E-Cat test was a success?

[Cloxxki]

NiO as catalyst, has that been confirmed, or can it be derived chemically?

I though I wanted to study economics, thus had to drop my favorite class, chemistry.

Would someone with more chemistry than me dare to just start sketching the possible reaction in E-Cat? Surely Rossi thought well about it before trying it, and didn't just try reactions between all types of materials under all kinds of conditions, hoping to get lucky. He seems a bit more "on" it than that.

So, Ni, NiO and H. We get out... Copper and a little bit of radiation and something more? Will the NiO still be there when the Ni is used up?
I'm daring to ask unedducated question, and hope you guys will dare to just wing it. Who knows, we may get close to understanding this. We cannot risk this tech dieing along with Rossi.
Thanks!

[jibbguy]

The US Naval Research Lab said they improved energy output when using a "Lithium bath" made up of Lithium Salts dissolved in the heavy water, and this is also what the Energetics of Israel group says they use (again, this LENR it is based on the original Pons and Fleichmann "Deuterium and Palladium" with an electromagnetic biasing signal which "shakes" the electrons in and out of the lattice greatly improving energy COP efficiency, not "Nickle/Hydrogen" as Rossi uses).

I guess we could say they all are lying? Or lying here and there? This is the problem when we decide to accept SOME of it because it fits our own theories

One thing i found significant, but no one else i've read picked up on, was that Professor Levy at U. of Bologna mentioned in an interview, that Rossi used to work for the US Naval Research Lab and DARPA... on their LENR project. I haven't seen Rossi himself state that.

SuperWave™ Fusion "excess heat" process visualization - YouTube!

EDIT: I notice that the "superwavefusion.com" site has been taken over... it is NOT what it used to be and is now useless for info on LENR... LOL, it reminds us of the "Xogen" site, huh????

[jibbguy]

Maybe its time to watch this again (first aired in 2009). In my last post, i mentioned that the "Superwave" site has been "nerfed"... possible suppressed (as many thought the Xogen company in Canada, reportedly based on Stanley Meyer hydroxy on demand technology site was). Who knows yet.

More Than Junk Science - 60 Minutes - CBS News

It is important to remember, that no matter what happens with the Rossi ECat... That the US government admitted that LENR is "real" in 2009 .

And no matter how many psy-ops games are run, this will not change, and this fundamental fact will not be forgotten.

I notice that the larger part of Meyer hydroxy research seen on this site has essentially changed to another technology involving inert gasses.

[PhysicsProf]

IF proton capture by nickel nuclei is indeed occurring as claimed by Rossi, then the COPPER nuclei produced will show a tell-tale ISOTOPE distribution.

I could go into details, but first I seem to recall a short discussion of the copper isotope distribution AFTER the Rossi reactor had run for weeks... Does anyone have the link to this information? We can learn from available data -- first need the data.

Thanks.

[soundiceuk]

Maybe its time to watch this again (first aired in 2009). In my last post, i mentioned that the "Superwave" site has been "nerfed"... possible suppressed (as many thought the Xogen company in Canada, reportedly based on Stanley Meyer hydroxy on demand technology site was). Who knows yet.

More Than Junk Science - 60 Minutes - CBS News

It is important to remember, that no matter what happens with the Rossi ECat... That the US government admitted that LENR is "real" in 2009 .

And no matter how many psy-ops games are run, this will not change, and this fundamental fact will not be forgotten.

I notice that the larger part of Meyer hydroxy research seen on this site has essentially changed to another technology involving inert gasses.

That video was an eye opener! Thanks

What a thing to see an inventor that has actually been discredited and lived through it, to now be excited that he no longer has to be discredited and he wants to get involved! Get him on here!

[PhysicsProf]

I must look at available data -- and add a word of caution regarding Rossi's bold claims.

I've been following Rossi's e-cat (see e.g. PESN) and asking questions. I would be very glad to be able to test a "Rossi device" -- I would look for gamma's from isotopes of copper allegedly produced in the reaction. I have run a gamma spectrometer many times; and proton and neutron detectors.

There is some recent information -- let's take a look at the latest data that has come out:

Swedish physicists on the E-cat: “It’s a nuclear reaction” - NyTeknik
The used powder contains
ten percent copper
...
For copper to be formed out of nickel, the nucleus of nickel has to capture a proton. The fact that this possibly occurs in Rossi’s reactor is why the concept of cold fusion has been mentioned – it would consist of fusion between nuclei of nickel and hydrogen.
A term that many consider to be more accurate, however, is LENR, Low Energy Nuclear Reaction.

Ny Teknik: For how long has the powder supposedly been used in the process?
Kullander: The powder has reportedly been used for 2.5 months continuously with an output of 10 kW (according to Rossi). It corresponds to a total energy of 18 MWh, with a consumption of up to 100 grams of nickel and two grams of hydrogen. If the production had been done with oil, two tons of oil would have been required.
Ny Teknik: What analyses have you done on the powders?
Kullander: Element analysis and isotopic analysis. At the Ĺngström Laboratory in Uppsala, Sweden, element analysis has been made using X-ray Fluorescence (XRFS). Dr. Erik Lindahl undertook the investigation. At the Biomedical Center in Uppsala, both element analysis and isotope analysis has been done through Inductively Coupled Plasma Mass Spectrometry (ICP-MS). Associate Professor Jean Pettersson has made the measurement.

Ny Teknik: What results have you obtained from the analyses?
Kullander: Both measurements show that the pure nickel powder contains mainly nickel, and the used powder is different in that several elements are present, mainly 10 percent copper and 11 percent iron. The isotopic analysis through ICP-MS doesn’t show any deviation from the natural isotopic composition of nickel and copper.

Ny Teknik: How do you interpret the results?
Kullander: Provided that copper is not one of the additives used as catalyst, the copper isotopes 63 and 65 can only have been formed during the process. Their presence is therefore a proof that nuclear reactions took place in the process. However, it’s remarkable that nickel-58 and hydrogen can form copper-63 (70%) and copper-65 (30%). This means that in the process, the original nickel-58 should have grown by five and seven atomic mass-units, respectively, during the nuclear transmutation. However, there are two stable isotopes of nickel with low concentration, nickel-62 and nickel-64, which could conceivably contribute to copper production. According to Rossi copper is not among the additives. 100 grams of nickel had been used during 2.5 months of continuous heating with 10 kW output power. A straightforward calculation shows that a large proportion of the nickel must have been consumed if it was ‘burned’ in a nuclear process. It’s then somewhat strange that the isotopic composition doesn’t differ from the natural.

Indeed -- VERY strange that the copper in the "ash" after 2.5 months of running (with no copper initially) -- strange that the ash shows produced-copper in the "NATURAL isotopic composition". As the scientist under-states:

it’s remarkable that nickel-58 and hydrogen can form copper-63 (70%) and copper-65 (30%). This means that in the process, the original nickel-58 should have grown by five and seven atomic mass-units, respectively, during the nuclear transmutation. .

Right -- naturally-occurring nickel, as in the initial powder -- has this isotopic composition:

Ni-58 ( 68.077% ) Ni-60 ( 26.223% ) Ni-61 ( 1.140% ) Ni-62 ( 3.634% ) Ni-64 ( 0.926% )
Table of Nuclides

Adding ONE proton to a Nickel nucleus as claimed by Rossi and Focardi will produce Copper isotopes, predominately Cu-59 and Cu-61, since the predominate isotopes of nickel are Ni-58 (68%) and Ni-60 (26.2%). {Add one proton to Ni-58, becomes Cu-59; add proton to Ni-60, becomes Cu-61.) Furthermore, both of these copper isotopes are highly radioactive (releasing gammas) and easily detectable! And detecting their presence via decay products would conclusively demonstrate the occurrence of the proton-capture reaction on Nickel.

I wrote Rossi months ago and challenged him to allow gamma-detection during operation of his e-cat device. NO positive response from him yet. I noted:

Cu-59 59CU EC DECAY Half life: 81.5 s – short enough to be VERY easy to observe and demonstrate, to determine whether actually produced or not.

Cu-61 61CU EC DECAY Half life: 3.33 hrs, also short enough to be VERY easy to observe and demonstrate, to determine whether actually produced or not

But now we learn that the end products are NOT Cu-59 (which decays to Ni-59, decays in turn to cobalt-59 finally) and Cu-61, but rather the NATURALLY occurring isotopes found in copper, namely copper-63 (70%) and copper-65 (30%) [percents are approx.].

Now how do you explain THAT? easy -- its CONTAMINATION of natural copper into his device. That's my preliminary conclusion. This conclusion is supported by the observed IRON (11%) in the final powder, see scientists' data released above. If there is NO contamination, then where did all that IRON come from?

BUT-- If its proton capture on nickel, as claimed by Rossi -- then he's got some EXPLAINING TO DO. How do you get copper-63 (70%) with ONE proton capture on natural nickel? And- How do you get copper-65 (30%) with ONE proton capture on natural nickel? We're talking about NEUTRONS coming out of nowhere? where? in order to get up to the naturally-occuring ratio of Cu-63(70%) and Cu-65 (30)%. Where do these neutrons come from, in just the right ratios?

Do you grasp the problem? One more time: proton capture on the predominant isotope of NICKEL, Nickle-58 (68%) would produce Copper-59, not the observed Cu-63 (and Cu-65).
You have to add FOUR more NEUTRONS (not protons) to Cu-59 to get to stable Cu-63, and do it in less time than it takes for Cu-59 to decay away (half life of Cu-59 is only 81.5 seconds).

C'mon-- we're not that gullible... IMHO, we should be skeptical. Rossi is claiming a very specific process, proton capture on nickel, but the experimental RESULTS do not support his claims. Sorry.


Note from Steven Krivit of New Energy Times, regarding the Rossi claims:

But the time-honored question to ask in all situations like this is, What is the total energy balance? Anybody who gets excited about this public demonstration without such information is vulnerable to deception. The next questions to ask are, Exactly how has the energy been measured? And by whom?

A power measurement – without the total energy balance – is virtually meaningless. Without answers to these questions, this experiment and demonstration could easily be a scam. Sadly, I have been a first-hand witness to deceptions.

The red flags with Rossi have been up for months.

In October 2010, a New Energy Times reader in Italy sent the following to me:

“I imagine you are aware that Rossi’s patent [application] has been [partially] rejected in a preliminary report by the patent examiner. Piantelli also published a new WIPO patent [application] a few months ago too.

“I wish Rossi well in his endeavors although I also feel he’s claiming as an invention merely the scaling up of Piantelli’s pioneering work. Any working devices ought to be good news for mankind regardless [of] who discovered what first. If anything works, we will all get some share of the glory (and perhaps profits?).”

Today, another New Energy Times reader in Italy sent the following to me:

“Pay close attention to Andrea Rossi; he has a dirty past. Twenty years ago he was arrested for illegal importing of gold from the Swiss.

“Not only that, but in the 1980s he was involved in a scam with industrial waste. It is a complex thing to explain, but the scam cost the Lombardy region € 25 million. He honestly does not convince me as a person, and I am not convinced about the test done at Bologna today.

“Check this link: Petroldragon - Wikipedia

“In friendship, I suggest you be careful, I smell something burning.”

According to the link, in 1995, Rossi was jailed for conspiracy to engage in tax fraud for his involvement in a business that was trading precious materials between Switzerland and Italy.

[phi1.62]

Had a look at the specifications of the E-Cat of the 1MW heat plant at the website selling the E-Cat. It seems that the device can only be used for heating since the maximum temperature of the water emitted by the device is 120 C. Even if the device does work I'm sure that there would be a lot of people, who had high expectations for this device, who would disappointed that the device cannot be used to generate electricity.

One Megawatt Heat Plant for Sale

[kcarring]

Had a look at the specifications of the E-Cat of the 1MW heat plant at the website selling the E-Cat. It seems that the device can only be used for heating since the maximum temperature of the water emitted by the device is 120 C. Even if the device does work I'm sure that there would be a lot of people, who had high expectations for this device, who would disappointed that the device cannot be used to generate electricity.

One Megawatt Heat Plant for Sale

Interesting... heat is heat though. If it costs you X-(input gain from E-cat) joules/$ to heat the water to boil, to then produce steam, you're still way ahead. Is your statement not similar to saying, why would someone want to use a solar heat collector to heat water, if it doesn't bring it right up to temperature?

[Roland]

Had a look at the specifications of the E-Cat of the 1MW heat plant at the website selling the E-Cat. It seems that the device can only be used for heating since the maximum temperature of the water emitted by the device is 120 C. Even if the device does work I'm sure that there would be a lot of people, who had high expectations for this device, who would disappointed that the device cannot be used to generate electricity.

One Megawatt Heat Plant for Sale

I'd think maximum operating Pressure is the most important number. The pressure is what used to run things with steam. It says the water pump pressure is 4 bars, which is 58 PSI. I'd think a they could make a few motors/turbines that could be driven by 58 PSI to make electricity or...

[ashtweth]

If Rossi truly wants to see decentralization he should publish how to use the 5KW e-cat for home power generation, seems like its a "no brainer" for me

2m Euros for 1MW means another energy cartel , sadly its the same as what Hidro, black light power and EBM are doing.5Kw home power unit (if it works , no long term testing yet) is the best going "for now" since the Wang genset is gone now, however its far from being able to decentralize unless they have a themed plan FOR THIS, and technical advice for such tasks (5KW DECENTRALIZATION)

It will prob be over priced like the 1MW, who the hell has 2 million euros in a financial melt down,they all want the money, ill stick with open source R and D for now.


Ash

[kcarring]

So much BS and no true solutions offered like that thrive BS,going... they all want the money, ill stick with open source R and D for now. Ash

I agree. And if the rumors that his new client is military, are true (who knows) ... well that pretty much takes care of that, doesn't it?

My mind is furthering toward a large combination of things. Solar, wind, gasification, HV pulsed lighting circuits. Until something ridiculously successful comes along, at least if you combine and operate enough useful methods, the result is the same; that is, lack of dependency.

[ashtweth]

Hello my friend

sativa gasificaiton for energy conversion is VERY underrated , check out CANNABIS: THE FACTS, HUMAN RIGHTS AND THE LAW. Official facts on Cannabis/ Marijuana/ Hemp.

this is why industrial hemp is only allowed BTW.
Sativa has the highest bio mass to energy conversion ratio look it up
you read that only on Panacea and democracy defined BTW, not any other "FE" site.

id rather help people not money

Ash

[Arius Nowak]

10.000.000

Had a look at the specifications of the E-Cat of the 1MW heat plant at the website selling the E-Cat. It seems that the device can only be used for heating since the maximum temperature of the water emitted by the device is 120 C. Even if the device does work I'm sure that there would be a lot of people, who had high expectations for this device, who would disappointed that the device cannot be used to generate electricity.

One Megawatt Heat Plant for Sale

Our party's CNFHR.200 as well others devices, with each one internal going work "shot",
temps of 10.000.000 (10^7) degs producing are.
All You need to know, timing of chain reaction is.
Do You feel the difference now, Sir?

Facebook

[Arius Nowak]

Victor Schauberger

If Rossi truly wants to see decentralization why isn't he publishing how to use the 5KW e-cat for home power generation, seems like its a "no brainer" for me

2m Euros for 1MW means another energy cartel , the same as what Hidro, black light power and EBM are doing.

5Kw home power unit (if it works , no long term testing) is the best going "for now" since the Wang genset is gone now, however its far from being able to decentralize unless they have a themed plan FOR THIS, and technical advice for such tasks (5KW DECENTRALIZATION)

It will prob be over priced like the 1MW, who the hell has 2 million euros in a financial melt down, WTF man...The euro will be worth Xhit soon BTW,I think there is a strong possibility that The catalyst will be open source after a few installations will come about, trust me on that some one will do it, this is the internet .

seems ,like this guy is another trying to hold humanity at ransom?... and not learning from history, it will be years i bet till you see this in a factory, ill work on the PSEC mean time or any thing like it..

So much BS and no true solutions offered like that thrive BS,going...
they all want the money, ill stick with open source R and D for now.


Ash

Answer is simple, as i had always written about.
The real "free energy" for choosen ones only is, under conditions.
The same said V. Schauberger.
Search for his works!

[kcarring]

sativa gasificaiton for energy conversion is VERY underrated

I think BC Canada has about a million acres of "not working out" replants of clear cuts that could be used to annually grow millions of lbs of plant matter with minimal human effort / resources.