Bedini Earth Light

[John_Bedini]

Galvanic Effect

Ibpointless,
Not to be a bigger jerk, but maybe this is all misunderstood right from the start as to why I did the experiment with each Chemical.


I have already taken two of these Epsom Salt cells apart and found no water and no galvanic effect on the magnesium or the copper.
The water in the cell is bound in a crystalline form. So there is no free water. I can do better then that and mount a probe inside the crystal .

Here is what I found,
The Rochelle Salts combined with Epsom Salts and Sodium Silicate does suck in water that is why I said do not use it in the mix. Rochelle Salts is known for that as it has destroyed many Microphones. We can do better then that by making a ceramic out of it with the pure chemicals contained in Epsom Salts.

The cells I have made continue to put out power with heat I check that everyday.

So what your saying is that Hutchinson's cell is Galvanic and will only work for a short time until the chemicals dry completely out, unless water appears again (That means Ionic and no spooky Casmir effect or Zero point energy, just a Galvanic Battery). And that all of the cells including yours will do the same thing?.

Cook some and find the water that is free we all need to see this.

Now did you heat the cell again? See what I was doing here was making a Thermopile out of cheap Epsom Salts has nothing to do with a battery as I could use any metals and get the effect. To tell the truth, I would not make a Crystal Battery this way, But I have learned something here about what not to do.
John B

[quantumuppercut]

I've just spent times playing around some more. I tried the same metal but it does not work out as a temperature differentials. So still sticking with two dissimilar metal.

The water theory seems plausible, but as I heat up the cell a while ago and observe voltage going up, I accidentally melt the salt again and it gives no voltage. If I didn't short it out, then the water theory won't fit.

[ibpointless2]

Ibpointless,
Not to be a bigger jerk, but maybe this is all misunderstood right from the start as to why I did the experiment with each Chemical.


I have already taken two of these Epsom Salt cells apart and found no water and no galvanic effect on the magnesium or the copper.
The water in the cell is bound in a crystalline form. So there is no free water. I can do better then that and mount a probe inside the crystal .

Here is what I found,
The Rochelle Salts combined with Epsom Salts and Sodium Silicate does suck in water that is why I said do not use it in the mix. Rochelle Salts is known for that as it has destroyed many Microphones. We can do better then that by making a ceramic out of it with the pure chemicals contained in Epsom Salts.

The cells I have made continue to put out power with heat I check that everyday.

So what your saying is that Hutchinson's cell is Galvanic and will only work for a short time until the chemicals dry completely out, unless water appears again (That means Ionic and no spooky Casmir effect or Zero point energy, just a Galvanic Battery). And that all of the cells including yours will do the same thing?.

Cook some and find the water that is free we all need to see this.

Now did you heat the cell again? See what I was doing here was making a Thermopile out of cheap Epsom Salts has nothing to do with a battery as I could use any metals and get the effect. To tell the truth, I would not make a Crystal Battery this way, But I have learned something here about what not to do.
John B

John Bedini,

I like I said I don't mean to be rude. I can only report what I see and I do agree that this is just a big learning process for all of us. I can not confirm John Hutchinson cells as I have not built one nor plan to. I can only report on the cells I've built. I have built the Epsom salt only cell and after 24 hours sitting in room temperature It produces 7mV, but thats my cell and your cell maybe doing something different. My dry cell that uses Alum, Salt substitute, and Borax still produces over a volt sitting in room temperature for more than 24 hours and is able to run a LED as proof from Lidmotor. I'm not typing this to insult you, but I respect you enough to let know the bad news and I would expect the same from you when you look at my cells. I'm sorry I misunderstood you intentions with the Epsom salt, I and probably many others thought you were building a crystal battery and not a Thermopile. I get what you're doing with the idea, trying to collect the wasted heat energy that is around us but I'm looking out for you as in my experiment the Epsom salt is dirty girl to mess with. I have heated the epsom salt cell back up and it does spring back to life but I must stand by what i say, when you heat the Epsom salt up it release the water and let it cool the water goes back into the crystal and after 24 hours no water is left and the cell becomes dead.

[John_Bedini]

Epsom Salts

Ibpointless,
Ok, so you did not build the cell that John Hutchinson has shown.
And you did re-heat the Epsom salt to find the same thing. That is what I wanted to know, you have answered my question. I do understand the bad news when it comes to Epsom Salts but I'm not using it that way and I can substitute it, it's just going to cost way more.

Have you tried heating the Salt substitute to melt it? And yes I would let you know also. I have not built your cells yet so I can't say. I just like to focus one thing at a time. So I guess I can move on figuring out how to dope this material for what I want it to do. I guess we have a new name for this salt, Dirty Girl.
Thanks ibpointless2
John B

[area46241]

copper alum coffee filters campfire starter...

Hey there people...I have put together two cells with the 2 inch coppr pipe caps filled the bottom with half a small can of alum each poored saturated alum water on them and stuffed coffee filters around the base of the mag stick and have been running a joule thief for about a month now...they dry out but the light never goes out completely...the crystals of alum and mag are growing around the base nicely and it appears to put out when its completely dry......the one thing I thought was important was to not disturb the mag stick or the crystal growth in the filters. It does better when wet yes...but when dry it still works...oh and i heated the copper on a hot plate to get the burnt discoloring before assembling... they work dry...they work better wet...........so where is the epsom salt leading? away from alum? I like the alum cell. Is there a particular mineral I can get out of the colorful landscape stones and crush for a dopant? gelena? boron? oxides? This topic is a hot one...

[John_Bedini]

Epsom Salts Heated

Ibpointless2,

Anyway you asked me to tell you so I will, this is what happens when you heat Epsom Salt or melt it.

Empirical Formula of Epsom Salt MgSO4·7H2O... not very stable and all the water may be removed from the hydrated crystal by heating, leaving the anhydrous salt behind MgSO4.

MgSO4·7H2O Heat > to MgSO4.

John B

[quantumuppercut]

I've just done some more experiment this morning.

First I dismantle the epsom melt cells and there were no short when it melts. So in melt form it does not act as a water battery in my opinion. I also observed 2 forms of epsoms. One is the fine powder and one is hard rock. The powder is easily crush by hand and the hard rock doesn't react much to water and very hard to break. My opinion is we do need the water to keep the crystal intact. If it is in powder form, it does not conduct. So overheat the epsom will lead to bad cells.

I also try 3 new cells this morning.

1/ alum only
2/ norton salt only
3/ borax only

The norton salt (NaCl) does not melt. I think this is due to no water in the crystal. Borax becomes a foam and not liquid to work with. Alum is the best one. It is even better than epsom in my opinion. It acts as a thermo cell just like the epsom. When I over heat and melt it, again, voltage decrease as it become a liquid, showing water galvanic is not an accurate analysis.

I think this is a great finding and great time to come together to develop these cheap cells, or at least promote the engineering of such. This thing will beat any solar or thermo currently in the market.

[chuck H]

E-mail

John B. check your e-mail.

[John_Bedini]

Crystal Cells

John B. check your e-mail.

Chuck,
Yes this is what we need to make that salutation. That looks like real good stuff. I have some of the other in the garage. I will give it a test today, I want to prove it out before we say anything about how to do it.
If this works out we can test any of the rocks.
John B

[eternalightwithin]

research

Been reading up on the MgSO4*7H2O crystalline structure.
Apparently it's Orthorhombic. I typed that into google and link 13 was this paper out of Japan.

Crystallographically engineered BaTiO3 (Barium Titanate) single crystals for high-performance piezoelectrics.

It has the same orthorhombic structure as the hydrated form of MgSO4. It's Piezolectricity increases when a bias current is supplied.

[mikrovolt]

Eternalightwithin, welcome , thankyou.
I also came into that area of piezo as part of trying to find an accurate description of the star cell.

It has been difficult, the star cell is very unique. I am looking at two properties; the energy generation and the seismic energy absorption.

Some of the difficulties was I needed an approach to piezoelectric ceramic structure that produce the natual thermal electric properties and how that structure can sense seismic activity. I read that the introduction of electrical current during the molten to solid transition results in an expanded lattice. When it cools there are attraction forces from being stretched will remain locked in solidly fixed. The Prigogine theory explains further how the properties engineered into the crystal can accomplish source or sink.

Possibly the thermal wave from the copper induced through the crystal produces IR electrical current in the magnesium, however
the longitudinal (siesmic wave) appears to be forming constructive interference as a microphonic modulation on an IR carrier.
I am not that aware that a normal diode can demodulate seismic off an IR wave?
It can be compared and contrasted to earth battery picking up this phenomena on an oscilloscope.
there is another unusual glitch he calls a jump where the silly thing disappears like the oscilloscope is defective.
Oscilloscope Connected to Earth Battery Showing Seismic Activity? - YouTube


Most documentation on piezoelectric focus on the acoustic and transducer wafer model. For this reason most information does not apply because star cell is not standard piezo but is related.
If there is a Tom Bearden explanation on piezoelectric energy as a starting point in getting basic definitions and terminology that could help build a model to explain all this. I think your comment is in the right direction.

[eternalightwithin]

I'm just really wishing to continue T.T.Brown research with Lab Book 3
It was getting good.

[John_Bedini]

Crystal Cells

Eternalightwithin, welcome , thankyou.
I also came into that area of piezo as part of trying to find an accurate description of the star cell.

It has been difficult, the star cell is very unique. I am looking at two properties; the energy generation and the seismic energy absorption.

Some of the difficulties was I needed an approach to piezoelectric ceramic structure that produce the natual thermal electric properties and how that structure can sense seismic activity. I read that the introduction of electrical current during the molten to solid transition results in an expanded lattice. When it cools there are attraction forces from being stretched will remain locked in solidly fixed. The Prigogine theory explains further how the properties engineered into the crystal can accomplish source or sink.

Possibly the thermal wave from the copper induced through the crystal produces IR electrical current in the magnesium, however
the longitudinal (siesmic wave) appears to be forming constructive interference as a microphonic modulation on an IR carrier.
I am not that aware that a normal diode can demodulate seismic off an IR wave?
It can be compared and contrasted to earth battery picking up this phenomena on an oscilloscope.
there is another unusual glitch he calls a jump where the silly thing disappears like the oscilloscope is defective.
Oscilloscope Connected to Earth Battery Showing Seismic Activity? - YouTube


Most documentation on piezoelectric focus on the acoustic and transducer wafer model. For this reason most information does not apply because star cell is not standard piezo but is related.
If there is a Tom Bearden explanation on piezoelectric energy as a starting point in getting basic definitions and terminology that could help build a model to explain all this. I think your comment is in the right direction.

Mikrovolt,
Maybe I can help you see to what my thinking was. As you know I have been working with rocks, just about my whole life, this is how I met Tom Bearden years ago. I sent Tom these crystals and then started investigating all the sources for the different types of energies. The one thing I did learn from what I was doing was that everything is interconnected in nature, you can't break that field.

My research was always documented with lab notes. So let me explain, If you set up magnets in a line and you wiggle just one of them they all wiggle. Nature works just the same way. If you cut down one tree they all feel it and this has been measured, that's right they all cry.

Your senses are the best to indicate these things except we do not exercise the mind that way, but some people have been trained to use it. Another example of that is, you decide one day to take the left road and have missed the accident, how did that happen, something just told you that and you just turned without thinking. Later you have read about an accident taking place on the right road.

Look at it this way when your not thinking to much is when the answer just pops out of nowhere, that has happened to you. Myself on the other hand want to test everything and in doing so I find Natures hidden energies this way. I know that the Star Cell may be very difficult to understand but it is not that is why I conducted all these test to find out what each Chemical did when you change them with heat.

The penny cells I wanted to test because I did change the mix to Rochelle Salts, Epsom Salts, Barium Titanate , Strontium Titanate, very little Selenium.

We know That Corpus Copper can be used for Solar Cells, Rectifiers and Photo Sensors and can be tailored to conduct certain bands of energy, your eyes work this way. Now In one of my early posts I did point out that Gravitational waves could be detected, along with earthquakes in the noise of the semiconductor device. Again anything you do on the surface of the earth affects everything and can be detected in this Gravity field, the magnets as an example.

I did post that I was going to find out where the energy was coming from, I said, I can heat Alum and not get much of an effect, Rochelle Salts I can get the effect, the only thing left was the Epsom Salts as a cell stand alone. I already knew that if the chemical is heated it no longer is Epsom Salts and looses the water, but now this is a far different Crystal and conducts different. I had the Two Metals I wanted to use, Remember each metal has it's own frequency bands it works in.

First was to find out how John Hutchinson's Cell worked It was good and tricky as he never explains himself so I had to go through all of these tests. The Cell is more then what he is talking about as it can change energy patterns over different areas and detect much more when the correct filters are applied and amplified, Gravity Waves with information.

So I will go over this again, The Rochelle Salts are piezoelectric, meaning they can generate small amounts of energy with small stress to them, Epsom Salts when heated is a much different Crystal and expands different from the Rochelle Salts these two cause a differential in expansion this is enough to generate small Carrier Electrons in the Crystal Lattice, doping just helps move them along to the metal plates.

( What it detects is Gravitontial, Heat or ambient energy and Far-inferred and anything that can generate Longitudinal waves )

When you heat these two together you change the way the Crystal works and at which bandwidth it detects, but you can not do it every time as we are working with crude tools. And this applies to the semiconductor industry as each transistor has high and low betas, and different curves.

I pointed to: "Prigogine system" because this is what happens when you cause things to be non-linear, you are building a non-linear device because you want to detect non-liner things with this Crystal Cells.

Again, "Prigogine system: a many-particle system which is deliberately forced to exist far from thermodynamic equilibrium, and which exhibits negative entropy. Note that local curvature of vacuum spacetime places the local virtual state flux in nonequilibrium conditions, with the result that an observable energy "sink" or "source" can be produced."
You must undestand this mans thinking.......
Hope this helps
John B

[John_Bedini]

Prigogine crystal

Prigogine crystal: an amorphous pellet or crystal made by sintering finely divided material at high temperature and pressure, in such fashion that the pellet becomes a highly stressed system far from thermodynamic equilibrium. Specifically, more than one type of material must be used, one ingredient of which must be piezoelectric. One ingredient should also be radioactive, and preferably one of the uranium compounds exhibiting highly anomalous magnetic spin coupling. For best results, a third ingredient should be luminescent when electrically stimulated. The stress on each grain of the piezoelectric material must be just so that the grain is on the very verge of being slightly stress cracked, but not split. Each grain then becomes a scalar interferometer. Such a crystal produces a scalar potential field and can react to minute changes in potential - i.e., it can react to scalar waves. Via scalar interferometry it can change scalar waves into negative (time-reversed) electromagnetic radiation and energy at a slight distance. Under oscillating potential stress, the radioactive ingredient provides a one-way gate valve from the Dirac Sea electrons of vacuum and the scalar interferometers provide necessary impetus on these negative energy electrons to lift them out of the Dirac sea, producing negative electricity and currents. These currents can then be collected in multiple stages to provide electrical power (negative power operates devices much better than positive power). In the proper arrangement, such a Prigogine crystal can be made into a system capable of tapping the energy of vacuum directly. T. H. Moray built exactly such systems in the 1920's and 1930's, finally obtaining 50 kilowatts of negative power from a 55-lb device. J. Bedini has produced modern versions of these stress crystals in the 1980's, and a series of negative power devices. Several other inventors have produced successful negative power devices also.

[seth]

The water in the cell is bound in a crystalline form. So there is no free water. I can do better then that and mount a probe inside the crystal .

Here is what I found,
The Rochelle Salts combined with Epsom Salts and Sodium Silicate does suck in water that is why I said do not use it in the mix. Rochelle Salts is known for that as it has destroyed many Microphones. We can do better then that by making a ceramic out of it with the pure chemicals contained in Epsom Salts.

The cells I have made continue to put out power with heat I check that everyday.

So what your saying is that Hutchinson's cell is Galvanic and will only work for a short time until the chemicals dry completely out, unless water appears again (That means Ionic and no spooky Casmir effect or Zero point energy, just a Galvanic Battery). And that all of the cells including yours will do the same thing?.

Cook some and find the water that is free we all need to see this.

Now did you heat the cell again? See what I was doing here was making a Thermopile out of cheap Epsom Salts has nothing to do with a battery as I could use any metals and get the effect. To tell the truth, I would not make a Crystal Battery this way, But I have learned something here about what not to do.
John B

I really like your explanation of whats going on here - the piezoelectric Rochelle salt converting mechanical stress into electricity as the epsom salt cools and crystallizes - a fascinating idea. Im reading as much as I can about piezoelectricity, ferroelectricity and electrets to try and get a grasp of what may be going on here.....


But sadly my cells have all died now - they all used the JHutchison cell ingredients, but without the sodium sillicate. If I add water to them (just a drop), they start working again.

I'm afraid that the water of crystallization molecules are NOT firmly bonded into the crystal lattice - weak hydrogen bonds hold them in place, and because of the large number of water molecules for each magnesium sulphate, these bonds are easily broken allowing the water molecules to carry the charge and oxidize the electrodes.

Im difinitely going to have to try a different mix to get something which isnt galvanic. John Hutchison's cells arent doing it for me so far.....