3 Battery Generating System

[Matthew Jones]

An axial Flux gen is still going to slow down at high speed on a current draw. But the low speed option is there if it puts out enough power. I wouldn't suggest using a mod motor. I would just used a regular motor to turn it.

Even if you can get it up 4-5k rpms as soon a load touches the gen you'll lock the mod motor up.

I would use a buck converter between the pole of the battery and feed the motor something like 6-8 volt to keep the rpms down. You should be able to find a moderate range that the gen does not drag. But if you try to do AA high speed job with that gen your in for some damage if your not careful.

Matt

[axxelxavier]

@Turion,
The disks are from 15 mm steel (0,6 inch) and the frame is also made from square pipe steel, so imagine how heavy it is...
This is not my invention, I made only some small mods, where it matters Actually, my project was to use this generator for a domestic purpose, but after the surgery, I have to wait a little bit. Actually, a little more.
This kind of alternator is usually made for eolian generators, rotor with square or rectangular magnets, and coils wounded in star or triangle connection. I`m quite surprised you don`t know about this.
Nevermind, HERE and HERE you can find some good video tutorials about axial flux alternator, and HERE is a translation of a forum I am following for a while. There you have first class info!
HERE It`s a video of my generator with a 30 watt car bulb hooked to a trifazic bridge (i think it was 30 watt, I will check later).
L.E. - The car light bulb is rated 55/60 Watt, so I think it was hooked up at 55 watt filament. It will be fun to test with both filaments in paralel - 115 watts...
There is much more to learn, I don`t know if this is a better solution, but at least this is the path I am going to go, at least for the generator side. I have to test at least 3 different stators, and one of them I think will be just enough for 3BGS system.
All in time, as I am running out of founds and time, so I am waiting for the time I will be able to dismantle the generator, to weld the platform for the My 1016 (which I am going to order tomorrow), to see it working at high speed. ALL the materials are expensive, the magnets are 15 mm thick, and for the wire, I think I used here at least 5 kg of copper for coils, and so on. I think you know better, about the „free energy”, which cost real good money...
Anyway, I will keep posting updates.
If you need more info about this generator, I can give more info, tutorials, books, etc. as I`m not going to take with me in the grave all of this...
Take care,
Teo

[Turion]

Two,
If the metal framework you have there is aluminum, you are going to have an issue with rotating magnets/aluminum/eddy currents.

Chances are, the magnets on both sides of the coils, as you seem to have, is overkill. The core material will only absorb so much magnetic flux from a passing magnet. One of the reasons why I have built eight different versions of the generator with different rotors and different magnets was to establish what was NEEDED to get max performance. I’ll be interested to hear what your results are.

[axxelxavier]

Teo,
Take some more pictures from side and such looks interesting.
Time to nuke the coffee,
wantomake

Here are some more pictures. There is much to be done on this generator, and soon I as will completely recover from my surgery, I am planning to change the bearings with high speed versions, and to connect the generator to MY1016 motor, at the beginning in stock mode, and after some tests, in Matt / Dave mod. I still have to weld a platform, to make some room for motor...
But I have to take care, the disks are quite heavy, and can`t lift more than 7 kg (15 lbs) - not to mention the huge magnet attraction (very, very dangerous). That`s why I will test first with a smaller version, easier to mount and less expensive for copper wires and resin.
Best regards,
Teo

[wantomake]

Redesigning

Still in process of redesigning the Dave upright generator.

As far as the coil core go, trying to decide to mold some magnetite with resin. Or go the acid route then compress somehow.

Many things to work out as per instruction from the original.

Coffee is getting cold. Time to nukify it.

wantomake

[padova]

Warning Warning The fallowing statement is my opinion based on my own tests!!

I feel there is defiantly OU potential here. I have done tons of tests across all types of batteries and one thing that I can say is that I personally believe to be 100% true is the battery manufacturers are for some reason either misstating the true capacity of the batteries that they sell or just do not believe anyone will believe that they can be reused over and over but also become much more efficient over time.

I can run a load just off a very basic setup when tuned correctly 35% longer then I can in a normal configuration.



-Altrez

I deleted my post because I thought it was unproductive.
Repeating for most people already familiar things. And nothing practical.

I guess when someone makes a claim, he probably knows what he's talking about
You put it back again. Didn't have to. But anyway, okay.

regards

[wantomake]

Per your email

Matthew,
Your e-mail said 24 awg with 3 strands at 100 feet each. But I can't remember the ohms for each coil. Also you stated 1.3-1.5 amps to turn the motor.

Sorry I will dig more through my notes(4 or 5 notebooks full) to know for sure.

wantomake
Edit:I just opened up my motor and the ohms is 0.4 ohms. I did minus the ohm reading of my fluke meter connectors. But I do have same reading across both coil windings. I did wind each side 40-30-30 turns. But I have the smaller 250 watt my1016 24 volt.

[Matthew Jones]

I have a 350 watt version, but it has more windings.

I would have to go back and measure the ohms, but the OHM's of resistance you want.
Does anybody remember that number so I do not have to take a motor apart?

Anyway You can use any wire size as long as its like 1 ohm or something and any motor size granted the motor can handle more footage of wire so as you stack up the wire you are looking for like .8 to 1 ohm. I can't remember the number.

If you use a 350 or 500 you have to use a little bigger wire or more strands, something like that.

Maybe someone will measure the resistance of the windings and remember how many strands of wire.

https://www.cirris.com/learning-cent...lculator-table

Here is the resistance of wire calculator.

Matt

[axxelxavier]

@wantomake,
Thanks for your reply. Axial flux generator it`s mostly used for eolian energy, and there you have thick steel discs (acting almost like a flywheel - for BIG generators, like mine), and different number of magnets and coils, for minimizing the cogging. Here is some simulations. There are users on eolian forums which have versions of those generators made with tesla coils, with low drag. Of course, this information is missing, but if you put all the pieces together, I think you will have a surprise.
I believe this axial flux generator made with multistrand coil in series it is the winner in conjunction with 3BGS system + arduino control. You will not have to break magnetic lock to 20+amps, just let it run to speed with no load, and then hook up the load. So far, my coils on this generator are wounded in classic style, so there is some drag, but I have to test is further at higher speed. I will make some tests, also, on a smaller version, so much cheaper for making coils and casting the stator in resin...
All I need now is the motor, so here is my question: which version should I order, 24 volt/350 watt or 24 volt/500 watt?
Best regards,
Teo

[wantomake]

Looks good

@Turion,
I agree, I was not expecting such high current draw... Curious, the voltage from B3 did not goes down I was expected as such big current draw. Anyway, in 4 hours, the loses in all 3 batts are 0,15 volts, but gaining in B4 are +0,21 volts, and the LED light is, also, a bonus. The REMF charger, still, can be improved...
@wantomake,
It was just a simple test, at the end of the day. I still have to order my motor, and in the meantime, I just play with what I have around me. I will try to switch batts manually, and in the future I plan to do that with Arduino, for the beginning, with relays.
@Matthew Jones,
As you said, it is a nice box, but the main purpose was to easily use it with jacks and big wires in my setup. I was not really expected to go so warm... lesson learned, though.

Anyway, what do you think about using a axial flux gen. as generator in 3BGS?
I think it can be done with not so much cogging, though my first setup, from another project, is quite hard to rotate by hand with a car bulb as load... open voltage is 62 volt, with rotor rotated by hand... I did not tried to test it on high speed, to see, what is happening when loaded...
Best regards,
Teo

Teo,

Sorry I wasn't trying to down play your setup. It is very good that Matthew and Dave both gave you some pointers.

You keep replicating go forward no matter what. There are many more surprises coming. The idea is to get the 3BGS to balance. Meaning don't drain primaries B1 and B2 while charging B3. The balance between Primaries and Charge, or High and Low sides. If you boost the voltage back to primaries and keep them charged, then adjust the second booster attached to the motor which keeps the potential difference from dropping too low. For myself that is how I balanced the system.

My first testing used no boosters but only had the my1016 modified Matt motor and I saw good results. But the primaries would lose voltage. I added the boosters and saw the "balancing" Matthew and Dave posted about.

What is that axle flux generator? Take some more pictures from side and such looks interesting.

But build and learn is best classroom. I pestered Dave and Matthew but as they stated if someone builds then they would help.

Time to nuke the coffee,
wantomake

[axxelxavier]

@Turion,
I agree, I was not expecting such high current draw... Curious, the voltage from B3 did not goes down I was expected as such big current draw. Anyway, in 4 hours, the loses in all 3 batts are 0,15 volts, but gaining in B4 are +0,21 volts, and the LED light is, also, a bonus. The REMF charger, still, can be improved...
@wantomake,
It was just a simple test, at the end of the day. I still have to order my motor, and in the meantime, I just play with what I have around me. I will try to switch batts manually, and in the future I plan to do that with Arduino, for the beginning, with relays.
@Matthew Jones,
As you said, it is a nice box, but the main purpose was to easily use it with jacks and big wires in my setup. I was not really expected to go so warm... lesson learned, though.

Anyway, what do you think about using a axial flux gen. as generator in 3BGS?
I think it can be done with not so much cogging, though my first setup, from another project, is quite hard to rotate by hand with a car bulb as load... open voltage is 62 volt, with rotor rotated by hand... I did not tried to test it on high speed, to see, what is happening when loaded...
Best regards,
Teo

[Matthew Jones]

Well No circulation of air can contribute to heat build up as well. Nice little box, but without a fan to concentrate the flow of air, completely useless.

Come on wake up!!! Its not magic!!

[wantomake]

Teo,
I can't give you an answer cause your setup is so different than Dave's 3BGS.
Here is a quote from him from "Your basic coil" as per Tesla thread:

"I have cores in my coils made from 1/16 rod. I have three machines total right now. All previous machines have been disassembled as I do not have room. All three have the same cores.

I never talked about doping the rods with anything. I have a coil testing machine that I have set up with the same motor, the same rotor, the same number of magnets with the same spacing. It is connected to a power supply so that the voltage can be adjusted and the rpm controlled. It has a small light board so the coil output can be tested. I have tried the iron rods, #12 shot, and black sand, and have test data on those cores. I know from experience that ferrite does NOT have as much magnetic attraction as the iron and SHOULD make a better core, but I have NOT run the numbers yet. It will ALSO put out less power and switch quicker, so THAT can affect your SUUL. Possibly change the required frequency SO MUCH that you have to have 9000 rpm or something ridiculous to reach it. In other words, ferrite MAY NOT work. I think it will though. I had a lot of OTHER things to get worked out on this machine, like the magnetic lock issue. That was the OTHER reason I started the “your basic coil” thread. So some OTHER people could get involved in testing coil cores and I wouldn’t have to do it all myself. I have a core that works for solving all my other issues, so core material was my LAST project with this generator. I have ferrite and metglass and a couple less well known things to test. Then I can compare results.

But here is the thing. The only data I can trust and really USE in my investigation is that put on this forum by Wantomake or myself. Why? Because we are using the SAME sized rotor with the SAME sized magnets spaced the SAME distance apart, running the SAME core on our coils with the SAME number of wires the SAME length.

That’s the problem with this forum and why it is really a waste of my time. Everyone builds their machines out of whatever they have lying around, so their data is NO GOOD when you try to compare it to yours. Not their fault. They are doing the best that they can. But it is not contributing to MY research. As far as MY research goes, it is just throwing crap against a wall to see what sticks.

Not to say their efforts are worthless, because it ALL comes down to watts in vs watts out. Whoever is producing the most power for the least input and can maintain it without melting their motor or their coils is the MAN. I would gladly scrap this design for something that puts out MORE.

Just remember, unless something is replicated EXACTLY, it is not a replication. I know this drove John B nuts!!!!! People made Bedini energizers out of everything under the sun and whined when they didn’t work."

The last 4 paragraphs is what I refer to. I used a my1016 motor between the positives at first. But later test had a my1016 motor coupled to a generator(actually was next size bigger my1016 motor) to balance out the system.

wantomake

[Turion]

Only reason for boost modules to get warm is if the load you are pulling THROUGH them is too high. You shouldn’t exceed the C-20 discharge rate of your batteries withthe load or the rated amp draw of your boost modules.

[axxelxavier]

New setup

My new setup it`s almost ready, 3x40AH deep cycle batteries, 2 boosters, big wires, and hooked as load, REMF charger for Batt 4 (4x7,2 AH alum batts).

VERY INTERESTING...

Some numbers:
20,29
[B1-12,63][B2-12,92][B3-12,63][B4-12,75]load 700 mA REMF
21,05
[B1-12,64][B2-12,91][B3-12,66][B4-12,81]load 700 mA, tweaked booster 2 for 25,55 volts series batts.
21,45
[B1-12,61][B2-12,86][B3-12,61][B4-12,82]load 600 mA (I tried to adjust the load, to balance Batt 3. Anyway, all the numbers goes down...
22,22
[B1-12,56][B2-12,78][B3-12,66][B4-12,85] tweaked booster 2 for 25,35 volts series batts.
22,55
[B1-12,59][B2-12,79][B3-12,58][B4-12,88]
One question: the Input amperage measured at second booster (the one for topping series batts) is 4,4 Amp, and the booster is quite warm. Is it normal?
At this rate, Batt 3 should be discharged VERY fast... but is not
Greetings,
Teo