Bedini Earth Light

[John_Bedini]

That is right it does not make any difference

I have a quick question, Have any of you guys noticed a correlation between energy output and surface area of the electrodes?
with the cell I have been playing around with today, I have noticed it doesn't work nearly as well when I increase the electrode surface area. I am talking night and day difference.
I used the same cell plates from the video I posted, and wasn't getting anywhere near the same output. but when I just put the edges of the plates together, the output went up to enough to light the LED. When I went back to using the smaller plates, I got much much better output...
Still having issues with the LED not lighting at all in certain current ranges, which is also very confusing.
I am not sure what to make of all this, but I am still getting nice bright light from the LED @ 500ľA input from the cell. I am also still struggling to increase the voltage.
I also tried the iron pyrite, but it didn't seem to work as well as the iron filings, which I am sure are rusting, so there is a real possibility to using oxidized iron in these cells to boost output.
who knows, I might just be having a galvanic reaction, and could be totally off base here. I will make another video shortly, though I want to run some more tests first, and will document my results so far
Very interesting to say the least

N8

Neight,
That is right it does not make any difference, the only difference is the spacing between electrodes. But these crystals grow and push away from each other, then the current goes down. The metals have a fixed potential and that is the way it is. To get the current you need to make it look like the plates in a storage battery, this is going to take some doing but it can be done. I have done that experiment and it works.
John B

[Lidmotor]

AM radio chip on Ebay

@John and Chuck

Here the link to the AM radio chip on Ebay. Two for $5 encluding shipping. Comes from Rhode Island-- NOT China. Good supplier and fast.

TA7642 Replaces MK484/ZN414 Single Chip AM Radio: 2-Lot | eBay

Here is some circuit ideas using the chip---

Alan Yates' Laboratory - MK484 MW Receiver

Lidmotor

[Neight]

Neight,
That is right it does not make any difference, the only difference is the spacing between electrodes. But these crystals grow and push away from each other, then the current goes down. The metals have a fixed potential and that is the way it is. To get the current you need to make it look like the plates in a storage battery, this is going to take some doing but it can be done. I have done that experiment and it works.
John B

Thanks so much for the response John
You pretty well confirmed what I was thinking about the contact surface area of the plates, and caused me to go look up storage battery construction.
After looking through some images of storage batteries, I went ahead and put two cells together and made myself a battery
I used the same mix in both cells, with paper towels separating each layer, and a dry paper towel between the two individual cells.
on the meters, I can now get just a bit over 1v and shorted over 2mA.
This thing is still really sensitive to how much water I use in it, too much and I get lower output, too little and I get almost no output.
I made a video showing what I have here, and also showing the light going out at certain current ranges.
I have to run some more tests, but for the moment, I am going to let this thing set and see how long it lasts without adding water, and how much adding water brings it back.
I will keep you guys updated, but I am pretty excited with the results I am getting, and happy to be going in the right direction

The video is uploading, and I will post the link when it is ready
thanks!

N8

After posting this, I realized I made a mistake in hooking the cells up in series, as that is not a storage battery. I went ahead and hooked them up in parallel, and got much brighter light out of the LED! In parallel, shorted on the meter, it makes over 500mV and just a bit over 3mA. in series I was getting around 1v at 1-2mA, so much better current output. I was really suprised at how much brighter the LED got, and I will keep playing with this and see how much I can improve the results!

here is the video link -
2 cells = 1 battery - YouTube
and I will post another link shortly showing the battery with the cells hooked in parallel instead of in series. I am also quickly show a few other short tests I did in the meantime

and now for video 2 -
2cells=1 battery (part 2) + crystal cell battery charger, and foolsgold quarts cell! - YouTube
this one just shows the light output of the two cells hooked in parallel, along with using this 2 cell battery to run a joule ringer AA battery charger, and a very quick demo using different rocks and crystals as electrodes.
enjoy

[ibpointless2]

Thas real interesting, thanks man... im ordering my hematites now... if the cells work with the mix the same way with good current, thats great, no more corrosion problems, what about the current? im really curious man, all of us wanna see the current reading... cheers, good job

You don't have to worry about the hematite corroding because its already in its corroded state.

[jehdds]

Guys,
Here is a macroscopic precedent for how our cells may work.
Antarctic salty soil sucks water out of atmosphere: Could it happen on Mars?
Very Best Regards,
Jim

[ibpointless2]

The amp reading on a cell with a Hematite electrode. Amp reading on Hematite Rock Electrode - YouTube


different spots on the rock and different hematite rocks give different kinds of amp readings. You must find the sweet spot on the rock just like you would with a crystal detector on a crystal radio. Also what Electrodes you use with the rock also will affect the reading and how big it is too. In the video I used tap water and small aluminum wire.

[jehdds]

Guys,

Here is another compound that I have used to make cells that digest water akin to what John's cells do. TiO2 is worth exploring as a constituent.

"The photocatalytic properties of titanium dioxide were discovered by Akira Fujishima in 1967[27] and published in 1972.[28] The process on the surface of the titanium dioxide was called the Honda-Fujishima effect.[27] Titanium dioxide has potential for use in energy production: as a photocatalyst, it can carry out hydrolysis; i.e., break water into hydrogen and oxygen. Were the hydrogen collected, it could be used as a fuel. The efficiency of this process can be greatly improved by doping the oxide with carbon.[29] Further efficiency and durability has been obtained by introducing disorder to the lattice structure of the surface layer of titanium dioxide nanocrystals, permitting infrared absorption.[30]

This disassociation may be one mechanism of current production in these cells as well.

Titanium dioxide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Very Best Regards,
Jim

[cgalvisardila]

The amp reading on a cell with a Hematite electrode. Amp reading on Hematite Rock Electrode - YouTube


different spots on the rock and different hematite rocks give different kinds of amp readings. You must find the sweet spot on the rock just like you would with a crystal detector on a crystal radio. Also what Electrodes you use with the rock also will affect the reading and how big it is too. In the video I used tap water and small aluminum wire.

hey, not bad at all, definitely worth looking into it

[Neight]

Hello all
After a 7 hour run on my oscillator, my battery had used up all it's water, and the light was barely putting out anything at all...
I would like to find a easy way to seal this up, and keep as much evaporation out of the equation as possible, but it sure seems like it is consuming a lot of water at the moment. just a few drops added to it perked it right back up to full power though, so that is encouraging
It would be nice to figure out a way to feed water to the battery along the lines of Lidmotor's test from his video several days back.
I am thinking of trying to find a drip feed method that would only drip one drop on the edge of the battery once or twice an hour, though I am not even sure it is possible to control the drip rate without some kind of control system in place.
Will have to do some thinking on that one...
either way, I am glad to see it working so well, and I will keep you guys updated
N8

[plengo]

I have a quick question, Have any of you guys noticed a correlation between energy output and surface area of the electrodes?
with the cell I have been playing around with today, I have noticed it doesn't work nearly as well when I increase the electrode surface area. I am talking night and day difference.
I used the same cell plates from the video I posted, and wasn't getting anywhere near the same output. but when I just put the edges of the plates together, the output went up to enough to light the LED. When I went back to using the smaller plates, I got much much better output...
Still having issues with the LED not lighting at all in certain current ranges, which is also very confusing.
I am not sure what to make of all this, but I am still getting nice bright light from the LED @ 500ľA input from the cell. I am also still struggling to increase the voltage.
I also tried the iron pyrite, but it didn't seem to work as well as the iron filings, which I am sure are rusting, so there is a real possibility to using oxidized iron in these cells to boost output.
who knows, I might just be having a galvanic reaction, and could be totally off base here. I will make another video shortly, though I want to run some more tests first, and will document my results so far
Very interesting to say the least

N8

Yes I have. I have cells from 1/4" inch height up to 12" and the total current output seems to not have any linear correlation. It is very much limited to small amperage.

Putting many cells in parallel or in series did not behave as expected. THey seems to fight each other and balance to a certain current. Voltage DOES increase linearly.

My 1/4" height cells seems to be the winner in output and constant over time. My 2" height cells is also very good.

Fausto.

[Neight]

Yes I have. I have cells from 1/4" inch height up to 12" and the total current output seems to not have any linear correlation. It is very much limited to small amperage.

Putting many cells in parallel or in series did not behave as expected. THey seems to fight each other and balance to a certain current. Voltage DOES increase linearly.

My 1/4" height cells seems to be the winner in output and constant over time. My 2" height cells is also very good.

Fausto.

Thanks so much for the info Fausto!
I seem to have something working a bit different in my cells, as adding them in series and in parallel acts just as I would expect them to, but adding more contact surface area does match your results, limited voltage output, regardless of size. As with yours, the smaller contact area I use, the better (more efficient maybe?) the output is. Very interesting to say the least.
I have not had to add more water since my last post, and I am still getting great light output. This little battery seems to be either on or off. Either it has some water in it, and has great output, or it doesn't and has nearly no output. Which sort of correlates with my issues of it not working in a certain current range.
I definitely have something going on here that isn't happening with everyone else's cells, but overall I seem to be in the ballpark.
Thanks for the info

N8

[NickZ]

There has to be some correlation between current output and cell size, as with normal AA to D size regular batteries. AAs size can output 1500 mA, while D size have 10.000 mA, almost ten time more current output, with the same voltage. So, I would assume it is very similar with with our cells.
What we not know yet is what it the best size and ratio for every given combination of electrodes and electrolyte. And what volume is optimum size of the electrolyte, also an important point.

[Neight]

There has to be some correlation between current output and cell size, as with normal AA to D size regular batteries. AAs size can output 1500 mA, while D size have 10.000 mA, almost ten time more current output, with the same voltage. So, I would assume it is very similar with with our cells.
What we not know yet is what it the best size and ratio for every given combination of electrodes and electrolyte. And what volume is optimum size of the electrolyte, also an important point.

You make a good point, and I think more rigorous testing needs to be done on the amount of electrolyte used in relationship to plate size. It seems nearly impossible that there is no difference in plate size and output, but so far I have built a few different cells, and in every case, the less contact area I had between the plates, the better my output got...
Since it is an issue that has come up, perhaps more people will start testing cell size and electrolyte volume, and we can find an optimum range for these cells to be built with, and more standard relationships to build these cells and get consistent results.

[Dan S]

Hi, here is a link to a fellow selling the MK484, not the substitute for MK484 IC on Ebay.

Scotts Electronics MK484 AM Radio IC MK 484 or MK-484 MK484-1

Dan

[plengo]

You make a good point, and I think more rigorous testing needs to be done on the amount of electrolyte used in relationship to plate size. It seems nearly impossible that there is no difference in plate size and output, but so far I have built a few different cells, and in every case, the less contact area I had between the plates, the better my output got...
Since it is an issue that has come up, perhaps more people will start testing cell size and electrolyte volume, and we can find an optimum range for these cells to be built with, and more standard relationships to build these cells and get consistent results.

THis was one of the reason I mention much earlier that geometry seems to be extremely important. I could not see a linear relationship with my cells sizes. They do perform much longer without refueling with water when they are bigger and that is very logic, more area more water.

Unfortunately surface area only will not give you the amps you want. I think the trick with geometry is not really surface area since my smallest cells performs as good as my biggest one.

IF, and a BIG IF, the crystal growth is really important, like veins in our bodies, I think it is not about surface area but inner surface area of the tubes like our intestines (sorry for the grotesqueness). We can have lots of surface are in small areas. So linear straight surface area or Mg for example is not interesting but the growth of the crystal paths where the water must flow and therefore becomes power is of relevance.

I have a tiny cell that puts so much power out that is simply illogical.

BTW, my iron pyrite cell is going extremely well. It does protect much better the Mg.

I will try a new cell using Titanium.

Fausto.