Bedini Ferris Wheel Regauging Motor

[iankoglin]

Kogs,
NO, NO, NO find the wire surplus way too much money.
I did not even spend that with Rick supplying the wire.
JB

G'Day John Bedini
I thank you for your reply and I have already asked Rick for a quote the request I sent him is below.
when I receive the wire I will then continue with my build in the mean time I hope to be able to sort out the circuit problem.

Thanks again and Kindest regards Kogs


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G'Day Rick
On the Energetic Forum where John Bedini is helping the members there to build a modified 3GT Ferris wheel called S1GT
I have already made a frame and 4 foot rotor with magnets with the hall switch and timing wheel and running Just nicely, and now I need the coils. JB has suggested that even though the wheel is 4 foot diam we will still need the full size coils to gain the required effect.

Could you please confirm to me the coil price and details as you have set out below.

.Also the expected delivery time

The Specs for JB's coils as I understand are as follows

1 spool of 4 strands of wires on the same spool, 4000feet each strand (1220 meters) each wound in parallel (NOT litzed)

2 strands 4000feet (1220 meters) each AWG#15 ( 1.5mm ) and

2 strands 4000feet each (1220 meters) each AWG#18( 1.0mm )

2 spools 2 strands of wire on each spool, 2000feet each strand (610meters) each wound in parallel (NOT litzed)

Spool 2 - 2 strands 2000feet each (610 meters) each AWG#15 ( 1.5mm )

Spool 1 - 2 strands 2000feet each (610 meters) each AWG#15 ( 1.5mm )

I imagine that these coils includes the core rods and are already wound on the appropriate spools as stated below and winding each on a lathe.

Could you please confirm these details and include the delivery price to Portland Australia Postcode 3305


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[minoly]

G'day all,
Ok, I can take it
never said I was the sharpest pencil in the box

so the FET's are in place of the MJL21194/3's on the Bedini Cole ckt then right?
I looked up the IRF 260 and there are several choices at digikey.
can anyone point me to the exact pair or part numbers?

Patrick

[Mark]

Kogs,

Looks like Rick sells the coils for the Ferris Wheel for $1100.00 each already wound and with welding rod. Here is the link just scroll down a little, 13' Ferris Wheel Frame and Rotor Kit

[RS_]

minoly,

The IRF260 is for the Cap discharge battery charging part of the circuit.... JB still uses the MJL21193/4's on the Cole circuit, and parallels 2 or more beta matched sets of each of them, so that the Cole circuit can handle more current

[BrentA929]

Wire

Kogs,

That is about three times as much as we paid for our wire...I think it was around $1,500.00.

Also, we only have one strand on our slave coils.


Best of luck, Brent

[John_Bedini]

Bedini GT16-3

Patrick,
The Bedini Cole switch is a differnt circuit . The FET is for the capacitor dump circuit to the secondary batteries.
John B

[John_Bedini]

Bedini GT16-3

Brent,
That sounds about right if your winding them yourself. So I do not know who is winding the coils for Rick. John K who is winding the coils?
John B

[iankoglin]

wire for 3GT coils

Kogs,

Looks like Rick sells the coils for the Ferris Wheel for $1100.00 each already wound and with welding rod. Here is the link just scroll down a little, 13' Ferris Wheel Frame and Rotor Kit

G'Day Mark
AS I mentioned in my last post I did ask Rick to confirm the specs for these coils. I am glad I did before ordering them as the coils he is selling are completely different coil sizes to JB's spects of his coils as discussed here on this list.
Here is the reply
__________________________________________________ _________
Ian,

I am not able to follow the other lists at this time, or to keep track of what John has said there. I had not planned to do the same coil we did on the big wheel for my own reasons. I will be making a rather larger coil available shortly for someone who has interest in ordering the 13' setup. First announcement is that we will be offering the complete parts for the 8 circuit SSG as sold in the big kits. Second announcement is that we will also offer this fully assembled. This is a start towards full assembly, at least half way there. Third announcement is that the large coil will be a multistrand coil many more than 4 wires. These will be at least 200 feet long wires, depending on the wire gauge we use. Then they will either be twisted or just wound parallel. How many wires? This I have to calculate. If we get 8 wires around those small coils, then this large coil will have many more. Maybe 24 18 gauge wires as soon as I can arrange for making it. I have to do the math still. So this will give you the power of at least the 4 pole Sr. setup in one coil, plus all the advantage of the bigger rotor, magnets, and core.

More details tonight...

Rick
__________________________________________________ _________

Looks like I just have to keep looking.

Brent where did you get your wire?, and why only 1 wire on the side coils?

Kindest Regards Kogs

[BrentA929]

Slave coils

Hey Kogs,

We got our wire from an Essex wire distributor here in Dallas, TX.

Also, here is where JB talks about the number of wires...


Brent

Brent,
You both may have different interpretations but, I'm telling you the center coil has four wires on it. The two outer coils have one wire each and that they are all hooked in parallel to form one inductor.
Big coil two #15 wires two #18 wires.
Small coils both coils # 15 wires.
John B

[Rl2003]

I have just uploaded a short video of a new board and the self start.
I have added the parallel transistors to the circuit. I also have some MJL's to play with now
and the parts to make a fet trigger for the cap. Has anyone had any luck
with that yet??

I still need to address the timing wheel, because it is ever so slightly out of round.
My advice to any one building this is to make it as perfect as you can. As you will
find out it is a very fine line between right and off. And there is a very small window
to get it to self start. I had made a second timing wheel and then it would not self
start so I went back up to the first one just to get it going again.
This time I am going to use an optical switch..I feel I will be able to get a better on off time and not
so touchy.. I just need to get the slot the right size.
I also put my scope on it but it is very hard to see thew spikes.
I will make some more upgrades and update every one when I can.

YouTube - Bedini GT3 19.1

Mark

[iankoglin]

[QUOTE=BrentA929;132476]Hey Kogs,

We got our wire from an Essex wire distributor here in Dallas, TX.

Also, here is where JB talks about the number of wires...


Brent /QUOTE]

G'Day Brent
Thank you[
I went over all the pages regarding the number of wires You are correct I just do not know why I thought there was 2 strands per side coil
Boy I am glad I havent built the coils.

Kindest regards Kogs

[genessc]

Hi John B.

When you are charging a battery under pulse, you want to have the same "target" voltage of what you want the cell to charge up to as the source charge to be discharged into the batteries on the charge end of the circuit, right? This is because the pulse being discharged into the battery needs to be right at the target of what you want the voltage to build up to in the charge bank?

Is there a difference between using a 330uF cap at 48vdc versus using a 2400uF cap at 48vdc as the source collection cap which is being discharged into the 24volt series battery bank? How does current density (aka the uF of the capacitor) affect how well the battery takes the charge?

What Sidac would you recommend to replace the LED/Zener combo on the gate of the SCR? Are you looking for a 48vdc sidac at 1amp or so? (or is this more like a 24vdc sidac, which would see the 24vdc as being over the existing 24vdc of the series battery stack? )

I'll look into what I need to get an IRF260 and mod it so I can swap it into the mjl21194's place with a harness on my discharge controller.

Thanks for the reply.
Gene

Bedini GT 16-3
I think I have been over this a couple hundred times.
I said That I made modifications to the Bedini Cole Switch. I have paralleled the transistors all Bata matched and that the timing must be just right to give the most voltage to the capacitor , Everybody has seen waveforms on how capacitors charge and discharge, yes it's like a sawtooth wave. I also said that you must double the voltage to charge the battery under pulse. Think about what I'm saying about charging batteries under pulse. John K is giving very good advice here about the condition of your batteries. I also said that I'm using a Fet to pulse my batteries and I told you what it was IRF260. I also said that the diodes were mounted as close to the switching rails as possible. Bad sulphated batteries will not work right with the SCR and it will not discharge the energy. The Impedance of the battery is very important with the SCR in you can not have junk batteries, gel cells become a big pain in your As.... as the impedance is all over the place. Discharging the FET you must choose the voltage and then discharge it with the timing wheel if you need to that, this is why I wanted to use the SIDAC to make this simple so everybody could get the same resaults.
John B

[genessc]

Irf260...

Hi Crew,

It looks like the IRF260 is rebadged to the IRFP260PBF ID. You will need that one to find it, or use the search of IRFP260 as the key search word.

Heres a link to that mosfets Datasheet.
http://www.mouser.com/catalog/specsheets/91215irf.pdf

John B, is this still an acceptable device to use? Looks like it may have changed slightly...

If its good, I'll snag a couple... they ain't cheap at 7bux and change for 1 device.

Take care,
Gene

Hi John B.

When you are charging a battery under pulse, you want to have the same "target" voltage of what you want the cell to charge up to as the source charge to be discharged into the batteries on the charge end of the circuit, right? This is because the pulse being discharged into the battery needs to be right at the target of what you want the voltage to build up to in the charge bank?

Is there a difference between using a 330uF cap at 48vdc versus using a 2400uF cap at 48vdc as the source collection cap which is being discharged into the 24volt series battery bank? How does current density (aka the uF of the capacitor) affect how well the battery takes the charge?

What Sidac would you recommend to replace the LED/Zener combo on the gate of the SCR? Are you looking for a 48vdc sidac at 1amp or so? (or is this more like a 24vdc sidac, which would see the 24vdc as being over the existing 24vdc of the series battery stack? )

I'll look into what I need to get an IRF260 and mod it so I can swap it into the mjl21194's place with a harness on my discharge controller.

Thanks for the reply.
Gene

[txaggie00]

Reels and coil size

@Kogs,

First let me say that you did a fantastic job on the construction of your wheel! It looks great! Since it seems you are trying to match your coil size to JB's coils, I wanted to warn you about the available space you may not have. We barely had enough space under our 6 foot wheel to fit all three coils and the steel flap under the main coil. Our coils are pretty closely matched to JB's and we used the same size reels as him and they are all full leaving only an inch between the wire and the outer edge of the 10.5 inch flange. Height wasn't an issue, it was how close the magnets are together that made the spacing tight. I'd imagine with a 4 foot wheel (which if I remember correctly, that's about the size of your wheel), youd have even less spacing than we have. Just something to think about before you shell out all that cash for wire.

Here is a cad drawing of our coil spacing under our wheel - Coil Closeup

You can see how close the flap is to the two slave coils.

Keep up the good work!

Scott

G'Day Brent
Thank you[
I went over all the pages regarding the number of wires You are correct I just do not know why I thought there was 2 strands per side coil
Boy I am glad I havent built the coils.

Kindest regards Kogs

[iankoglin]

Kogs Coils

@Kogs,

Since it seems you are trying to match your coil size to JB's coils, I wanted to warn you about the available space you may not have. We barely had enough space under our 6 foot wheel to fit all three coils and the steel flap under the main coil.
Height wasn't an issue, it was how close the magnets are together that made the spacing tight. I'd imagine with your 4 foot wheel youd have even less spacing than we have. Just something to think about before you shell out all that cash for wire.


Scott

G'Day Scott
Thanks for drawing my attention to the size. That was the reason why in page 39 my post 1162 I suggested different size coils perhaps one would suit the size of my wheel I was thinking perhaps one 1/2 size.

Then in post 1163 JB wrote
John K,
Some tips.....
Think I might say again the big coils are far different in what they can do as far as recovery energy output to the batteries. The bigger the coils the more you will collect. I'm hoping Brent gets his machine running. I might point out that the Bedini Cole switch was changed by me for that machine. This is not the same machine everybody is use to. You all have the basics to get this device working and working good. If you do a simple experiment with a coil that large you will discover the energy returned is something to be dealt with.

So perhaps I really need to make the "BIG" coil first anyway and remembering I live Down Under so the cores hang out the Top 3" so there might just be enough space If not I will just use the big coil first on this wheel and experiment first to get my circuit right then perhaps make a larger wheel that I can disassemble to move through my door and assemble again.
I found that the 4' wheel I was Just able to handle it on my own so perhaps a 8 or 9 footer. I will have to get my wife to help me lift it.


Kindest regards Kogs