My Motors got me to Tap into Radiant Energy

[Lightworker1]

You can upload your design as an Eagle board file, or a ZIP file containing Gerber CA

[QUOTE=iankoglin;235077]

HI John Stone, welcome back and hope your wife is doing well.

I had been working on using ExpressPCB as a source of prototype boards until a member pointed out OSHPark, and I submitted your gerber files to them. ExpressPCB does not use gerber files from customers. So I had attempted to use their software to make a similar PCB to the T3001. I could not seem to crack design processes in T3001. I had been concerned about equidistance on the heavy leads and making the PCB separable between FETs and FET Drivers, As Don H and Dana seemed to like to build that board separated from the input section. You may have noticed some of those board designs I posted. Although OSHPark edges ExpressPCB out in price, its not by much and an alternate source may still be a good idea. So I hadn't posted the latest design to address the above concerns. So here it is.





QUOTE]

G'day Sanpojo and especially John Stone
John Stone told me that R2 should be 330 ohms Not 1K ohms as shown
Please confirm before Production
Kindest Regards

Kogs Just keeping his eye on things

Many Thanks Kogs & @All posting this link about
OSH Park PCB Order - Upload your design
I am glad they are able to accept eagle cad files too.

You can upload your design as an Eagle board file, or a ZIP file containing Gerber CAM files. See our design submission guidelines for more information.

There is great wisdom in the following statement:
Good teams make the most of individual and talents.
UFOPOLITICS made This The Reality

Planning my Monster Quad Pulser. One thing I do not want to reinvent if the Monster Pulser PCBs are already now available from PCB fab place.

Warmest Regards All

Nameste

light

[Lightworker1]

Cornboy, You saw the email, we should have ours from OSHPark around July 12. I ordere

Cornboy, You saw the email, we should have ours from OSHPark around July 12. I ordered 20. we are getting ~$11/bd unit cost. I will have my hands full just assembling 4 and a spare or 2 and could part with the overage. I said what the heck, I wanted 5 or 6, and for around $100 on my own or teaming up with Cornboy, I got 4+ more. Ordered FETs, still trying to put together a BOM at Mouser for the rest. Just get a packet with everything in it... thats the plan.

So Machine, Let me know if you are interested in these PCBs. (driver circuitry and FETs on same board). OSHPark planning to put them on his store. He will make a few and try to stay ahead of ordering rates. If he gets volume he may put it on his higher output line, may lower the end unit cost. I will try to get when he might post the PWM board.

Hello Sampojo, looks like you have the info about the availability of these JS monster PCBs. Due to circumstances I got behind with this particular thread. Sorry about that. I am trying to go through various posts

Many Thanks

Warmest regards all

Nameste

light

[Lightworker1]

Hello everyone, just a couple of pics of John Stone Pulser boards that Sampojo, organised.

Thanks Joe.

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

Regards Cornboy.

Hello Cornboy indeed these pcbs are beauty
Looking forward to buying them.

Warmest regards all

nameste

light

[Cornboy 555]

Joe.

G'day Cornboy
Try here

Buy PCB Headers 6W,1ROW STRT HEADER,GOLD TE Connectivity 826629-6 online from RS for next day delivery.

Please how much are the Monster Boards?

Kindest Regards

Hey Kogs, thanks for the link, for some reason i was looking for screw terminal blocks, but 2.54 pitch are hard to find at any decent price.

I am sure Sampojo will update price and availability of boards, when he sees these posts.

He's the man on the ground, so to speak. @ Lightworker as well.

[JohnStone]

Advantage of pulsing:
This night I continued simulating pulses on a coil. Same coil 100mH and 5 Ohm resistor.
Voltages: 12, 24, 36,48,60
Period: 22 ms
Variation: Adjusting duty cycle as to result in very same resistor loss.

Discussion:
Pulse width needs to be decreased on a nonlinear way while coil energy stored increases linearly with voltage. Not amazing because curent increases linearly.
Amazing is: with higher voltage and shorter pulses we get more energy into the coil, while losses in resistor are stable!!!!!
Good news: pump more power in short time into your coils while not increasing losses! Harvest HER gift while extended off time.

Please note: Symmetric motors do not make use of radiant and hence are not interested in harvesting after switch off. They require constant current flow into the motor.
Here we are interested in pumping power into the coil in short time in order to make use of the magic ocurring after switch off.
But of course we still need to put torque on the armature. Therefore we expect a sweetspot for torque and harvesting. And this sweet spot will be individual for every motor. load condition and speed. And please do not expecrt linear behaviour - a challenge for any controller!!

BTW: I simulated for rectified mains as well pertaining constant loss. Pulse time decreases (compared to 12V) to 20% for 115V and 10% for 230V.
This info is just for information. But please do not do that yourself. It is dagerous and might be lethal for you or others.
JS

[JohnStone]

Hey Kogs, thanks for the link, for some reason i was looking for screw terminal blocks, but 2.54 pitch are hard to find at any decent price.

I am sure Sampojo will update price and availability of boards, when he sees these posts.

He's the man on the ground, so to speak. @ Lightworker as well.

@ALL: Please understand I designed this board for hand wiring - for everybody all over the world. I was not aware at that time that it will be multiplied as true PCB. We can enhance it for two layer PCB later on. And then we will add screw terminals, current sensor ...... and make it somewhat smaller.
JS

[Cornboy 555]

Next.

@ALL: Please understand I designed this board for hand wiring - for everybody all over the world. I was not aware at that time that it will be multiplied as true PCB. We can enhance it for two layer PCB later on. And then we will add screw terminals, current sensor ...... and make it somewhat smaller.
JS

Sounds great John, by then we will probably need to put other bits on as well, Who Knows, i look forward to the future,

Thanks Friend, Cornboy.

[Lightworker1]

Advantage of pulsing:
This night I continued simulating pulses on a coil. Same coil 100mH and 5 Ohm resistor.
Voltages: 12, 24, 36,48,60
Period: 22 ms
Variation: Adjusting duty cycle as to result in very same resistor loss.

Discussion:
Pulse width needs to be decreased on a nonlinear way while coil energy stored increases linearly with voltage. Not amazing because curent increases linearly.
Amazing is: with higher voltage and shorter pulses we get more energy into the coil, while losses in resistor are stable!!!!!
Good news: pump more power in short time into your coils while not increasing losses! Harvest HER gift while extended off time.

Please note: Symmetric motors do not make use of radiant and hence are not interested in harvesting after switch off. They require constant current flow into the motor.
Here we are interested in pumping power into the coil in short time in order to make use of the magic ocurring after switch off.
But of course we still need to put torque on the armature. Therefore we expect a sweetspot for torque and harvesting. And this sweet spot will be individual for every motor. load condition and speed. And please do not expecrt linear behaviour - a challenge for any controller!!

BTW: I simulated for rectified mains as well pertaining constant loss. Pulse time decreases (compared to 12V) to 20% for 115V and 10% for 230V.
This info is just for information. But please do not do that yourself. It is dagerous and might be lethal for you or others.
JS

Hello John Stone. Many thanks for this insight.

Warmest regards

Nameste

light

[Lightworker1]

@ALL: Please understand I designed this board for hand wiring - for everybody all over the world. I was not aware at that time that it will be multiplied as true PCB. We can enhance it for two layer PCB later on. And then we will add screw terminals, current sensor ...... and make it somewhat smaller.
JS

Hello John stone. Many thanks. I am really looking forward to the possible monster driver pcbs. At present, I am in the planning stage for the 4ch monster pulser. So in a way, I have some time at hand as I am currently trying all kinds of measurements on the dual pentagon motor.

Good Luck.

Warmest regards

Nameste

light

[Ufopolitics]

Excellent Analysis!

Advantage of pulsing:
This night I continued simulating pulses on a coil. Same coil 100mH and 5 Ohm resistor.
Voltages: 12, 24, 36,48,60
Period: 22 ms
Variation: Adjusting duty cycle as to result in very same resistor loss.

Discussion:
Pulse width needs to be decreased on a nonlinear way while coil energy stored increases linearly with voltage. Not amazing because curent increases linearly.
Amazing is: with higher voltage and shorter pulses we get more energy into the coil, while losses in resistor are stable!!!!!
Good news: pump more power in short time into your coils while not increasing losses! Harvest HER gift while extended off time.

Please note: Symmetric motors do not make use of radiant and hence are not interested in harvesting after switch off. They require constant current flow into the motor.
Here we are interested in pumping power into the coil in short time in order to make use of the magic ocurring after switch off.
But of course we still need to put torque on the armature. Therefore we expect a sweetspot for torque and harvesting. And this sweet spot will be individual for every motor. load condition and speed. And please do not expecrt linear behaviour - a challenge for any controller!!

BTW: I simulated for rectified mains as well pertaining constant loss. Pulse time decreases (compared to 12V) to 20% for 115V and 10% for 230V.
This info is just for information. But please do not do that yourself. It is dagerous and might be lethal for you or others.
JS

Hello My Friend Sir John Stone!


Excellent Analysis!...awesome...

John, could You, please, simulate also an LC (Capacitor and Coil) in parallel, individual connections?...using same parameters/comparisons as you have shown above?

Say we try to add "static" capacitance values (Cap Farads) within a closed range related to Coil Capacitance/Resistance...or above...

We should figure Non Polarized Caps...since SHE will come in "reversed mode" ...even though I do not think both energies within one "ordinary" Container...will ever "add up"...since they are different energies nature...but we still could use advantages of both individually, even if they "do not mix"...similar as they both "live" within a Coil...

It would be a nice Simulation to see...


Kind Regards


Ufopolitics

[JohnStone]

... John, could You, please, simulate also an LC (Capacitor and Coil) in parallel, individual connections?...using same parameters/comparisons as you have shown above? ....

Ufo, yes well I will do it. You intend to add a cap at coil and at armature turning along coils.
But any simulations will not take care of HER. She is completely tranparent for any human made simulation.
Anyway I expect no sudden pulses or current interruption like before but oscillations of that tank circuit. Special case if we hit resonance with pulsing frequency or on/off from commutator segements or both.

BTW: I will continue motor building . Is it still advisable to use a 20 pole armture with 4 brushes / magnets?
I have now two identical motors 36V 1000W.
I will cut housings at shaft side in order to get magnets of both housings together like magnets of double length. Then I will put both armatures on one new long shaft. Commutators and brushes will sit at both ends at their genuine place like before.

Armatures are somewhat shorter than magnets. Is that a drawback? I would like to prevent cutting magnets.

JS

[Ufopolitics]

Is Fine John...

Ufo, yes well I will do it. You intend to add a cap at coil and at armature turning along coils.
But any simulations will not take care of HER. She is completely tranparent for any human made simulation.
Anyway I expect no sudden pulses or current interruption like before but oscillations of that tank circuit. Special case if we hit resonance with pulsing frequency or on/off from commutator segements or both.

BTW: I will continue motor building . Is it still advisable to use a 20 pole armture with 4 brushes / magnets?
I have now two identical motors 36V 1000W.
I will cut housings at shaft side in order to get magnets of both housings together like magnets of double length. Then I will put both armatures on one new long shaft. Commutators and brushes will sit at both ends at their genuine place like before.

Armatures are somewhat shorter than magnets. Is that a drawback? I would like to prevent cutting magnets.

JS

Hello John,


I know "simulations" are written by Humans... ...and they do not include/accept HER (so far..)...but I was referring to Hot Side behavior.

On Your build, that is a great Motor!, a P20 is same as my BADSEY/BOSCH Motor...Very strong!

It does not matter that Armature lamination area, is smaller than magnets...what should not be is the opposite. Think that you will be designing the size/strength of your rotor magnetic fields...so, you could expand them or shrink it to size...

On My BOSCH I used 18 gauge...and 21-22 turns per Coil...a P21.

But later on, after I have already built it...I came up with the Quad Pentagons Design...However, I have not build that type yet...


Warm Regards


Ufopolitics

[iankoglin]

BTW: I will continue motor building . Is it still advisable to use a 20 pole armture with 4 brushes / magnets?
I have now two identical motors 36V 1000W.
I will cut housings at shaft side in order to get magnets of both housings together like magnets of double length. Then I will put both armatures on one new long shaft. Commutators and brushes will sit at both ends at their genuine place like before.

Armatures are somewhat shorter than magnets. Is that a drawback? I would like to prevent cutting magnets.

JS

G'day John
My Monster 5.1's work great thanks for your designing of them
My 1000w motor has larger bearings on the shaft side and my motors have the same longer magnets. I am getting my engineering friend to make a new shaft that is the same size to fit the bearings on the commutator end and continue or rather extend the shaft at both ends so I can use either end to drive the tricycle it will be used in at the moment the thread is ccw I will have cw one end and ccw the other. The wiring of the armature is .8mm diam. I have some wire but it has/is used in other coils and they were litzed and therefore if I stretch them to make then straight they will be thinner so I ordered .8mm from off EBay it is coming from the US I imagine I will have it within the next week or two by then I will have the motor Mods finished.

One Question my friend about your monsters Please can I use them in place of the Mosfets in the "Happy Motor Circuit" I did try them 3 times with an Oscillator I purchased on EBay but they the Oscillators became defunct.
Please I would like your opinion regarding this when you have time

Kindest Regards


Kogs still working at it

[prochiro]

I did try them 3 times with an Oscillator I purchased on EBay but they the Oscillators became defunct.Please I would like your opinion regarding this when you have time

@ Kogs
What voltage were you putting out in the oscillators, what general frequency range and were you going thru the SFH617-3 Opto on monster board? Bob French and I went thru a number of Ebay units while not using the opto's as they really have no on board protection are picky about voltage source.
Dana

[JohnStone]

Hi Kogs,
Unfortunately I can not know how you connected your oscillator to opto of monster driver. Can you post please a schematic of your oscillator or a link to the ebay offer. I will instruct you how to connect.

(@ALL: It would be great help for helpers if you could forward some basic schematics of your setups)

Regarding small bearing at commutator side please regard my recent post

I own a MY1016 and MY1020. Major difference is length of shaft and shaft diameter at armature 12mm vs. 14mm.
I decided to buy a second 1020 and cut both motor housings at shaft side down to magnets. Then I join cut sides of housings and both armatures on a new shaft. Then I have left genuine commutator sides at both ends.

You can do very same procedure with 1016. This type provides even more free space at commutator side - plenty of space.

The spare end caps from shaft side can be stacked on top of brush cap at each side in order to make use of the bigger bearings.

The whole stack above can be inserted in a steel tube in order to get them tight together without any need for welding.

The brush caps can be made adjustable while fixing former shaft caps at steel tube for stability.

These motors have not abundant space for wiring at aramture gaps therefore I decided to get 2 aramtures joined together in order to get more wire wound.

Regarding plastic commutators: One of my motor was a defective one. Commutator was very hot before that copper segements changed color to bluish. Plastic still OK. There is plastic material available (liquid crystal plastic) with permanent usage temerature up to 400°C. Probably the commutators are not made of this high grade material but they seem to be quite rugged.

Anyway these Chineese motors are cheap, available all over teh world and many replicators can afford two of them along relatively simple mods.

I will post a drawing explainig what I planned exactly to do.
JS

G'day John
My Monster 5.1's work great thanks for your designing of them
My 1000w motor has larger bearings on the shaft side and my motors have the same longer magnets. I am getting my engineering friend to make a new shaft that is the same size to fit the bearings on the commutator end and continue or rather extend the shaft at both ends so I can use either end to drive the tricycle it will be used in at the moment the thread is ccw I will have cw one end and ccw the other. The wiring of the armature is .8mm diam. I have some wire but it has/is used in other coils and they were litzed and therefore if I stretch them to make then straight they will be thinner so I ordered .8mm from off EBay it is coming from the US I imagine I will have it within the next week or two by then I will have the motor Mods finished.

One Question my friend about your monsters Please can I use them in place of the Mosfets in the "Happy Motor Circuit" I did try them 3 times with an Oscillator I purchased on EBay but they the Oscillators became defunct.
Please I would like your opinion regarding this when you have time

Kindest Regards


Kogs still working at it