3 Battery Generating System

[citfta]

Thanks citfta and Turion,

citfta,

Did this guy ever measure or quantify his results? These successes always appear subjective to me. The restrictions like less than the 20 hour rate and battery swaps and rest periods mean a controlled test would require weeks with close attention. Otherwise, the fact that the 3bgs has significantly more batteries will yield longer run times not to mention the continual attention being a benefit to the 3bgs.

Back to the balance question, or answer, it looks like sizing the 3bgs system for the load is the only way. That doesn't seem practical for a home power system where the load is constantly changing. The primary purpose of batteries on home solar installations is to buffer or contend with varying loads, like night to day, or refrigerator or pumps cycling. So wouldn't the balanced 3gbs installation into an existing battery assisted home solar PV system double or triple the total battery count for the home owner?

citfta, are you using a 3bgs for anything useful? Is anybody here doing so?

You can take or leave it, but I've been involved with energy conversion and energy storage for 40 years. I've tested thousands of batteries and hundreds of motors and generators. I really like the modern Lithium based batteries and really hate the lead acid. I have no desire to increase the amount of lead acid on my property. In all of the testing on lead acid which I've done or studied, I've never seen more than a temporary improvement from pulse charging and never any indication of "running between positives" as beneficial. Just stating reasons that I'm not interested in building the 3bgs, as you always tell me to do. The only quantitative controlled test which I've seen does not support your 3bgs claims. Of course Turion objects to that test. All this time, has no one else instrumented and recorded data from a controlled 3bgs test?

Oh well, back to other stuff. Carry on.

bi

Hello again,

I have highlighted again some areas you asked about. The guy in Tennessee conducted many many tests on his system. He is a single guy who only worked as a truck driver when he wanted to. The rest of the time he spent doing research on alternative energy. Primarily the 3BGS and various kinds of generators to use with the 3BGS system. I don't have any of the results of his tests but I think some of them are buried in this thread somewhere. You would have to look back in probably the first half of this thread to find those results. But he was very convinced that he got longer run times using the 3BGS.

You are correct that this is not a practical system for most people to use to power their home. It just takes too much attention and time to keep everything in balance and working correctly. But there are very many things that are not practical. That doesn't mean they don't work! It is certainly possible to run your home by using steam power to turn a generator. And that of course will work. But for most people that is just not practical or worth the trouble. But as far as the loads constantly changing that can be dealt with. That is just a simple engineering problem that can be met several ways. But again all that is not practical.

For those reasons listed above, no I am not using the 3BGS for anything useful. But I have proven to myself that it does work. Saying something is not practical is not the same as saying it doesn't work. If nothing else the 3BGS is a great learning experiment. And if you were living off the grid it could very well mean the difference between success and failure at providing your own source of power.

I am surprised you did not see any benefit from pulse charging batteries. This method of charging lead acid batteries has been around a while. But the frequency of the pulses and the voltage and current of them all play a part in the success or failure of the charging process. The commercial charger I have uses a microprocessor to monitor the battery and adjust the pulses accordingly.

I have been very busy with family matters for several months now. I am hoping to get some time to work with the boost circuit here in the hopefully near future. IF I get time to work on that I will provide all the data I can about what I find. I know Matt and Dave personally. I know what they have told me that I have had time to verify has been true.

It is fine that you don't want to spend time on the 3BGS. But it is certainly NOT fine that you want to keep claiming it doesn't work when you haven't tried it.

I understand what you are saying about the newer Lithium base batteries. But they have their problems also. I use them regularly in my RC airplanes. The power to weight ratio is amazing. But, I have never had a lead acid battery catch fire while in operation. And I have personally had that happen with one of my Lithium batteries. The plane took off just fine and at about 100 feet in the air there was a sudden explosion and the plane came tumbling down. The battery was blown out to the plane and landed on the ground. And as you are probably aware the fire of a burning Lithium battery is very hard to put out as they burn so hot. Of course it eventually burned up. I only charge mine in a special fireproof bag made just for that purpose. Any source of stored energy has the potential to be dangerous.

Respectfully,
Carroll

[wantomake]

Ignore list

The reason I don't care what anyone post here is simple. I deal with unbelief all the time. The "ignore list" is great to use. I get no benefit from reading anything from the ones that don't build or want to see a system work. As a seasoned and tried missionary, I see a great deal of unbelief because when people don't see it then it's not real. I've seen spiritual powers-that-be and know how they kill, steal, and destroy but I know the Name of Jesus does defeat them. So the powers-that-be in this FE world are easy to see and ignore.
Their words and methods never ever change.

Data and numbers are good if that helps someone. Then tptb will say you measured wrong or that's the incorrect raw data. Where does it stop? It never will.

Tptb from FE or spiritual, can't tell me what I've seen isn't real. Because I've seen both!!!

What a shame for them.
wantomake

[bistander]

Don't think I said that

I am surprised you did not see any benefit from pulse charging batteries. ... <snip>
...
It is fine that you don't want to spend time on the 3BGS. But it is certainly NOT fine that you want to keep claiming it doesn't work when you haven't tried it.
...

Hi citfta,

I said I saw some temporary improvement from pulsing. That was confined to batteries which likely suffered from sulfation. There may be some benefit to healthy batteries in longevity but in the lab we could find no performance improvement. Our test we're not comprehensive and happened about 20 years ago. I have not seen published scientific literature confirmation. And for years I received battery industry journals and periodicals. But not here to argue that. BTW, do you find it odd that Turion insists on the Matt modded motor and a boost converter when the converter contains a diode which blocks any "charge" pulse going to the battery from the motor?

And I don't think you find me saying that the 3bgs does not work. Maybe I slipped once and said that but I don't think so. What I have said is there is no valid proof that it is better than using batteries in the conventional manner. And that I have no interest in building a 3bgs. You'll notice the system I did build and test used a single battery. I thought it provided a clean demonstration.

Actually, I rarely claim something doesn't work. What I do is ask for data and proof of the claims made about the thing.

Been nice,

bi

[Turion]

How can the boost module block the charge impulse from the motor when the motor is running between the OUTPUT of the boost module and the battery. If you are running it any other way,no wonder you can’t get positive results.

[bistander]

Which battery

How can the boost module block the charge impulse from the motor when the motor is running between the OUTPUT of the boost module and the battery. If you are running it any other way,no wonder you can’t get positive results.

That battery is being charged by the motor running current. The magic pulse from the Matt modded motor is supposed to go to the source battery, isn't it?

A diagram would help.

[Turion]

Diagram?

SSUPPOSEDLY you already built this from previously (dozens of times) posted diagrams, yet you do not seem to know how it goes together. In BOTH the 3 battery circuit and the single battery circuit the output of the boost goes to the positive of the motor and the negative of the motor goes to battery 3 in the 3 battery setup or to the positive of the primary in the single battery setup. In ZERO diagrams have I shown the output of the motor going to the boost converter.

There are SONE diagrams that show a SECOND boost converter running directly off battery 3, but that’s s whole different story.

[wantomake]

Email

Dave I sent you an email about the 3BGS diagram. Did you receive it?

wantomake

[Turion]

E mail

No. I didn’t get an email from you.

[wantomake]

Resent

Sorry I resent the email. IPhone doesn't send email sometimes.

[Turion]

Circuits

Here are the two circuits I am working with.

[wantomake]

Circuits

Thanks Dave,
Now I see what you referred to in the first email.

Time to think over nuked cup of coffee.
wantomake

[bistander]

Pulse

Here are the two circuits I am working with.

That battery is being charged by the motor running current. The magic pulse from the Matt modded motor is supposed to go to the source battery, isn't it?

A diagram would help.

Thanks.


3BGS with BOOST CONVERTER

So the current flows out of the converter output + into the motor +. Then it flows out of motor - into battery C +. Current will flow from battery C - into battery B -. Because current flows from + to - inside battery C, it charges battery C.

The magic pulse from the Matt modded motor flows the opposite way, out of the motor + into the + source terminal, which is usually a battery which will accept the pulse. However in this case, the motor + is connected to converter output +. There is a diode inside the converter which blocks current from flowing in this direction. The result is that this pulse never reaches the source battery (B) but instead increases the converter output capacitor charge, which is inconsequential.

bi

[Turion]

Charging

I'm so glad that you know everything about how this system works.

[bistander]

You're welcome

I'm so glad that you know everything about how this system works.

It is just circuit analysis.

[Turion]

Analysis

Unfortunately, your analysis is incorrect. You have already stated that both current and voltage go from the motor to battery 3. Because this is a PULSE motor with a mechanically built in off and on time, the 3rd battery receives a PULSE of current and voltage from the motor. Since the boost module sets the voltage, what is hitting battery 3 is two volts higher than the battery standing voltage at whatever current comes out of the motor. THAT is the “magic pulse” the third battery gets, just like it would from a store bought battery charger.


The boost module does NOT eliminate this effect as you claim. If you don’t even understand how this system works, how can you “claim” that it doesn’t do what we say it does? Because SOME of the energy sent into the motor is NOT consumed by the motor, but passed right THRIUGH it to the 3rd battery, charging it, you can get extended run times from this setup by rotating the batteries. PERIOD

As for your statement that this is insignificant because you can’t run your house on this system. You are correct. You cannot. We never said you could. We gave this away to get people to think outside the box and understand some basic principles of operation. Those principles CAN be used to build a system that WILL run your house if you really understand what is going on with this basic system. We have talked about ALL the needed components for that system on this and the basic free energy device thread. And that’s all we are giving away.