3 Battery Generating System

[Bizzy]

Hey Bizzy,
Great to see you here. I have also added a basic schematic to the bottom of post 1, just to make it less confusing for new folks. In post 1
following the word "CAUTION" there is also a step by step process for starting this thing up the first time, and it DOES make a difference how you start it up the first time, because there is only ONE first time after all. To see everything I talk about, you have to follow those steps. Not that everything I talk about there is important, but I just want folks to have all the info I have. Once you have started it and run it, it develops what I think of as a magnetic memory, and will not do some of the things it did the first time unless you shut it down and let it just set for a few days.


Dave

Hi Dave
Thanks...this is a very fasinating set up.
Bizzy

[Turion]

All,
I know I keep harping on this like a broken record, but I keep thinking about the behavior of my original device that put out endless power.

"The voltage on battery three would jump to 24+ volts when you threw the switch. Then it would drop to around 18 volts and the motor would come on. It would continue to drop to around nine volts and then the motor would shut off and the cycle would repeat." That's from my notes and that's what I saw happen. It did that over and over for hours.

For some of you, the first time you hooked up the circuit, the motor did NOT start immediately because the voltage in battery number three was low enough. Within a few minutes the motor started up.

1. If you shut down the circuit at this point and then started it up AGAIN, the motor would start IMMEDIATELY.

2. If you shut down and recharged batteries one and two so they are completely full (as full as they can POSSIBLY get, as they were when you started it the first time), PLUS drained battery three (so it is as DEAD as it can possibly get as it was the first time) and throw the switch again, the motor will STILL start IMMEDIATELY. WHY??????

3. If you shut down the system and wait a couple days and then throw the switch again, the motor will NOT start right up (if it didn't start right up the first time) WHY????

This tells me that the reason the motor did not start right up the first time was NOT because of the potential difference between the two in series and the battery that was reversed. Otherwise it would have started in #2 where those conditions were optimal.

To me it suggests perhaps some kind of magnetic memory where because of the higher voltage of + going to the negative pole it takes a few minutes, but suddenly switches the polarity of the battery somehow, and it remembers that for a couple days. So during that time, whenever you start the motor, it starts right up. But the battery I had on my first one wouldn't HOLD that memory. I know people have mentioned that they have permanently switched the polarity of batteries by reverse charging them like this, and somehow to me this is the key to what made the first one work so incredible well while these others just work ok.

So what if we hit the battery with positive to neg and neg to pos, and then hit it with pos to pos and neg to neg to reverse that memory? If I had my setup going I would try switching, and will in a few days, but have to get my energizer off the bench first. So much to do, so little ROOM. I have only a four foot bench available in my shop because it is so crammed full of stuff. Maybe this won't work, but I think the solution is along those lines.

I have a one track mind. Can't help it.

Dave

[clueless]

Turion a favor please

The diagram on post #1 does it make any difference which is the bad battery? I assume it is either one of the two outside batteries, but one is hooked - to - and the other is + to + .

[citfta]

Clueless,

Look at the schematic Dave added to post number one. Number the batteries from left to right as 1,2 and 3. Number 3 should then be on the right. The - end is connected to the - of battery 2. The + end is connected to the motor. The bad battery HAS to go in this position.

Carroll

[Turion]

citfta is correct. I will label them and repost that schematic.
OK---reposted it with the batteries numbered and battery three in red.

[darkoni]

Turion,

Just to let you know, there's a mistake in the updated diagram you uploaded to your first posting. Battery 3 is now in series with Battery 1 and Battery 2(Neg from Batt 2 is going to Pos of Batt 3). This will obviously give the motor a 36v supply.

According to original diagram Batt 2 neg should be going to Batt 3 neg, with one of the motor leads connected at Batt 3 Pos. Hope i'm not missing something here. In any case, thanks for all the info you have shared with us.

[hello_all]

Turion,

When are u gonna post your next steps of progress in video, i think it is just talk and no action which will not lead to any results..

[Bizzy]

Turion,

When are u gonna post your next steps of progress in video, i think it is just talk and no action which will not lead to any results..

In Dave's defense. I think he is very forthcoming with his help and information. There is a lot of time involved in testing studying retesting then videoing and posting...I know first hand becuase I am working the same way on my thread.

Dave/Turion is allowing us to see how he is thinking through his ideas and offering us help while at the same time allowing us to help him. That is a rare gift
So my advise to you would be to continue asking questions but to be patient. Dave is anything BUT no action!!!!!

[Turion]

darkoni,
Thanks for spotting that. I fixed it. That's what I get for trying to update things!

hello_all,
You are certainly entitled to think whatever you want. If you see nothing of value here, feel free to go somewhere else. I came here to share some ideas with folks and to help them to get to where I am in building this thing so that we could explore possibilities together. Nobody is forcing you to keep coming back to this thread.

As for me posting more to video, I would be happy to go down in my basement and put together a video of what I am working on right at the moment. Unfortunately, that is an 80 coil energizer to attach to my motor as the load which I will then balance by attaching an inverter to battery three. MY next step is to put a huge load on the motor and balance it with a huge load on battery three. When I have the energizer completed, I will be happy to share the results. However, until it is complete, I don't have a system up and running on my bench because my bench space is very limited. I would be happy to take a video to PROVE that to you if you like.

If I were all talk, and there was nothing to this, I don't think you would see so many people able to replicate it with some success. The more success they have will probably parallel how closely they follow the original directions I gave. Since that time I have remembered a couple things that make a difference...like the fact that #6 or larger wire to make battery connections helps get better results and, depending on the 12 volt brushed DC motor you use, switching the two wire connections on the motor may give better results because of brush placement within the motor.

If YOU are having trouble replicating this, I would be more than happy to answer any questions you have. I am here to help.

But let me make one thing perfectly clear...YOU are responsible for where it goes from here. I don't owe you anything. I will continue with my research with or without you, and I will share what I think is appropriate and help out when I can. I have given you the cake. If you want it frosted with sprinkles and ice cream, that's YOUR problem. I'm not hiding anything. I just am working on something that takes time to complete. Winding 80 coils can't be done in a day, and I haven't even started on coil winding yet. So I will be tied up with this for a couple weeks. And by the way, do you think I would be investing the time, energy and money into the construction of this energizer if I DIDN"T think it would work with this system? I had to buy a $450.00 wire feed welder just to weld the frame of my energizer because I had to return the one I borrowed to weld other parts with. I am putting the time and the money into this thing. So I think I'm showing my commitment. Now, where's yours?

Here's a video, just for you
Energizer - YouTube


Dave

[citfta]

Maybe hello_all can't read as Dave has posted several times in the past couple of weeks that he is working on his energizer and when that is done he will get back to testing.

I love how so many people come on here asking for results when you never see anything they have done. They want results but they are not willing to put any effort into helping to get those results. Dave has asked several times for others to get involved so we would have more people looking for the solution. This circuit is so simple anyone should be able to build it and start testing. Even if you bought new batteries for batts 1 and 2 it still wouldn't be very expensive either.

Just my opinion,
Carroll

[FRC]

Thanks Turion

Thanks again Dave for presenting this system. You did not have to do it, and
I find the criticisms very disrespectful. Especially when one realizes how valuable
this is and what potential it has. It is much easier and simpler than a lot of the
other projects that a lot of people are working on in threads on this forum. I should
try to do some videos also, my video camera is screwed up, but I could probably do something with my iphone. The last couple months I have had a lot of problems to
deal with and I still may have to put things on hold and get back to work to get some money coming in. This system has been one of the few bright spots to come along
during this time and I am very grateful that you gave it to us Dave.

George

[Turion]

Thanks for the words of support guys. I've been on the forums long enough to know what goes on here, so I won't get discouraged no matter what anyone has to say. I had all kinds of folks at OU tell me this was a nothing system, yet here I am four years later still plugging away at it. Those of you who have taken the time to build a system know why.

Dave

[fathershand]

Making Progress

fathershand,
The motor will definitely make a difference BUT in all probability you "fixed" your bad battery (to some extent) with just that short run you did before. I have had that happen on several occasions. This setup does amazing things to bad batteries. So it probably wasn't the motor. The way to know for sure is to try the motor you used the first time. If the system starts up, you know it was the battery. If it doesn't, it was the different motor.

The battery in the third position makes a difference.
Whether you have #6 or larger wire connecting your batteries to each other matters.
Whether the loads are balanced matters.

If you load down the motor, you can add loads to battery three. That's really everything you need to know. Get it into the zone and keep it there, and continue to add loads to the motor and battery three, and keep an eye on your two primary batteries. Don't worry about battery three, except that it has to be a battery that will cause the motor to run without a load and should be as low voltage as possible. Keep that voltage low by adding loads to it.

Dave

Dave, I did as you suggested and used large wire and/or copper bar to connect the batteries. I also retried the old motor, it wouldn't start without a load on batt 3. When I hook up my new 95V DC motor to battery 3 as prescribed in your schematic, it starts right away. When I add a load to batt 3, the motor speeds up. My battery 3 load is a small 12v motor. In order to get it to start spinning, I have to load the 95V motor. The more I load it, the faster the 12V spins. If I add a 12V light bulb in parallel with the 12V motor, my 12V motor slows a bit and the 12V bulb lights somewhat. The light gets brighter the more I load the motor.

I think that I had a proper "bad battery 3". The voltage before and after my tesing today was 1.89V. What do you think? The primary batteries were fully charged and did drop off a bit. I haven't properly balanced both loads.

What method do you use to balance the batt3ery 3 load and the load on the motor? What I planned to do is to measure the voltage across a 1 ohlm resistor at the battery 3 load and compare that to the voltage across the 1 ohlm resistor on the motor load.

Also, since I am using 24V in series and this is a 95V motor, would there be some advantage for me to increase the 24V to 36/48/higher voltage? If I do, I will get higher RPMS on my motor with less current draw. It's running rather slowly now.

FYI, in order to further load my 95V motor, I hooked it up to a car alternator. Since it spins rather slow, I was only getting 8 volts DC rectified.

Thanks and keep going on this!!

Tony

[Turion]

What method do you use to balance the batt3ery 3 load and the load on the motor? What I planned to do is to measure the voltage across a 1 ohlm resistor at the battery 3 load and compare that to the voltage across the 1 ohlm resistor on the motor load.

Also, since I am using 24V in series and this is a 95V motor, would there be some advantage for me to increase the 24V to 36/48/higher voltage?

Adding more batteries in series will spread out your small voltage loss across more batteries and they will recover faster, so if you have the batteries it can't hurt. I NEED to get my 110 volt motor up to higher rpm's to see good return of my input voltage, so you do too.

To balance the loads I have not found anything yet but trial and error, but I have been using different motors and different loads. If we are consistent, I hope to find some kind of correlation that will work. RIght now it's just add a small load and wait five minutes, then add another. Once you get the loads to balance and the motor to speed up and are running i the zone, the draw on your primaries will change significantly. :-)

[FRC]

Alum battery

On my run last night, I had two bad batteries in parallel and my alum conversion
battery that would not work as a bad battery also hooked up to these two. I ran things altogether for about an hour and a half adding different loads, but
also trying to charge the alum battery for about 45 minutes of the run without loads. The cells were bubbling in the alum battery and looked like they were taking a charge. After shutting things down, I hooked up the alum battery to the 2 amp battery charger and the light indicated it was charging, which it would not before. I left it on over night. Today it still indicated it was charging but then stopped after about an hour. The voltage only read about 5 volts.

Tonight I tried the alum battery on its own as the battery 3. I think it was reading only 2 or 3 volts this time. The motor would not turn. After letting things sit for awhile, I turned the motor by hand and it ran for awhile then stopped. Turned it again and it ran. Had to do this a few times until it ran
on its own. Then I attached another motor as load and things ran well
except for fluctuation in RPM's at first. Later RPM's increased so I must
have been in the zone. I also burnt out another 12v bulb that I had tried before the motor as load. I only ran things for about half an hour, and when
disconnected alum battery 3 only showed less than 2 volts.

I think hooking up the alum battery with the other 2 bad batteries somehow conditioned it to work as a bad battery. I have another lead acid battery
that would not work before and am going to try and condition it to work
also.

George