3 Battery Generating System

[Sawt2]

I like where you are headed Dave, I am working on the rotating of the batteries along with running a generator to throw energy back in to the batteries or to use for something else.

As I've said before…even if we haven't been able to replicate what I got out of my original 3BGS, the concept of running a motor between the positives of two batteries is something we NEED to be exploring.

Logic would tell you that as battery 3 fills up the motor would slow down because the potential difference goes away. It doesn't slow down.. It only slows when the two primaries have discharged significantly. So, if you put a cap on the primaries and pulse the motor, charging the primaries during the off time using the cap, the motor will continue to run. You get the benefit of the long run times the 3BGS setup gives you, plus the motor as generator because of the way it is wired. If you are using the motor to run a generator that is worth a crap, you can keep the cap charged, and thus the primaries. And you have LEFT OVER energy to use. How MUCH depends on the size of your motor and the efficiency of your generator.

Rotate your batteries through the three positions and it increases their capacity.I know I need to post results on this to convince folks, but there should be SOME of you willing to give it a shot. It isn't rocket science. Use the Bedini cap dump circuit and you have it. Add a flywheel to smooth out your rotation and keep the thing moving. It is all here. We HAVE all the pieces. Now we need to figure out what the most efficient coils are, most efficient cores, most efficient motor to use, perfect size for the flywheel.
Dave

[Turion]

Testing

As I've said before…even if we haven't been able to replicate what I got out of my original 3BGS, the concept of running a motor between the positives of two batteries is something we NEED to be exploring.

Logic would tell you that as battery 3 fills up the motor would slow down because the potential difference goes away. It doesn't slow down.. It only slows when the two primaries have discharged significantly. So, if you put a cap on the primaries and pulse the motor, charging the primaries during the off time using the cap, the motor will continue to run. You get the benefit of the long run times the 3BGS setup gives you, plus the motor as generator because of the way it is wired. If you are using the motor to run a generator that is worth a crap, you can keep the cap charged, and thus the primaries. And you have LEFT OVER energy to use. How MUCH depends on the size of your motor and the efficiency of your generator.

Rotate your batteries through the three positions and it increases their capacity.
I know I need to post results on this to convince folks, but there should be SOME of you willing to give it a shot. It isn't rocket science. Use the Bedini cap dump circuit and you have it. Add a flywheel to smooth out your rotation and keep the thing moving. It is all here. We HAVE all the pieces. Now we need to figure out what the most efficient coils are, most efficient cores, most efficient motor to use, perfect size for the flywheel. There is a ton of experimenting to be done.

Dave

[Turion]

Bigger Motors

Shylo,
I agree that bigger motors put out more in relationship to their size than the little motors do. I think Luther has noticed that also.

I will keep everyone posted on progress. It will probably be three weeks before parts are in and I have it all put together to test. By then I may have my house up for sale finally!!!

Dave

[shylo]

motor size

Hi Dave, I recently just started a new job so things have stalled. I don't have enough time to keep up. But I have found that the bigger the motors do give more , they draw more but what they give back is more , at a better ratio than the little motors.
You need 4 batteries so 1 is always excepting charge, but not being drained while charging.
I think we need to use transformers... still exp.
My longest runs are always with the dead battery.
Always trying...artv

[Sawt2]

Very cool Dave, I am curious/excited to hear your results. I am slowly making progress in getting my workshop back together at our new place. I am hoping to be able to get back to experimenting again soon. I have a machinist friend making some of the parts for the rotating of the batteries. I look everyday with hopes that someone is making some progress.

My life is so complicated right now I badly have time to post, but I wanted to let folks know that I haven't faded completely into the woodwork. Remodeling one house to sell, while fixing up another close to our property to live in while we build our retirement home on a third property. And property one is 2 1/2 hours from property 2 and 3.

Anyway, here is a picture of the generator. The two white stacks each contain six coils. The wheel on the left with the red pieces in it is the flywheel. That is a small razor scooter motor to the right which runs the whole thing. It runs as a motor until it is up to speed, and then will run as a generator. I have data from previous test runs, but have burnt up two razor scooter motors trying to turn that 10 lb flywheel from a standstill plus overcome magnetic lock of the rotors on the coil cores running it with JUST the motor. But I HAVE run it that way, so I know how many amps it takes to run, and how many volts each coil puts out TO A LOAD at 1800 rpm (which is where it puts out 120-130 volts.) I have ordered all the electronics, but some of the parts are on backorder, so don't know when I will have this up and running and can post test data. Can't wait to see what it does when it is all working properly. I know what I have seen with just two coils and the same rotor setup in long test runs. If I get several times that with 12 coils, I am home free.

As I said, the setup JB says to run in the Free Energy Generation handbook, run with a pulse motor on the 3BGS setup which gives longer runs, charges the batteries during the off pulse, and uses the stock motor as a generator by running it between the positives…This setup combines everything I have learned so far….except that I have already thought of half a dozen improvements for the next version.

[Turion]

Udate

My life is so complicated right now I badly have time to post, but I wanted to let folks know that I haven't faded completely into the woodwork. Remodeling one house to sell, while fixing up another close to our property to live in while we build our retirement home on a third property. And property one is 2 1/2 hours from property 2 and 3.

Anyway, here is a picture of the generator. The two white stacks each contain six coils. The wheel on the left with the red pieces in it is the flywheel. That is a small razor scooter motor to the right which runs the whole thing. It runs as a motor until it is up to speed, and then will run as a generator. I have data from previous test runs, but have burnt up two razor scooter motors trying to turn that 10 lb flywheel from a standstill plus overcome magnetic lock of the rotors on the coil cores running it with JUST the motor. But I HAVE run it that way, so I know how many amps it takes to run, and how many volts each coil puts out TO A LOAD at 1800 rpm (which is where it puts out 120-130 volts.) I have ordered all the electronics, but some of the parts are on backorder, so don't know when I will have this up and running and can post test data. Can't wait to see what it does when it is all working properly. I know what I have seen with just two coils and the same rotor setup in long test runs. If I get several times that with 12 coils, I am home free.

As I said, the setup JB says to run in the Free Energy Generation handbook, run with a pulse motor on the 3BGS setup which gives longer runs, charges the batteries during the off pulse, and uses the stock motor as a generator by running it between the positives…This setup combines everything I have learned so far….except that I have already thought of half a dozen improvements for the next version.

[Turion]

Sawt2
"The premise of the SERPS is to pull power from a generator through an electrical load to some form of charge storage. The stored electrical charge is then discharged back through the electrical load and through the generator windings which produces work at the load for a second time and simultaneously produces a magnetic motive force within the generator."

From what I understand, a WORKING device was demonstrated at the last energy conference, and they have released the video presentation about it. Not that there will be enough info to replicate it, but it is interesting. Kind of a cross between what we are doing with the 3BGS, a generator, and a Tesla switch.

Now the 3BGS is not SERPS, but compare the highlighted red point. Take power from two batteries in series through the motor to one battery (or two batteries in parallel)

Then switch the positions of the batteries as you would with a TESLA switch. PULSE the motor with this setup, and the motor outputs more voltage than it took to run it, because it acts as a generator. Yes there are losses in the system, but IF that motor is being used to turn a generating device you can provide voltage back to the batteries in the "off" time. And if you have a pulsing device you are running it as a motor some of the time and as a generator some of the time, are you not???

BroMikey
All I was trying to do here is show that I really do believe we have all the pieces.

The tesla switch proves that if you take power out of batteries in series and send it to batteries in parallel it can go through something and do work WITHOUT running down the batteries, IF YOU ROTATE BATTERIES and if you HIT THEM WITH A HIGH ENOUGH VOLTAGE SPIKE (key).

The 3BGS proves that an OFF THE SHELF motor run between the positives of two batteries acts as a generator putting out MORE power than it takes to run.
(As long as it is putting out 14 volts or higher, you have a "charge state" going on in the batteries.) Will a really BIG motor put out more of a high voltage spike than a little motor? Will a motor run at high speed or on higher voltages put out a bigger voltage spike than a motor run at low speed or low voltages?

If you use your PULSE motor to turn a generator, you can use some of the generated voltage from the (actual) generator to keep batteries topped off during the OFF times IF THEY EVEN NEED IT.

The "Free Energy Generation" book says you need a motor, a generating device, a flywheel to keep it running at speed (since you are pulsing it) and the electronics to make it all work.

Watson did it with the famous "Watson Device" I have seen working devices. I have built one.

I won't share the design of the generator I have built because it is NOT my design, but what does THAT matter?? It doesn't have to be perfect to work. The first one I built worked and I have been working and working to make it better and better. Do you have a rotor with some magnets on it and a couple coils? If you're like me, you have lots of different coils with lots of different sizes and lengths of wire that you've wound over the years. I just started experimenting with what Beardon put out in the "Free Energy Generation" book in 2006, and trying to combine that with the 3BGS and the Tesla switch concept. ALL of these devices work. The SERPS works. We have everything we need to create working devices if we don't give up.

If you have a Bedini wheel, you have your generator already built. Just attach a small motor to it somehow and run the motor between two 12 volt batteries wired in series and two wired in parallel. You will need to pulse the motor, but you should know how to set up a pulse circuit by now. If not, there are lots of them on the forum. You will have to manually switch the batteries every few minutes and you won't be taking the output of the generator back to the batteries, but use that cap dump circuit of yours to collect the output in some caps and dump it into the batteries during the off time. There you have it. Will it be as good as mine? Heck no. But you didn't spend $2,000.00 either.

My generator setup is (hopefully) completed and will be assembled AGAIN today. I have never been able to run it for more than 15 or 20 minutes because magnets would pop out of the rotors or something else would come loose and start grinding or "clacking." Hopefully all those problems are solved. If not, I have some final solutions that I know will work, but will require a rebuild of a lot of the setup and I just don't have the money for that right now. I've got well over $2,000.00 into this thing as it stands, mostly because I have redesigned and redesigned, but also because 12 coils of copper wire is a butt load of money. Especially when they have been replaced several times with different configurations using NEW new wire. I still have all these wound coils that are in configurations that didn't work quite as well. They are NOT useless, but I want the best production I can get.

Buy Beardon's book. I BOUGHT it. But you can find it on the internet in a downloadable version.
http://thepiratebay.se/torrent/51820...rgy_Generation
If you want to give this a shot, great. If you don't, that's fine too. I'm not here to ram anything down anyone's throat.

The 3BGS has taught me a lot. There are concepts here that I will continue to play with. I said YEARS ago that I believed we were flipping the magnetic polarity of the 3rd battery in the 3BGS setup at times, and that's what got us incredibly long runs. And I have seen that the electrical polarity on battery 3 will flip, especially with large enough loads. So I will CONTINUE to mess with the 3BGS until I understand flipping magnetic polarity on a battery and how to do it AT WILL.

This generator, the 3BGS, the Benitez (Tesla) switch, and Steele Braden's generator are the things I will focus on until I have a better direction to go.

Dave

[Sawt2]

I'm not familiar with S.E.R.P.S. could you please explain?

If you come up with a schematic to rotate all batteries through all three positions, let me know. I would love to give that a try while running loads.

We KNOW that runing a load between a high voltage and a low voltage works, and that is what S.E.R.P.S. is all about.

[Turion]

If you come up with a schematic to rotate all batteries through all three positions, let me know. I would love to give that a try while running loads.

We KNOW that runing a load between a high voltage and a low voltage works, and that is what S.E.R.P.S. is all about.

[Sawt2]

You are correct you should have gotten a response, and for that I say I'm sorry, but please know your postings don't go unnoticed. I actually look at this forum in hopes that you or someone has posted something more on the 3bgs thread. I must admit I don' post much at all, and I should I know. I have been working on building a setup using 24 volt wheelchair motors with 76 ah agm batteries. I have also designed a switch that will allow me to rotate the batteries while the system is running, working on the final construction of switch. In theory I am thinking the batteries could potentially switch at a rate of speed that the system could keep all three batteries charged and potentially each one run a load along with the main system load.

Is the forum so dead that I post this information and don't get a single response? I can see that checking in here is becoming a waste of time. It has been real.

Dave

[Turion]

No response?

Is the forum so dead that I post this information and don't get a single response? I can see that checking in here is becoming a waste of time. It has been real.

Dave

[Turion]

Use for there 3BGS

Let me begin by stating that all of the following is supposition, conjecture and bulldoodie. But what if it isn’t?

One of the VERY FIRST things I talked about with the 3BGS is that you have to balance the loads between the load on the motor and the load on battery 3. When you do, you get the extended run times that everyone wants. In my very first post I even explained HOW to balance the loads, but of course very few folks pay much attention to that. If they had, here is what they would have discovered with just a tiny bit of research on their own. If you get the loads to balance, you will get a certain run time per amp hour on your batteries. SOMETIMES, when you double the load on the motor and get it into balance with the load on battery 3 (or double the load on battery 3 and get the load on the motor into balance… and doubling one does NOT mean you automatically double the other) you will get the EXACT SAME run time per amp hour measurement on your battery even though you have doubled the load. Triple the load, get it into balance, and SOMETIMES you get EXACTLY THE SAME run time per amp hour on your batteries. Luther and I have always said that we aren’t putting ENOUGH of a load on the system to really understand what it is capable of doing for us.

Suppose you have a DC motor Let’s take a Razor Scooter motor as an example. To it you attach an “energizer” device consisting of some coils and some rotors with magnets that when turned will produce some electricity. To this you attach a flywheel, so that once it is up to speed, it will continue at about the same speed as long as you remember to pulse that Razor Scooter motor.

Suppose this “energizer” or generator produced 120 volts per coil at one amp (under load), or 1440 watts of (resistive only loads) electrical output. The construction specs of this energizer are not something I came up with by the way. The design is not mine to share, but is something I replicated and then spent a lot of time and money working with different sized coils, different sizes and lengths of wire, different numbers of strands. But the relationship of how the coils and rotors and magnets all work together is not my design.

Suppose the razor scooter motor ran on 12 volts at 7 amps once it reached its run speed of 1800 rpm’s. That would be an input of 84 watts to the motor to turn the generator. But for fun, lets round it up to 10 amps at 12 volts for 120 watts consumed. But the generator puts out 1440. Already, it would seem, the generator is putting out more than it takes to run. Even if each coil only put out .5 amps it would be WAY more. Even if the coil put out .25 amps.

Issues
1. The motor speeds up when you run a resistive load, but slows down when you attach an inductive load.

2. The motor requires a controller so you can charge batteries during the “off” time of the motor with output from the generator or the battery will run down

3. The motor needs an assist to get up to the 1800rpm run speed. You have the magnetic lock of 16 coils to the cores plus the weight of the flywheel to overcome, and it draws enough amps to smoke the wiring on the motor. I have done THAT a couple times.

4. Because you can only run resistive loads you must deposit the generated power into batteries or capacitors before it can be taken out to do real work


Now let us suppose that we use the pulse motor designed by Matt Jones or the aysemetric motor designed by UFO. Either one would probably need much higher voltage than 12 volts to have the power to keep the gen running, but lets assume for a moment that the thing would run with one of them at some higher voltage

Run the motor in the 3BGS setup as “the” motor. But you need to balance it to get long run times, so what do you do? You put a second motor on battery 3 as the “load” on battery 3. Then you add whatever loads you need to get the system balanced.

What do we use that second motor for that is running for “FREE” as the load on battery Three???? (As long as the two loads are balanced) We use it to power a second generator that is putting out 120 volts per coil at just over one amp. And what do we do with the energy produced by the second generator?? We use SOME OF IT to make sure ALL batteries are always charged up. Would pulsing the first motor or USING a pulse motor automatically pulse the second motor??? I have wondered about this. There probably isn't enough juice in battery 3 to run the motor, so it would only run because we have a complete circuit that connects it with the other two batteries. If we are breaking that circuit by pulsing the first motor or using a pulse motor, won't that pulse the second motor also? I think it will, but haven't gotten that far.

We might even be able to connect inductive loads to the second generator. Why is it different that the FIRST generator?????

Connecting an inductive load to the second generator bogs down the second motor which is attached to battery 3. This causes motor number one to SPEED UP and put out MORE power. Of course that puts things "out of balance" and we have to solve THAT problem again.

Could this work? Like I said, all conjecture, supposition and bulldoodie. Until it’s not.

I have built the first generator and have been testing it off and on for several months. Those test runs have resulted in several design changes and modifications to make the thing stronger and run more smoothly. They have also allowed me to move the rotors closer to the coil cores which should increase output. Higher speed would do that too, but the machine has been designed to run at 1800 rpm because that is where I get an output of 120-130 volts, which is what I wanted.

This is not a toy. A lot of time and money has gone into this, and a lot of research. If everything works out, we will probably share some stuff here sometime in the future. And you needn't worry that I will vanish into the woodwork like many others have, because there are several folks, some who have posted on this forum, who have all the details of the construction of this generator and have seen videos of it in operation.

Before you begin to cry like a baby because I'm not sharing, There are only four parts to this setup, and John Bedini talked about what the parts are in his "Free Energy" book.

DC motor
Energizer (magnets/coils/rotors)
Flywheel
Pulse control circuit so you can recharge battery while motor is in "off" position.

I built it and then I messed around with it. And I am not the only one to get it to work. Someone else here on the forum sent me a video of his working before I built mine. I just had lots of ideas for a bigger model with lots of changes. I would suggest a two coil model to start. When you see that you can get out more power with two coils than you put in, THEN spend the time and money to build a bigger unit. Plus, the pulse motor Matt designed will run a two coil model at lower voltages, so you can see all the principles in action.

Dave

[Turion]

Three batteries is special because the third battery is reversed in series with the other two. This gives you 24 volts on one side of the motor and a 12 volt potential (if battery 3 is dead) on the other side of the motor. The current moving from the high side to the low side runs the motor, which acts as a generator and outputs additional current.

[Turion]

I posted that video link because I found it interesting that someone was running their SG on the three battery setup.

I have been working on this for almost 8 years now, and I have tried a variety of different kinds of batteries. I have used deep cycle 120 amp hour marine batteries and AAA flashlight batteries. The best results seem to come from AGM batteries. It doesn't matter WHAT their amp hour rating. The times where I have gotten extended runs of weeks or even a month have come using them, but I have had runs of several days with FLA's.

Using smaller batteries it is MUCH easier to tell whether you have something or not. For instance, I know about how long my motor will run on two BRAND NEW 7.5 amp hour AGM batteries before it stops because they are drained. If I can run the setup 10 times longer than that, I know I have something interesting going on. So a "true researcher" doesn't need to use 120 amp hour batteries where you have to run the experiment for days before you know if you are getting any results.

One thing I have come to realize it that what your meter says means NOTHING when you are running this setup. I have had the meter read 2 or three volts on the battery, and when I disconnect it from the system the voltage will jump up to 12.3 or 4 and climb up from there. I have had the battery go negative and continue to run loads.

I have discharged batteries down to less than a volt time after time, which should ruin them, and have had them charge back up to over 13 volts and hold charge. Not just a surface charge either.

You have to know what "Good" batteries will do with the motor you are using, but once you do it is fairly easy to tell when you've got something special happening, especially in those cases where your voltages go up on the primaries.

Dave

[BroMikey]

GenMode

Just thought I would post this for you all.
Bedini's SG, Gen Mode, Splitting The Positive - YouTube

Does this look a little familiar??

So it looks like the key to charging the primary back up is to run a load between positives on the SG machines. However it was clearly pointed out that the secondary charged up and then the primary charged up at the end.

If this is the way it is really charged up then I don't think it is an EXTRA ENERGY function, just a re-transferring of power from one battery, back to another.

Almost looks like a magic trick. See my hand? See my other hand?? See it? See it? Well after awhile everyone catches up.

I will try this and see what can come of it. I guess the DC motor could be hooked to a generator also and recover THAT LOAD ENERGY back to the source for faster charging of the primary but fast is not always good for batteries.

The way it was presented using GENMODE was that magically the primary charged up too, WHILE the secondary still kept charging.

Unless a start battery (Like a lawnmower uses) is employed to collect up a quick surface charge the few minute energy transfer will not seem as impressive.

Anyone who has been charging TRUE deep cycles knows that. A true deep cycle battery with all of it's delivery and performance curves require long hours at proper input levels to charge it up sufficiently so power may be retrieved at a known level.

Instead start batteries perform just the opposite. They charge fast and empty fast and if we compare these charges to a true deep cycle thinking we have the power like deep cycles delivers, we are going to be fooled.

I have several 100ah start batteries and some converted to ALUM as well and I wouldn't give you a nickel for them. During the power failures we have here I can only run them for minutes compared to the hours deep cycle battery gives for hours.

Any serious experimenter should change out their cheap lawnmower batteries for the good ones and this way when you make a measurement you won't be making that mistake.

When I see a video now using a start battery I write it off as a novel experiment non practical application.

But I did not know that running a little dc motor between positives would transfer the power back to the primary. That way I don't have to use a battery changer.

These are my views thus far and I might be wrong, I don't know, and if I am corrected so be it. I always enjoy being set straight where I have missed it.

This is the best I can do with what I have witnessed with my SG OSC and wide range of batteries.

Of course the video shows a motor burning up huge amounts of AMPS in a short space zapping up a battery so this is COP less than 1.