COP 17 Heater | Rosemary Ainslie | Part 2

[sucahyo]

@sucahyo: Zoomed in at the requested area.

Thanks for that .

[witsend]

Bart, I'm copying this over from my thesis thread because I know you don't read there. But I think you may find this less offensive because it's simply a variation to the co-valence bonding per mainstream but, in this instance, attributed to those 'zipons'. You don't have to 'buy in'. What I'm trying to do here is show you that there is a 'recharge' moment. You've seen it for yourself when the battery voltage momentarily 'went up'. That is not typical of battery performance under 'load' conditions. Glen logged a steady climb over an extended period. So did Aaron. And so did I. This means, at its least, that there is energy being returned to re-establish the ionised condition of the electrolyte. But this 'muscle' is only given to the circuit when the circuit components find their own resonating frequency. Horowitz refers to it as an aperiodic oscillating frequency - ofen seen in applications - but as often systematically overridden in the interests of imposing a required frequency. It's text book material. A fairly well known phenomenon. It's just that we need to encourage it to manifest rather than mainstream's object of 'killing' it on sight. LOL.

Here's the post.

Ok. Batteries vary - one from another. Each manufacturer uses his own variety of trace elements in the electrodes to increase the plate's efficiencies. There's no hard and fast rule. But assuming that we are talking about your average lead acid battery - then the mix - very broadly, is plates of lead, lead dioxide with a mix of sulphuric acid used as an electrolyte. Now. The sulphur bonds with the lead, and systematically during discharge the electrolyte mixture turns to pure water as the sulphur is systematically leached out of the electrolyte mix.

The zipon thesis proposes that the bonding of those electrolytes - that sulphuric acid is managed by zipons. The atomic mix - the base - is acidic - indicating that it has an imbalanced valence condition in the atoms. Then those atoms have been further bonded into molecules which, in the case of sulphuric acid would be two hydrogen atoms to four sulphur atoms. The thesis proposes that the molecules are actually bonded by these extraneous fields of zipons. The acid state indicates an imbalanced valence condition. Therefore the bonding zipon fields share that same imbalance. There are too many 'like spins' in the bonding zipon fields. Just imagine this as fields all spinning clockwise. What's needed for balance is that half the fields spin anticlockwise. Zipons always move to generate a balance. That's an immutable imperative.

By separating from the molecular bond the zipons are able to move the sulphur atom towards the elctrode. This 'breaks' the symmetry of that molecular orbit. The zipons that belong to the sulphur, then attach the suphur atom to that lead. This forms another molecule - not sure what it is but may be lead sulphate or somesuch. You'll know. Now the hydrogen atoms are unbonded from the sulphur. But the hydrogen also has it's fields of binding zipons. These are released through the electrolyte in bubbles which gravitate towards the terminals of the battery. Now it needs to incorporate the hydrogen back into the mix as this is essentially trapped within the structure of the battery. Now the zipons break their symmetries - that bonding condition holding those hydrogen atoms - they line up head to toe at the postive terminal and simply move - lickety split - through the circuit - generating that current flow. They then represent at the negative terminal, re-enter the electrolyte base and rebond the hydrogen - this time with the water in the base, thereby forming hard water. Net result - a complete neutralisation of the previously acidic condition of the electrolyte.

Now reverse that current flow and the previously acidic condition is re-established. That reversal is organised by the introduction of new fields of potential energy - this time generated from the material of the resistor. Here the symmetries are broken that half the fields are routed anticlockwise through the circuit. This is reverse current flow. That reverse path also feeds through the battery. In its passage through the battery the previous condition is simply reversed and the sulphuric acid is reconstituded.
Does that make it clear. LOL. I live in hope here Suchayo.

EDITED. COLOUR EMPHASIS

[witsend]

So. Again. You need to 'look for' that self-resonance. It's there. But it definitely is an elusive moment. That's why it's referred to as 'a learned' process - in the paper. Frankly, if it was readily seen then I also suspect that it's benefits would have been widely chronicled.

But do have fun with it Bart. It's possibly frustrating not getting it first off - but nor did any of us. We all went through that learning curve. Mine just took years longer than Aaron or Glen. And I just kept looking because I had a shrewd idea that it was there.

[b4FreeEnergy]

Reorganizing my troops

I took a day off today to reorganize my troops and to prepare for the next attack on this self-oscillation thing… I wonder which of the parameters are really critical. Is it the length of the wires to the batteries, the resistance value, the inductance of the resistor, something about the 555 output stage, the potentiometers? I hope it’s not all of them together. The connection to my batteries is not soldered but done with a special ‘clip’, not a crocodile. Would that be enough to have no oscillation? I find that hard to believe but of course it is possible. I will solder them tomorrow.

Is the diameter of the resistor windings critical? I only have 29mm at this moment. The good thing is I have a second glass cylinder on its way so I can make a second resistor with this time a diameter of 40mm. Is that 10 Ohm critical? Does it matter if it would be 14 Ohms (which it is now)?
Mmmh, way too much uncertainties at this moment …

Cheers,
B

[witsend]

I took a day off today to reorganize my troops and to prepare for the next attack on this self-oscillation thing… I wonder which of the parameters are really critical. Is it the length of the wires to the batteries, the resistance value, the inductance of the resistor, something about the 555 output stage, the potentiometers? I hope it’s not all of them together. The connection to my batteries is not soldered but done with a special ‘clip’, not a crocodile. Would that be enough to have no oscillation? I find that hard to believe but of course it is possible. I will solder them tomorrow.

Is the diameter of the resistor windings critical? I only have 29mm at this moment. The good thing is I have a second glass cylinder on its way so I can make a second resistor with this time a diameter of 40mm. Is that 10 Ohm critical? Does it matter if it would be 14 Ohms (which it is now)?
Mmmh, way too much uncertainties at this moment …

Cheers,
B

Hi Bart

Frankly I don't think any of those parameters you listed should prevent that 'self-oscillation'. It's always there - regardless. That 'aperiodic oscillation' is a given. It's doable. It's only that the 'fine tuning' is needed to realise or optimise the benefits. I spent long hours on Skype with Glen. In the end he found the moment himself - and having found it, could tune in with ease. Patience Bart. But I'm concerned that you're not getting there. I think Ash et al may have had or are also having difficulties here. Perhaps he could comment? Have you reduced the 'gate' resistance? That much is critical. But technically and in fact, the resonance should be realisable at multiple frequencies. It simply always simply defaults to it's own required resonance when that 'pump' action gets going.

I should have the Skype computer back by the weekend. Here's hoping.

[witsend]

Guys,

I see this thread winding down to a natural conclusion - and that's a good thing. The fact is that these effects are now known. What's needed is the applications. And I think that's where the actual progress will be established - together with a whole new set of 'things to learn'. It's technology in its infancy. Given the turbulence of this thread and the entire topic - I think it may be as well to start a new thread but I'll give it some thought and ask around.

Tomorrow is my first meeting on campus. I'm to see the lab and meet the students and academics who will be 'on board'. The hope is to find out time constraints, and priorities and - more to the point - the skills and talents that will be 'on board'. Very exciting for me. Then I hope to start getting the components assembled soon thereafter. With luck we should be able to get some loose assembly for testing towards the end of next week around the 25h of the month. It means my time will be more constrained - but I'll be posting here on results - as and when they're available. I'll also make a point of getting photos up - but my one computer is 'down' at the moment. Hopefully it'll be up as I need it for my photobucket and video shots.

Certainly I'll keep you all posted, for those that may yet be interested.

This is a significant chapter starting here. Very much a first. I've been knocking at the campus doors for over a decade. Once this application is 'in the bag' then I do not anticipate any significant hold ups for this technology. Let's hope that the progress is quick. It's being funded by all the players here - one way or another - but we could not have initiated this without our 'benefactor' so some hearthfelt gratitude owing here.

[witsend]

Bart, My computer will be up and running by the end of the day. I'll pm you on my skype address.

[witsend]

Hi Bart. My computers up. Check your pm.s

[witsend]

Guys,

Very constructive discussion with our learned and revered. But a minor modification in plans.

We're rethinking the test parameters to get around the transistor. Here's what's proposed. That we heat 5 Ml of water in a miniature version of our hot water cylinder - to be made of copper but with some design modifications which I'll show. The object being to get the water to boil. We'll also need to modify the resistor design. I'll show this as well when it's built. If we get the water to boiling with commesurate gains then we'll have all the motivation required to get the correct transistor tailored. But this time the design will be especially tailored so that the scaling will be feasible. But right now there's concensus that the lack of an appropriate resistor will possibly 'kill' the effectiveness of the project. This is one way around it.

It makes sense.

I'll post more on this tomorrow. I need to find out from our boiler manufacturer that he can build at this scale. I'm sure it's doable.

[b4FreeEnergy]

Hi Bart. My computers up. Check your pm.s

Ok got it.
Cheers,
B

[witsend]

Guys, Bart, all, I'm just practising. My first picture. This is the proposed proton.

[Kindred]

Hi R. So nice to be able to pick up on your progress again. And no arguments or vicious slanging that was the order of the day last time I checked in. Best of luck to all of you - great work.

Peter

[witsend]

Hi R. So nice to be able to pick up on your progress again. And no arguments or vicious slanging that was the order of the day last time I checked in. Best of luck to all of you - great work.

Peter

Thanks Peter Petes, (have I got that right?)
Long may it last. I think we owe this to our moderators. And indeed - there's some healthy progress. Welcome to the forum and to the thread. I see it's a maiden post. Always welcome.

[b4FreeEnergy]

Few questions from the field

A little question about the 555 timer circuit. I’m trying to have that special ‘oscillation’ reproduced on my setup and while measuring I noticed that the 110R resistor gets rather hot. Is this intentional? Is there a special reason for having a rather high current through the setup circuits for the 555?

If you put the 2K pot-meter to zero Ohms for minimum on-time while having the 10K pot-meter to maximum resistance for maximum off-time it’s normal for that 110 Ohms resistor to get hot. Pin 7 of the 555 is pulled low by an internal transistor if its output is high. This way the current through the 110R is 109mA. The dissipation will be close to 1.3W (The duty-cycle not taken into account, on average it’s a little less in fact)

Anyway the struggle continues, any remarks and or tips are welcome.

Best regards,
B

[witsend]

A little question about the 555 timer circuit. I’m trying to have that special ‘oscillation’ reproduced on my setup and while measuring I noticed that the 110R resistor gets rather hot. Is this intentional? Is there a special reason for having a rather high current through the setup circuits for the 555?

If you put the 2K pot-meter to zero Ohms for minimum on-time while having the 10K pot-meter to maximum resistance for maximum off-time it’s normal for that 110 Ohms resistor to get hot. Pin 7 of the 555 is pulled low by an internal transistor if its output is high. This way the current through the 110R is 109mA. The dissipation will be close to 1.3W (The duty-cycle not taken into account, on average it’s a little less in fact)

Anyway the struggle continues, any remarks and or tips are welcome.

Best regards,
B

Hi Bart - I can't comment on that resistor. I don't think Glen reads here and I also think he's probably the only one who can explain why he used this resistor at all. I believe you're allowed to post on their thread? You may want to ask him there - directly.

I was sort of looking anxiously for results last night. I get it you're still struggling to get that into oscillation mode? I'm concerned that there may, yet again, be some flaw in the representation of the switching design. It seems contagious. The concern is compounded because I understand that that Ash et al used that same circuit switching design. Maybe the cause for their difficulties also. But Aaron romped into the aperiodicity and I actually think he'd be your best guide with this. He also, very definitely, used his own switching circuit. Try and message him? I'll see if I can send him an email.

If I can give advice it's this. Use your own switch - power it off it's own battery - and try those same test on a 12 volt battery supply. We only used 24 volts for that definitive test because it enhanced the heat and that was a reliable measurement's guide.

I know you can get it into that collapsed waveform because I've seen you do it. That's where the switch defaulted to about 50% on/off. But there's definitely too much energy delivered - too much voltage above zero across the shunt. And way too little heat on the load. My instincts are this. You could start with lower battery supply voltage (12) - power your switch with the other - then adjust your on cycle at a slower, much slower frequency. That way you should be able to get more voltage / heat onto your load. If and when it goes into that 'collapsed' mode or that 'preferred oscillation mode' it naturally increases its frequency. In fact - it simply adjusts to its own resonating frequency and it overrides the applied duty cycle completely.

Sorry I can't be of more help. I will definitely be in again tonight if you need to discuss this. Meanwhile I'll try and email Aaron and see if he can help.