Bedini's Kromrey Converter

[xpskid]

XpsKid - Thanks for the warm welcome -

Here are a couple pics - 1 while glueing the coils mounts in gives a good shot of the coils. For scale the center bolts are 1" diameter and the plastic side squares are 4 1/4" on each side.

The other shot is taken during testing setup.

I am working on that wiring you requested, since it is not the same as the 4 coil rotary i will draw and scan it in. I do have a drawing i may include now that shows how the coils are wound but is connected in parallel.

Take care,
Pneuphysics

Pneuphysics,

Looks like a G-Field unit ! That's great

There are a couple folks working on this design, I'm sure you'll hear from them.
One point the I know Lambda and myself are working on is John's statement in the DVD (Town Hall Meeting .... I believe, off the top of my head 1:49 +) that " You must produce 2 figure eight patterns" . Not sure how that fits in or how it's wound.... but it appears you've moved the group closer to a low impedance wind.

When you get a chance, fill us in on the specific's of you build.

I assume you didn't do anything with the trigger wire.... just open ended ?

Regards,

Timm

[pneuphysics]

MileHigh - 8)

MileHigh -

It sure as hell looks like that doesn't it? lol Sometimes you gotta look harder! lol
Don't use black construction paper, use tracing paper!

I have a question or two: For the unrectified waveform, is that across just one coil? Can you describe the what magnet polarity sequence the coil sees as it goes around a full turn? (It looks to me like N-S or N-S-N-S if there are four magnets)

Sure - the unrectified waveform is taken from the rectifier ac inputs. The bars in my picture (2, one on each side of the coil) have a C8 ferrite magnet ssg standard 7/8x1 7/8x3/8 one at each of the 4 ends and are N,S. So when 2 magnets cross the top they are N,S and on the bottom those crossing at the same time on the bottom coil are S,N the opposite.

For the cancelled potentials stuff I can only ask you to try some stuff and see for yourself. I am very confident on my side.

Have you ever built anything that displayed COP>1 taking its extra input from an unknown or unconventional source?

Happy OUing
Pneuphysics

[pneuphysics]

Great XpsKid -

I tied the trigger to the others - all 5 wires are in parallel - let me go measure it right now. Right back. Well all i can get is a dc resistance of 1 ohm across both coils in series - My inductance meter either is not working or out of range. I'll post more as soon as i have time.

Thanks,
Pneuphysics

[MileHigh]

Timm: No I haven't seen the EFTV 10 so that puts me at a disadvantage.

> If a device supposedly can power kW's of load through a wire measured in microns, how can that fit traditional theory ?

Without seeing the DVD it's a bit hard to comment on what was demoed. A generic answer would be that as long as your voltage is high enough, you can drive a kW load through a very tiny wire.

It's great that you are going to investigate your setup. I am pretty rusty on this stuff, but I have a very solid foundation. We can always agree to disagree like diplomats. I just ask you to not make too many intellectual leaps and always assume that the device is unconventional to explain things that you don't understand. From my perspective the device looks like a meat and potatoes alternator. So please try to keep both viewpoints in your thought processes. I would be willing to see the "other side" if I saw something convincing myself.

Pneuphysics: Are you French? Oops, I get it now "pneu <-> new."

For your unrectified waveform: Start below the second "0" in the fist "30.02Hz". That's the beginning of your "sine wave", it's not the middle of a folded-down peak like you think. Suppose the coils are starting to see "N-S" here. The spike you see slightly left of center of the "2" is the positive peak of your sine wave. Then you see the zero-cross and the negative peak of your sine wave. The next sine wave starts below the "H" and this time it is upside-down because the rotor has rotated by 180 degrees and now the coils see the beginning of the opposite polarity, "S-N". Since the magnetic polarity is now reversed, you see a mirror-image sine wave, almost like you swapped the leads. In this case you swapped the polarities.

So that's the waveform: sine wave, inverted sine wave, sine wave, etc. I am using the term "sine wave" very loosely here.

If you are scratching your heads here I suggest that you do some Wikipedia reading up on this stuff. For example, do you know why it barely resembles a sine wave? You would be much better with your future research if you understand this important concept first. I am too tired to go any further...

[baroutologos]

In order to comprehend batter the phenomena we seek to experience perhaps we should question ourselves.

What are the major construction differences (not performance) between a Kromrey generator (G-field) and a conventional one ??? (say a DCPM motor that is also generator)

Regards,
Baroutologos

* a list of key points and some explaination will be great
** if we cannot spot any desicive difference(s) then we too far from goal

[pneuphysics]

To MileHigh

MileHigh > For your unrectified waveform: Start below the second "0" in the fist "30.02Hz". That's the beginning of your "sine wave", it's not the middle of a folded-down peak like you think.

Me > I had no such thought - sine wave measurement IMHO starts as the wave crosses the zero point upward to the first peak and continues until the following negative peak comes up through the zero point. I can only assume you missed my point on the paper doll exercise.

MileHigh > Suppose the coils are starting to see "N-S" here. The spike you see slightly left of center of the "2" is the positive peak of your sine wave. Then you see the zero-cross and the negative peak of your sine wave. The next sine wave starts below the "H" and this time it is upside-down because the rotor has rotated by 180 degrees and now the coils see the beginning of the opposite polarity, "S-N". Since the magnetic polarity is now reversed, you see a mirror-image sine wave, almost like you swapped the leads. In this case you swapped the polarities.

Me > Yes this is my take too.

So that's the waveform: sine wave, inverted sine wave, sine wave, etc. I am using the term "sine wave" very loosely here.

Me > Yes this is my take too.

If you are scratching your heads here I suggest that you do some Wikipedia reading up on this stuff. For example, do you know why it barely resembles a sine wave? You would be much better with your future research if you understand this important concept first. I am too tired to go any further...

Me > I understand my design - i was just struct by the visual i tried to convey by the drawing exercise.

[xpskid]

Bingo Kent -

Here are my wave forms - rectified and full wave.

Enjoy,
Pneuphysics

From a non-EE point of view....
The longest time period appears to be peak to peak... so I'd interpret that as when the magnets are moving to the next pole.
The magnet move into the pole center line, approaching the core which is polarized opposite from the previous magnet. The pos peak (under the first 2) is the result of reversing the core and closing the flux circuit. As the magnet leaves, the field dumps through the coil, the resulting immediate reversal peak. Using SSG/Bedini logic, the very sharp reversal should be the key. The next cycle start opposite (Neg) but is a similar process.

Is that consistent with your interpretation Pneuphysics ?

Timm

[dllabarre]

The reason for this is that the frequency 'f' in the equation above will be roughly ((RPM x 4)/60) and the 'L' will also be very small.

Now, plug in the inductance you measured and then the other variable would be your frequency, which is based upon the RPM and the number of poles. If it is a 4 pole, I imagine there would be 4 pulses per revolution, so multiply the RPM by 4.
Mike H.

Posted are 2 different equations for estimating frequency.

Which equation is correct for estimating frequency?
(RPM x 4) or ((RPM x 4)/60)

Thanks
DonL

[xpskid]

Which equation is correct for estimating frequency?
(RPM x 4) or ((RPM x 4)/60)

Thanks
DonL

Don,

I'll take a stab at this, but it kind of depends...

Hertz (which your equations will need) is cycles/sec
So for a two pole device (unrectified), I would think a full revolution would = 1 cycle or wave, a positive peak and a negative peak. So cycles / sec would = RPM/60.

On a six pole device I would think you'd get 3 full cycles, thus 3xRPM/60

Not sure on a 4 pole device because it sees N-N-S-S

If you think in terms of pulses, not full cycles, then a 2 pole = #polesxRPM/60
Yet as you look a pneuphysics wave form, it appears to show 4 peaks per revolution ?

Is that correct ?

Timm

[Lambda]

Actually, the ((RPM X 4) / 60) would be correct, as the formula I posted would put it in cycles per minute, and this corrects it to cycles per second, which is how it should be. Sorry about that!

I'm getting the same waveforms, both AC & DC that Pneuphysics has posted, but I'm not experiencing any of the effects, which I believe is due to the coil's impedance. The 4 coils are wound with a single 23 AWG, 550 turns per coil. Some wire came in today, so I can tri-filar it (22AWG) and then hopefully the coils impedance will fall inside the bell curve. Hopefully we can eventually figure out the bell curve John speaks of, where the peak is, and the thresholds to get inside of it.

Regards,

Mike

[pneuphysics]

xpskid -

If you think in terms of pulses, not full cycles, then a 2 pole = #polesxRPM/60
Yet as you look a pneuphysics wave form, it appears to show 4 peaks per revolution ?

My view - Yep the first 2 pos peaks are what one magnet makes and the valley between being a function of what the bottom magnet does to that what would be single pos peak if the bottom magnet did not push back with its own potential - opposite direction. the second 2 peaks come from the negative part of the bottom sine wave pushd up in the middle by the opposite pole. 4 peaks per revolution. 10-4

[pneuphysics]

From a non-EE point of view....
The longest time period appears to be peak to peak... so I'd interpret that as when the magnets are moving to the next pole.
The magnet move into the pole center line, approaching the core which is polarized opposite from the previous magnet. The pos peak (under the first 2) is the result of reversing the core and closing the flux circuit. As the magnet leaves, the field dumps through the coil, the resulting immediate reversal peak. Using SSG/Bedini logic, the very sharp reversal should be the key. The next cycle start opposite (Neg) but is a similar process.

Is that consistent with your interpretation Pneuphysics ?

Timm

Yep - i also noticed a big difference in output with respect to speed. Not scientific but i was able to get non rectified pulses of only 4 to 5vdc with a drill motor. when i went with a 24vdc motor it went up to 58vdc. I know someone mentioned there is a speed curve but so far i do not see an end to the pulse potential. One of my magnet bars center hole did not machine straight, i need to put it back on the mill and bore it out. Also, i am searching my junk drawer to find a larger dc motor. I do have a 100hp aircraft starter generator. whoo hoo probably send my magnets into the 10 dimension

Take care,
Pneuphysics

[xpskid]

Coil windings

Folks,

I'd be interested in anyones experience with coil fabrication with respect to windings. Different ways to wind the coil... Which ways reduce the inductance/impedance ? Are there ways to provide a capacitance effect via the wind configuration ?

We've had multi-filar and twisted multi-filar... Does anyone have data to suggest what twisting does to the reisistance/inductance/ impedance ?
Are there other tricks ?

Thanks,

Timm

[MileHigh]

For the waveform, when the rotating magents are perfectly lined up with the coils, the optput voltage is zero, just like the pick-up coil in a Bedini motor. You only see the waveform cross zero on the very steep parts. That might help.

For the frequency calculation for the coil reactance, X(L), like I said before we are only making a very rough estimate by calculating the magnet fly-by frequency. The formula only works for a pure, true sine wave, where there are no harmonics. The coil waveform has a lot of harmonics in it so the calculation is a bit more complicated.

[Shamus]

A non-magnetic cage?
I know, stupid question...

There are no stupid questions IMO. Yes, the cage is made of 3/4" MDF--quite non-magnetic.