Bedini Pendulum

[amigo]

Anyone has plans/circuit schematic for it and how different is the circuit for the pendulum from the SSG one?

The pendulum appears to be pretty effective in charging batteries and much simpler to construct - no rotor, single magnet suspended from the swing, etc?

Thanks

[Aaron]

pendulum

I'm not sure of the exact circuit John used for that, but I have had 1 magnet on my bicycle wheel motor but the kick is so strong, it actually rotates all the way around. LOL. I'm not sure if John publicly disclosed any of the pendulum circuits.

[amigo]

Darn it does look interesting and he said that the pendulum works pretty well, it being just a single magnet driven by pulse and gravity.

[Aaron]

pendulum

I would start with the regular sg circuit but make the pendulum heavy enough so that it does not go "over the top" so that gravity will just pull it back down.

[Shamus]

If it is the regular SG circuit that John has setup there at the bottom of the pendulum, then it would probably charge several orders of magnitude slower than a regular monopole, no?

/me is still in load/charge testing mode...

[amigo]

If it is the regular SG circuit that John has setup there at the bottom of the pendulum, then it would probably charge several orders of magnitude slower than a regular monopole, no?

/me is still in load/charge testing mode...

You are right, I do not think it's a regular circuit. JB mentions balancing act between the batteries and there's a capacitor outside that black box that plays a role as well, so the search continues...

[Shamus]

This is a Tesla design, is it not? If so, then there has to be literature somewhere (either by Tesla or somebody near him) explaining how it works. I've seen the waveforms on the source side and collection side and it's all the same radiant spikes... It shouldn't be too difficult to figure out--I'm sure the switching is very similar to the monopole design.

[amigo]

This is a Tesla design, is it not? If so, then there has to be literature somewhere (either by Tesla or somebody near him) explaining how it works. I've seen the waveforms on the source side and collection side and it's all the same radiant spikes... It shouldn't be too difficult to figure out--I'm sure the switching is very similar to the monopole design.

Again you are most likely correct, just that I'm not an expert in theoretical (traditional) closed loop electronics, and this open loop stuff is driving me up the wall, too. I was always a hands-on type of a person, never cared much for theory...which is now biting me back in the a$$

[Shamus]

A little analysis

Perhaps thinking about what's seen and what's unseen and pondering what's been said about it would be useful. Here's what stood out to me:

He said that it's basically the same circuit as the SG, but slightly different because it (the circuit) wants to sit at zero (shades of Kron here!). He also said that it's a single wind on the coil since multi-strand performs worse than a single. He said that the motoring is eliminated since it relies on gravity. He also says that the charge rocks back and forth, that the higher the impedance on the back end the higher the pendulum goes, and finally, that the smaller versions work better than the larger ones.

What's seen and what isn't? On the front end, you have a dinky battery connecting to a BIG ol' capacitor which goes into the box. Also going into the box are the wires from the coil. Coming out the other end are a couple of wires that hook onto the charging side.

Now the big ol' capacitor tells me that we're trying to capture the radiant energy in it as it goes towards the front end when the pendulum swings a certain way. It's connected right across the two incoming power leads, which also says that the current draw on the front end is going to be minimal, since the radiant energy is going to fill up the cap and keep it filled. Some of that will spill into the front end battery as well.

On to the coil. It looks like a single wind, but closer examination reveals a much thinner wire going into the box on the bottom, which means bifilar trigger/power coil setup like the SG. Also, the wire is quite a bit bigger than #23. The waveform on the receiving end lends some clues here as well: You see the small trigger pulse followed by the radiant spike.

I wish I had more time to play with a setup like this. It's quite cool the way it charges, and it charges fast.

[amigo]

further to analysis

Interesting observations, though I am not sure why does the primary battery connects through the capacitor. there's no radiant energy in the primary circuit, is there (if primary just does triggering of the transistor)?

I thought that the capacitor gathers collects it on the secondary end and dumps it every now and then. You gather would that be a high capacity/low voltage (ie. 15,000uF/450V) or low capacity/high voltage (ie. 500uF/6000V) capacitor?

And that coil looks like it's 5" tall, one big mutha of a coil I wonder if that's 20 or 18 AWG there. I suppose it does not matter, if the whole setup is scalable.

He says that he has high impedance at the front and low impedance at the back? shows the front/primary voltage rocking and says all it's driving is the trigger. The impedance driven machine, same as SG circuit...only done in a pendulum.
But if batteries are flip-flopping as he says, and never equal each other because they are always zero in the center, that's not really the same as the SG circuit, is it? He even says that later, that it's a different circuit, just to add more to confusion, sigh.

Either way the whole setup is fascinating because it utilizes gravity and there are no rotors or bearings to worry about.

[Shamus]

A hypothesis

Since I have to do things with pictures in order to properly visualize what's going on in a setup like the pendulum, I thought I'd put this in. This could be completely wrong. It's difficult to chase down information on this sort of thing and I don't have a galvanometer lying around to actually do empirical testing, so YMMV.

At any rate, what I have pictured is a pendulum swing going in one direction and inducing a current. Now from what I understand, the direction of the magnet going past the coil determines the direction of current flow. Which means that when the magnet goes the opposite direction, the current flow and battery diagrams are reversed.

Which means that whatever is in the black box has to be able to deal with current going both ways in the trigger wire (the same thing happens in the power wire, but probably does nothing)--and could be the method by which the batteries are flip-flopped.

The actual electromagnet portion (power wire) would not have to care about which way the current is flowing in the trigger, since all it is concerned with is turning the power on long enough to 1), give the incoming magnet a kick in the direction it's going and 2), generate the radiant spike. A clue to this portion of the circuit is that the higher the impedance on the charging end, the higher it swings and thus the stronger the kick of the electromagnet. This means that there's a feedback mechanism at work on that part of the circuit.

That's all the ideas I have for now, feel free to pick it apart/point out inaccuracies.

[Shamus]

Experimental results

Ok, now I've actually had time to check out what happens when a magnet goes past a coil (rather than all the examples I've seen, where it passes in). I dug out my old analog multi-meter and hooked it up to the trigger wires and set the meter to the lowest scale it has, which is 10V. The deflections were small, but very clear in the directions they were going.

The picture below shows what happens when you move a magnet towards a coil and then away--basically it induces a current going one way as it approaches the center of the coil, then the current stops as the magnet hits the center of the coil. As the magnet moves away, it induces a current going the opposite way it was going as the magnet was approaching.

The implications are that this flip-flopping is happening very fast. That waveform is happening in a fraction of a second which, of course, is what causes the sharp gradient in the rest of the circuit. Which means that the circuit is sending radiant energy to both batteries almost simultaneously. An important clue here is that the trigger signal is only seen on the load side, though.

We'll figure this thing out yet.

[amigo]

...and I thought analog multi-meters are "old tech", I need to get me one just for times like this. JB is right when he said that most people have stopped experimenting because everything has been "discovered" and is taken for granted as empirically proven fact.

I haven't spent much time past few days on the pendulum case - I'm struggling to figure out best ways of winding tri- and more filar wires without losing my sanity (or feeling in my fingertips).

So we get a full wave from one pass, though isn't this the case with monopole motors as well, the magnets pass the coil in similar way?

I would suspect that the curve might actually look slightly different, the magnet moves towards the coil and induces current but when it hits the center it does not stop because I feel there's some lingering magnetic induction due to the imperfections of the cores we use - they do not demagnetize immediately. There might be a short platou then a straight dip across the X axis then another platou after which the curve continues in reverse. But that's all hypothetical, I could be theorizing all wrong.

[Shamus]

Yes, the monopole responds in a similar way, but because of the diode between the emitter and the base half of the wave does nothing.

I may have found some useful information WRT the pendulum. It seems that when John says it's just a SG circuit, he wasn't kidding. More to come once I know more...

[amigo]

That's good news. On my end I'm struggling to read many things at the same time and I feel I'm losing focus (or have already lost it).

I think I should first read through the FEG circuit book book just to make my thoughts coherent on the subject.