Aquaponics Getting started.

[Savvypro]

@Ash

I posted the following in another thread, but thought I'd add it here as it has some relevant and useful points:

The mixing of the plants is called companion planting - as stated you can use:


As well as Garlic and Onions.

Another benefit of the plant mixing is that not all plants are equal in photosynthesis efficiency. Not all plants like direct sun light, as some prefer shade over direct sun light. Then you have to solar saturation limit where the plants will stop photosynthesis by about mid day - if they don't have shade cover.

If anyone has seen the David Blume “Alcohol can be a gas" videos, from min 29:30 to the 1 hour mark (of the following one), he covers a lot of what plants actually do - and it's a real eye opener.

David Blume "Alcohol Can Be A Gas"

The time frame that I give for the linked video, has a lot of very important information - that you may want to add to your open source video. Hell that whole video is gold in-terms of what plants actually do.

[clueless]

Savvypro I spent most of the day

on that link. I got caught up in the alcohol as gas aspect of it as approaching senior status I have a decent understanding of a still and making moonshine. I think if the SHTF ever hits for an extended time, food and energy will be at the top of the list.
So I ought to knock a knot on your head ( just kidding) for a day spent tracking down a lot of interesting stuff when I have other things planned.
-Clueless

@Ash

I posted the following in another thread, but thought I'd add it here as it has some relevant and useful points:



The time frame that I give for the linked video, has a lot of very important information - that you may want to add to your open source video. Hell that whole video is gold in-terms of what plants actually do.

[Savvypro]

on that link. I got caught up in the alcohol as gas aspect of it as approaching senior status I have a decent understanding of a still and making moonshine. I think if the SHTF ever hits for an extended time, food and energy will be at the top of the list.
So I ought to knock a knot on your head ( just kidding) for a day spent tracking down a lot of interesting stuff when I have other things planned.
-Clueless

Well, I don't know what to say to that - apart from: I'm armed with information and I'm not afraid to use it.

If you learnt anything new or useful from the video, then it's time well spent.
Also David Blume did mention that he had a book which covers everything he talks about. It's at: http://www.permaculture.com

[clueless]

Savvypro it is not like I have never been sidetracked

before.
I've had to teach myself medicine and alternatives to traditional modialities or I'm afraid I'd be pushing up daiseys now. In the end, I think through divine inspiration, I created a new diet that has worked for me.
I'm now working on acquiring knowledge on food and energy production. David Blume did/does cover both pretty well, though I like his Alcohol As A Gas thoughts.
What was interesting to me was that the by-product in making ethanol from corn is a better feed for livestock. I'm toying with the idea of applying for a alcohol as a fuel permit as it seems a perfect match for farmers;better feed and cheaper fuel.
But I don't want to derail this thread as I'm really interested in aquaphonics as well and combining that with permaculture methods seems to be a way to grow a lot of safe and nutritious food in a limited space. Make no mistake about it all factory farming methods whether they are plant or animal absorb too many chemicals and additives and it is in our best interests to provide at least some of our food and fuel that we use.
But I did learn alot from that link.
Thanks
-Clueless

[Savvypro]

before.
I've had to teach myself medicine and alternatives to traditional modialities or I'm afraid I'd be pushing up daiseys now. In the end, I think through divine inspiration, I created a new diet that has worked for me.
I'm now working on acquiring knowledge on food and energy production. David Blume did/does cover both pretty well, though I like his Alcohol As A Gas thoughts.
What was interesting to me was that the by-product in making ethanol from corn is a better feed for livestock. I'm toying with the idea of applying for a alcohol as a fuel permit as it seems a perfect match for farmers;better feed and cheaper fuel.
But I don't want to derail this thread as I'm really interested in aquaphonics as well and combining that with permaculture methods seems to be a way to grow a lot of safe and nutritious food in a limited space. Make no mistake about it all factory farming methods whether they are plant or animal absorb too many chemicals and additives and it is in our best interests to provide at least some of our food and fuel that we use.
But I did learn alot from that link.
Thanks
-Clueless

I'm sorry, but I can't call you clueless, as based on what you've written - you are more clued up, than clueless.

There is another video that I've seen of David Blume, where he covers using the corn/ethanol by-product as a fertiliser. That one is another eye opener.

If you were to grow 1 acer of corn then process it for ethanol, the by-product would when spread on the field to grow next years corn. It would result in 10% more than required. The process basically removes oil, artificial fertilisers (and pesticides - if I remember correctly, as the by-product when combined with the microbes in the ground actually produce healthier crops) from farming. You'd produce your energy crop (corn), process it for ethanol, and end up with the fertiliser for next years crop plus 10% extra.

Anyway, if your interested in growing stuff in small spaces, keep an eye on my algae thread.

[clueless]

I use clueless as a reminder.

Locally I've been called Bullwinkle, from the Rocky and Bullwinkle show. Bullwinkle is "Mr Know It All." I've also been called "Wile E Coyote" of Roadrunner fame who is sometimes know as "Resident Genius." I sometimes use RG signing of. The Clueless name is a reminder and internally poking fun at myself to listen more as I can be an opinionated jack a@%.
I will check out the algae thread.
Thanks
-RG

[clueless]

A question about collecting water

for aquaponics. Getting an aquaponics setup going is on my to do list but along that same thought is conserving as much energy as possible. It is likely in the future that disruptions in the supply chain, food, fuel, electricity, etc., can happen at any time and/or inflation could have a similar effect.
If that happens and you don't have a backup energy source then I'm certain your system dies. And the plants and fish with it.
Or if you do have some power backup it probably won't be sufficent for all your needs.
So I got to thinking could you set up a rainwater collection system for the aquaponics. Something like a 10' tarp suspended like a funnel above a container and catching the rain in it. I think a 10 square foot tarp yields 6 gallons with an inch of rain. Could that captured water then be used to gravity feed the system and eliminate a pump and provide backup water also? For the aquaponics system.
And if it could work how large should the catchment area be to work effectively.
As I say it may not work but I would like to get you all thoughts on it. Has anyone done this?
Thanks

[Savvypro]

Off the top of my head:

I know of a melon farm in Malaysia (if memory serves), which only uses rain water - collected off of their Polly tunnels. They ship 25,000 melons a week, so their not a back yard operation.

The thing that I would do to the rain water, is to pass it through at least a Zeolite filter possibly through a RO unit. So as to remove the radioactive particles. Storing the water for a bit before use would deal with some of the short half life particles, but it won’t for those with half life's measured in 1,000’s of years - thus the need for Zeolite and the RO unit.

On the power issue, gravity is our friend - so it’s best to design the system for the least amount of lifting points. That way water is lifted to the highest point and then it spread out as it goes down. Back up pumps, wind generator, some solar panels plus Nickel Iron batteries (see the Edison battery thread) should do the trick.

And if all else fails, a peddle power generator for the power generation.

And if it gets really bad - you and a bucket plus a step ladder or a hand pump. For this last idea to work, it would require a aquaponics setup with a single high point - which distributes to the whole of the system. So that your moving water to one point and not having to fill multiple points.

[theremart]

Conserving energy.

There is a book I have found "How to grow fish in the Mountains"

How to Grow Fish in the Mountains


It is not for aquaponics, but... this guy grew fish in ponds with algae. This system used no pumps whatever, but used the algae to supply the oxygen for the fish.

I was thinking that on a large scale this would be ideal in countries that you can't get electricity to where you are. Then you could pull out manually water for your plants.

for aquaponics. Getting an aquaponics setup going is on my to do list but along that same thought is conserving as much energy as possible. It is likely in the future that disruptions in the supply chain, food, fuel, electricity, etc., can happen at any time and/or inflation could have a similar effect.
If that happens and you don't have a backup energy source then I'm certain your system dies. And the plants and fish with it.
Or if you do have some power backup it probably won't be sufficent for all your needs.
So I got to thinking could you set up a rainwater collection system for the aquaponics. Something like a 10' tarp suspended like a funnel above a container and catching the rain in it. I think a 10 square foot tarp yields 6 gallons with an inch of rain. Could that captured water then be used to gravity feed the system and eliminate a pump and provide backup water also? For the aquaponics system.
And if it could work how large should the catchment area be to work effectively.
As I say it may not work but I would like to get you all thoughts on it. Has anyone done this?
Thanks

[Savvypro]

There is a book I have found "How to grow fish in the Mountains"

How to Grow Fish in the Mountains


It is not for aquaponics, but... this guy grew fish in ponds with algae. This system used no pumps whatever, but used the algae to supply the oxygen for the fish.

I was thinking that on a large scale this would be ideal in countries that you can't get electricity to where you are. Then you could pull out manually water for your plants.

Do you have any more info on how it was done?

I've looked at ordering the book ($5 is cheap) but the shipping cost to me puts the book at $85.

[theremart]

Very cool video, Don't know much about these guys.

YouTube - ‪Farmin' in the HOOD!‬‏


But I think they may be on to something.

[Savvypro]

The methane production is a nice touch to the system.
Although I would add more solar heat collection systems (basically 55 gallon oil drums painted black and filled with water, plus a large insulated water tank for thermal mass storage). I know they have the fish tanks, but you don't really want to store the heat in the water the fish live in (which could get up to 60 °C). Oh and lots of insulation especially in areas which get very cold or and snow).

But apart from that, that’s almost how I envisioned my ideal setup. Since then it’s changed quite a bit. I’d add Spirulina production and a few other things, which would make it more of an eco system.

[theremart]

Fighting damage to the squash,

‪Video 117 Help! Plants dying, not sure why. Also some good progress with some plants‬‏ - YouTube

Aquaponics still going strong.

Slowy getting nitrogen fixing plants going.

cheers

[theremart]

Testing the water..

From back on 11/27/10 my system tested as

Nitrite >1
Nitrate 50 - 250
Ammonia 25

-------------------

Today 8/6/2011

My test results

PH 6.9
ORP 150
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 0
Ammonia 0

I am guessing the plants are taking all the nutrients out of the system, so my alternatives seem to be to add more fish to boost the nitrates, or feed the fish more.

Fish have been in for several months and are doing fine. My plants are not as green as they should be, so I need to make adjustments.

Fish food has been,

Peas + shrimp + garlic + spirilina. which the fish love.

Video of testing:
‪118 Water testing and Kiwi.wmv‬‏ - YouTube

[Savvypro]

From back on 11/27/10 my system tested as

Nitrite >1
Nitrate 50 - 250
Ammonia 25

-------------------

Today 8/6/2011

My test results

PH 6.9
ORP 150
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 0
Ammonia 0

I am guessing the plants are taking all the nutrients out of the system, so my alternatives seem to be to add more fish to boost the nitrates, or feed the fish more.

Fish have been in for several months and are doing fine. My plants are not as green as they should be, so I need to make adjustments.

Fish food has been,

Peas + shrimp + garlic + spirilina. which the fish love.

Video of testing:
‪118 Water testing and Kiwi.wmv‬‏ - YouTube

Not all "tests" are created equal. The liquid tests are better than the powder/tablet ones. Some salt/marine tests can only be used on salt water, while others which say salt water are not picky and can be used on fresh water.

One the tests results: once a system has been cycled, Ammonia and Nitrite should always show 0 - unless you change the load by adding more fish. Once the system is cycled, most people only test for Nitrate and only test for Ammonia and Nitrite, when there is something wrong or when they add to the load.