3 Battery Generating System

[Farmhand]

Hi guy's, I'm joining in for a while. I've got a big stack of bad batteries that
have resisted all means of desulfating I've tried. So I grabbed one and
connected it as in the simple arrangement on the first page, I used a small PM
DC motor which uses about 1 amp and after about 2 minutes it started
spinning, the voltage of the bad battery went straight to almost the voltage
of the two series batteries which was 25.6 volts then as the bad battery
voltage dropped under the pressure of the voltage, a voltage difference
appeared and became more and more which allowed the voltage difference to
cause more and more current. After stopping it the bad battery went to 8.4 volts
where it is now sitting. This is promising because 12 months or more ago when
I tried to desulfate this battery it wouldn't rest above 5 volts.

I have noticed when reclaiming batteries it helps to run a small load from a
battery that will not take charge, by doing that it causes the current from the
load to "loosen the battery" a bit, then it will take charge.

I think this is doing a similar thing but with an external power source and
rather than draining the bad battery it is charging it, of course a small load
cannot be run directly from the bad battery unless the bad battery already
has some charge enough to run a load.

Anyway I'll see what happens with this setup after a while, I need to see if I
can arrange a useful load for the motor like a small generator.

I have a stack of about 10 big bad batteries. I have nothing to lose unless
one blows up in my hut. I don't think that will happen with a 1 amp load
though.

Cheers

[Matthew Jones]

Hi guy's, I'm joining in for a while. I've got a big stack of bad batteries that
have resisted all means of desulfating I've tried. So I grabbed one and
connected it as in the simple arrangement on the first page, I used a small PM
DC motor which uses about 1 amp and after about 2 minutes it started
spinning, the voltage of the bad battery went straight to almost the voltage
of the two series batteries which was 25.6 volts then as the bad battery
voltage dropped under the pressure of the voltage, a voltage difference
appeared and became more and more which allowed the voltage difference to
cause more and more current. After stopping it the bad battery went to 8.4 volts
where it is now sitting. This is promising because 12 months or more ago when
I tried to desulfate this battery it wouldn't rest above 5 volts.

I have noticed when reclaiming batteries it helps to run a small load from a
battery that will not take charge, by doing that it causes the current from the
load to "loosen the battery" a bit, then it will take charge.

I think this is doing a similar thing but with an external power source and
rather than draining the bad battery it is charging it, of course a small load
cannot be run directly from the bad battery unless the bad battery already
has some charge enough to run a load.

Anyway I'll see what happens with this setup after a while, I need to see if I
can arrange a useful load for the motor like a small generator.

I have a stack of about 10 big bad batteries. I have nothing to lose unless
one blows up in my hut. I don't think that will happen with a 1 amp load
though.

Cheers

Just remember we are not trying to fix the bad battery. For more detail read the very first post. Davids got it all laid out.

Matt

[blackchisel97]

Just checked my batteries from last night run. I used another candidate for batt 3 but it wouldn't start unless I had a load across. I tried different loads and with just a 5W dome light I could feel the shaft turning very easily, hoping it would start to run. It didn't, unless I increased a load. I let it run anyhow but I've lost 0.2V. I don't thing it is good candidate. I'll search for another one.
(Maybe they should use the same criteria for presidents - let it run a bit and see if the economy recovers)

Cheers
Vtech

[Turion]

Don't forget, it could take as much as 20 minutes before the motor starts up depending on the shape your battery is in, and the LONGER it takes, the better the "bad" battery is for these experiments.

Dave

[clueless]

12 volt golf cart batteries

I have an opportunity to buy 2 golf cart 12 volt batteries that are not any "good"?
I haven't put a meter on them yet and ifI buy them it will have to be today 'cause the recyler is coming tomorrow for them. What voltage and are there anything else I should be looking at and can a golf battery be reconditioned like a car battery, desulphation and or new acid?
I can get these for $25 each which I think is a bargain.
I believe I recall that the larger deep cycle batteries works best. Give me your advice on these.
Thanks
-rg
PS Matt I got the stuff today.

[blackchisel97]

I have an opportunity to buy 2 golf cart 12 volt batteries that are not any "good"?
I haven't put a meter on them yet and ifI buy them it will have to be today 'cause the recyler is coming tomorrow for them. What voltage and are there anything else I should be looking at and can a golf battery be reconditioned like a car battery, desulphation and or new acid?
I can get these for $25 each which I think is a bargain.
I believe I recall that the larger deep cycle batteries works best. Give me your advice on these.
Thanks
-rg
PS Matt I got the stuff today.

I would buy them on the spot. They're the best batteries you can have. Beside being deep cycle (they can be safely discharged down to 10.5V) they are never abused like an automotive starting batt's, when being raped in the winter to start the car. They can be sulfated but this is a minor inconvenience
Two batteries like that will outperform 10 starting batteries bank.
Yes, they can be reconditioned just like any acid battery but better.

Cheers
Vtech

[Matthew Jones]

SOme new stuff

DavidsSetup3.AVI - YouTube

This is movie of setup. I will post a link to the switch test as soon as it gets uploaded.

@Clueless buy the golf cart batts.

Don't forget, it could take as much as 20 minutes before the motor starts up depending on the shape your battery is in, and the LONGER it takes, the better the "bad" battery is for these experiments.

Dave

@All I had a stroke of something today the goal is not to let the bad battery get fixed right? Use 2-3 dead batteries in series depending on whether or your primaries are 12 or 24 volt.
May take a couple of hours to get started. Be patient.

I'll post that link as soon as its done.

Matt

[blackchisel97]

Update on my setup

Thanks Matt

I left my bigger setup alone until new motor arrives and went back to small setup. Instead of two 6V in series as 1&2 I just used 12V power wheel battery and 6V 5Ah SLAB sitting below 4V. I used the same RC motor as before (in my first setup). Motor didn't want to start even after 30min but I could see the spikes with my scope across the motor. I don't know why but I put a coil in series with motor (between the motor and + of 12V battery). I had a spool of thick wire salvaged from MOT. At first I used without the core but later fitted with 2 pcs of hollow ferrite cores. I did notice spikes across the motor getting near 8V p-p. I also tried various capacitors in parallel and their effect on the spikes. The highest were with couple hundreds nF range. However, I didn't notice clear effect in potential over the batteries after motor started running so it's is probably not important.
12V battery was at 12.56 and batt 3 at 3.56V before the switch was turned on.
After throwing switch they were 12.52V and 10.57V and within 15min motor started. Since it did that I recorded 12.43V and 8.67V respectively.
After an hour running - 12.40V and 8.80V and motor stopped. (switch remained ON all the time).
Batteries recovered to - 12.55V and 12.38V. Within 5min motor restarted, ran for 30min and stopped again.
Batteries recovered to - 12.64V and 6.67V. System restarted on its own and ran for 15 min. Since it didn't restart again within 30 min I decided to shot it off.
After an hour batteries are - 12.73V and 6.48V.

Cheers
Vtech

[Matthew Jones]

Here is the switch test

DavidsSetup4 - YouTube

Enjoy
Matt

[clueless]

Guys your Enthausism must have rubbed off

My wife is in a wheelchair and I take her shopping ( women need to shop) (guys buy) but by the time I got back to the battery place they were closing but did indicate if I came before noon those batteries will still be available.
Here is the interesting part, I had talked with the owner of the battery center when I went earlier in the day about the 3BGS and he wants to be kept informed. From his response I believe he will hold two of the four batteries until I get paid next month.
I am going in the morning early and buy two. Hopefully he will hold the other two until next month.
It will probably take two days to desuphlate both batteries and a good friend of mine who is both a electrician and electronics guy is coming up on Friday to help me with some home repair stuff and he has agreed to help me wire Matt's setup.
In the meantime I will build a platform for the motor(s). I must tell you that patience is not a virtue of mine but I love the encouragement from everyone here. I'd just like to take what I can scrape together and get things moving but in this case I will wait until my ducks are lined up.
This setup deserves the best I can give.
-Robert

[blackchisel97]

Here is the switch test

DavidsSetup4 - YouTube

Enjoy
Matt

Looks good! Thank you Matt

You should be all set to go Robert

Vtech

[Turion]

blackchisel97,
That's exactly the behavior my original setup had. If you look at my very first post, I talk about my motor stopping and starting all on its own.

Matt,
I agree with you about the load on the motor. I have NEVER been able to get the system into the zone without a load of SOME KIND on the motor, and I have no idea why. LOL

Also, I have always feel that the motor is putting out power in two directions....CEMF that goes back to the primary batteries and generated current that goes forward to the dead battery. I know I keep saying this, but it is the way I have always looked at this thing operating. And I'm probably wrong, but I've seen things that led me to think that way.

I really, REALLY appreciate the time and effort you have put into this Matt. I know you are a busy man, and it's awesome not just that you're working on it, but that you are taking the time to share results with all of us.

I pick up the last of my parts tomorrow for my setup, and then I will be doing some more testing of my own. Luther sent me two motors and I just HAD to incorporate them into my setup. SO I will have three different setups to play with.

Dave

[Matthew Jones]

More!!!!



This setup is holding the charge in the primaries while running. It also running an extra 10-15 watt load via the inverter.

The resistor in the schematic is 1 oh 100 watt.

If you got the stuff try it and maybe look for some combos.

Cheers
Matt

[citfta]

Hi guys,

I have finally gotten some time to work on this again. I have gotten a mosfet switching circuit to work on this. I have the motor connected the same as we have been doing and the mosfets connected across batt 3 to vary the current through the motor. It works very well with my little radio shack motor. It also will control my scooter motor although it will get pretty warm depending on the duty cycle. I have attached a schematic of the mosfet circuit. Thanks to Vissie for allowing me to modify his circuit and share it with the rest of you.

While I was working on this I had a scope connected to my 2 good batts to look at the spikes coming back to them. I discovered something that seems pretty strange. I only had the motor connected with the mosfet circuit as a load on batt 3. I have a switch in line between the motor and batt 1 positive. When I turn that switch off I still get spikes back to the good batts until the motor comes to a stop. There shouldn't be any way for the spikes to get back to the batts because the circuit is open. I checked this several times and they were always there until the motor stopped. I am using shielded scope leads so I don't think they were picking up the spikes and especially since the ground lead was still connected to - connection on the battery. Strange?

Carroll

[citfta]

Hey Matt,

I guess you and I were posting at the same time. I really liked the videos and now your latest circuit looks very interesting. If I can find some more dead batteries I plan to give it a try.

Thanks for sharing,
Carroll