3 Battery Generating System

[FRC]

Thanks Gene

George,
If you have access to lumber I might have a solution for your motor's mount (secure alinement problem). You will need 1-2x6 slightly longer than the two motors nose to nose with hose attached. You will also need 2-1x2's of about the same length. Now place the motors near the center line of the 2x6 and slide 1 of the 1x2's under both motors and screw down parallel to the edge of the 2x6. Now go around to the other side and do the same, but ever so slightly force the motors up off the 2x6, perhaps 1/4". Use a piece of shim to check gap at motor's ends and now screw down the second 1x2. A pilot hole for all screws in the 1x2's would ease assembly and also prevent splitting of wood. 1-1/2" sheet rock, or deck screws would be ideal. Now the motors if viewed from the end would be seen resting only on the corners of the 1x2's. A couple of ratchet straps would be perfect right now, wrapped around center of each motor and cinched down slightly crushing the corners of the 1x2's, hopefully creating a fairly well alined saddle for both motors. The hose should help with any slight misalignment like a love joy coupler.
Good Luck, Gene

Thanks for this. I think a a 2X4 would work since the motors are not that big.
I would have to notch the 1X2s or have four pieces since the front of motors
have an overhanging lip ahead of the cylindrical part of the motor.

George

[Neight]

Hey guys
Been doing some testing today, having a lot of fun so far
I tried my idea with the diodes, and found that they don't really do anything spectacular. They only work one way, which is the way I described in my post. The other way around, the motor wont start, and the power is just shorted across B3, which burned out some LEDs I was working with, and one pot.
I also tried Luther's idea of a pot across B3, which works nicely for finding the zone with the motor and the load.
This is using the alum battery I made for B3, and using a 1M pot gave me some decent wiggle room for tuning.
along with the pot, I am running two other motors slowly as a load on B3, both small DC motors, and both turning fast enough to do some minor work, but nothing special.
for the load on my main motor, I am belt driving a second larger motor as a genny, and that is turning a 12V PC fan with nice air movement, and a small tail lightbulb to great brightness!
Unfortunately, the pot I burned was the one on B3, and it was the largest pot I had, so that test was short lived, but worked well before burning out the pot...
I am pretty well out of loads to add and aligator clips to add them with at this point. The drain on B1 and 2 has been nominal so far, and I am hoping they will recover nicely. I have the diodes in place, but if they are helping, I can't tell. We will see how they recover, as the final word on that.
I am nearly at the point of stopping this run, though it has been going for more than an hour right now!
My loads have started fluctuating, and that is usually where I stop the tests, as I don't get full recovery after the load destabilizes.
good run today, very encouraging, given the small motors and batteries I am using for all this. Full (or nearly, it is hard to tell just by looking) brightness out of a tail light bulb is a first for me working with small benchtop experiments, so things are moving in the right direction!

One other thing I did for just a moment today was run this through a solar panel as B3. I figured what offers resistance better than a solar panel in a dimly lit room? It works great, though I haven't added a load to the panel to test how well it handles it. When I get some time, I will make up a better system to add loads to the solar panel, and even put it in the light to see how it goes.

As I am typing this message, the tail light just burned out, so I guess it was at full bright after all
great stuff, lots of ideas to try, and I will definitely keep at it!


N8

[FRC]

Neight

Would not the solar panel just be completing the battery 1 and 2 series circuit ?
My negative connection came off when I had the halogen light hooked up and
I thought that was something but then realized the light was completing the
circuit. Also the draw on battery 1 and 2 was greater when this happened. So
that must be what happened. That is also why a load should not be put on B3
until the motor is running or we might just be completing the circuit with the
load.

George

[fathershand]

Big Motor

Dave, is this big motor a brush motor? Is there a link to it that you saw online? Have you hooked it up to the circuit? What are the results from that test?

George, why are you trying to hook up 2 motors with a direct connection? Wouldn't it be simpler to have them belt driven? In that case, they could "slip" even so slightly without damaging each other. Just a thought.

Keep up the good work, guys. We ate gonna solve this.

Tony

[FRC]

fathershand

Yes if I could find small enough pulleys around here to fit the small diameter
shafts.

George

[albertMunich]

Saw this thread and KNEW I had to try this. The pieces were right on the bench here!
All my batts are lead acid from a car wrecker. Two were brought back by the Bedini charger, the third I had given up on and it only had 6 Volts. Ideal candidate! All three are in the 60-70 AH range, nothing was charged before the test.
Connected like you described it. Motor is a Plettenberg hi speed Dc motor from an electric model helicopter. Very powerful.
Motor did not start. But showed signs of current flowing thru it. I gave it a couple turns by hand and it started immediately. The volotage on the motor went up to 20 Volts and then stabilized out at about 12 v. But one could hear slight speed variations all the time. You need low impedance connections between the batteries.
I ran this for one hour with the motor and no load. Motor drew about 1.8 amps. Batts 1 and 2 only dropped 0.004 Volts at the end but had gone up plus 0.009 volts during this hour test.Varies all the time.
Then after about one hour interval I connected a 40 Watt car lamp in place of the motor. The filament would just barely glow for a few seconds, then all of a sudden the lamp would light to full brightness and the voltage would go to 12.6 Volts.
I then tried an inverter and that too worked when I matched the lamps so the thing would draw about 2 amps like the motor.
So I think its not the sparks from the collector of the motor doing the magic here. Besides the motor has capacitors to inhibit the sparks, being used in a RC model.
Reminds me of the Ossie Callanan process where he used a dead battery as his radiant energy collector.
Might this is the famous NEGATIVE RESISTOR?
I have worked with the Bedini process for years and there are many hints that the magic is in the battery and the sulfate crystals.
WHAT IF one could use a Bedini running off the two positives to charge the run batteries?
I will try and do the generator trick, connecting a similar motor to the one I am using now. Piece of rubber hose should do here.
Now I am going to let the whole thing rest overnight.
Batt 3 showed no sign of heating or bubbling. But I would be careful nonetheless and never run this without surveillance or overnight!

If its that simple I wonder what we have been doing all these years!!!!???

[We.The.People]

1 - ...is this big motor a brush motor?
2 - Is there a link to it that you saw online?

1 Data Sheet & Dimensions:
http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/Manuals/ME1002_Data.pdf
http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/Manu...Dimensions.pdf

2 Many links (Google):
https://www.google.com/search?num=10...tenergy+ME1002

Hope this helps.

[Turion]

fathershand,
Yes, that is a Brush-Type Series Wound DC motor. There are 4 brushes, capable of 205 amps continuous, and 500 amps peak for 2 minutes. Each motor is run at the factory for 2 hours at 72 VDC, 205 amps, and adjusted for peak efficiency.

It has a Brush Life Indicator, and a Temperature Switch in the windings.

Contact is :
John Fiorenza
Motenergy, Inc.
3580 Slinger Road
Slinger, WI 53086 USA
Phone: 262-644-7525
Fax: 262-644-7527
Website: motenergy.com
Skype: john.fiorenzaii

I haven't connected it, as I want to be SURE of everything before I do. I don't want to ruin an expensive motor either. But I have some similar spec motors that are old that I got from junkyards that I have been running. They require higher voltage to get the rpms I want, so more batteries. This spreads out the losses over more batteries, and recover times are quicker. So I really like my results. I only mentioned that motor because it is suitable for an electric car, and that is the direction I'd like to go on this thing. But ANY higer voltage higher hp brushed DC motor will give you some more interesting results.

albertMunich,
Glad to see you aboard and actually testing on the bench. That's the way we find out things. I would be curious to know if you have a scope? If you do, and you put it on batteries 1 & 2, do you see the over voltage spikes I am seeing (higher than the 12 volts of the battery) that seem to be hitting batteries 1 & 2 with your setup. If you do, then they must be coming from other than the motor. If you do NOT, then maybe the caps in your motor are preventing them, and perhaps your motor won't work as well as a DC motor without those caps.
That would be valuable information. Because I KNOW my batteries 1 & 2 are being hit with spikes. It's there on the scope. I believe someone else posted scope shots here of exactly the same thing. And at least two others who aren't posting here, but have sent me pm's or e-mails are seeing it on their scopes. So if you are NOT seeing them, I better revise my statement that ANY brushed DC motor will work right off the shelf! That's important to know.

And as long as I am on the subject, there are some things that should be brought up here. My whole purpose in bringing this to the forum was to get other people experimenting on the bench. In order for you guys to see what I see, you needed to duplicate what I have to become a believer that there is something here. I can't tell you how many times I have doubted this myself, even though I KNOW what I saw with my original setup. It's one thing to remember something and it's quite another to have a working model on the bench.
So here's the thing...once you know in your heart that there is something here because you have SEEN it, the real research begins.
1st question....which brushed DC motor works the best...
http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/e...tes/00905a.pdf
1. Permanent Magnet DC motor
2. Shunt Wound DC motor
3. Series Wound DC motor
4. Compound Wound DC motors.
Some may work better than others...some may not work at all...some may be amazing. I don't have the time or the money to experiment with ALL of them, but a group of people could divide this up and go after it, reporting the data back to the team. This is one of the many reasons I have been looking really hard into R & D money for this. My original device was a Permanent Magnet Motor, so that's what I intend to stick with, because I KNOW with some work on battery three, I can get those same results, but I wouldn't discount those OTHER kinds of motors if we cannot figure out a way to replicate battery three. We may have to make changes to the only other major component, which is the motor.

Dave

[Guruji]

Motor with load

Turion what if for the load to the motor you connect another generator to battery2 and see what happens.

[LutherG]

Hey guys
Been doing some testing today, having a lot of fun so far
I tried my idea with the diodes, and found that they don't really do anything spectacular. They only work one way, which is the way I described in my post. The other way around, the motor wont start, and the power is just shorted across B3, which burned out some LEDs I was working with, and one pot.
I also tried Luther's idea of a pot across B3, which works nicely for finding the zone with the motor and the load.
This is using the alum battery I made for B3, and using a 1M pot gave me some decent wiggle room for tuning.
along with the pot, I am running two other motors slowly as a load on B3, both small DC motors, and both turning fast enough to do some minor work, but nothing special.
for the load on my main motor, I am belt driving a second larger motor as a genny, and that is turning a 12V PC fan with nice air movement, and a small tail lightbulb to great brightness!
Unfortunately, the pot I burned was the one on B3, and it was the largest pot I had, so that test was short lived, but worked well before burning out the pot...
I am pretty well out of loads to add and aligator clips to add them with at this point. The drain on B1 and 2 has been nominal so far, and I am hoping they will recover nicely. I have the diodes in place, but if they are helping, I can't tell. We will see how they recover, as the final word on that.
I am nearly at the point of stopping this run, though it has been going for more than an hour right now!
My loads have started fluctuating, and that is usually where I stop the tests, as I don't get full recovery after the load destabilizes.
good run today, very encouraging, given the small motors and batteries I am using for all this. Full (or nearly, it is hard to tell just by looking) brightness out of a tail light bulb is a first for me working with small benchtop experiments, so things are moving in the right direction!

One other thing I did for just a moment today was run this through a solar panel as B3. I figured what offers resistance better than a solar panel in a dimly lit room? It works great, though I haven't added a load to the panel to test how well it handles it. When I get some time, I will make up a better system to add loads to the solar panel, and even put it in the light to see how it goes.

As I am typing this message, the tail light just burned out, so I guess it was at full bright after all
great stuff, lots of ideas to try, and I will definitely keep at it!


N8

That's awesome Neight!

BTW, I want to point out that we're stealing what JB calls the surface charge with this setup. You can also do this with John's Monopole Circuit - its one of the lessons of the SG... John really has held nothing back...

If you watch the DVD "John Bedini Talks" that Rick Friedrich has available from the July 2011 Free Energy Convention, you will see this mentioned at 1 hour 22 minutes into the lecture...

Many Thanks JB!

best regards to all,

Luther

[Turion]

Ok,
I finally got my motor and energizer back on the bench today for a test run after it has been sitting idle for the last couple weeks.

My battery #3 showed 0 voltage on the gauge that is connected to it and 0 voltage using a meter. The battery I am using for my number 3 battery is one I have messed with, putting metal filings in four of the six cells, just to see what would happen. And today, something unusual definitely happened.

When I connected it all and flipped the switch, the motor did not start although the voltage did jump to 24 volts. That is what I expected. As I am lazy and didn't want to sit around and wait for the motor to start on its own, I flipped switch number one which connects a 12 volt dome light bulb to battery number three. At this point, I fully expected the motor to start. It did NOT!!! This is the first time that has ever happened to me. For a couple minutes I couldn't get over the shock and was checking all my connections. But then I realized that the bulb was lit up like it was supposed to be.

So, I flipped a second switch....this one connects an auto headlight across battery three. This time the motor started and ran as expected. However, rather than dropping to around 12 or 13 volts like it usually does, the voltage on battery three went down to zero as long as I had that second bulb turned on, and the first bulb went out. I turned that second switch on and off several times. The motor would NOT run on the system with only the smaller bulb connected. I only ran it for a few minutes because I didn't want to "fix" what it was doing by running it too long, in case someone had some good ideas but we needed the system to be operating as it was when I observed it. At the end of that time, battery three was up to 6 volts on the meter and gauge. I took video if anyone is interested. OK electrical wizards, any thoughts??
Dave

[Joit]

Turion, you may damaged the Cells more, that they got very high resistance, the 2 Cells what left do still work. You may should be more carefully with the amount from the metal fillings, to damage them only a bit.

Well, Pot at Batt 3, didnt i mention that already anywhere, to use a stronger one, at best a Variac? Ever since Page 5.
But mainly you move the high Resistance between B3 and the Load on B3, where the Current runs through. May some will try different Loads on B3.

Albert, For the Spikes, i think they help the Batteries, just a Load between B1 and B3 only drains B1. You also may wanna look at the amperage from the Batterie, not only the Voltage, because when they get desulfated, their Voltage can change too. And why its so simple?
I think, it sounds like it makes more Sense to build a Tesla Switch, where all Batteries get continuously charged, and you can take work from the Load. I still have to charge my Batteries again to run the next Test.

What i have read lately from Teslas Patents and the Spikes, what he did looking for was the Spike what appears when you load a Coil, before Current(Ah) comes, and with this Spike he did work with in some from his Decives, like the 'most efficent Generator'.
In this Case here, the Spike come from B1 and goes over the Motor into B3, and also it may goes back into B1. Therefor its may a Idea to replace any Load with a Joulethief, and leading the Spikes back, but then, you may better replace B1 with a Capacitor, since Batteries dont like the charge and discharge to much.
From my Setup, i should had switch with the Ground and the Probe between Plus B1 and B3, because it would show then what happens on the Motor. When i use B2 neg as Reference, the Spike and Voltage at B1 is much lower then at Plus B3.


FRC for a Motor as generator, i allways calculate what a Motor takes when you run it idle and what it would generate when you use it as generator. Most DC Motors are therefor bad Generators.

[Turion]

Joit,
You may be right, but it is interesting that this happened now, after the battery had set for two weeks. Prior to that I was using it every day and I never saw this behavior. I used it for at least a few days after I put the metal shavings in it. And I know once I let it set for two days so I could get it to the point where it would not start up when I turned it on, just because I wanted to video the startup and show people that the motor did not come on immediately.

Dave

[citfta]

Dave, is this the same motor you have been using in that position or is this a newer larger motor? If this is a larger motor than what you have been using before then I think this only means the newer motor requires more current and thus you need the second bulb to get the current high enough. If this is the same motor you have been using then I will have to think about this some more.

Carroll

[plengo]

Hey Turion,

please, post the video of that weird test. Thanks.

Fausto.