and has nothing to do with lenz's law.

The acceleration you get with shorting the generator coil is something else but it is worth watching the amp draw on the input to the motor and not from the supply because if there is an increase in amps then it is likely that this has something to do with the regenerative circuit.

The basics of this type of regenerative action is, is once you reach a pulse frequency that the current on the discharge of the coil hasn't dissipated before the next pulse, it adds to the current on the next pulse until the circuit cannot flow any more amps due to ohms law. http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...uits-regen.jpg

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...-circuits.html

If this is not the reason for the acceleration then truly something interesting is happening.

[minoly]

I found this vid by magluvin to be extremely useful and right along w/ what I have been noticing as well:
Finding resonance lock with coil and rotor - YouTube

Patrick

[Allen Burgess]

Coils.

The thread spool axle bearing spinner core on the left was designed for the same two wraps as it's big brother to the right of it, with the spiral coil sphere spinner inside. A twin wire coil sleeve, with one counter wind of 18 gauge over a multi layer of 32 gauge, needs to slip over the bearing shaft, which needs to be cut flush to the outside of the inner core wall. Thane loops his output back to his power coil. I haven't tried this yet. I have only looped back to the run battery so far.

Coil-rotor adjustment is easier with the small CD top, than the larger spiral coil unit. I have yet to finsh wraping the thread spool model, but I believe it has the potential to out perform the larger model. I think replacing the Reed switch with a Hall effect transister might help improve the tube spnner unit too.

I tried wireing a 32 gauge outer bifilar coil wrap in series like the power coils, but it made the spinner buck and jolt. Very bad results! Both those outer wraps have to be single wire. So that's how the tiny one's supposed to look when finished.

So that yields two "Lenz Delay Propulsion" coils, one inside the core and one outside. This leaves the bifilar thread spool power coil secondary BEMF to light big LED bulbs like 62498 does in his "test tube sphere" video. I believe this type of very simple unit has the potential to go overunity. It sounds like Thane's claiming COP>5 on one of his regenerative accelerators. The tiny one with just a Reed switch does not present a great challenge for the beginning experimental builder. Let me stress once more though, it's the costly precision ceramic bearings that make the "Lenz Delay" RPM's possible. I noticed Boca improved the bearing and doubled the cost.

There's a simple wireing schematic for the Reed switch in series, and further to the right, a "Lenz Delay" spiral coil and tube magnet I dimpled like a golf ball to increase speed. The magnet's on wheels and free to re-orient itself by spinning around in the wooden cup. This feature helped set new speed records. This setup caught the "Lenz Boost Effect" at high speeds too. I invented the coil. I hit 58K with the 1" with it, way over anything Skycollection attained with his squashed Rodin Starship coil and levitating spinner. Those tiny "Boca" ceramic bearings did the trick.

The spinner takes a few minutes to build speed slowly up to about 15k, but when the "Over Drive" effect kicks in, it begins to gain around 5k every few seconds.

[brusers]

Calculation questions

Hi You All,

Please See my Latest Video About: 'How to Calculate the Delayed Lenz Effect'
Calculation of the Delayed Lenz Effect - YouTube

This Video demonstrates how we can calculate the desired Delayed Lenz Effect, and shows that the experimental results of my previous video about: the Difference between Loading and Shorting the Regenerative Acceleration Generator coil can be explained and can be calculated. So than again high impedance is really important. And the Lenz Delay can be calculated by L/R

With Kind Regards, Overunityguide

Hello Overunityguide.

In your calculations there, you use your figures from you coil, and get 3.733 mS for your time constant. 3000 RPM with 12 magnets gives 300 Hz, or T = 3.33, which is about the same as your time constant for your coil. Also in your video you show, in steps, that this is the "hump" at where the effect starts to take place.

Is it safe to assume that anything over 3000 is going to show the effect? Meaning there would be no higher RPM that would start to show a decline in the effect.

If so I guess shooting for 1(L/Rtotal) would be optimizing the prime mover, so as to not expend any unnecessary energy on higher speeds.

Would be nice to hear your thoughts, and thank you for the videos you put up. Good documentation, things are a bit clearer.

Best regards,

Marcel

[Allen Burgess]

Upward Lenz delay Limit.

@brusers,

Excuse me for pre-empting Overunityguide on the Hertz and over limit issue. How safe is it to assume there's no higher RPM decline in effect?

Overunityguide's 3000 RPM'S times 12 magnets is very close to my ballpark estimation of 15,000 RPM's times 2 magnet poles for the "Lenz Delay" threshold of diametric spinners. Looks like a fixed constant perhaps? Once the magnet speed is past the lag, it dosen't appear to reverse itself judging from "Pirate Twinbeard's" Mach speed to magnet sphere shattering spin speed experiments. He started his own "Flower Power" Energetic Forum thread, and contributed mightily to the upward limit experimentation.

"Pirate Twinbeard's" experiments set new speed records for magnet spin, and as a disciple of Thane Heins, and master of "Lenz Delay Propulsion" he qualifies as the Chuck Yeager of Spintronics! He attained multiple Mach speeds. He demonstrates his tiny sphere spinner raceing to magnet structure material limits within seconds of crossing the "Lenz Delay" threshold limit, reaching nearly Mach three on propulsion runaway. Here's a quote from one of his posts repoting a frequency of 57,500 Hz, or nearly 3.5 million RPM.:

"So, without further ado the results of using a lower mass, lower diameter rotor:

Voltage at output stage, as measured by the Tek 465M mil-spec oscope:
@1100V
Amperage as measured by the RCA WV-526A inductive ammeter:
@700mA
Frequency, as measured in the method used a few posts ago, with the following differences:
Since I am seeing slightly irregular spacings between AC output wave peaks, probably because we are modulating the time domain to create the scalar waves, I decided to sum the peaks and divide by divisions. Hence, at a 20 microsecond per division timebase, I am seeing 11.5 full waveforms across the 10 divisions. This gives us 1.15 waves per division. 20 microseconds divided by 1.15 gives us an average period of 17.39 microseconds per full waveform. This translates to an approximate frequency of 57,500Hz. Multiplied by 60 seconds per minute, that gives us 3450000 RPM's with the smaller rotor. I regret that I cannot find an even smaller magnet to buy anywhere."

Try and catch up with some of his magnet shattering videos:

piratetwinbeard's Channel - YouTube

[Allen Burgess]

A quote from Pirate Twinbeard describing "A time delay in the generator coil that shifts Lenz drag and accelerates the rotor while drawing less power when placed under load". These are his exact words:

"Sharing this rotor is a generator stage, which is designed to have capacitive effects by use of high ohmic resistance coils. These capacitive effects manifest as electrostatic potentials on the surface of the conductor, instead of electromagnetic current in the core of the conductor, which the electrostatic potential quickly decays into. Therein, however, is a minute time delay that advantageously phase shifts Lenz related drag out of the frame of reference of the passing pole of the rotor. This allows us to extract usable energy from the generator stage without drawing more power in the prime mover circuit, nor slowing the rotor. When optimally tuned to exploit this phase shift, a prime mover rotor will actually accelerate while drawing less current when the generator stage is placed under load. Further research into mathematically quantifying this phase shifting of the Lenz effect are ongoing, in an effort to break down the relationship of coil impedance, frequency, and phase angle of output into an equation."

Further proof confirming "Lenz Delay". Basicly, the magnet sphere just runs away and goes hypersonic till it disintigrates once past the "Lenz Delay" threshold.

FlowerPower shared rotor dc pulse motor/generator.

You'll notice Twinbeard's Flower Power device on the left is simply a high inductance spool coil on top of an air core Rodin Torus. A nearly identical configuration to my sphere spinner spiral coil nested inside a large high inductance spool core. The axis of sphere rotation is necessarily on the perpidicular to the output core windings. The second picture is a machined sphere chamber. The thread spool, rodin torus and spiral coils are all air core, and all three have achieved reliable "Lenz Delay Propulsion".

[Shadesz]

# of magnets vs rpm's (frequency) does not determine how fast the magnet is passing the coil. Using these numbers as input will not help you identify the correct target speed.

Magnet bypass time is determined by RPM in relation to the circumference of the rotor. It doesn't matter how many magnets you have.

Increasing magnets but keeping the same rpm will not decrease magnet bypass time.

The only thing it could do is influence the coils effect one the magnet behind it.

[Allen Burgess]

Hysterisis loop.

The unanswered question I have is why did I witness "Lenz Delay Propulsion" with just the bifilar power coils alone? Both the air core thread spool series wraped bifilar with Reed switch, and the bifilar series wraped air core spiral coil with Bedini SSG circuit exhibited the effect alone at high speed, without an output coil and load. This effect with just the power pulse coil alone opened up a whole new range of possible applications ideas for me. An electro turbo fan with a variable blade pitch for example.

Are we dealing with simply a hysterisis loop in the case of these two types of power coils alone?

[Shadesz]

Hey guys check this out. It may be something to consider...
http://www.energeticforum.com/157895-post1765.html