3 Battery Generating System

[Neight]

very quick update...
The first battery i have tried with this new motor did not start, and I even let it sit for a bit over 20 minutes. This is the same battery that ran the PC fan that I have been posting about.

I tried one of the two other batteries I have, and it started the motor right away. Now here is the interesting part, this battery is a 12V 33Ah lawn mower battery. It has been sitting at less than 1V for quite a long time. I have tried to charge it on my SSG with cap pulser, and couldn't get it to take a charge what so ever. When I hooked up the motor, it started immediately, so I quickly took the motor back off the battery, and after a few minutes tested the voltage on again. Right now, it is sitting there with 11.5V on it
That would be a near instantanious charging of this battery. I didn't even let the motor run for 5 full seconds before taking it off, and I keep testing it to make sure I am not reading this wrong, but it is still putting out 11.5V on the meter.
out of sheer curiosity, I put the first battery back on, waited about 10 minutes, and was about to take it off. I remembered Turion posting that he once spun the motor by hand and got it to start, and just to see what happens, I did the same, and right now the motor is slowly spinning and very very gradually picking up speed!

I really need to catch a few hours sleep, but it will be very hard to relax knowing what I have sitting on my bench right now

If I can pull myself away from the bench, I am going to try to get some rest (recharge my own batteries) and come back to this ASAP. I will test some different loads on Bat 3 and try to find the balance that has been discussed on here, and will report anything that I find.

this is incredibly interesting, and I can't wait to see what comes out of all this next!

N8

just before I hit the post button, I looked over and the motor had stopped. I went and put the fan on battery 3 only, as an additional load, and both the fan and the little motor came right to life! both are fluctuating speed right now. also, I put the fan on the 12V 33Ah battery, and it ran just fine, so that battery did indeed accept a charge nearly instantly...
crazy stuff man...

I added a light bulb (not sure what wattage, as it came out of a drill press that the motor siezed up in) and while it is very faintly glowing, when I applied that additional load, I heard the motor speed up just a tiny bit. Now it is back to fluctuating speed again... Just don't know what to think, this is pretty incredible!
also, when I load down the motor shaft to nearly stopping it, the fan motor picks up speed dramatically. I am still checking the voltage on the 33Ah battery in absolute disbelief, but it is still at 11.5V and does run a 12V load very well. This battery has been completely dead for years!

I took a quick video of what I have going on here, so I could show a scope shot of it running all of this. I am going to wait to post it until later, as I want to run some more tests, and will likely have more to add to it before posting to youtube. I will make sure to get shots in the video of the scope across bats 1 and 2, one on bat3 only and one on the motor by itself also, just so we have a frame of reference to work from. My shot of bat 3 was similar to the photo posted by Citfta, though it is a bit more chaotic since I still had both loads (fan and light bulb) on bat 3.

[FRC]

Neight

Good to see you are seeing these results. This system is pretty amazing, you
seem to keep finding new aspects to it all the time. Hope we can get things
figured out better. The more people trying it, the more info we all will benefit from.

George

[Turion]

Fausto, that diagram you posted is correct. The motor is between the positives of battery one and the positive of the bad battery. That's how I described it in my first post. How do you have it set up? I wouldn't say that what you have done is incorrect, because until we figure out WHY and HOW this works, who knows what different combinations you can have and still get it to work. The motor can pull current around the circuit from any position I would assume, and some may work better than others. Also splitting the negative may be better than splitting the positive, and flipping the wires on the motor may have some effect.

I would suggest (as suggested to me by DavidE) that we try and get a standardized setup that everybody is running, get those working, and then venture down these various paths of exploration to see what works better. Right now I see all kinds of motors and all kinds of batteries and all kinds of setups. The ONE good thing about that is everybody seems to be getting positive results of SOME kind, which says there is a wide window where this works. There may be a much narrower window where it works perfectly.

Here's the YouTube video of my current setup. The motor and energizer aren't on my bench right now, but the rest of the stuff is. AND I've rewired my coils in series since then, so my diode arrangement is different.
3 Motor Setup - YouTube


Dave

[Neight]

One last quick update (maybe, I seem to keep repeating myself with this...it's much too exciting to watch to walk away )
I loaded the motor shaft to a stop while taking my video, and I think it overloaded my PC fan. the whole system stops without both the motor and the fan on it, and when the fan died, everything stopped. I hooked it all back up, but the fan would not run, even though the LED's would light, and the motor would barely spin. I replaced the fan with an identical one, and it all came back on, just as before. small light bulb is lit, motor running with fluctuating speed, and fan running along just fine. It seems if you load the system down too much, you can overload some of the additional load components
I tested the busted fan on the 33Ah battery that has magically come back to life, and the fan will not spin, though the LEDs do light, so I killed that one for sure... glad I have been collecting those things for a while, got a few more just in case it happens again.

[hello_all]

can the motor be able to run car alternator , i mean what will be neeeded to have motor so much torque to run alternator charge battery 2 .

[FRC]

Alernator

I have an extra car alternator I was thinking of trying. Do not know if the motors I have will have enough RPM's to run it. I also have a small gas generator 950 watts, that I want to pull the gas motor out of and try that.

George

[Turion]

If you want to run a car alternator as your load on your motor, you should be able to do that, depending of course on your MOTOR. I have a 110 volt DC motor, so plenty of wiggle room to add loads to battery 3 and speed up my motor to run almost any kind of load. It might be too much for just a 12 volt DC motor, but I don't know for sure. I know Luther ran two DC motors coupled to each other...one as motor and one as generator. If the load is balanced, the motor will produce plenty of torque to run this kind of a load. But you guys who are jumping into trying to run big loads like this right away who have NOT spent time learning how the system works with small loads are just asking to be disappointed when you can't get your loads balanced and you keep draining batteries one and two. But then again, you may get lucky or learn some new things that none of us know yet. I don't want to discourage anybody from trying anything. I just don't want people to be unsuccessful and then blame it on this system. I recommend you start with small loads and work your way up, but I would consider running a generator without anything hooked up to it as a reasonable small load, just because of the resistance of turning it. Then go from there. Just keep us all posted.

Neight,
I have a whole stack (about 25) of those computer fans still in boxes. I got a good deal on them when I was building some of Imhotep's circuits and ordered a whole case! They make really nice 12 volt loads and cool off my shop during the summer! LOL
Dave

[plengo]

Fausto, that diagram you posted is correct. The motor is between the positives of battery one and the positive of the bad battery. That's how I described it in my first post. How do you have it set up? I wouldn't say that what you have done is incorrect, because until we figure out WHY and HOW this works, who knows what different combinations you can have and still get it to work. The motor can pull current around the circuit from any position I would assume, and some may work better than others. Also splitting the negative may be better than splitting the positive, and flipping the wires on the motor may have some effect.

I would suggest (as suggested to me by DavidE) that we try and get a standardized setup that everybody is running, get those working, and then venture down these various paths of exploration to see what works better. Right now I see all kinds of motors and all kinds of batteries and all kinds of setups. The ONE good thing about that is everybody seems to be getting positive results of SOME kind, which says there is a wide window where this works. There may be a much narrower window where it works perfectly.

Here's the YouTube video of my current setup. The motor and energizer aren't on my bench right now, but the rest of the stuff is. AND I've rewired my coils in series since then, so my diode arrangement is different.
3 Motor Setup - YouTube


Dave

great motor position is done. Now, on that diagram I see after the bad battery on the negative a LOAD.

So the load goes between the bad battery and battery 2? I was adding load across the bad battery.

So my test had the motor on the correct location but not the load.

Please, just confirm that for me.

Many thanks,

Fausto.

[Turion]

The load does go across the bad battery, connected to each terminal of it. At least that is the way I have been running it. Connect the loads directly to battery three. Sorry, I didn't notice where they connected the loads on that diagram when I looked at it.
Dave

[plengo]

The load does go across the bad battery, connected to each terminal of it. At least that is the way I have been running it. Connect the loads directly to battery three. Sorry, I didn't notice where they connected the loads on that diagram when I looked at it.
Dave

oh good. So I did the test correctly.
Thanks,

Fausto.

[Neight]

Neight,
I have a whole stack (about 25) of those computer fans still in boxes. I got a good deal on them when I was building some of Imhotep's circuits and ordered a whole case! They make really nice 12 volt loads and cool off my shop during the summer! LOL
Dave

That is why I kept these motors around and didn't make energizers out of them I was really surprised last summer how effective those little fans can be! I look forward to running them again this year, but this time I think I will be getting a bit more use out of them at the same time

[citfta]

Still trying

Ok after I reconnected my 24 volt scooter motor to the 1/4 hp 90 volt DC motor I ran it again with only the drag of the 90 volt motor with no load on it. (Remember I was planning to use it as a generator). I had to add quit a bit of load across batt 3 to get the scooter motor back into the zone. I noticed a couple of things I want to pass on. As I added loads I saw the voltage go down each time on batt 3. And of course the motor sped up some. After a couple of minutes things seemed to stabilize. I then added more load and waited. When I added the load that made the motor shift into the zone I noticed the voltage started going down a little faster and then dropped at the same time the motor took off. So for me a clue I am getting close to the right load on batt 3 is that the voltage did not stabilize after adding the load. So if the voltage on batt 3 seems to stabilize after a few minutes you are probably going to need to add more load.

Now I have a problem. When my 24 volt motor gets in the zone I only have about 5 1/2 volts across batt 3. This will not be enough to run an inverter. If I try loading the 90 volt motor enough to get 12 volts or so across batt 3 then I drop out of the zone I believe because I see batts 1 and 2 starting to drop. I think I am going to need a different motor for my load motor. I am thinking of switching the scooter motor and the 90 volt motor and trying again after I let my batts rest. Does anyone care to comment on that idea?

Another thing I have noticed is that the scooter motor is running pretty cool while in the zone. Considering I had it turning a 1/4 hp motor for about a 1/2 hour and it is just barely above room temperature. I have used this motor before and had it just running without anything connected to it and I am pretty sure it always ran warmer than that. David have you noticed your motor running cooler when in the zone?

Later,
Carroll

[Turion]

Carroll,
I HAVE noticed that when I'm in the zone the motor runs cooler. Man I am so glad you are doing this. You guys keep bringing up things that I had forgotten, or didn't think were important enough to remember I guess. But EVERYTHING is important to remember about this setup.

About the motors. I guess we need to try a basic 12 volt DC motor running a load, and then a high voltage DC motor running a load, and see which gets us the most power out of battery 3. I have no idea which one it will be. Before you switch, you might hook up some lights to the motor you are using as your generator and see what effect that has on the zone. Maybe a load there will make the difference. If it doesn't help, THEN switch out the motors, and then try adding the lights as load on the generator.

Neight,
You are also right about the ability of this thing to quick charge batteries and bring batteries back from the dead. If you have batteries yo have not been able to bring back life to with your Bedini monopole, try it on this in the third position. If anyone has a battery that is so dead it will not start the system even after you have waited for 15 minutes, grab the motor shaft and give it a spin to see what happens. I have restored many batteries with this thing. I didn't WANT to, believe me, but that's what happened. I am still searching for that 'perfect" bad battery.
Seeing what you guys are doing and where this is heading has got me chomping at the bit to get back to working on mine again. I wish I wasn't going to be gone for the next three days!

Dave

[FRC]

2 runs

I did a 1 hour run and a 2 hour run after a long rest after the first run. The last
run I hooked up a fourth battery in parallel to battery three hoping to charge it
up. Now I think I might have turned what I thought was a good battery into a bad one. It does not seem to want to take a conventional charge and just went down in voltage during the run. Will have to let things rest and check later.

George

[Joit]

I did a 1 hour run and a 2 hour run after a long rest after the first run. The last
run I hooked up a fourth battery in parallel to battery three hoping to charge it
up. Now I think I might have turned what I thought was a good battery into a bad one. It does not seem to want to take a conventional charge and just went down in voltage during the run. Will have to let things rest and check later.

George

Scare Me! I did connect one in the same way before some hours. Parallel to Batt 3.
I immediatly stopped it now and disconnected it, to see if it comes back to a healthy Voltage.
At last you found out a Way how to produce bad Batteries