Inductive Collapse - capture and use

[garrypm]

Hi Barbiosi,

Sorry, I haven't forgetten you.

I wanted to have a go at doing Matts TS. That is about out of the way now.

I will get that circuit back on the bench and take a pic or two.

Thanks, Garry

[garrypm]

Ok,

Taken the TS off the bench and back to the 1" sphere spinner -


You'll see red lead goes to MA meter then orange wire to collector

Thanks, Garry

[drak]

Would it be possible to bypass using a diode and just turn on a capacitor at the base of the spike and then turn off the capacitor at the peak of the spike?

[garrypm]

Hi Drak,

Which diode are you referring to?

I have a single diode for recovery, back to the source battery.

How could I control the switching into the cap you describe?

Thanks, Garry

[drak]

Hi Drak,

Which diode are you referring to?

I have a single diode for recovery, back to the source battery.

How could I control the switching into the cap you describe?

Thanks, Garry

That diode. The diode is only there to stop the cap from being discharged once filled with the spike at its peak. I would say micro-controller, or some kind of 555 setup. No clue if it will work, was just asking.

[garrypm]

Hi Drak,

I think I understand what you are saying.

I have the microcontroller, so give me a circuit and I'll whack it together.

Thanks, Garry

[drak]

Hi Drak,

I think I understand what you are saying.

I have the microcontroller, so give me a circuit and I'll whack it together.

Thanks, Garry

Well, I used this circuit to short coils on the muller motor, and as a switch for hv flyback. I just removed the reed switch, used a 10k resistor, and in place of the battery I used the logic 5v out from my avr. Shorting coil gives back more power And I used 18n50 instead of the IRF640.

[garrypm]

Thanks Drak, I am off to work now but, will set it up when I get home.

Garry

[mbrownn]

Well, I used this circuit to short coils on the muller motor, and as a switch for hv flyback. I just removed the reed switch, used a 10k resistor, and in place of the battery I used the logic 5v out from my avr. Shorting coil gives back more power And I used 18n50 instead of the IRF640.

Notice what aviso is doing with that circuit. He collects the power from the coil short and uses it to power the next step in the motor cycle, it is not an output, the motor power is the output. He has it right because we need to use the power in a conventional way either to run a car or power a generator. We have all being trying to collect power from the circuits and found that the output is not enough for what we would like but if we use this energy to reduce our input and collect the power conventionally, ie the motor power.

If we have a 100w motor that is 70% efficient it will give 70 watts of mechanical power which then can power a 70% efficient generator giving us 49 watts of output. At the same time we can recover 70w from the motor through coil shorting or collecting the output of inductive kickback in a pulsed motor. Most of us have done something like this but we have tried to use this power as an output and with further losses the result is disappointing, usually less than 49 watts and when combined with the generator on the motor only makes 98 watts which is not enough to make it self running.

Motors that are genuinely more than 70% efficient are rare.

So using the same system as above we now use the recovered energy directly to power the motor so that only 30 watts is required to top up the supply of 100 watts. we still have the same generator giving 49 watts but that is now enough to power the 30w required input and have 19 watts of extra usable power.

How do we do that? Aviso was using coil-shorting because he is using AC. I use inductive kickback because I use Pulsed DC and here is how its done http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...uits-regen.jpg The standard circuit is on the left and the overunity one is on the right. If you wire it with 12v input and a 12v motor it won't work. Here we use 220v so my generator is 220v but you can do it with 110. Lower than 60v does not work in practice. I rectify some of it and use it as the source for the 12v motor I then switch it fast enough so that the 12v motor wont burn out. The pulse width has to be less than 50% or the motor will run away and burn out. You have to use a fixed load on the generator or the motor will run away and the load is how you control it. There I have given you it.

Aviso is doing the same thing but in a slightly different way. Try it, test it and post your results here http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...tml#post143009 . If you cant make it work I will tell you how to do it. The trifilar coil is for balancing bit you don't need it with pulse width modulation.

[drak]

Notice what aviso is doing with that circuit. He collects the power from the coil short and uses it to power the next step in the motor cycle, it is not an output, the motor power is the output. He has it right because we need to use the power in a conventional way either to run a car or power a generator. We have all being trying to collect power from the circuits and found that the output is not enough for what we would like but if we use this energy to reduce our input and collect the power conventionally, ie the motor power.

If we have a 100w motor that is 70% efficient it will give 70 watts of mechanical power which then can power a 70% efficient generator giving us 49 watts of output. At the same time we can recover 70w from the motor through coil shorting or collecting the output of inductive kickback in a pulsed motor. Most of us have done something like this but we have tried to use this power as an output and with further losses the result is disappointing, usually less than 49 watts and when combined with the generator on the motor only makes 98 watts which is not enough to make it self running.

Motors that are genuinely more than 70% efficient are rare.

So using the same system as above we now use the recovered energy directly to power the motor so that only 30 watts is required to top up the supply of 100 watts. we still have the same generator giving 49 watts but that is now enough to power the 30w required input and have 19 watts of extra usable power.

How do we do that? Aviso was using coil-shorting because he is using AC. I use inductive kickback because I use Pulsed DC and here is how its done http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...uits-regen.jpg The standard circuit is on the left and the overunity one is on the right. If you wire it with 12v input and a 12v motor it won't work. Here we use 220v so my generator is 220v but you can do it with 110. Lower than 60v does not work in practice. I rectify some of it and use it as the source for the 12v motor I then switch it fast enough so that the 12v motor wont burn out. The pulse width has to be less than 50% or the motor will run away and burn out. You have to use a fixed load on the generator or the motor will run away and the load is how you control it. There I have given you it.

Aviso is doing the same thing but in a slightly different way. Try it, test it and post your results here http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...tml#post143009 . If you cant make it work I will tell you how to do it. The trifilar coil is for balancing bit you don't need it with pulse width modulation.

Interesting...

[mbrownn]

Interesting...

Glad you like it, I notice you have been working with what is to all intents is a bucking coil. That is similar to the Lockridge trifler coil, they have interesting properties but in the Lockridge device it works as an inductance multiplier as well as a recovery device. I believe ou can store energy in it and collect a high voltage spike without taking the stored energy.

[drak]

I think I'm going to give this thread a shot. Thinking about trying to capture the inductive collapse to a few caps, then connect them in series and discharge into something. Wondering if I should pulse primary with secondary, capture the secondary along with the collapse of the primary, or should I just use a primary with no secondary and just capture the collapse on disconnect.

I suppose I could try both.

Going to use ferrite so I can get high frequency. Does iron give higher collapse?

[mbrownn]

try this circuit http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...tml#post193825

By pulsing the motor into a cap we collect the supply and inductive kickback in the cap and reuse it to power the motor on the next pulse, smaller caps will increase the voltage in the cap but reduce the power in each pulse and vice versa. Use a motor with a high inductance but as low a resistance as possible. You switch it with a home made commutator on the output shaft, ill show you how to do it if you are interested.

On my test I did not get an overunity of mechanical power but I did get a lot of heat suggesting that the energy gain was being dissipated in heat. If you use a universal motor, one of the field coils can be used as an output improving efficiency.

[drak]

try this circuit http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...tml#post193825

By pulsing the motor into a cap we collect the supply and inductive kickback in the cap and reuse it to power the motor on the next pulse, smaller caps will increase the voltage in the cap but reduce the power in each pulse and vice versa. Use a motor with a high inductance but as low a resistance as possible. You switch it with a home made commutator on the output shaft, ill show you how to do it if you are interested.

On my test I did not get an overunity of mechanical power but I did get a lot of heat suggesting that the energy gain was being dissipated in heat. If you use a universal motor, one of the field coils can be used as an output improving efficiency.

I was thinking more along the lines of solid state. Maybe something like this?



All switches controlled by micro controller.

[kEhYo77]

Hi.
Maybe something like this?