One magnet no bearing Bedini motor

[jeanna]

Thank you jonny and joit.
Lidmotor, I am very glad you jumped in here because my coil is just like the one you made somewhere from just the green and red radioshack wire. I used all of both spools and wound them on an empty spool. You counted them, so I was relieved that I did not need to count the turns.

... My experience is that when you get a hot coil there is a wiring problem or the transistor is fried (shorted).

ok good info.

... The base resistance, like Jonny said, doesn't have to be anything but a resistor and it will run.

OK I am familiar with that concept from the jtc.

... See if your drive coil will push a magnet by hot wiring it to a AA. If it doesn't move the magnet then you might have to add more wire.

I will try that.

I use only neos on my motors but of course the snake egg is a Hematite.

Maybe I am combining things. Did you not get a start-up with your radioshack pack coil and the egg? Wasn't that the very noisy one?
I ordered "your" neos yesterday... soon it won't matter.

On the trigger coil, if you wave a neo by the coil the transistor should do it's thing and work. You can test that with a battery and a volt meter.

umm a battery and a voltmeter connected to what?
This circuit still makes very little sense to me, and I do not know where to put the test equipment.

thank you,

jeanna

edit add
I tried a few things with the scope.
The most voltage I saw while running a neo past the coil was with the core of nails inside and hooked up from the base at the coil to the emitter at the transistor and that was 0.224v. I must not have enough wire.
The coil only got hot yesterday when I used a 12v for source and 9v for charge.
j

[Lidmotor]

Getting the Bedini to run

Thank you jonny and joit.
Lidmotor, I am very glad you jumped in here because my coil is just like the one you made somewhere from just the green and red radioshack wire. I used all of both spools and wound them on an empty spool. You counted them, so I was relieved that I did not need to count the turns.


ok good info.




OK I am familiar with that concept from the jtc.



I will try that.

Maybe I am combining things. Did you not get a start-up with your radioshack pack coil and the egg? Wasn't that the very noisy one?
I ordered "your" neos yesterday... soon it won't matter.



umm a battery and a voltmeter connected to what?
This circuit still makes very little sense to me, and I do not know where to put the test equipment.

thank you,

jeanna

edit add
I tried a few things with the scope.
The most voltage I saw while running a neo past the coil was with the core of nails inside and hooked up from the base at the coil to the emitter at the transistor and that was 0.224v. I must not have enough wire.
The coil only got hot yesterday when I used a 12v for source and 9v for charge.
j

OK. The coil that you made I know works. "Pirate" also made one sucessfully. It isn't right but it is a place to start. The correct one is supposed to be twisted equal length wires of longer length (about 800+ turns). I figured my coil was sort of a transformer design because of the unequal lengths. Another thing that I tried that also worked, was to solder the gold (copper?) color wire that comes in the Radio Shack package onto the green wire to make a longer drive coil. There is enough red wire for the trigger coil if your magnet is strong enough.
I did run my snake egg on a Lidmotor coil but it was very hard to start and I had to start it on 12 volts and then switch to 1.5v. Once started it ran just fine.
To see if the trigger coil works make a little circuit with a AA such that when you wave a magnet past the coil the energy created will tell the emmiter to "flip the switch" and allow current to pass through the transistor. An amp meter in series or a 1.5v flashlight bulb will work to test it. If your little circuit has current going through it without waving the magnet, then the transistor is shorted.
It sounds like you maybe need stronger magnets to make this thing run.

Let us know how things go.

Lidmotor

[jeanna]

YEAY I got it working!

I made a new coil but the magnets arrived too so before I took it all apart I tried a few combos. In the end the 4th set of magnets- a cylinder on a sphere is what worked, and then I added a saturn on an overturned bowl and so I have a cylinder AND a saturn satellite magnet spinning for over 1 1/2 hours now.
It has remained the same speed from the moment it grabbed on.

I have a very small and ugly avi I posted on the ou no rotor thread started by jonny
here
One magnet no bearing Bedini motor

jeanna

yeay!

[Lidmotor]

Excellent!! Hip Hip Hooray!

YEAY I got it working!

I made a new coil but the magnets arrived too so before I took it all apart I tried a few combos. In the end the 4th set of magnets- a cylinder on a sphere is what worked, and then I added a saturn on an overturned bowl and so I have a cylinder AND a saturn satellite magnet spinning for over 1 1/2 hours now.
It has remained the same speed from the moment it grabbed on.

I have a very small and ugly avi I posted on the ou no rotor thread started by jonny
here
One magnet no bearing Bedini motor

jeanna

yeay!

Great news Jeanna! Good job. I remember the day that I got my first Bedini running. I just stood there looking at it in amazement. It just looked like magic--- Still does and that is why I keep coming back to it. Spinning magnets are fun.
Congratulations.

Lidmotor

[jeanna]

Thank you, lidmotor,

It isn't finished yet, I guess.
I just checked and the run battery is only down 0.01v to 9.45v maybe but the charging battery is not charging.
It is NOT a rechargable battery, but it seems that it is going down.

Everything is cool and cold, and it is very possible that this 6.6v is what that battery was down to when stressed, but I rather think it was 8.85v.

I guess I will stop it before lights out.

Anyway the other day I made a coil with the proper amount of wire and I bought some welding rods to replace the nails. I am encouraged to continue.

Also the magnet people sent me a free sample with a tiny cylinder I can probably use to hang a cylinder from above. I particularly like that design along with maggie.

jeanna

[jonnydavro]

Hi Jeanna.I am so glad you stuck with it and got it going
I am pretty sure you will be able to get all your magnets to spin it is just a case of getting to know your motor and fine tuning.I would try all your magnets again but using aircore.
With regards to your charge battery.I would check your diode and maybe swap the battery for a high voltage cap to see if it fills but monitor the voltage to make sure you don't exceed the cap rating.This will give you an idea of what is going on.
Can you give us more details of your coil and resistances you are using so we can envisage your setup?
Great job once again Jeanna and i am glad you didn't give up
Regards jonny.

[Lidmotor]

"Magnifcent Spinning Machines"

@All
Years ago there was a movie called "Those Magniticent Men In Their Flying Machines" and it was a favorite of mine. In the movie were all these weird and amazing old early style airplanes that flew in a race. These Bedini type motors remind me of those funny airplanes with all the different designs and inventive ways of getting the job done. Everytime a new one pops up on Youtube I have to look at it and see what someone else came up with.
@Jeana
Jonny's air coil suggestion is a good one and in fact I am winding another "Lidmotor coil" today like that. His suggestion about checking your collector diode charging circuit with a big cap is always the way I do it. Just don't leave it alone and monitor the voltage climb. On some of Slayer's great designs I could actually keep a 110v night light illuminated off the BEMF alone. Remember to use a fast switching diode off the collector. The favorite is the 1N4007 but I use the small 1N914 on my little motors.

@Jony
I am still working with Dr. Stiffler's SEC and as you found out, it is very intriguing. If you havn't already, try his latest circuit where you split the LED string after the AV plug and run 2/3 of them back to the source (+) and 1/3 back to the source (-). It is a self recharging circuit running in the mHz range. The SEC 15 you have will do it. Do it on a lead acid battery just like a Bedini. It is another magic show. It is not a total self-runner but very close.

Lidmotor

[jeanna]

Thanks jonny and
Thanks again lidmotor,

The resistance total is 193 ohms. Any more and it stops the motor.

My plan for now, before I change to a 'better' coil, is to fill the core with welding rods that I am now cutting up.
I made a coil before the magnets arrived and it fills the spool and has equal lengths of 24awg and 28awg.
I want to finish testing this one before I de-sloder it.

I will see if I can get some kind of reading on the cap in the place of the charging battery. I guess that is essential anyway so I will learn about that too.

So, here is the full 45 second video.

YouTube - Bedini No Rotor Saturn 1

jeanna

[theremart]

Zzzzoooommm

YouTube - Video 75 Zzzzzooooom 23,900 rpm with Jonny Davro Bedini motor

This magnet would get a ticket at the end of this video I clocked it at 23,900 RPM.

Thanks Johnny this is an awesome thing to play with...

Mart

[Lidmotor]

Simple circuit with air core coil

@All
Here is a very simple pulse circuit with an air core coil.
@Mart
SPEED KILLS!!!! Just kidding. We all have to thank Jonny for this thread and the many hours of fun working with the now famous--"One Magnet No Bearing Bedini". Does anyone know if there is a "steps" program for this. It is very addictive.
Zooooooommmmm!!!!
YouTube - Simple Pulse Circuit with Air Core Coil

Lidmotor

[jonnydavro]

@Jeanna.Nice vid The saturn Satellite is a great idea and you seem to have it spinning a fair bit away from the main rotor.The Saturn config is ideal for spinning satellites as the rpm's are just right and not to fast so you may be able to get some secondary satallites spinning of the saturn.
With regards to your large cylinder magnet spinning on its side,this is a bit strange.I would check that it is diametrically magnetised and not axially magetised as Pirate has a vid where he has an axially magnetised cylinder spinning like yours as the magnet shop may have got it mixed up.
When you start the cylinder spinning by hand,does it spin and pivot on the small steel ball bearing and then flip on its side when you switch the circuit on?
I would also remove the core and try aircore as this is how i run my strong neo's if in the close proximity to the coil due to the attraction as Lidmotor has mentioned in his last vid.
You mention that your resistance is 193ohms.Is there no pot at all in your Bedini circuit now or is this what you have it set at?
Keep up your great work and happy experimenting
@theremart.Hi Mart .I am so glad you have taken the first step with this and hope you explore and try out and invent furthur variants as when you think you have seen it all,someone comes up with something else but the Snake egg is my favourite as this gave me my biggest thrill when it first span up.
With regards to your motor,24000 rpm's is fast.It may go faster if you can stabilise it and reduce the friction.SMW1998a on utube has measured his snake egg at 33000 rpm's and he has his running nice and stable.You can find his vid here.
YouTube - The Snake Egg Rotor
YouTube - Snake Egg Replication
Imagine if we could find a neo snake egg.What would that spin at?
Welcome aboard Mart.Regards jonny.
@Lidmotor.Hi Lid.I am glad you are still experimenting with the snake egg and your new simplified one transistor circuit is genius You mentioned that you measured the snake egg at 11000rpm's.Was this on a 1.5v battery?if so i find that quite remarkable as it seems a lot of bang for your buck.
In your vid where you have a saturn spinning and feeding Maggie,have you considered trying another saturn opposite the first and she may think she is dating twins
I am sure there are plenty of furthur things to discover with these one magnet motors,have you seen whats going on in the Rodin thread?
Regarding Dr Stifflers Sec and his NILS.I have been following yours and Shamus's replications and thank you for paving the way for us slower experimenters as i am playing catchup on this and you have prooved his technology so the flood gates may open on this and i hope to replicate soon. Regards jonny

[jeanna]

@Jeanna.Nice vid The saturn Satellite is a great idea and you seem to have it spinning a fair bit away from the main rotor...

just about 10-12 inches.
The note pad is 8 x 11 for reference.

With regards to your large cylinder magnet spinning on its side,this is a bit strange.I would check that it is diametrically magnetised and not axially magetised as Pirate has a vid where he has an axially magnetised cylinder spinning like yours as the magnet shop may have got it mixed up.

No, it is. (because things stick to the sides not the ends)

I am using another magnet and not just a steel bearing, though. I do not know how much of anything matters. It seems if one knows how to tweek it, almost anything works... except for many lights.

When you start the cylinder spinning by hand,does it spin and pivot on the small steel ball bearing and then flip on its side when you switch the circuit on?

Yes, sometimes. It seems to be a matter of speed, but again, I am not really sure.

I would also remove the core and try aircore as this is how i run my strong neo's if in the close proximity to the coil due to the attraction as Lidmotor has mentioned in his last vid.

Nope. It won't spin on an air core, but as I mentioned somewhere, this core is a ring of nails and not a solid core of nails, so it is half air core.. Actually not air core. If I don't keep a spacer over the center hole, the nails snap up onto the magnet.

You mention that your resistance is 193ohms.Is there no pot at all in your Bedini circuit now or is this what you have it set at?

I have 3 resistors in series.
68ohm plain resistor
20kohm pot
1kohm pot
If I turn either pot to a higher value, the spinning slows.

Keep up your great work and happy experimenting

Thanks for your encouragement.

------------------------------
I noticed last night when I removed the charge battery that the magnet came to an instant stop.
Is that right?

Then I re-checked and I think there is a conflict of picture images at least between pirates and introvertebrate's.

I first wired it as introvertebrate did and got all the heating in the coil and batteries.

Then I resoldered it to pirate's pic and that is what is working... but it is different in that the source and charge are the opposite batteries.
If I am confused, I would like to be set straight on this, but so far I keep seeing this conflict.
I am about to go to bedini and daftman to study which they are using.

It does seem very strange to me that the pos from one battery is connected to the neg of the next one along with a spike producing coil.
I am not sure why it is the spike and not the other battery that is filling the charge battery .
Or, maybe this is the essence of the conflict I am seeing in the drawings.

?? ??
thank you,

jeanna

[theremart]

Great to be here Jonny,

@theremart.Hi Mart .I am so glad you have taken the first step with this and hope you explore and try out and invent furthur variants as when you think you have seen it all,someone comes up with something else but the Snake egg is my favourite as this gave me my biggest thrill when it first span up.
With regards to your motor,24000 rpm's is fast.It may go faster if you can stabilise it and reduce the friction.SMW1998a on utube has measured his snake egg at 33000 rpm's and he has his running nice and stable.You can find his vid here.
YouTube - The Snake Egg Rotor
YouTube - Snake Egg Replication
Imagine if we could find a neo snake egg.What would that spin at?
Welcome aboard Mart.Regards jonny.

Johnny, I did some other testing not shown in the video I put some dura-lube in the container. I got some very interesing results, one breaking the glass that contained it

One of my thoughts is to take a sphere neo, then get an Easter egg and pack the neo in with the N-S poles out just like the rattle snake egg.

I must say I am tempted to get some carbon rods and make the earth battery that Pirate has made. Would be interesting to see if it could charge up a AA battery with his setup.

Another thought I had is using this magnet with a Newman type motor... considered it would work also with the Bedini window motor.

the real trick seems to be getting it controlled.

I guess I wanted to do the video the way I did because you may say after reading the scope shots it turns this fast but seeing a tach meter on it is something else.

Someday I may be brave enough to jump to 24v

[Lidmotor]

@Jonny
I got the snake egg spinning that fast on a AA. To do it the egg has to be totally stable and it makes very little sound. The mirror has such low friction and I use a drop of oil-- maybe that is why. Very high speeds beyond that send the rotor flying so you have to be careful.
There are several other projects that I am following. Of course Dr. Stiffler's SEC then there is the Rodin coil and the Self-Charging Battery thread. There are lots of interesting things going on. The most exotic is Dr. Stiffler's device that seems to suck energy right out of thin air. What's that all about?? He has tried to explain it to me several times and I still can't get my brain around it. You have been working with it what do you think?
I sense that there is a common element among all these things we are working with.

@ Jeanna
If you disconnect your charge battery and the system stops, then something is hooked up wrong. These circuits run fine with no charge battery. Most people put a neon between the collector and emmiter to keep the transistor from being harmed by the back spike when you do it.
Jonny is right about the cylinder magnet standing straight upright. Get a small steel ball bearing at the hardware store and use that instead of a neo magnet on the bottom. I put a small piece of wood dowel rod in the center to spin the "top" by. Jonny came up with this rotor months ago and it is still the best one that I have tried.

I got Maggie working again in the "Flux Field Generator" mode today with the spinning small neo in her mouth. The new air core coil works really good with this new simple circuit.

Lidmotor

[jeanna]

@ Jeanna
If you disconnect your charge battery and the system stops, then something is hooked up wrong. These circuits run fine with no charge battery. Most people put a neon between the collector and emmiter to keep the transistor from being harmed by the back spike when you do it.
Jonny is right about the cylinder magnet standing straight upright. Get a small steel ball bearing at the hardware store and use that instead of a neo magnet on the bottom. I put a small piece of wood dowel rod in the center to spin the "top" by. Jonny came up with this rotor months ago and it is still the best one that I have tried.

Now, this is the weird part.
The first time I made this I got overheating and not much results.The neon never went on, either. The no results is probably from the less powerful magnet. But the overheating is not.

I resoldered it according to pirates drawing and after I was finished I realized I had completely reversed the source and charge battery.
So, what I have is wired backwards but it works. ??!
I get no heating or any problem, but the clue that there is a real problem was that the charge battery turned the motor off when I disconnected it.

But, the funny thing is that the charge battery had charged from 6.6v to 7.1v in the 3 hours I was listening to it and the drive battery had only gone down 0.01v to 9.44v

After 24 hours the charge battery is now 8.05v and the NiMH source is 9.40v
The charge battery is a very old extra heavy duty which I believe means zinc??

-----
I have been on this forum reading the bedini sg thread all day and it seems that it works even without the motor running, so it is just running the transistor to get the spike into the charge battery, I guess.

The new air core coil works really good with this new simple circuit.

That is cool. AND this is the simple circuit without a centertap?
I remember you made one with a magnet inside maggie with a centertap, I think... but this is straight up like a bedini?

thank you,

jeanna