COP 17 Heater | Rosemary Ainslie

[witsend]

Hi Mike - I noticed your question here since last night and simply don't know the answer. How does one progress this system to higher values as needed?

As I see it the problems are to do with those RF frequencies - the same things that prevent you filming the circuit. As I remember it the actual noise pollution - on higher ac applications (from utility supplies) is extreme. Not sure if these can be muffled or how one does it.

But I wonder if Fuzzy's solution is perhaps the best. I think he suggested that batteries in series with a plug would allow one a chance to exploit the spike. And I'm also not sure if capacitors enable the effect or frustrate it. So. This is the new ground that you guys will need to forge. But, for now, I do see a really neat little circuit to extend the life of your average torch - and - with some neat circuitry - it may be possible to keep the car battery rechaged - in that awful event that one leaves on the car lights. I know I've done this too often to be recalled - and I've got one of those alarms that warn me they're on! But one of the most obvious advantages are to the geyser or hot water cylinder application as it's called in the States. Here there would be an immediate advantage and it goes back to your STEAP designs.

I was intrigued with your two resistor arrangement. It's innovative and neat. But how about this? design the cylinder around a hollow tube in its centre - and then insert a really long resistor through that tube to get a quick dispersion of the heat into the water. Then switch the energy to that resistor but put batteries in series with the plug and the resistor in series with the battery and its switch. That way the draw down from the plug should be reduced to 'topping' the battery - when and as required.

That way research can be confined to the optimised cylinder design coupled to the optimised resistor design. But you'll still need to experiment on the resistor and the type of windings. At the risk of getting overly technical - I'd recommend that you keep the resistive wire 'thick' - LOL.

That's the best I can suggest but I'll keep thinking about applications. Get some hefty wattages and we'll definitely start making inroads, and, hopefully, you guys can start getting some returns for your hard work here.

[witsend]

Also, by the way, I think that LED's are pretty well inured to those spikes so on LED systems we can get super efficiency? I'm open to correction here guys, but if so - then batteries in series with utility plug points, lights in series with batteries - inductor of sorts in series with the lights - switching system applied in series with the inductors - and then the lights replaced with LED numbers? May work but will also need an inductor introduced to induce those fields.

[witsend]

Guys - am doing some shameless spamming here but I think Fuzzy' publication merits it and I'd quite like this on each page - until Fuzzy withdraws it - as required.

Open Source Evaluation of Power Transients Generated to Improve Performance Coefficient of Resistive Heating Systems


Thank you Fuzzy, Harvey, Andrew, Donny, Steve and last but by no means least Ashtweth - FOR ALL THIS HARD WORK.

[Harvey]

Now I need some advice on the charge return. The last experiment was with a cap in series with the positive to the battery, is this good or is there a better way. My concern is the battery will not like this over a long period, it is very high voltage (100's volts)

Mike

The gaps on the battery plates are not able to withstand High Voltages without arcing across. There is a real danger that the gas area above the plates will ionize and provide a path for the voltage to reach back to the negative terminal. This is especially true when the electrolyte drops below the tops of the plates. This can be an explosive situation and needs to be addressed carefully. Check with the battery manufacturer for the maximum allowable charge voltage and stay under that value at the terminal. We don't want to turn the battery into an internal combustion engine with built in spark plugs.

Likewise, there is a maximum current that the plates can endure without heating and warping. So that too must be properly addressed.

Consider if too much energy is present on the recharge cycle, perhaps we need to apply it to do work in some beneficial way. A lamp, in series with it for that half of the cycle only, may drop the voltage to an acceptable level while keeping the current active for the necessary oscillation.

It certainly is intriguing to see the versatility of this technical application.

[Michael John Nunnerley]

converting high voltage

Hi Harvey and all

How can we convert high voltage low current into a lower voltage higher current.

I am able to run a 35v dc motor on the output that I am getting and have thought of using this to power a generator but it would be more practical if we had an electronic solution to this.

A bank of batteries in series is a thought but that would increase the power in the circuit if all were used to the input. Or we could use just two as the input and recharge four which would be a better solution.

As I am more of a hobbyist in electronics, I need to ask this question, high voltage put across a suitable resistance will drop the voltage in leu of increasing amperage, right or wrong?

Mike

[Groundloop]

Michael John Nunnerley,

Just change your output transformer to give out approx. 15 volt
instead of 230 volt.

Alex.

[gyula]

Hi Harvey and all

How can we convert high voltage low current into a lower voltage higher current.

I am able to run a 35v dc motor on the output that I am getting and have thought of using this to power a generator but it would be more practical if we had an electronic solution to this.

A bank of batteries in series is a thought but that would increase the power in the circuit if all were used to the input. Or we could use just two as the input and recharge four which would be a better solution.

As I am more of a hobbyist in electronics, I need to ask this question, high voltage put across a suitable resistance will drop the voltage in leu of increasing amperage, right or wrong?

Mike

Hi Mike,

On your first question, to convert HV low current to LV high current, the first answer is to use an appropiate transformer (you have 4.3 kHz output, right?).
Here the convertion efficiency can be around 90-93% minimum, using good core material for the transformer.
Another possibility is using active AC/DC or AC/AC converters that take your AC input and convert it to lower voltage output, to either AC or DC output.
Efficiency can also be around or over 90%.
There are many circuits on AC/DC DC/DC etc converters on the web, I am not an expert in building such but aware of IC manufacturers like Linear Technology, Maxim, Texas Instruments etc who sells such ICs, with many applications.
IF you think it over, a normal television set includes such a power supply that receives the 230-240V AC mains input, and converts it to much lower DC power as the set needs, so it is an AC/DC converter if you like.

On your last question: No, the high voltage will dissipate on your resistance (not sure what you really mean here, a high wattage resistor?) and the current will be dictated by normal Ohm's law.

The best way is to use a switch mode power supply if you want to maintain high efficiency, a switch mode power supply basically an AC/DC converter or a DC/DC converter if you use a diode bridge with a puffer capacitor to full wave rectify your AC output, then feed the DC/DC converter.
As the simplest (passive) solution, consider testing a transformer. You can find suitable ferrite core in older CRT television sets to wind for your needs, they work around 15.6kHz and surely handle around 30-40W power.

rgds, Gyula

EDIT: just noticed Alex excellent suggestion on reducing your present output coil number of turns, I agree!

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Hi Mike,

On your first question, to convert HV low current to LV high current, the first answer is to use an appropiate transformer (you have 4.3 kHz output, right?).
Here the convertion efficiency can be around 90-93% minimum, using good core material for the transformer.
Another possibility is using active AC/DC or AC/AC converters that take your AC input and convert it to lower voltage output, to either AC or DC output.
Efficiency can also be around or over 90%.
There are many circuits on AC/DC DC/DC etc converters on the web, I am not an expert in building such but aware of IC manufacturers like Linear Technology, Maxim, Texas Instruments etc who sells such ICs, with many applications.
IF you think it over, a normal television set includes such a power supply that receives the 230-240V AC mains input, and converts it to much lower DC power as the set needs, so it is an AC/DC converter if you like.

On your last question: No, the high voltage will dissipate on your resistance (not sure what you really mean here, a high wattage resistor?) and the current will be dictated by normal Ohm's law.

The best way is to use a switch mode power supply if you want to maintain high efficiency, a switch mode power supply basically an AC/DC converter or a DC/DC converter if you use a diode bridge with a puffer capacitor to full wave rectify your AC output, then feed the DC/DC converter.
As the simplest (passive) solution, consider testing a transformer. You can find suitable ferrite core in older CRT television sets to wind for your needs, they work around 15.6kHz and surely handle around 30-40W power.

rgds, Gyula

EDIT: just noticed Alex excellent suggestion on reducing your present output coil number of turns, I agree!

Hi Gyula and Alex

Much appreciated the input, I was thinking much the same on the transformer but I do not know if it will affect the gain as I believe that part of the gain may be in the high voltage around those coils of the transformer, we can but try and see what happens



Mike

[gyula]

Hi Mike,

If your present output transformer has still got enough room for winding into its central column some turns of heavier wire, you could test loading that new low voltage output and see how it behaves.

Gyula

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Luc

Hi Luc

Your link does not work

Mike

[gotoluc]

You need to be logged into youtube for it to work. That is what they say anyways.

Luc

[witsend]

You need to be logged into youtube for it to work. That is what they say anyways.

Luc

Luc, Is there a another video here? If so, would be very glad of a link if you'd oblige?



OK Luc. sorry. Didn't realise.

[gotoluc]

Luc, Is there a another video here? If so, would be very glad of a link if you'd oblige?

Hi Rosemary,

I made a video of my replication of Michael's circuit. However, I'm not getting the effect Michael is.

I want him to visually view what I have done to see if he can pickup something that maybe is not correct.

In order not to confuse the many viewer that look at my videos, I made the video private.

Luc

[Michael John Nunnerley]

no joy

Luc, send it over on skype

Mike

[Michael John Nunnerley]

untill I can see the video

Hi luc

Assuming that the circuit is connected right, what are you using to switch the mosfet, is it your signal generator? if so can you tune it so as you are getting multiple harmonics in the phasing coil? if not it may be that the duty cycle is the problem. With my PWM I have variable duty cycle and I do not think at any time it is at 50%, much less, as in the off time there is set up a resonance between the power coil (transformer) and the phasing coil with the cap, as many sometimes as 20 of various amplitudes.

If you are using a signal generator change it for a simple 555 like Rosemary's and play around with the duty. If you are using the MO coils, put a ferrite rod in the middle of the secoundary and a neon across the secoundary coil as a tuning aid. When you have the resonance point the neon will be very bright, it will measure well over 1000v, I have had near 1500v and you would think that the neon would explode.

Hope tomorrow with luck to do that video with a borrowed camera which seems ok with the circuit.

Mike