3 Battery Generating System

[Turion]

I guess we're going into the battery making business! If that is what it takes, I'm all for it.

Dave

[Duncan]

when is a battery not a battery?

Hi Dave I keep checking in .. after all I've got a sleepless night invested in this contraption! .. not really a battery is it ? Say a battery that’s been allowed to fester and rot and become something else probably quite worthless as a battery, yeh it might look like a battery but its actually some thing very different isn't it? What other word would fit? How about a filter, or perhaps a trampoline? Absorbing the rubbish and reflecting back huge amounts of usable power.
Certainly from a experimental view all of this is duplicable apart from the X …. One buggered battery! Or to narrow it down even further a circuit that reacts the same as “a perfect buggered battery” (would that be an oxymoron via a moron David?) of course there must be a circuit that would imitates the “duff battery” I believe EPD has such a circuit but alas its his priority..
Here are a set of examples from Tesla that seem to relate http://www.tesla.hu/tesla/articles/18930200/fig01.gif there is much to be said to “KISS “ though make “something” ??? to connect to those two wires and the jobs done !! Its down to the scribblers to make what they will of it.

[Turion]

I've seen that file before, and I believe Peter L. once explained it as Tesla showing 6 different ways to capture radiant energy. But I could be mistaken about that. Perhaps if Peter is out there watching he could chime in here? It would be great to get his input. As for EPD, his thread is so far over my head it's like a satellite in orbit. I can see it, but the chances I will ever get there are slim. Wouldn't it be lovely if he could drop by and give us a hint or two? Perhaps I'll pop over to his thread and ask. Can't hurt. He could say no or just ignore me, but I've been told no and ignored before. My wife told me no, but we're married now, so I kinda sneak up on people.
Dave

[fathershand]

The Zone - Questions

Dave, if you have already answered this, please forgive me for asking it again. [It is said that in order for people to "get" something, they have to hear it 7 times.]

Are you saying that IYHO, the battery 3 load is being driven by radiant energy?

Are you describing this event of radiant energy as "being in the zone"?

If you say yes to the above, what are some of the observable facts that we look for when we think we are "in the zone" also.

Finally IYHO, is it radiant energy that is powering the motor? If so, is it coming from the coil collapse in the motor?

Have you tried the one ohm test for determining the load on either battery 3 and/or the motor? This effectively gives the amp draw. But maybe radiant energy doesn't have "normal" amps.

FYI, I am gonna add some more 12V batteries to get higher RPMS for my 95V motor?

Thanks so much for your help!!
Tony

[Turion]

Tony,
I think a several things are happening here. I think that when the primary batteries send voltage to the motor (EMF) and it hits the motor, the motor produces CEMF that goes out in both directions from the motor. ( see this video DEFINING RADIANT ENERGY FIELD (Part 1) - YouTube )I think it goes right back down the same wires and hits the primaries. Maybe even a different polarity than what came out of the battery. It is heavier down one wire than the other. If you have the heavier wire directed back toward the primaries, they get hit with over voltage that will show up on a scope. Take a look at Carroll's post #139 where he shows the scope shots and mbrownn's discussion of it in post #145 So you can actually CHARGE back the primaries.

Now the voltage from the primaries moves through the motor and runs into the "bad battery" That bad battery doesn't care if the voltage that hits it is EMF or CEMF. It just gets hits from the motor. Personally, I think it gets THREE hits from the motor, the EMF that was passing through the motor, the CEMF that the motor produced (less on the wire going this direction) plus generative current from the magnets on the motor passing the coils and acting as a generator, not a motor. When all of this hits battery three this opens the dipole and (and this is according to John B, who knows more about this than I do) the battery is charged NOT by the voltage that hits it, but by the vacuum in reaction to the voltage that hits it. (John, if I have misquoted you, please forgive me. And please set me straight.) so some of that voltage hits the battery which knows what to do with it, but can only deal with so much (those lead plates are SLOW to react to pulses) and the rest goes into the load, which bypasses the battery, or THROUGH the load and BACK to the primary batteries, which ALSO know what to do when they are hit.

In my original setup that no longer works, I had to watch the voltages on my PRIMARY batteries as well as the voltage on battery three. Once when I had a large load on battery three (my shop vac running on an inverter) the feed back raised the voltages on my primaries to 18 volts when I wasn't watching them and it scared the crap out of me. I had a separate analogue meter on each battery, so this was for real. I think the higher charge my primary was getting in my original was because battery three accepted NOTHING and all of it went to the primaries or into the load. I think there is a fine balance you have to maintain where the loads are balanced, yet enough voltage passes through to get to the primaries again. You can achieve a balance where NO voltage gets through to the primaries, but then they slowly come down in charge. I am no expert on this stuff and that's why I wish the experts were here. And no one is going to offend me by telling me I'm full of poo, and they have the real explanation. If you do, let's hear it. I'm all about making this thing work better than it does, and nobody is going to step on my toes by stepping up and leading the charge on this thing. (pun intended)

There is SERIOUS potential for this system to do REAL work. I believe it is generative power that comes out of it as WELL as reactive power, and I think Luther agrees. He doesn't post here much because he isn't able to run his system much right now, but we have discussed this a lot on the phone and by e-mail, and he agrees that this is what he is seeing (reactive and generate power). The bigger the motor, the more you will see interesting things happen with this system.

I think that "the zone" is when the load on battery three plus what the battery will absorb is enough to take everything that is coming from the motor, and the motor speeds up. Nothing is building up anywhere, and you have a balanced system. I'm just guessing here. I don't know. It's just an idea and some smarter folks will probably have a different and BETTER one.

I think enough people have played with this now and enough have been successful that there is no turning back and nobody is going to be able to come in here and run everybody off by casting doubt on everything we're doing. I worried about that at the beginning, but too many people have seen it now, and those folks will be shouted down. So while I didn't want to say too much at the beginning and get everybody's hopes up, I really DO believe that this system holds all the answers. And if we can replace battery three with an electrical circuit we have a winner. If not, we STILL have an amazing system that will does more than what I claimed it would do in my first post here. BUT, the PROOF is in the results. I should probably just shut up and let people find out for themselves. My concern is that when nobody is able to power their house with their $100.00 investment in batteries and a motor and some wire, they will say this thing sucks and move on. I just want them to know it DOESN'T suck, and it is well worth the investment and their time. And they will always have the two batteries and the motor to do other things with if they give up on this, because it's all off the shelf parts.

I hope that wasn't too much of a long winded answer to a simple question! LOL
Sometimes I just get excited about this thing.

Dave

[Turion]

I was up until 1:30 AM and reread every post here (something some of you might consider doing) to make sure I haven't missed anything, and I think I did.

Hi folks, I have a dead car battery, though it didn't work well because the plates, etc. are bulging the sides of the battery out.
I also have a 6 volt 4.5AH SLA that I knew was very dead and sulphated, so i used that as a third battery and used 24 volts, 2-12 volt 7Ah SLA for input.
Using a small 12 volt motor splitting the positives, it gradually started rotating while 6 volt battery is around 16 volts and if i put finger load on shaft it drops to around 10 volts.
Another thing, the motor periodically stops for awhile while 3rd battery voltage rises and then for no apparent reason, it will start rotating again.
And when i put a car tail light bulb on 3rd battery as load, the motor rotates much faster, though i do see the input batteries 1 and 2 dropping in voltage, though they do recover fairly well, not sure what to make of it so far.
peace love light
tyson

Tyson, I think the behavior this battery exhibited MIGHT be exactly what my original "magic" battery did. When I would connect my system, the voltage on the bad battery would jump to 24 volts. It would drop down to about 18 volts and the motor would come on. Then the battery voltage on the bad battery would drop down to about 9 volts and the system would shut off. The voltage would jump to 24 volts and the cycle would repeat. If your battery is doing something CLOSE to this, guard it with your life! LOL This happened with no load on the motor and it went on for hours. I would like it better of your two primaries were also 6 volt so there was a stronger correlation, but it sounds like you may have something really special. I want one!

hello_all,
I watched your video again. I couldn't tell where in the schematic your motor was connected. Would you check to make sure it is connected like the schematic at the end of post #1? I want to make sure you are on the right track and are successful.

Thanks guys, for all your hard work, suggestions and ideas. I'm recording all of them and will try them all.

Dave

[FRC]

Motor/generator

I still have not been able to get a generator hooked up to a motor properly. I was only able to get 7 or 8 volts out when using one of my motors as a generator. So hope to run 2 motors one as load with the other 2 motors attached as generators. That way when hooked up in series, should be able to
get 14v to 16v output, sufficient for charging 12v batteries. Still have not got the gas generator apart either. I thought that would be easy. However, the gas
motor and generator are not as separate as I thought they would be they are
more of an integrated unit. Also, have only done another short 5 minute run
with the alum battery to see if it still would work. This battery may end up being a better "bad battery" since there seems to be less draw on the good batteries. Will have to try some longer runs to see for sure.

George

[Joit]

FRC, i wouldnt use anyway standard Motors as Generators too, they are bad at it, to less Windings in it and a bad efficency. I used once one from a Fan from a Car, but it s not exiting, what it did produce. You may build better one by your own or use a Motor, what has higher Resistance in it, this one produce more Energy as to waste it.
Or, you try something like this Guy does. Energy Creator, Home build PMG Gnerators / alternators
And a Hint, i bet he use in his Drum Magnets what are aligned like a Spiral, else, someone has to buy the DVD, to find it out.

[Turion]

I already bought the DVD.

Connecting loads to this motor setup is my ultimate goal, so I am always looking for the best energy producing setup I can find. Since I am spending so much time and energy building my energizer anyway I figured what the heck.

He does indeed have a rotating drum with many, many magnets on it as his rotor. They are in rows on one build, and offset rows on another, so magnets on one row are between magnets on the next, and they can be closer together. I will be building one of them as soon as I finish my CURRENT energizer project so I can see which is better. His uses far less wire, and there are other things I like about his design, including the simplicity of construction.

How much power it produces is my only concern. I would have abandoned my rather complicated build in favor of his if I had seen a significant demonstration of power output. That really wasn't included in the video as far as I remember, but I will go back and make sure and report back here.

Dave

[citfta]

Hi Dave,

If you go to Energy Creator's web site he gives some test results about how much power his different size generators produce. I don't have the DVD so I don't know how large each generator is he is talking about in the test results.

Carroll

PS: I am still trying different motors and loads to try and learn more about how to best tune and use the 3 battery generator system. Thanks for sharing it with us.

[Neight]

I am actually thinking of buying Energy Creator's video myself, as it looks very interesting.
In the meantime, I had a few busted printers that I was given, and I have taken them apart. got me a small cache of motors from them, and on some preliminary testing, I can get one motor to drive a larger motor on a single 12V 7Ah battery, and the larger motor will put out about 11V and with the motor output shorted, it makes about 300-400mA. I used the output of this to run one other motor that is smaller. I need to find a way to mount all this, so it's easier to run, but later today I hope to be able to test all this on the 3BGS and see what happens.
I have noticed that using the alum cell as bat3 seems to make the alum crystals grow much faster, not sure if that is significant, but it's neat to see.
Very glad to see FRC got his working, and perhaps others will be testing this as well.
If we build our own batteries, with this method, or possibly other crystal cells that have little to no output on their own, and can get them to work consistently on this setup, I think we can find out what exactly makes bat3 work or not. There will be better data open to us, with solid results to share. Things like plate size and number of plates. battery output open and shorted, how much of what ingredients are used. If we all work on this, I am sure we can gather enough data to find some solid and highly repeatable answers!

I am still thinking of taking the output of one genny, and rectifying it back to bats one and two, and seeing if we can allow them to simply be conduits for the energy, and not have to shut the system off and allow it to recover.
This is the only project left on my bench at the moment, which is very rare for me, I like to have a lot of fingers in a lot of pies so to speak. I see so much potential here, it is ridiculous, and I am very excited to be apart of it!
I hope to have a solid test setup built today, and might be able to update with some results later tonight.

I would like to say a huge thanks to Turion for bringing this back to our attention, especially after his results with the OU forum. That took some guts, and anyone who says he is not pulling his weight, or doubts this system is horribly off base, and needs to step out of the way.
I will report back later, and hope to have something good to report

N8

[Neight]

Ok, things are going well so far, though I still have some work to do, to make sure I am in the zone here, which I may not yet be there.
I am running 6 motors right now. three as a load on battery 3. one as the load motor, which is driving a second motor as a generator, and I am running another motor from the power being made by the generator. on the meter, my genny output is a bit over 20V! maybe a couple hundred mA's, but that is enough power to run a lot of different things. I am getting close to pulling out a FWBR and running the genny output to bats 1 and 2 and seeing what kind of balance I can achieve.
I will take a video of all this running a bit later, once I have a better setup for a video, but I am showing some decent results so far!

Make that 7 motors. I am now running 2 motors in parallel off the energy I get from the motor I am using as a generator. Everything is running pretty strong right now, and I am waiting to see if I get the 2nd speed up to show that I am in the zone.

[Turion]

For those that have this up and running and have figured out how to get it into the zone, I'd love to see somebody throw a three wire transformer into the mix and use the output from it back to the primaries. That has been one of my goals from the beginning. If it goes between the two battery stack and the motor, and you connect two of the wires to the motor and the same two wires to the stack, the output of the third wire could go to the primaries to recharge them. I would put diodes on the two wires that are connected between the motor and the stack so each allows current to only pass in one direction. This is actually also a TEST to see if current goes both ways between the motor and the stack as I believe it DOES. (That MIGHT require a dump to a cap and a commutator on the motor shaft to dump from the cap to the primaries on the off time.) If you watched the video I posted in post #276, you can see why I think we have two way movement of current on the same wire. I think in a standard motor the CEMF is trapped within the system and causes problems, but because OUR motor is wired between two POSITIVES it has an escape route OUT of the motor for some reason. That's my theory. We turn EVERY brushed DC motor connected this way into something far more than it was.

I have to tell you guys that I don't sleep much at night because of this thing. I TOO see the potential. Which is why it doesn't bother me if other people don't see it. However, I have been involved in enough of these forums as an active participant or a lurker to want ANYONE who tries this to be successful. I don't want anyone to walk away from here feeling like this was a waste of their time. This kind of research is too important and we need everybody we can get involved in it. I have seen too many times where someone posts something but you don't get that little bit of info you need to replicate and be successful. So folks get discouraged and quit, but ONLY after having spent tons of money. I really, really don't want that to happen.

There are so many of you out there like John B., Peter L., Matt Jones, Carroll, Luther, who I KNOW are so much more knowledgable about electronics and electronic circuits than I am, and especially about this stuff. They probably read my explanations of how and why I think this works and just shake their heads and chuckle, but that's ok too. I don't care if I look ridiculous. All I care about is that we keep getting data and information and keep making improvements to this until we have a final product that we can all use. Over the years people have looked at this circuit and dismissed it as nothing but a section of the whole Tesla switch circuit, but the bad battery turns it into something special, and discovering that was a complete accident.

Luther and I KNEW we had something here. I will never forget the day he sent me an e-mail to an old address I had posted on OU and gave me his number and asked me to call. When we talked, he said he thought he knew why and how my original system worked, and thats what got me revved up again. He and I thought long and hard about whether to bring it to the forums. First, because we didn't have a system that was completely finished, and we knew people might look at it and say it wasn't worth it, but also because we could have just kept working on it on our own until we had something marketable, pulling in some folks who had expertise into a small group and working with them to develop something that could make us all rich. But we also knew if we threw it out there to everybody we might get that one idea that would take this to a new level that we would never get otherwise. We didn't want this idea to disappear like so many others have in the past.

The only thing I ask of you guys is this, that if you discover that "one thing" don't go dark on the rest of us. Don't let greed get the better of you. There are other ways to get rich than to sell something to people. I guarantee that if you are one of the small group of people that discovered and brought to the public the solution to free energy for the world, you will not only secure for yourself a place in history, but will spend the rest of your life getting big bucks for speaking engagements all over the world talking about what you did and how you did it. Don't you think? There are NOT that many of us here on the forum working on this. Go back and count them. I have. And of those who have posted, count how many have actually built a working model. And of those, how many have gotten it to go into the zone (a pain in the butt, I KNOW!) It almost REQUIRES a load on the motor to give you the wiggle room to adjust the load on battery three. In my very FIRST post I said a load on the motor was necessary, but I realize most people read part of the first post, and then jump to the end of the thread to see if anyone has replicated and is now powering their house or running their car off the system. If it looks PROMISING, they MIGHT go back and read some of the stuff at the beginning, but more often than not, they take the shortcut of jumping into the middle of trying to replicate and start asking questions that have been answered a bunch of times already.

But that's ok. As long as they stay and contribute.
I think I'M going to be famous for long rants with no substance, and I need to get to work on my energizer, so I'm outa here.

Dave

[wingstalysis]

Wright Brothers

For those that have this up and running and have figured out how to get it into the zone, I'd love to see somebody throw a three wire transformer into the mix and use the output from it back to the primaries. That has been one of my goals from the beginning. If it goes between the two battery stack and the motor, and you connect two of the wires to the motor and the same two wires to the stack, the output of the third wire could go to the primaries to recharge them. I would put diodes on the two wires that are connected between the motor and the stack so each allows current to only pass in one direction. This is actually also a TEST to see if current goes both ways between the motor and the stack as I believe it DOES. (That MIGHT require a dump to a cap and a commutator on the motor shaft to dump from the cap to the primaries on the off time, but I DOUBT it. It is ALREADY happening, so we are just putting a transformer in the middle.) If you watched the video I posted in post #276, you can see why I think we have two way movement of current on the same wire. I think in a standard motor the CEMF is trapped within the system and causes problems, but because OUR motor is wired between two POSITIVES it has an escape route OUT of the motor for some reason. That's my theory. We turn EVERY brushed DC motor connected this way into something far more than it was.

I have to tell you guys that I don't sleep much at night because of this thing. I TOO see the potential. Which is why it doesn't bother me if other people don't see it. However, I have been involved in enough of these forums as an active participant or a lurker to want ANYONE who tries this to be successful. I don't want anyone to walk away from here feeling like this was a waste of their time. This kind of research is too important and we need everybody we can get involved in it. I have seen too many times where someone posts something but you don't get that little bit of info you need to replicate and be successful. So folks get discouraged and quit, but ONLY after having spent tons of money. I really, really don't want that to happen.

There are so many of you out there like John B., Peter L., Matt Jones, Carroll, Luther, who I KNOW are so much more knowledgable about electronics and electronic circuits than I am, and especially about this stuff. They probably read my explanations of how and why I think this works and just shake their heads and chuckle, but that's ok too. I don't care if I look ridiculous. All I care about is that we keep getting data and information and keep making improvements to this until we have a final product that we can all use. Over the years people have looked at this circuit and dismissed it as nothing but a section of the whole Tesla switch circuit, but the bad battery turns it into something special, and discovering that was a complete accident.

Luther and I KNEW we had something here. I will never forget the day he sent me an e-mail to an old address I had posted on OU and gave me his number and asked me to call. When we talked, he said he thought he knew why and how my original system worked, and thats what got me revved up again. He and I thought long and hard about whether to bring it to the forums. First, because we didn't have a system that was completely finished, and we knew people might look at it and say it wasn't worth it, but also because we could have just kept working on it on our own until we had something marketable, pulling in some folks who had expertise into a small group and working with them to develop something that could make us all rich. But we also knew if we threw it out there to everybody we might get that one idea that would take this to a new level that we would never get otherwise. We didn't want this idea to disappear like so many others have in the past.

The only thing I ask of you guys is this, that if you discover that "one thing" don't go dark on the rest of us. Don't let greed get the better of you. There are other ways to get rich than to sell something to people. I guarantee that if you are one of the small group of people that discovered and brought to the public the solution to free energy for the world, you will not only secure for yourself a place in history, but will spend the rest of your life getting big bucks for speaking engagements all over the world talking about what you did and how you did it. Don't you think? There are NOT that many of us here on the forum working on this. Go back and count them. I have. And of those who have posted, count how many have actually built a working model. And of those, how many have gotten it to go into the zone (a pain in the butt, I KNOW!) It almost REQUIRES a load on the motor to give you the wiggle room to adjust the load on battery three. In my very FIRST post I said a load on the motor was necessary, but I realize most people read part of the first post, and then jump to the end of the thread to see if anyone has replicated and is now powering their house or running their car off the system. If it looks PROMISING, they MIGHT go back and read some of the stuff at the beginning, but more often than not, they take the shortcut of jumping into the middle of trying to replicate and start asking questions that have been answered a bunch of times already.

But that's ok. As long as they stay and contribute.
I think I'M going to be famous for long rants with no substance, and I need to get to work on my energizer, so I'm outa here.

Dave

Yo! George kindly informed me of your research, and that I should get involved for it can assist me greatly with my DC motor radiant research.
Yes, I know what you are saying Bro'. Yes, their are many techies who have deep technical knowledge, and big ego, but, so what? I think it easier to think outside the box when one is not factory produced. It is wonderful that you are a Pioneer in this area known as Radiant Energy, that has so much potential. I have come over to your office, and hope you will accept me into the fold as the research your involved in is also that which I am most interested in. I wish to use it to not only benefit myself but many others. Plus it is so an exciting area to experience in. I am not into it for the money or fame-only to free myself mentally, and from being taken advantage of by energy companies, stealing my pension money for heating, lighting etc. I beat the government, dvla, and gas company etc by using an mobility scooter. It is an excellent test bed as it has an DC motor. Enough said. Time to Rock Dave!
Love and Honour,
WingsTalysis

[darkoni]

Turion and Guys,

Is a setup that requires you to start your motor by giving it a spin inferior to one that self-starts, in terms of performance?

It seems like the majority of the time I have to spin-start the motor and I want to know if I'm better off just looking for a better "bad" battery that allows for a self-starting system.

Performance wise, it seems like everything is in line with what is mentioned in this thread, but If I can get better results by letting the motor start by itself after waiting a few minutes, than I rather focus on achieving that than continuing with building upon my current setup.

Thanks for you help,
Sam