3 Battery Generating System

[Turion]

Duncan and All,
Duncan you made a comment about the NEED to share what we come up with on the research we are doing on the 3BGS. As I look down at the bottom of the page, there are currently 2 people logged into this thread. There may be a bunch more secretly watching, but only two who choose to reveal that they are, and one of them is me. Most of what we have are lurkers, waiting for someone to share something good hoping something clicks in their mind and they can run off and patent something it made them think of to make a bunch of money. They don't intend to share their ideas here. They are about taking, not giving. I started this to give people the basics and a direction in the hopes that we could work together, and I have made some friends along the way that I continue to work with off thread. But most folks here talk, talk, talk and never build a thing.

We needed hundreds of people to try this thing. We needed thousands. We needed so many people to try it and see that it works that nobody could deny the truth of it. We needed a tidal wave of people who see the truth and are so excited about it that they change the course of research into free energy. In the five years I've been posting about this on the forums, there have been maybe ten or twelve people who have followed through on this enough to find a bad battery that would work and have actually seen what you and I have seen. That's just sad. It breaks my heart when I think about it. I tried to go back to Peswiki and update them on our progress and all anyone wanted to do there was demand proof , tell me my methods of measurement are inaccurate, and deny that this thing works.

So when something amazing happens do I post it here? Not likely. I email those folks who have been interested enough to BUILD this thing and who are emailing me and talking to me on the phone about it, and who have seen it work for themselves. I share it with THEM.

We'll never save the world be revealing the magic to the two people who are logged into this thread. We'll do it be building a community of folks who have working devices that are tested, who can then appear at conferences and other places to show people something that actually works that you can build yourself, because even if we post the plans here, how many people are actually going to build it?

I'm absolutely committed to getting this out there. So much so that when we get a working prototype device, if it is not too expensive, I will build them and GIVE them away to all the folks I know who are off the grid and could use one...the kind of people who will help their friends and neighbors build one too. Like my dad, who is in his 80's, on a fixed income, and is still climbing up on the roof of his wood yard to nail down shingles because he can't afford to pay somebody to do it for him. But share with some low life whose only goal is to run off and patent something to make money for himself? I think not.
So I really am committed to sharing. I'm just not sure this is the place to do it.

Dave

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, fear and all its derivative emotions and effects is but a momentary lapse of remembering.
We are all immortal spirit, having a physical experience.
Fear is only of this world, therefore, not actually real.
Unconditional love and embodying this energy in all situations, is the only path to what most of us really need.
Share freely and ignore the fear mongers, no matter how much supposed reasons they may give to fear, because all the fear pushing is ultimately based upon the BIG LIE and this lie tells us we are only these human vessels, which could not be further from the truth.

Hooked up a solar led garden light to the bad 1.2 volt AA cell as a load, but it caused the motor to stop, probably too much of a load.
peace love light
tyson

[LutherG]

Was gonna post this earlier... so doing it now

I was gonna post this last Wednesday but after reading it, thought differently about it and just sent it to Dave... but maybe it should be posted... hopefully it'll turn a light on somewhere...

Hi Guys,

WOW - lots going on with this thread! EXCELLENT! My apologies for being in and out - mostly out - I've just got "stuff" going on...

I read the last couple of pages today and just wanted to throw in a couple of thoughts for whatever its worth...

First, that all three batteries have to be the same type and kind - I'm not so sure about this. My setup is not that way and it worked for me. It doesn't raise the voltages on 1 & 2 while running, but afterwards, my batteries always come back to starting voltage. My primaries are 18Ah sealed batteries and my third battery is an old lead acid car battery... I've pulled loads of 2 car headlights and ran an inverter with a 60-watt or 100-watt bulb plus a dome light for the better part of an hour... let it rest awhile and it bounces back. It could definitely be better and maybe by using 3 matching batteries I'll see the voltage rise on 1 and 2 while running... we'll see...

Secondly, as for resonance, when David put his dad's battery bank in parallel to his third battery, he radically changed the impedance and thereby would have changed the resonant frequency... Yet that bank charged like mad! I don't know what kind of tuning he had to do if any - so I'll let him comment further on that. David - it'd be nice to know what the Ah capacity of those 6-volt batteries are/were. You also said they were tied 2 to a set to make 12 volts and then the whole bank was in series - did you mean series or were they 12-volt pairs wired in parallel? It's parallel - right?

I'd like to add another thought for consideration. I think that what happens in the third battery, is that because the plates and electrolyte cannot absorb much of the charge, the flux - I say its magnetic flux from the environment coming into battery 3 plus what is being pulled from the motor - is available for our use because battery 3 cannot absorb it - thus it remains available for our use. Maybe there is some alignment that occurs in the crystal lattice built up on the plates - I don't know - but magnetic flux (which is current) is definitely there and can be seen with a coil wrapped around the battery as several people have done and pointed out on this thread.

If the poles are assymmetrically potentialized then all parallel poles (such as David's dad's battery bank put in parallel to battery 3) are assymmetrically potentialized and if the flux from the motor and battery 3 are available then the battery bank (or inverter tied to load) has access to the flux - being sucked into the batteries in an effort to balance the poles. This is why John Bedini likes an inverted cap pulser. This is also something Don Smith talked about - that the ambient always seeks a balance. If it cannot discharge a charge, it will move on its own (kinetic) to create an opposite charge in order to create that balance of opposite charges. This can be seen in nature whenever we have a lightning discharge. We're sitting in that same field and so are our batteries...

I believe an electrostatic spike or sharp impulse induces a movement in the earths magnetic field. Because it is a negatively charged influx it tends to release the bonds of the sulfation that has adhered to the plates returning it to solution, thus "healing" the battery over time and this we do not want because now the battery holds onto the flux and the battery charges up and acts like a normal battery again. However, when it cannot hold this flux for whatever reason, this flux remains available to be used by our loads - we have in effect a "teflon" battery...

I don't think we can take lightly the importance of the magnetic field backdrop. I would even go so far as to say that we should focus more on the magnetic side of this system than the electric or electrostatic side... Gauss meters might come in real handy with tuning this setup... When we relieve the motor of the generated flux that would normally fight the incoming current, it speeds up and gains massive torque. This in turn causes the motor to generate even more as it is now running at a higher rpm or frequency. Adding more physical load increases the overal voltage bringing the system back into resonance. So the system grows. Further relieve that newly generated flux and the motor speeds up even more, and gains even more torque but its not drawing down the primary batteries - so I don't believe its getting all this added flux/current from the primaries - its generating it "on the fly" and we're getting it out of the motor and into our loads...

So perhaps what we have, is a resonant system that flips the magnetic polarity of the generated current in the motor and we pull it from the motor with our loads on battery 3 and this is what gives us the gain or amplification that keeps us topped up because when the system is working correctly, there's lot's of power available and its not coming from batteries 1 & 2...

So basically I'm saying we should focus more on the magnetic interactions- or at least bear those in mind as we look at the electrical side - as this is the side our tools allow us to "see"... Leedskalnin said the postitive pole was magnetic north, and the negative pole is a magnetic south pole... So when the battery flips its polarity we need to see the magnetic fields as flipping their polarity... I could be totally wrong but this is what I see when I observe what this system is doing...

Anyways, I hope this post can be taken as "food for thought"...

Best regards to all,

Luther

[tachyoncatcher]

Lab work

So here's what I bet is happenning to the bad battery.
1 Some of the cells have reversed polarity. ie positive has become negative and vice versa.
.

@a.king21,
Nice observation. I think Matt shared a similar observation some time ago. Guess when you spelled it out at the cell level it clicked for me. Time to build a new type of "3rd battery".

@Luther G,
Good to see you again. I too have observed the magnetic flux "dance" of that 3rd battery. A gauss meter is a great idea. I noticed that my primaries charged when the magnetic flux was VERY unstable. I noticed this by accidentally placing a DVM against the 3rd battery while trying to read the voltage on the primaries and the meter bounced/read impossible voltages. Most times off scale even at the 1000v scale. I attributed this to a strong magnetic flux messing with the DVM circuitry. --- Maybe not. Time to measure. ---
Randy

[davesw]

Hi Guys,
Sorry to drop off the map there. Last week was just crazy. Have I too many fires, never mind irons in them? Naaaa….
Hopefully stability has returned….

@ Duncan (and others!)
You wrote -
sorta like this (perhaps)
Hi Dave I hope you don’t mind me playing devils advocate here … just trying to force some synaptic action and intentionally being contrary
Perfect! Exactly my intent! We don’t get to really think about what we say if someone does not challenge it! I think we are pretty much on the same page here, though we may say some things slightly differently.

Looking into this topic I begin to feel like a terrier in a rabbit warren. He is going frantic running round in circles trying to figure which hole to go down! (and you are very good at uncovering yet more new holes!) We all have inquiring minds or we would not be here. Trouble is we are tossing so many pebbles into the pond that the pond is boiling and we can’t see what we are doing.

And this leads me to comment that I think we are in danger of expending huge energy on trying to get hold of the fruit right at the top of the tree while at the same time ignoring the fruit hanging right in front of us. (I hasten to add that my comment is meant across all the energy groups – a good example of this is UFO’s gold standard, frequency stable, AC alternator) I think we need to be keeping it as simple as we can to start with. Every time we make one piece more complex, even by a little, we add more collateral potential pitfalls.

The other thing I need to clarify for myself is – am I trying to receive energy or am I trying to generate and broadcast it? For me I guess, I am into trying to receive the energy (presumably scalar) and then convert it into something I can use. I think the original 3BS (along with Newman motors, SSGs etc) is a receiver and converter.

Tesla obviously saw the need to broadcast the energy, but he was looking at large scale usage. (and communication) I think there is more than enough naturally available to meet our small scale usage. I plan to get my receivers working first before I go on to boosting the supply. (You There! Turn away from that rabbit hole! Now!)

And that leads me back to the 3BS. I obviously need a setup to do some tests of my own. In the interests of being on the same page and not off at yet another tangent –

Turion, could I ask what motor you actually used on the original? (Was it a brushed RC motor – was that a pile of Lipos I saw in front of your load bank?)

Duncan, didn’t you hit a lucky strike with your first test? Which motor did you use?

I don’t think the motor is super critical here, but I am trying to remove variables as much as possible.

I think the magnetic field around bat3 could simply be a result of the resonance. If so, it could be used as a measure of the resonance? Also it could tell us when the resonance actually starts? Here my head is going round in circles (Generating its own field? LOL) thinking about that little initial current and how come it grows as it does. Does the magnetic field arise as soon as one connects power across bat3? Ie does it arise from simply applying voltage across the crystal structure in bat3?

As soon as I can get hold of a suitable bat3 the fun will begin!

Davesw.

[Duncan]

on Impulse...

Ouch .. a bit of a lambaste ah well no matter I'd much rather squabble a bit on thread than spend hours chasing my own tail. All said and done boys and girls this circuit has nothing to it .. has it?
I mean in the scheme of things it really couldn't get any easier however … Its a loose canon .. she's a rebel breaking all the rules (bless her) we are all (me too) trying to engineer the thing with known physics, after all its the only language we know anything else puts us in the tower of Bable.
In other words I suggest resonance which of course is quite rightly countered with its an altered load how can that be so? I too try and desperately cling onto known dogma ..however.. It doesn't fit here !
Bits fit .. resonance .. fits …the harmonic and overtone relationship … fits as does the variable frequency . At face value the Impedance question becomes a white elephant sitting on a chair in the corner of the room.
It demands attention I agree .. IMHO as regards the internal action of the “bad battery” because of tuning” you are actually dealing with the Impulse wave and any and all standard engineering is quite worthless. Indeed the term Impedance doesn't exist as the dimension is crossed.
I really don't blame anyone for clinging on to official dogma (I hang on for dear life as well) Its more a case of at which point your prepared to take the “leap of faith” I can explain pretty much everything in standard engineering terms including series resonance until .. the perpetual nightmare .. the bad battery... however at that point everything changes, your in a different dimension with different units …. chemists may try and explain it as … re using electrons … or amplified Muon's or some such however I think EPD probably has the truth of it, His maths... the units and dimensions have been simplified (a little bit) here
Key Points & Glossary | Gestalt Reality
No one has seen electricity .. never mind an electron, we don't know what it is, we can see what it does however and we are as a group pushing this extraordinary action towards the finishing line at some point each of us has to abandon standard physics … It doesn't fit ! I have simply taken what I consider to be the only sensible exit that will hold up under scrutiny with regard to the very few who have documented alternative theories.
As to Lurkers … .
On the off chance that we may be dealing with something other that “free energy” I can agree and will hence forth ….
However lets assume this thing is “fate accompli” what’s the purpose ? You know yourself David its not patentable. As I'm sure your wife has already pointed out. once every-bodies spent lots of money time and effort to develop such a thing it gets a “military asset” gagging order … I don’t think that’s really what any of us are doing this for is it?
So what if there's a few thousand Lurker's ? I rather hope there is .. I hope there are thousands of 3BS systems being built and tested across Asia and every where else in the world for that matter.. After all as far as tptb are concerned anyone who starts making this thing is public enemy number one. All we are doing is giving a lurker a “poisoned challis” …. may he drink long and hearty... before its our turn! The history of Free energy is scattered with bodies and maimed and injured if somebody is in a great rush to take our place at the head of the queue why not?
Unless that is there's a cunning plan to have the cake and eat it .. that would have my undivided attention.

[Duncan]

motor? nothing special

Hi Davesw Nice to have you back … there was nothing extraordinary about the motor or the batteries
just very old Gel cells from an abandoned Power bike .. It wasn't even a large motor . In fact a very small one originally used for vibrating lumber support in the seats of BMW’s this is the bad battery and the little motor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-U3M99olqI
It is also that little brushed motor that iced the battery post surround. PS that battery that you see is totally beyond redemption, came back from the dead and is now a good battery

[Matthew Jones]

@Luther G,
Good to see you again. I too have observed the magnetic flux "dance" of that 3rd battery. A gauss meter is a great idea. I noticed that my primaries charged when the magnetic flux was VERY unstable. I noticed this by accidentally placing a DVM against the 3rd battery while trying to read the voltage on the primaries and the meter bounced/read impossible voltages. Most times off scale even at the 1000v scale. I attributed this to a strong magnetic flux messing with the DVM circuitry. --- Maybe not. Time to measure. ---
Randy

David at one time wrapped his third battery with a coil. Wound it right on the battery...


Matt

[Turion]

I still have that battery, all wrapped with wire. It was speaker wire I have no use for, so I just left it on the battery and stored the battery on the shelf. I see it every day and it is one of those things that makes me think every time I see it.

Dave

[Duncan]

ying or yang

Just to add a little bit to my last post I guess things break down into two very basic schools of thought one being that Energy is somehow being created “In house”... that is by some as yet to be defined chemical action such as electrons being used once or twice or some such and so energy is being used over and over . really?
The other school of thought is outlined by Steinmetz Tesla Moray et al , That of course is “The sea of energy” In my own mind I am pretty certain that we are investigating the second option as it is quite clear that tptb have been at great pains to hide anything to do with the linear wave and Impulse theories. All that aside I am aware no one has ever seen electricity never mind an electron and so I cant discount some unknown chemical miracle occurring I just doubt it. I cant escape the logical thought that the constant source of energy must come from somewhere and the only somewhere I see described and explained at all is what Tesla referred to as the Luminous Aether.
The fact that a coil of wire around the battery would interact relative to received Aether current is also no surprise at all probably when we get this worked out there will be some of both camps involved and It'll be a chicken and egg situation ...The real miracle is it all fits together and works …. press on. press on

[BobBrown]

From left field

Just a thought running through my head. Most of my thoughts are garbage, but this one may have some connection to your third battery.

Question, a bad battery, can it be said that the sulfur has crystallized on the plates of the battery? I'm interested in that word CRYSTAL. I'm assuming that the sulfur becomes normalized and the battery becomes good when the sulfuric acid is back as in a new battery. But so long as the sulfuric acid is in crystal form, the below may apply.

I've been surfing the web, these last few days, for anything related to the
John Hutchison crystal battery. Basically a couple of electrodes stuck together by a crystalline structure between them. Electricity is formed they say by thermal energy on the crystal, and though the current and voltage are tiny, the cell ( battery ) works forever without charging.

Could your third ( dead ) battery be actualy adding energy to your system in a manner related to the Hutchison crystal battery techonlogy ?

Andrew
Even the stupid occasional say something smart.
But not always. lol

PS Replace the third battery with a crystalline battery cell? late at night I should stop thinking while I'm ahead. lol, night

[Duncan]

Just a thought running through my head. Most of my thoughts are garbage, but this one may have some connection to your third battery.

Question, a bad battery, can it be said that the sulfur has crystallized on the plates of the battery? I'm interested in that word CRYSTAL. I'm assuming that the sulfur becomes normalized and the battery becomes good when the sulfuric acid is back as in a new battery. But so long as the sulfuric acid is in crystal form, the below may apply.

I've been surfing the web, these last few days, for anything related to the
John Hutchison crystal battery. Basically a couple of electrodes stuck together by a crystalline structure between them. Electricity is formed they say by thermal energy on the crystal, and though the current and voltage are tiny, the cell ( battery ) works forever without charging.

Could your third ( dead ) battery be actualy adding energy to your system in a manner related to the Hutchison crystal battery techonlogy ?

Andrew
Even the stupid occasional say something smart.
But not always. lol

PS Replace the third battery with a crystalline battery cell? late at night I should stop thinking while I'm ahead. lol, night

Hi Bob there is a sharp divide exactly along the lines you describe. my own thoughts are an expansion on your own as explained by Hutchinson and Marcus Reid, They like Moray , Tesla .EPD and very many others are basically of the “Sea of energy” school
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-wzLhzBH3Y
In other words that in a tuned resonant (to the impulse wave) energy floods into the system … that’s rather how I see things.


Others of course can't quite get their heads around that as an idea .. as it involves “dimension and time shift” as is pointed out in this newly released Video of EPDs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UA2tLgL0HqE circa 1H50M
In the mean time I can't grasp the idea of an electron doing service repeatedly … perhaps when we resolve the whole thing one might cause the other chicken and egg style … In the mean time the big thing is …. It happens! And we are all chasing it!by every and all means.

[Turion]

Converts

Duncan,

I've had two different folks contact me at different times over the last couple years. Both had setups running where the voltage on batteries one and two would mostly stay level, but would drop a bit and then recover after a rest. They were able to run loads for hours at a time without drawing down on the primaries. They were working their way through different battery 3's with varying results depending on the "bad" battery in question. In both cases they believed that what was happening in their setups could be explained by the motor somehow acting as a generator.

Then one day, (not the SAME day mind you) they each got a big surprise. Their system, which had been chugging along nicely, suddenly did something they were't quite expecting. They each had changed to a "new" bad battery and suddenly the voltages on batteries one and two were climbing. They were able to run huge loads for hours.

Needless to say, their belief that the motor was acting as a generator to produce the results went right out the window. It had to be the different battery. That was the only thing that had changed.

The longest "high power" run anyone has reported to me with an off the shelf battery is 6 hours. Then the battery was fixed and they got nothing. I have had some people who have concocted their own formula for electrolyte report runs of up to 3 days. (With rests of an hour every four hours of run time) I believe Randy had a run similar to this BUT when he tried to connect it for a continuous run to see how long he could go, it quit working sometime when he wasn't around. I don't remember whether or not he shared his formula here. I know what he told me it was, but he wasn't specific about amounts, just a general description, and it is not my formula to disclose. I know the folks who reported the long runs to me wanted to keep their formula "secret" which is unfortunate, because it might point us all in the right direction for further research.

I do believe it was a salt based electrolyte though, just from things they said.

Dave

[a.king21]

observation

Duncan,

I've had two different folks contact me at different times over the last couple years. Both had setups running where the voltage on batteries one and two would mostly stay level, but would drop a bit and then recover after a rest. They were able to run loads for hours at a time without drawing down on the primaries. They were working their way through different battery 3's with varying results depending on the "bad" battery in question. In both cases they believed that what was happening in their setups could be explained by the motor somehow acting as a generator.

Then one day, (not the SAME day mind you) they each got a big surprise. Their system, which had been chugging along nicely, suddenly did something they were't quite expecting. They each had changed to a "new" bad battery and suddenly the voltages on batteries one and two were climbing. They were able to run huge loads for hours.

Needless to say, their belief that the motor was acting as a generator to produce the results went right out the window. It had to be the different battery. That was the only thing that had changed.



Dave

I've seen this before in a different setup.
1 I believe the motor was still acting as a generator.
2 I believe the reason for the voltage climb was conditioning of the good batteries 1 and 2.
3 Remember the circuit is a loop and pulsing the bad battery is the same as pulsing the primaries - hence conditioning of the primaries(1 and 2).
4 The inclusion of a new "bad" battery meant the circuit started again from a higher starting point due to the prior conditioning of the primary batteries 1 and 2.

5 I've conditioned (spike charged) good car batteries before and after switching off the high voltage spikes the battery voltages continued to climb, whereas in a normal battery charger the voltages fall after you switch off.

[Turion]

a.king21,

I too believe the motor acts as a generator...always...even an off the shelf motor does in this setup.

What I was really trying to point out was that these folks felt that the small successes they were seeing with most of the bad batteries they tried could be explained away, but when they got the RIGHT bad battery, the power they got was way more than they could explain.

I got another email today from someone who doesn't post on the forum much, and he said some things I believe are well worth postings because they are thoughts I have had that get pushed aside by other things that are more exciting, yet they are really important to the basics of figuring this thing out. So I will share some of them here.

"Recently I have been amazed at the sensitivity of some Bedini circuits... just a few points off an activating frequency, no results. But once you get it tuned (based on the dynamics of each circuit) the battery goes from discharged to a full charge in minutes. Now the input current is virtually the same... so if that's not counter-intuitive what is?

Somewhere in any circuit that we build and test, there needs to be multiple points to tune based on almost countless variables. Variable capacitance, variable resistance, etc. We have to be able to hit a bullet with a bullet to get to the holy land. To pump and drink from the dipole.

Also clearly many have not admitted that we are dealing with at least two primal energies (each with huge variation of flavors), both at least being the inverse of the other. Things that are conductive on one side are resistive on the other. But our minds don't yet have enough clarity to separate and command these forces. Our minds think clearly about Amps, but not anti-Amps

......about your project - the ultimate truth is that it is connected with all other like projects. The fundamental forces that are just through the doors are and always have been immutable. It is us that must evolve, to see and apply what was always there."

I have always thought that we needed to be able to adjust several factors at once to give us the best shot at figuring this thing out.

Voltage going to the motor
Width of the pulse
Time between pulses
Resistance in the circuit, especially between the primaries and the motor (the line that contains the dead battery)
The capacitance.
A TRUE researcher would start with one of these and run through the combinations to see if you could make a good bad battery out of a normal battery by changing them. That takes a lot of time I'm afraid. But I've gotta begin somewhere.

Dave