3 Battery Generating System

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Quote:
I have nothing to prove that these are the reasons but but as you can see a battery is completely different to a cap. The salt cells mentioned before would seem to be a better option to me than a cap.

Right on the button there, but if you use a salt bridge in SERIES with the correct cap or caps then you will have done the right thing. You need ionic movement when in charge conduction mode, discharge is not a problem, the problem is to get the cap to charge, so you make it a battery cap

I am putting a circuit together to show this, when I have it right I will post it. The problem I am having is that with a motor you have to take into consideration polarity, and that makes the circuit a little more complicated.

If it was not for the problem of possible battery abuse "drive battery back end", then this would not be a problem, please bare with me, I AM HERE TO HELP AND NOT HINDER

Mike

[mbrownn]

Quote:

Right on the button there, but if you use a salt bridge in SERIES with the correct cap or caps then you will have done the right thing. You need ionic movement when in charge conduction mode, discharge is not a problem, the problem is to get the cap to charge, so you make it a battery cap

I see what you are saying, a "capatery"

I wonder what impedance changes there are in this if any?

I think you may have to play around with the concentration of salt as well as the cap sizes.

[harctan]

Hello all. I'm giving serious thought on attempting a replication on the 3BGS and I have a couple of questions. Do all AGM batteries specify that they are indeed AGM on the packaging? For example I have 2 of these VRLA batteries: http://www.ultracell.co.uk/datasheet...s/UL1.3-12.pdf. On the old manual it listed fibre glass as the seperator so I assumed they were AGM but in this new manual I link to such information is ommited. Also would a small 12V motor for RC models suffice or should I search for something bigger?

[Duncan]

More the merrier!

Hi Harctan I guess the ideal is to try and duplicate the equipment and tests of the others. However I didn't have the room the money or the time to do that.
I did exactly what you are considering, As I think has been well established the state of that “bad battery” is really the “x factor” as you read back through the thread you'll find guys have had success with a variety of brushed motors and different batteries. An adjustable load is needed which with a little motor like that I guess you can do with simple finger pressure.
You will feel the motor respond with more power. Once you have felt and seen that I doubt you'll be able to leave the subject alone.
If you have an RC motor and some batteries to hand please give it a go. You may not be lucky with your battery three, you can see the inordinate trouble people are going to in order to return a battery to that condition . But for 15 mins of your time to possibly validate what you see related here and nothing to loose ..please go ahead and try it for the benefit of all. What I find difficult to get my head around (and probably most folks too) is normally you build something and you expect it to work “to do” The very best outcome and indeed what you want, is to build that little circuit and for it to do nothing. … very boring and frustrating after a very short time however it will adjust (somehow) and start moving of its own volition. Apply gentle pressure to the shaft with your hand you will feel and see the motor respond with more power and speed .. (see the smoking glove video,) if your lucky enough to experience these things Harctan you will be seeking the answers just as enthusiastically as we all are, Its unmistakable once you’ve experienced it.Good luck &

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Mind twister

I see what you are saying, a "capatery"

I wonder what impedance changes there are in this if any?

I think you may have to play around with the concentration of salt as well as the cap sizes.

Yes you are right and the other problem is the delta P, the potencial difference, you need more pressure on the drive battery side, but also not over voltage the cap. So what is needed is a frequency of switching which is tuned to the charge rate of the cap bank, once nearly at full charge you dump that charge back into the circuit. That charge is electrons that have already passed through the motor on their way to ground, but you collect them in the cap and use them again. I have done this many times and is part of a system of mine.

Doing this you are gaining twice the usage "less losses" of the electron current and also save the main back end battery cells as they will not see the reverse current.

Now this will not create a self runner alone, but by use of say a UFO motor with a generating part to it, just might be an answer if the cap dump was put in series with that output!!! That is something that I am working on for UFO where that dump goes back to the main batteries as it will have a higher delta P "higher voltage than the run batteries and also give amperage from the instant cap dump, I hope you see where I am going, all interesting stuff and a real mind twister

Mike

[harctan]

Hi Harctan I guess the ideal is to try and duplicate the equipment and tests of the others. However I didn't have the room the money or the time to do that.
I did exactly what you are considering, As I think has been well established the state of that “bad battery” is really the “x factor” as you read back through the thread you'll find guys have had success with a variety of brushed motors and different batteries. An adjustable load is needed which with a little motor like that I guess you can do with simple finger pressure.
You will feel the motor respond with more power. Once you have felt and seen that I doubt you'll be able to leave the subject alone.
If you have an RC motor and some batteries to hand please give it a go. You may not be lucky with your battery three, you can see the inordinate trouble people are going to in order to return a battery to that condition . But for 15 mins of your time to possibly validate what you see related here and nothing to loose ..please go ahead and try it for the benefit of all. What I find difficult to get my head around (and probably most folks too) is normally you build something and you expect it to work “to do” The very best outcome and indeed what you want, is to build that little circuit and for it to do nothing. … very boring and frustrating after a very short time however it will adjust (somehow) and start moving of its own volition. Apply gentle pressure to the shaft with your hand you will feel and see the motor respond with more power and speed .. (see the smoking glove video,) if your lucky enough to experience these things Harctan you will be seeking the answers just as enthusiastically as we all are, Its unmistakable once you’ve experienced it.Good luck &

Thank you for the input Duncan. I think I'll try that and see what happens as soon as I get my hands on some bad batteries.

[PhysicsProf]

Three tries. No luck yet. See photos. Still questioning the circuit diagram with the CAPACITOR and two batteries and two DC motors... If that circuit diagram simply needs amending, it would be great... but agreed mbrownn and others -- there is a BIG difference between a cap and a battery.

I appreciate your reasoning on the observed voltage changes, David -- your deductions are logical to me.

David or Duncan or Matt or someone, I hope you can figure out a good way to make a good "bad battery"! Sounds like you may be on to something, Matt.

[Duncan]

12/2012 are ye ready sinners ???

Watch this Free Electrical Energy - YouTube
, compare schematics. It's Tesla method.


BTW. The circuit you are searching is exactly such or a variation of this , as in video - except the DC-DC converter from capacitor to battery is missing... It's simple I told you....you can also find a second variation with 2 diodes ;-)
I will post a circuit after 21.12.2012 he he he ;-)

http://dnp.s3.amazonaws.com/b/b4/2112_0.mp3

[tachyoncatcher]

No they don't

Hello all. I'm giving serious thought on attempting a replication on the 3BGS and I have a couple of questions. Do all AGM batteries specify that they are indeed AGM on the packaging? For example I have 2 of these VRLA batteries: http://www.ultracell.co.uk/datasheet...s/UL1.3-12.pdf. On the old manual it listed fibre glass as the seperator so I assumed they were AGM but in this new manual I link to such information is ommited. Also would a small 12V motor for RC models suffice or should I search for something bigger?

Hey harctan, AGMs are a strange breed, most are not labeled AGM. Matt has addressed this identity crisis in an earlier post. You ARE looking for fiber glass separators. This is the easiest way to identify them. Your dc brushed motor is going to need to be able to take what ever load you want to drive off your 3rd (dead) battery. AGMs seem to give you a better chance for, charging on the primaries and loads on the 3rd battery, at the same time. Also, a mechanical load on the motor. Go figure. But others have gotten it to work with out the AGMs (myself included). But, only once for me. AGMs are your best bet. A larger motor, than a rc model would be recommended. I tried an old cordless drill motor once. It created great pulses for effect, but didn't last long with a load.
Good Luck,
Randy

[mbrownn]

Yes you are right and the other problem is the delta P, the potencial difference, you need more pressure on the drive battery side, but also not over voltage the cap. So what is needed is a frequency of switching which is tuned to the charge rate of the cap bank, once nearly at full charge you dump that charge back into the circuit. That charge is electrons that have already passed through the motor on their way to ground, but you collect them in the cap and use them again. I have done this many times and is part of a system of mine.

Doing this you are gaining twice the usage "less losses" of the electron current and also save the main back end battery cells as they will not see the reverse current.

Now this will not create a self runner alone, but by use of say a UFO motor with a generating part to it, just might be an answer if the cap dump was put in series with that output!!! That is something that I am working on for UFO where that dump goes back to the main batteries as it will have a higher delta P "higher voltage than the run batteries and also give amperage from the instant cap dump, I hope you see where I am going, all interesting stuff and a real mind twister

Mike

Using the current twice makes sense on the Gray motor but I don't see how it could be happening in the standard 3BGS, there is no switching. If the bad battery was just oscillating, it would not explain the effects we are getting (LC circuit).

In my tests I have had a rise in voltage on the source for a short time while powering a small load as well as the motor but cannot say with any certainty that I had an overunity effect during that time as the bad battery rapidly recovered and the source voltage dropped off. I wonder if dendrites play a part in this as they short the dead battery to some extent?

[harctan]

Hey harctan, AGMs are a strange breed, most are not labeled AGM. Matt has addressed this identity crisis in an earlier post. You ARE looking for fiber glass separators. This is the easiest way to identify them. Your dc brushed motor is going to need to be able to take what ever load you want to drive off your 3rd (dead) battery. AGMs seem to give you a better chance for, charging on the primaries and loads on the 3rd battery, at the same time. Also, a mechanical load on the motor. Go figure. But others have gotten it to work with out the AGMs (myself included). But, only once for me. AGMs are your best bet. A larger motor, than a rc model would be recommended. I tried an old cordless drill motor once. It created great pulses for effect, but didn't last long with a load.
Good Luck,
Randy

Hey Randy, thank you for clarifying. I have already contacted 2 battery manufacturers that sell their products in my region, asking for verification but no answers as of yet. I will definately opt for a bigger motor then, if nothing else just to be future-proof.

[Matthew Jones]

Hey Randy, thank you for clarifying. I have already contacted 2 battery manufacturers that sell their products in my region, asking for verification but no answers as of yet. I will definately opt for a bigger motor then, if nothing else just to be future-proof.

All You need to do is Pop the Flat plastic piece off the top, you'll find a little notch to do this with. Then plug the plugs, You'll see them when you get there. If you look down inside you'll see some cotton lookin stuff over the plates then you have an AGM.

90% percent of your small batteries are AGM. They have not made gells in a long time and the Liquid ones are obvious as they screw top vent caps, Like a motor cycle battery or such.

Don't waist your time writing manufacturers they never answer and if they do you get endless spam in the end.

Matt

[harctan]

Thanks Matt, I guess I'll be going dead battery hunting sometime this week.

[Turion]

harctan,
A pulse motor will work MUCH, MUCH, MUCH better for you than a standard motor....ask anyone who has tried this. So if you are even the SLIGHTEST bit serious about continuing research on this, I would opt for an MY1016 Razor Scooter motor. You can pick one up on e-bay for $18-$25 and new for $38 plus shipping. It will have to be rewound to be a pulse motor so you will need some wire to do that, but it will be worth your time. Ask anyone who has done it.

Dave

[Ufopolitics]

harctan,
A pulse motor will work MUCH, MUCH, MUCH better for you than a standard motor....ask anyone who has tried this. So if you are even the SLIGHTEST bit serious about continuing research on this, I would opt for an MY1016 Razor Scooter motor. You can pick one up on e-bay for $18-$25 and new for $38 plus shipping. It will have to be rewound to be a pulse motor so you will need some wire to do that, but it will be worth your time. Ask anyone who has done it.

Dave

Hello Again Turion,

Wow!, long time no see you at My Thread...Did You ever finished that Asymmetrical Generator I have shown you all the how's to?...last time you were waiting on an extra magnet (Was this around three months ago?)...is it still "on its way"?

I would opt for an MY1016 Razor Scooter motor. You can pick one up on e-bay for $18-$25 and new for $38 plus shipping. It will have to be rewound to be a pulse motor so you will need some wire to do that, but it will be worth your time. Ask anyone who has done it.

Oh!...That "sounds" so familiar Turion!!...Is it Rewound "My UFO Style"?...Asymmetrically?...MUCH,MUCH, MUCH better?...or is it the very slow one you have shown that Matthew Jones have "designed", but no one have EVER seen How it was done?

Why don't you refer your replicators to the right source?!...on how to do this rewinding of the Motors MUCH,MUCH,MUCH better...and that is ONLY at My Thread...nowhere else they will be able to find this valuable info...Turion...You know that perfectly well...you were there for a long while...gathering ALL info... Am I right?

And -of course- don't think I am doing this to "gain" more views there...believe me...I've got plenty so far...

Regards and very nice talking to you again, I mean Me talking to you, not the other way around...

Regards to all other Members here also!


Ufopolitics


EDIT: Oh, by the way...I was just forgetting...and You could ask Your Wife...since she is into the Legal Intellectual Patent Protection Laws...that here, in US...such beautiful Country!...the USPTO allows Eleven Months (11)...after you publish all your material...on line or else...to file up an application with them...and of course...You have to provide all the "Specimens"...or material proof along with videos, sites, articles, threads and Forums...where you have revealed/disclosed/exposed all this info...and of course... all this with unchangeable/non accessible time stamp changes...and the more publishing, the more clever videos and graphics are...and all the Real Models shown on them...the better proof against any "false copies" or fraudulent (before time) applications/Disclosures, etc...isn't that a great Law?!

I, particularly LOVE it!!

Oh!...and also...let Matt knows about this...that way He could disclose -relaxed- that new designed very slow motor/no torque winding that you have shown working in your 3BGS...without any problems at all...

Regards again.