Solid State Bedini

[Sephiroth]

Hi Jetijs,


But how to run this circuit without any resistor between collector and base of transistor i.e. how to make it self start without resistor. Also please let me know, if i want to place a resistor between collector and base of each transistor then what should be value for the same and wattage.

Thanks in advance.

Regards

Praveen

I'm pretty sure the collector-base resistor is necessary for the circuit to self start/force oscillation. Though the best resistor to choose would be the highest resistance you can use and the device will still self start. even 20k ohms may work, so there will be very little energy leaked.

[pvar06]

Resistor

Hi,

Thanks for reply.

Yesterday late night I have used various resistors on one of the transistor. Following are the testing

1. 100 Ohm 2 watt resistor was heating up too much.

2. 100 Ohm 2 Watt and 180 Ohm 2 Watt placed in parallel. But this was taking power around 3.4 Amps. Also resistor was heating much.

3. 100 K 1/2 W resistor was not oscillating the coil.

4. Finally placed 1k 1/2 Watt [2 Nos] in parallel. With this circuit was oscillating and running cool.

But morning when i have checked the battery then the battery has not gone above 12.71 volts [the last reading was at 200 hrs in night which was 12.71 volts], So virtually there was not much change between 200 hrs to 900 hrs [Morning].

Do I need to place the resistor on each transistors used in the circuit or any one will be ok.

Tonight I will try other values like 10k, 20k etc.

Regards

Praveen

[Sephiroth]

Hi,

Thanks for reply.

Yesterday late night I have used various resistors on one of the transistor. Following are the testing

1. 100 Ohm 2 watt resistor was heating up too much.

2. 100 Ohm 2 Watt and 180 Ohm 2 Watt placed in parallel. But this was taking power around 3.4 Amps. Also resistor was heating much.

3. 100 K 1/2 W resistor was not oscillating the coil.

4. Finally placed 1k 1/2 Watt [2 Nos] in parallel. With this circuit was oscillating and running cool.

But morning when i have checked the battery then the battery has not gone above 12.71 volts [the last reading was at 200 hrs in night which was 12.71 volts], So virtually there was not much change between 200 hrs to 900 hrs [Morning].

Do I need to place the resistor on each transistors used in the circuit or any one will be ok.

Tonight I will try other values like 10k, 20k etc.

Regards

Praveen

only one resistor is required for the collector-base, though when using a multi transistor set up you would have a separate base resistor for each transistor (I normally use 100 ohms on each transistor). All the base resistors can be connected together in parallel, and then the collector-base resistor can be connected where the base resistors join together. This makes sure all the transistors are triggered evenly. Also, as you add more transistors, you will need to lower the value of the collector-base resistor to allow enough current through to trigger all the transistors. For example, if 20k worked well with a single transistor circuit, then you would use 10k on a double transistor circuit.

[pvar06]

Resistor and report

Hi Seph and all,

Thanks for your post.

I have tried various resistors on transistor. The 10k was not oscillating the coil, however 100ohm was getting overheated. So finally placed 500ohm (2 Nos 1k 1w resistor in parallel) on each transistor. So every thing is working fine and cool.

I have kept a bettery on this circuit. Today morning i have ocmpleted 33 hrs of charging. The battery voltage immidiately climbs upto the 13.99-14.05 volts (within 1 hours of charging). The details are as given below:

1. During charging time the battery voltage abserved in range of 13.99 to 14.05 volts.

2. When circuit is switched off then the battery voltage observed was 13.27 volts but constantly going down.

3. I have kept the battery for 30 minutes away from the circuit. The voltage dropped from 13.27 volts to 12.56 volts.

4. During the charging process seen lot of bubbles are coming out from the battery cells. Earlier the bubbles was big now they are becoming more finer (i think it is due to removal of sulphate layer from top edge of electrode plates). So this gives me satisfaction that atleast something is happening.

5. When I took the battery, it was completely dead. During that time i have seen lot of white deposit on top edge of the battery electrodes. Now after 33-34 hrs charging the quantity of white deposit is getting reduced.

6. During the charging I could not see any improvement in the gravity of the battery.

I dont know, what kind of charging is taking place. Have some little hope as the battery is bubbling and white layer is being removed. But concerned about no increase in the gravity.

Any ideas - What is happening inside the battery.

Regards

Praveen

[Sephiroth]

Hi Seph and all,

Thanks for your post.

I have tried various resistors on transistor. The 10k was not oscillating the coil, however 100ohm was getting overheated. So finally placed 500ohm (2 Nos 1k 1w resistor in parallel) on each transistor. So every thing is working fine and cool.

I have kept a bettery on this circuit. Today morning i have ocmpleted 33 hrs of charging. The battery voltage immidiately climbs upto the 13.99-14.05 volts (within 1 hours of charging). The details are as given below:

1. During charging time the battery voltage abserved in range of 13.99 to 14.05 volts.

2. When circuit is switched off then the battery voltage observed was 13.27 volts but constantly going down.

3. I have kept the battery for 30 minutes away from the circuit. The voltage dropped from 13.27 volts to 12.56 volts.

4. During the charging process seen lot of bubbles are coming out from the battery cells. Earlier the bubbles was big now they are becoming more finer (i think it is due to removal of sulphate layer from top edge of electrode plates). So this gives me satisfaction that atleast something is happening.

5. When I took the battery, it was completely dead. During that time i have seen lot of white deposit on top edge of the battery electrodes. Now after 33-34 hrs charging the quantity of white deposit is getting reduced.

6. During the charging I could not see any improvement in the gravity of the battery.

I dont know, what kind of charging is taking place. Have some little hope as the battery is bubbling and white layer is being removed. But concerned about no increase in the gravity.

Any ideas - What is happening inside the battery.

Regards

Praveen

Those are very big jumps in voltage. What size are your batteries and do you know the oscillator's amp draw?

[pvar06]

Hi Seph,

I am testing 12 Volt 35 Ah battery. For measuring the oscillator current draw I have installed a analog ampere meter in series at input side. This meter is constantly showing 2 Amps.

Regards

Praveen

[Sephiroth]

Hi Seph,

I am testing 12 Volt 35 Ah battery. For measuring the oscillator current draw I have installed a analog ampere meter in series at input side. This meter is constantly showing 2 Amps.

Regards

Praveen

That's a little high for a 35ah battery... if you were to use the C20 rate for the battery your max current draw should be 1.75 amps... I'm not criticizing it sounds like your oscillator is desulphating the battery nicely

[pvar06]

Hi Speh,

Actually there was no way in Jetijs circuit by which I can adjust the current draw to the circuit. So just running it as it is.

I am just hoping that the battery is getting desulpheted as lot of bubbles are coming out from the cells.

Regards

Praveen

[dambit]

Hi Speh,

Actually there was no way in Jetijs circuit by which I can adjust the current draw to the circuit. So just running it as it is.

I am just hoping that the battery is getting desulpheted as lot of bubbles are coming out from the cells.

Regards

Praveen

Sure there is, just use a variable resistor in place of a fixed one infront of the base. I do it all the time. This way I can adjust my charger for all battery sizes.

Make sure it is rated for enough wattage though.

Cheers Steve

[SkyWatcher]

Hi folks, I'm reading over this thread and I noticed Jetijs's circuit looks like a Joule Thief only without toroid. With my JT, the transistor gets way hotter than it should using only a darlington pair in this case, so thats why I'm using just a 555 to pulse my coils. Is Jetjs having this problem or maybe its because I'm using a bifilar with 18 gauge wire, which may be too much for the base of the transistor or the voltage aspect. And no raising base resistor only increases frequency and still gets darn hot. The 555 pulser is working great, though i would rather have a self oscillator that worked without overheating transistors. Any thoughts appreciated.
peace love light
Tyson

[theremart]

Adjusting the wattage

Sure there is, just use a variable resistor in place of a fixed one infront of the base. I do it all the time. This way I can adjust my charger for all battery sizes.

Make sure it is rated for enough wattage though.

Cheers Steve

Exactly Dambit.

I now have 10 transistors setup with the Jetijs setup, I have found heavy resistors out of old TV's that I match up depending on what I need. The only problem I have found with this setup is that I need to jump start it to get it going.

I am using about 120 watts of solar panels to feed the setup to charge my semi batteries. I use a large cap on the front of the setup to buffer for the clouds.

Again the Jetijs setup rocks it is a Joule Thief on steriods

[theremart]

RE: hot coils.

Hi folks, I'm reading over this thread and I noticed Jetijs's circuit looks like a Joule Thief only without toroid. With my JT, the transistor gets way hotter than it should using only a darlington pair in this case, so thats why I'm using just a 555 to pulse my coils. Is Jetjs having this problem or maybe its because I'm using a bifilar with 18 gauge wire, which may be too much for the base of the transistor or the voltage aspect. And no raising base resistor only increases frequency and still gets darn hot. The 555 pulser is working great, though i would rather have a self oscillator that worked without overheating transistors. Any thoughts appreciated.
peace love light
Tyson

I have this problem too. What I do is what I saw from John Bedini's setup is to simply wrap the coils in air not on a spool. If you are getting too much heat you are not using enough coil on the coil try taking two of your coils and hooking them up in series. You should find that it takes most of the heat out of the setup.

A trick I found handy is to use speaker wire in series it helps to curb most of the heat.

[SkyWatcher]

Hi theremart, thanks for reply. Do you mean air-core. Also you suggest upping the resistance of coil by making it longer, do you think my transistors peak amperage is being exceeded causing the transistor overheating, because the coils don't get hot, just the transistor. And when I run the same darlington pair on the 555 with the same coil the transistor does not get anywhere near the same temperature, that is why i think it has to do with the on-time pulse being too long or something and maybe that is why increasing the resistance of the coil is working for you. That is whats odd about this, is that even when increasing the base resistor, sure the amp draw goes down but the heat in the transistor is still fairly high in the heat sink. I mean if it is just pulse on-time duration being too long then one would think the lower input amps should help reduce heat in transistor. Thoughts appreciated.
peace love light
Tyson

[Sephiroth]

Hi theremart, thanks for reply. Do you mean air-core. Also you suggest upping the resistance of coil by making it longer, do you think my transistors peak amperage is being exceeded causing the transistor overheating, because the coils don't get hot, just the transistor. And when I run the same darlington pair on the 555 with the same coil the transistor does not get anywhere near the same temperature, that is why i think it has to do with the on-time pulse being too long or something and maybe that is why increasing the resistance of the coil is working for you. That is whats odd about this, is that even when increasing the base resistor, sure the amp draw goes down but the heat in the transistor is still fairly high in the heat sink. I mean if it is just pulse on-time duration being too long then one would think the lower input amps should help reduce heat in transistor. Thoughts appreciated.
peace love light
Tyson

You might have seen my more recent motor uses over an amp with just one transistor and it stays perfectly cool... I believe the heat problem isn't directly caused by the overall draw of the energizer.

Heat can build up in the transistor if switching speed is to slow or isn't turning fully on.

When the transistor is fully "on" the transistor has surprisingly low impedance and so very little energy gets dissipated as heat. Though during the transition between the on/off state the transistor has significant impedance and there is significant current flowing through it so if the on/off time is too slow alot more heat will build up.

This could be because your frequency is too high, or the resistor on the trigger winding is too high (if you are using a trigger winding). But I would guess it is because the 555 circuit doesn't provide a sharp enough transition...

[SkyWatcher]

Hi Sephiroth, No, the 555 timer pulser is the good setup. The one thats overheating the transistor is the Joule Thief circuit. thanks for the info though Seph, The transistor not turning fully on was my next guess as to why the JT circuit is overheating the trans.
I'm having great results with the 555 and its ability to be adjusted more.
peace love light