Bedini Earth Light

[Allwest]

@All
John Bedini did a great video on how to convert a regular lead acid battery to Alum. It is long but very detailed and walks you through all the steps.

Conversion Of A Dry-Charge Lead Acid Battery To an Alum Crystal Cell Battery John Bedini - YouTube



Lidmotor

Thanks Lid,

Hey John, very nice, thank you for your time

Lead is so easy to work with, I always wanted to try melting lead into a plate like yours, placing sand and or quartz on the bottom form, so it would be impregnated into the lead, it could be used as a spacer, but alas no time anymore for fun stuff

Thanks again John and chuck for your time
Best of luck

[Allwest]

Another mix used on the Lead Acid battery


Lead Salt Battery - YouTube
Inside the Lead Acid Battery - YouTube
Best of luck

[John_Bedini]

Alum Conversion

Lidmotor,
Hope you do not mind I moved your video so it showed up center and that youtub would pick it up and the search engines.

Anyway, Forgot to say that make sure when washing the insulator out that no bridge shorts are stuck in the paper insulators. And what you can expect with a full charge is about between 1.8 volts to 1.9 volts per cell. That would make the alum cells stand at 10.8 to 11.5 volts depending on the condition. The nice thing about all this is no acid is involved.
@ Slider, Sorry did not see your video here, I did the same thing you did. So I gave you credit on the Energy Science forum as proof of concept.
How to Make a Bedini Crystal Battery - Page 5
John B

[Lidmotor]

Making a battery VS converting one

@All
I converted an old lead acid motocycle battery yesterday and had good luck. For real world power this makes more sense than trying to build one from scratch. I do find it very interesting to make the small cells with the raw materials just to see the process.

@DadHav
John-- I have not gotten any red lead yet but I did see it on Ebay. According to John Bedini you just mash it up into a water added paste, shove it into the plates, and then let it dry out.

Here is my motorcycle battery conversion from yesterday. Today I got the battery to charge up to over 11 volts.

Lead-Acid battery converted to Lead-Alum - YouTube

Lidmotor

[Slider2732]

@Lidmotor - Excellent news there with the charging

@John - Thanks for the mention and for forwarding to all in your videos
After watching your latest vids, I changed a couple of things....and went with rubber bands, as they work !

The 'cellphone battery' sized 2 plate cell was taken apart again, to try an idea, that has worked very well.
After making the Alum/distilled water mix to a stronger slightly slippery feel in the fingers, the 2 cotton balls were resoaked in that solution. My previous mix was weaker, it's good to know the right ratio.
The sandwiched plates were then put in a Ziploc bag, the remaining part of the bag trimmed and the connection leads put through the zip area. It means the cell is plastic covered to limit moisture evaporation, is hand safe and can be checked readily for any Alum crystal growth or other effects over time.
3 rubber bands secure the assembly tightly. Easy to do.
It was reformed using the Electrifly R/C hobbyygrade Ni-MH/Ni-Cd charger at 450mA for 5 minutes. During that time, the cell fizzed and the zip section was left open to allow gas to escape. The bag was then closed again.
Sitting for 20 minutes, saw the voltage drop from approx 1.8V to 0.8V.
It was run down over 10 minutes with a blocking oscillator. Then charged on the charger at 200mA (the lowest setting).
3 charges later and running it to near flat each time, sees it sit after an hour at 1.6V and will recover well from any use, back to the voltage shown in the pic of about 1.45V.
The latest run has seen the oscillator run about as bright as the one in your vids John, for an hour. Very pleased with the increased strength of solution and method to test that was shown.




Fully charged voltage:

[DadHav]

@All
I converted an old lead acid motocycle battery yesterday and had good luck. For real world power this makes more sense than trying to build one from scratch. I do find it very interesting to make the small cells with the raw materials just to see the process.

@DadHav
John-- I have not gotten any red lead yet but I did see it on Ebay. According to John Bedini you just mash it up into a water added paste, shove it into the plates, and then let it dry out.

Here is my motorcycle battery conversion from yesterday. Today I got the battery to charge up to over 11 volts.

Lead-Acid battery converted to Lead-Alum - YouTube

Lidmotor

Hello Rusty, I tried my first experiment with the lead. I have about 10 lbs of 50/50 solder that was my grandfathers. It might be 60 years old. I wrapped a couple pieces of plastic credit card with it. I didn't have much alum left so my mix was very light but I do have a few things to mention. I had the two plates separated with a few strips of double sided tape and then a band around them. I charged at about 200 ma, to 3.3 volts then the cell took a nose dive and there was nothing I could do to recover it. I went up in current and it shocked the coating off the lead. I took the plates apart cleaned them up a little then separated them with thin rubber fuel lines from R/C motors. This time the charge seamed to work. It seems like I couldn't charge higher than 2.8 volts and the drop was all the way down to .6 volts. However the little plates which where only slightly bigger than an inch had a dead short current of over 200 ma. An observation: The plates where separated about 1/8" and submerged. The plates had an even distribution of plating effect. What I mean is even the outside of the plates had the two different colors after charging. This makes me think that the chemical reaction was still happening on the outside of the plates. So do we loose potential by just using the inside faces of the plates with the cotton balls?
The other thing is, there must be a place to by alum. There should be a local source like pottery shops, paint store, garden supply or something so we can cut expense a little bit. I asked a lot of questions before but I think it would be nice to make a Lexan case with slots to drop the electrodes into, a removable top and proper venting would work nice. That way you could exeriment and change plates as you feel fit. Ha, or just use a battery like you and John did.
Thanks Rusty.
PS I have to get caught up, but when you say it charges faster do you mean you can use more current to charge or do you mean it charges faster than acid with the same current. If the battery could actually charge faster than a LAB and still have potential then maybe it would be a candidate for over unity experiments.
John Hav.

[mikrovolt]

lead plates

In this figure 3.1 is photo of a lead cell (manchex type) study from Sandia labs:
http://www.azsolarcenter.org/images/...teries/ch3.pdf

I believe a large mold to form lead positive plates is cost affective when you
consider the benefits of having a home made battery that you can do maintenance on. It makes sense, a trojan battery is good but a battery that has no acid and is easy to work on is better.

Maybe some of you have considered what a survivor battery design might
have and why our friends in Idaho are wasting no time in making this available.

video on manufacturing batteries:
How It's Made Deep Cycle Batteries - YouTube

[John_Bedini]

Alum Batteries

Mikrovolt,
It seem that you have some insight into all this. But your very correct in what your saying. The power sometimes goes out for days, and we have no Sun like some other states. Up north the jet stream just keeps it gloomy all the time during the winter. To developed a cell that can charge in low light would be very valuable for people. Now most just consider this just a hobby but when the time comes you better have something. I have friends here that just live on batteries and your right they are working overtime on how to make these cells. You need batteries that can take a very deep discharge and the bounce back as if nothing ever happened. at any time people could face power failures. Junk batteries and the plates can be used, Alum is cheap and easy to get at a spice house. The other thing is the positive plate is very important as that is the active material. Only 10% would survive a Solar Flair why, because they just think the power will always be, it will not always be here, just look at the past.

AMMONIUM ALUMINUM SULFATE known as food grade Alum can do some very strange things when it's used with Lead batteries, For one thing when combined with Lead plates can change it's impedance in the cell. for example it can change under charge to a very high impedance giving a liner charge curve which a lead acid battery can not do, During dis-charge it can change to a very low impedance to supply current for a very long time right to zero volts. you can not do that with a lead acid battery without serious damage. The other thing no acid is involved so it's safe to be around. Between all the videos posted by me and lidmotor and Slider people should be able to figure this out. Use the electron charts you will see where the power comes from.

Minimum charge gives power for a very long time, that is like backwards for batteries. Impedance is very important in cells for power and current. However as stated over on the Energy Science Forum by me one chemical is missing for the best electrolyte, and it think that missing chemical we have all used. One other thing you should study is how plants use the Sun to generate power in it's process. could be a battery without a Solar Cells charging it. so you have your hint. I post my video on the other forum as I help on the SG groups. Crystal Batteries
John B

In this figure 3.1 is photo of a lead cell (manchex type) study from Sandia labs:
http://www.azsolarcenter.org/images/...teries/ch3.pdf

I believe a large mold to form lead positive plates is cost affective when you
consider the benefits of having a home made battery that you can do maintenance on. It makes sense, a trojan battery is good but a battery that has no acid and is easy to work on is better.

Maybe some of you have considered what a survivor battery design might
have and why our friends in Idaho are wasting no time in making this available.

video on manufacturing batteries:
How It's Made Deep Cycle Batteries - YouTube

[Slider2732]

Hmmmm, sugars ! could that be it ?!
From cane to syrups, that's worth exploring with same metal cells. Even the high fructose corn stuff might gain a use, it's in everything else.
Sugar and alum appeals as a test. Mix as much as will dissolve in warmed distilled water, use the Ziploc wrapping and rubber bands and throw it in the sunlight.

Have paused for thought, while waiting for 2 lead plates to neutralize in Baking Soda. Am looking properly at photosynthesis.
Within the page here: Photosynthesis I see that there is a diagram with Magnesium at the middle.

[redrichie]

Like rock candy, would the lead plates crow crystals. Rock candy is just sugar melted to saturation in a hot container of water. Would it be good or bad if it did build crystals on the plates.
John I have about 5 old batteries laying in the shed. What do I do with the old sulphuric acid? I want to dispose of it properly.

[Allwest]

Hmmmm, sugars ! could that be it ?!
From cane to syrups, that's worth exploring with same metal cells. Even the high fructose corn stuff might gain a use, it's in everything else.
Sugar and alum appeals as a test. Mix as much as will dissolve in warmed distilled water, use the Ziploc wrapping and rubber bands and throw it in the sunlight.

Have paused for thought, while waiting for 2 lead plates to neutralize in Baking Soda. Am looking properly at photosynthesis.
Within the page here: Photosynthesis I see that there is a diagram with Magnesium at the middle.

Slider
Very interesting read, thanks

[Lidmotor]

plate forming

@ Dadhav
John-- you have to make sure that the metal is clean I found out and it is better if you rough it up with sandpaper to increase the surface area. John Bedini has the Alum mixture very strong---almost like syrup. You can get the food grade Alum at a spice supply outlet online. I have been forming my little one cell plates by zapping them with a 6v battery for about 5 seconds. It bubbles like crazy. Then I discharge it and go again. About three times and the oxides are formed up. I slow charge the cell with 3 volts to get the joules in. Expect to see about a 1.5 volt cell form up. 50/50 solder may or may not work. I think what I showed was 80/20. I found some more on Ebay and also at another dollar store. That stuff was labeled. I am currently trying linotype lead and that works very good. It is 84% lead with antimony and tin. The antimony makes the alloy stronger and stiffer.


Hope this helped.

Lidmotor

[Allwest]

@ Dadhav
John-- you have to make sure that the metal is clean I found out and it is better if you rough it up with sandpaper to increase the surface area. John Bedini has the Alum mixture very strong---almost like syrup. You can get the food grade Alum at a spice supply outlet online. I have been forming my little one cell plates by zapping them with a 6v battery for about 5 seconds. It bubbles like crazy. Then I discharge it and go again. About three times and the oxides are formed up. I slow charge the cell with 3 volts to get the joules in. Expect to see about a 1.5 volt cell form up. 50/50 solder may or may not work. I think what I showed was 80/20. I found some more on Ebay and also at another dollar store. That stuff was labeled. I am currently trying linotype lead and that works very good. It is 84% lead with antimony and tin. The antimony makes the alloy stronger and stiffer.


Hope this helped.

Lidmotor

Lid,
Have you tried other mixtures with the Alum, I have seen other videos, where they used other mixtures that created more power?

Best of luck

[prato_braun]

Please Clarify

Hi guys,

could you please clarify which alum to use? I read somewhere that it has to be
Ammonium aluminium sulfate but on this site it says sodium aluminum silicate:

How to convert a Lead Acid Battery into an Alkaline Battery - Sepp Hasslberger

Thanks a lot guys.
Cheers,

Prato

[DadHav]

@ Dadhav
John-- you have to make sure that the metal is clean I found out and it is better if you rough it up with sandpaper to increase the surface area. John Bedini has the Alum mixture very strong---almost like syrup. You can get the food grade Alum at a spice supply outlet online. I have been forming my little one cell plates by zapping them with a 6v battery for about 5 seconds. It bubbles like crazy. Then I discharge it and go again. About three times and the oxides are formed up. I slow charge the cell with 3 volts to get the joules in. Expect to see about a 1.5 volt cell form up. 50/50 solder may or may not work. I think what I showed was 80/20. I found some more on Ebay and also at another dollar store. That stuff was labeled. I am currently trying linotype lead and that works very good. It is 84% lead with antimony and tin. The antimony makes the alloy stronger and stiffer.


Hope this helped.

Lidmotor

Hi Rusty. Thanks for helping out. I'm rinsing out a small battery right now to try out but still want to make a fully serviceable battery. I know food grade Alum should be used, but I wonder how it can be different than 99% pure from E-Bay. You can get three pounds for $15.00 and free shipping. Our grocery store sells McCormick but its about $4.00 for a few ounces. We have a huge metal salvage and supply house here. I'd bet I could find some lead plate there. I'll check this week. I'll talk with you later after I try the little conversion. Did you notice in the video showing how batteries are made that they had a different coating for the negative plates of the battery, but they didn't say what it was.
Take care.
John Hav.