All about electrolysers, HHO, joecells ect. :)

[Jetijs]

Here is a quick update about the aluminum in KOH solution:
YouTube - aluminum in KOH solution video2
As you can see, after 5 days there is still a gas production going on. The aluminum piece has became smaller. The reaction has also became less intense, that might indicate that the KOH is also consumed in this reaction. You can see all that black gunk on the bottom of the jar, that is aluminum oxide.
Thanks,
Jetijs

[dodeca]

Re: The aluminum piece has became smaller

Nice Vid ...

You Said ...

Five days have passed. The piece of aluminum has become very small, but there is still a reasonable production of gas going on. Still, the production seems less than at the first day. This could indicate that the KOH is also consumed in this reaction. The top of the glass jar has become covered with white powder, this is probably KOH that has settled on the jar via solution vapor. Anyway - this is interesting stuff If someone is good in chemistry, he might explain what is happening in this reaction better


What I notice is that electrolysis above a certain voltage breaks down the electrodes. And the problem being low voltage produces little gas.

I am currently entertaining the idea to use radiant energy ( hi freq and hi volts ) to charge up water like a capacitor. Apply high voltage to the water with only one electrode. Then in a separate current loop apply pulsed dc at a low voltage and hope i can find a frequency that will break the water down with less that normal current flow.

Dodeca

[rosco1]

Here is a quick update about the aluminum in KOH solution:
YouTube - aluminum in KOH solution video2
As you can see, after 5 days there is still a gas production going on. The aluminum piece has became smaller. The reaction has also became less intense, that might indicate that the KOH is also consumed in this reaction. You can see all that black gunk on the bottom of the jar, that is aluminum oxide.
Thanks,
Jetijs

I'd just like to sign in at this point and offer everyone my support and utmost encouragement, now that things appear to have settled down a little.

You Gentlemen are going beyond! I've sat back, edge of seat, and anxiously awaited the next installment, and I've never been disappointed.

I feel you fellows are breaking ground faster than anyone else, and given this "open" style forum, advances are always being realised, and shared, and seemingly advancing much faster than what could be expected in the usual "realm" of developments.

I'd love to hop in, but you fellows are way advanced on me at this point, and I dare say, I could never hope to catch up from here.

My only contribution at this point could be this:

I strongly feel, that attaining, adequate "firing" of the combustibles is failing at this point. I still feel that the advances are perhaps beyond where they should be, given that we still can't "fire" the stuff as well as we could, and indeed should.

While I realise the "Firestorm" plug concept is still awaiting further development, with regard to it's "ceramics", perhaps the Brisk plug could, and verily should, be regarded as at least the next best concept plug, to "test" at this point.

My reasoning here is this, we are seeing baseline tests being conducted with a far less than adequate ignition system, and while the results are very exciting, they are nevertheless, well below what could, and should be achievable at this point.

I strongly feel the "gains" here are offset by the "losses", in the poor ignitions we are getting inside the combustion chamber, due to the substandard ignitions on offer.

I'm not trying to dampen the spirit here, but perhaps while these other more advanced fellows are leaping ahead here with the combustibles, others could be backing them up, by looking at more efficient ways of "firing" the juice they produce.

I apologise if my frankness offends, but it seems to me, that we are getting a little bit ahead of ourselves here. I've sat back and watched too, in veritable awe, when I could have been doing "something" to help.

It's ok to sit back in awe, but there are people here who could be moving forward in other areas, which can aid the advancements of these more advanced few.

I have a pressure chamber arriving here sometime next week, hopefully suitable for testing all different types of spark plugs, and I plan to get down to it, looking at ways to "fire" this stuff, with a whole range of plugs.

I trust there are people out there with ideas, who may like to offer advices on modifications, etc, that could see us "catch up" to the point where we can offer these "fuel" chaps a system that will, fully realise they're efforts.

We shouldn't sit back and wait for the plug developers to catch up, they are verily stymying the advances.

We can't have the "best" plugs just yet, but we can have "next best".

I strongly feel that we should be burning as much as we can now, in a given combustion chamber, before we start "throwing another log on the fire".

Just a thought....

[Tarkus]

Plugs

Rosco1: I'm not sure who your addressing or maybe a general statement is all.

I myself am running the bosh Platinum 4 with a MSD (multiple spark discharge) at approx 45,000v, short of a true plasma field ignition it's the best I came up with for my HHO system.

I also think that Hydrogen has such a fast and complete burn, that good is all we need to get maximum efficiency as far as ignition systems, at least till we build completely new engines to run it in.

If you come up with better please post your finding and were to acquire.

Thanks
David

[Aaron]

hho burn speed

Hi David,

For gas engines, would you want the HHO gas to have a slower burn?

[Tarkus]

Burn rate

Aaron your correct we actually need to slow the burn rate down for standard ICEs and or modify timing to accommodate the faster burn rate. At least for burning just hydrogen

I should have stated that the HHO assist, increases the efficacy of the ignition of the other fuel hence my opinion that bigger & better ignition systems may not be needed. ( I could be wrong)

Any way someone stole my little Toyota last night with my HHO generator in it, so I guess I start over with my big Ford.

Best to all
David

[Aaron]

slow burn hho

Hi David,

The burn rate of HHO can be slowed by pulsing magnetic coils on the gas as it is produced.

Xogen mentions some of this in his patents and even Stan Meyer's showed the concept in his very first patent, which was in Canada.

I don't necessarily agree with the orthohydrogen vs parahydrogen concepts, but it seems documented enough that pulsed coils affect the burn rate of the water gases.

I have seen only video demos of the water gas burning slowly on a stove type burner situation.

It seems the concept can be carried to the ICE.

[blowback]

Hi jetijs
I have read all the parts I can about your electrolizer and would like to try and make one. I need a little help as to the final setup you used and I cannot see how you did the connections. What do you know about PWM as to its effect. I have made a 50 Amp PWM unit with either constant current or constant voltage. I guess if you keep the voltage constant then the heating effect will be minimal. I have started at the other end and now need to build the best gas unit I can. In my workshop at work I have most machines and can do the cutting myself. I have a good plasma cutter and will make the electrodes from SS plate. Some one wrote the thinner the better, is that correct?? Waiting to here from you. This is a great deal of fun.
Blowback

[Jetijs]

Hi blowback

Currently I am in plate conditioning process of my series cell. O don't really know which is the best design, they all have their advantages and disadvantages. Many things depend on what resources and tools you have available and how much money do you want to spend. I suggest you to read through the pdf document that Readmeanie posted here:

http://www.energeticforum.com/energy...ould-have.html

This should answer majority of your questions. Also I don't really know about plate thickness, I think that there is no difference if you use 1mm or 5mm thick plates, except for weight, of course But I am not sure
Hope this helps.

[rosco1]

For consideration

Here is a quick update about the aluminum in KOH solution:
YouTube - aluminum in KOH solution video2
As you can see, after 5 days there is still a gas production going on. The aluminum piece has became smaller. The reaction has also became less intense, that might indicate that the KOH is also consumed in this reaction. You can see all that black gunk on the bottom of the jar, that is aluminum oxide.
Thanks,
Jetijs

Hi Jetijs,

I've found some rather interesting information which may further your work, and perhaps help you resolve the foaming issue.

Please check this vid, and while the whole thing is interesting, the footage captured 1 minute into the vid really is quite amazing.

YouTube - Daniel Dingel - Water Car

Also see this vid, more info on same system.

YouTube - Car Using Water As Fuel 2

Finally this, again, more details are alluded to.

YouTube - Car Using Water As Fuel 1


Regards,
rosco1

[Redmeanie]

Hi blowback

Currently I am in plate conditioning process of my series cell. O don't really know which is the best design, they all have their advantages and disadvantages. Many things depend on what resources and tools you have available and how much money do you want to spend. I suggest you to read through the pdf document that Readmeanie posted here:

http://www.energeticforum.com/energy...ould-have.html

This should answer majority of your questions. Also I don't really know about plate thickness, I think that there is no difference if you use 1mm or 5mm thick plates, except for weight, of course But I am not sure
Hope this helps.

Jet, You are right, there is no difference in the thickness of the plates at all! So save your money and get the thinnest "usable" material you can find. Plus its allot easier to use tin cutters when making cuts..

[blowback]

Hi Jetijs
Thank you for the reply. I have done what you said and have learnt a lot. I guess it is true to say the learning curve is vertical at the moment. I do have a good workshop with milling machine , lathe etc. I also have a new toy which is a plasma cutter. Great for cutting anything metal and quick as well. Very low heat input to the cutting area so I can cut thin plates without distortion. Why has no one made just 1 cell to find out all they can before making a whole set. Is it because of the voltage supply issue of 1.4V at 20 to 50 amps?? It would save a lot of money, thats for sure. I have about 4 nearly new 0 to 50V at 100 amp adjustable power supplies. They can operate in constant current and constant voltage modes. I thought I would start there.
Blowback

[orgonaut]

Hi all,
My first post here, I am in the process of making a
Smack style cell to get some hands on experience,
and then I saw the pics of Jetijs' series cell at
post #153.
Well I am in love with it, as you say Jetijs
relatively easy to make and good looking too.
Have you any new mods or results on this cell? I
would like to replicate it if it is ok with you
Jetijs so any more pics or drawings would be
appreciated as I am not quite sure how the top is made
gas tight and access for topping up the cells.
I intend to use a Dave Lawton PWM but the 555 timer
chips won't carry much current so they need to be
replaced with high amp triacs but I am not sure of
a suitable one, any suggestons welcome.
My goal is to run a 5hp stationary engine on 100%
hho.
Anyway thanks to all the posters here, very useful
info.

Zap
(in the Philippines.)

[rosco1]

Exciting new development in HHO production

On Saturday, something quite interesting occurred in the development of HHO production as we know it.

Watch this vid carefully: YouTube - HHO experiement with horizontal stainless mesh cell

Of course the volatility of the output is still in question, but I feel that once the vacuum source has been adjusted down to allow for a higher percentage of HHO in the overall output, the gains will be hard to ignore.

I think this fellow has stumbled across something very promising here.

[Fatman1]

Hello people, this is my frist try and replaying in here so I might mess it up.
Been watching and reading on this site a while and thought I would join and share the fun. I read alot that its amps not volts that make HHO. My frist try was S/S welding rod in a water bottles. I have 4 of them but when i put them in parallel I get more gas than in series. So what am I missing. I working on one thats bigger with swich plates made of 304 and should have it going soon as the "goop" dries.
My next one I want to try with S/S mesh wire and rabbit cage wire.Dont know how to get my plans on here but I belive it will help fuel milage as I plan on making it to fit in side the truck frame in a 6" pvc pipe with the fuel line running thur it( heat fuel and pull heat from the water) got the idea from acft and the way they have fuel/oil heaters.I saw a cool one on u tube made of what looked like rabbit wire out of 316 S/s wish I knew where he got the mesh. Love the idea of standing off the O2 sendor, works better than my alum tape over the end of it LOL. Does anyone know where I can get a cheap EGT set up? Thanks for ur time and space :-) I'll keep reading urs and try to post my findings.
The time is past for thinking outside the box, the time has come to get rid of it:-).