Water Sparkplug

[rosco1]

Spark under pressure videos

Here's the link to the vids, again, the quality is not great.

Just pay attention to the colours and relative strengths of the generated sparks.

Remember, this is a running engine, at idle.

YouTube - navigation2000's Channel

[lighty]

@Aaron

I was just thinking- why do you even bother with inverter, capacitor and everything?

If things are working the way you described than ordinary battery should work in place of an capacitor and might even work better.

1. When you close the "discharge" switch you would generate more than enough current through primary.
2. When you open the "discharge" switch you would get HV impulse.
3. Everything that happens with HV impulse after that would be pretty much the same since the battery would provide "bounce" point with it's negative pole.

The main advantage of that experiment would be the fact that you would magnetize ignition coil completely thus providing a full energy capacity of coil to the production of the HV impulse. Also, you would omit completely unnecessary inverter (at least unnecessary for this kind of experiment).

[theremart]

Lighty got me to thinkin...

Why not fill the cap with an SSG circuit or.. and Solid State Bedini? I mean... that would remove the inverter from a power draw from the equation.

[GotGas]

@Aaron

I was just thinking- why do you even bother with inverter, capacitor and everything?

If things are working the way you described than ordinary battery should work in place of an capacitor and might even work better.

1. When you close the "discharge" switch you would generate more than enough current through primary.
2. When you open the "discharge" switch you would get HV impulse.
3. Everything that happens with HV impulse after that would be pretty much the same since the battery would provide "bounce" point with it's negative pole.

The main advantage of that experiment would be the fact that you would magnetize ignition coil completely thus providing a full energy capacity of coil to the production of the HV impulse. Also, you would omit completely unnecessary inverter (at least unnecessary for this kind of experiment).

Maybe this will answer your question and explain why Aaron is on the right track and eliminate some of these magical technical descriptions in the process. Be sure and read the whole post because I am going to disclose something towards the end that may open your eyes a bit wider.

I feel that Aaron actually understands at an intuitive level at least partly what is going on in the circuit.

First off the circuit has two primary components. An inductor (the coil) and a capacitor. The way a capacitor and an inductor charge and discharge are exactly opposite.

Voltage leads current through an inductor and current leads voltage in a capacitor.

Next we take a closer look at the inductor. Inside that coil is roughly 1/4 mile of wire. We call this a delay line since it delays the voltage and current arriving through the inductor side of the circuit.

Aaron used the term "water hammer effect" which is a cavitation. Here is what happens in a cavitation:

First off, a cavitation is an atomic event. The way it is initiated is by moving mass through the ambient medium faster than the mass can travel without cavitation. So a jet going supersonic produces a cavitation because the sound can't keep up with it and a cavity is sucked into the air which is made of atoms and then the atoms begin to clap against each other as the cavity moves through the air and collapses upon itself. A bit like an atomic head on collision.

This condition rips a hole in the universe for an instant. The universe fills the hole by pressing back from all directions and in the process, creates trillions of little atom smashers all pointed at the center of that cavity where the atoms come together.

The pressure is so great for an instant, that electrons cluster momentarily and we call this electron clustering. Electrons being negative in charge are repulsive but will cluster under some conditions usually in groups of just 4, 6, 8 or so - very small numbers. Once the pressure begins to equalize, the electrons explode back out and in the process collide with and free other electrons. We call this event electron cascade effect or secondary emission.

This process of creating a cavitation and electron cascade event is how we convert mass into the atomic energy contained within the mass and is at the heart of all free energy machines. Usually we use H2 to H1 transmute as the mass.

If you understand that you will never lose the thermodynamics argument again. An atom bomb (hydrogen bomb) is an OU free energy machine and works by converting mass to the atomic energy contained within the mass.

And so when Aaron talks about electricity banging into the diodes and so on, while he is not technically correct, intuitively he is almost right on the money.

Another thing that most people don't understand, including most engineers and scientist, is what electricity is and how it is created.

I am not going to get into the details here, this post will be plenty long enough but a few brief understandings are in order:

Electricity is made of two things. Current and voltage. Current is the magnetic component of electricity and created by electron movement. Voltage is the shock wave that moves the electrons. The electrons move from the ground to the positive voltage source. Voltage moves at 300 million meters a second where as an electron moves down a copper wire slower than a snail crawls. An electron spirals down copper but moves in a straight line across the surface of steel.

A bit about what occurs in the water is also going to be helpful:

An atom has four forces. Electrostatic, (voltage) electromagnetic (current) and strong and weak nuclear force.

I feel we could state that an atom only has two forces and the other are effects of the original two. This is my theory and not something you will read somewhere else so take it for what it is worth.. I.e., electromagnetic force is an effect of the electrostatic shock wave.

As the voltage from the coil arrives at the spark plug, it is wanting some magnetic current which is 90 degrees behind. But it sees the current that is coming from the cap straight ahead and through the diodes and heads for that. Shortly after that, the voltage from the cap arrives at our water droplet and sees the current now arriving from our coil and they get together. In the middle of all this out of phase collision is our water droplet that just got the snot beat out of it from two sides from two forces both heading right at each other at the speed of light.

That is where this post started - cavitation - being breaking the speed limit and creating a electron cascade. You see, electricity can only go so fast and was originally created from a cavitation so we could say it is going mach 1. If we take two positive charges of different potential and ram them into each other head on, boom! We just broke the speed limit of our mass by 300 million meters per second and now we have mach 2. "Nobody ever thought of using an accelerator before" - Stan Meyer

The law of force:
F=MA

The law of force has three exceptions. One of them is if the mass is moving at or near quantum speeds.

There is some backup right there from mainstream science.

Final thought - If you don't think this circuit approximates Meyer's VIC circuit, you haven't read and understood Meyer's notes.

Here is a thought, why don't you lose the spark plug, and use three electrodes in contact with the water droplet like Meyer did. The two positive and the ground in the middle. You have what amounts to a fuel cell since the electrons are going to try and hop over the fence. ;-)

Also, somewhere in this forum someone wrote that electrolysis is all just a waste of time and what Stan and others were doing is exploding water with high voltage impulses. I think that person was was right.

I have a pretty good understanding of Meyer's components and I am sure that water went to what you all refer to the injector. In reality, it was not an injector, it was an igniter. The injector was the gate control valve and I feel where the resonant cavity lives. I could get into that another time if you are interested. It will explain why Meyer used the term fracturing instead of electrolysis.

[GotGas]

I guess I should have answered the question regarding the inverter. The inverter has an ac output. Push / pull on the bridge = faster better charge on the cap.

[lighty]

@GotGas

While your theory is certainly interesting I'm afraid you misunderstood my questions.


I'm well aware of the role of the inverter and the capacitor in the circuit at least from the engineering point of view. The fact I was pointing out is that it is quite possible that capacitor is not needed at all. If battery replaces capacitor from engineering point of view it would turn circuit from CDI to ordinary point-break ignition circuit. If HV diode is left in it's place a completely identical event should occur as in the case of CDI circuit. HV impulse would go through HV diode to the (-) of the battery and bounce back.

As for my suggestion to reverse polarity of the whole system it would cause a collision of positive HV impulse with (+) pole of capacitor or battery. It might behave differently than the presently used negative HV impulse colliding with (-) pole of capacitor (or battery).

[GotGas]

@GotGas

While your theory is certainly interesting I'm afraid you misunderstood my questions.


I'm well aware of the role of the inverter and the capacitor in the circuit at least from the engineering point of view. The fact I was pointing out is that it is quite possible that capacitor is not needed at all. If battery replaces capacitor from engineering point of view it would turn circuit from CDI to ordinary point-break ignition circuit. If HV diode is left in it's place a completely identical event should occur as in the case of CDI circuit. HV impulse would go through HV diode to the (-) of the battery and bounce back.

As for my suggestion to reverse polarity of the whole system it would cause a collision of positive HV impulse with (+) pole of capacitor or battery. It might behave differently than the presently used negative HV impulse colliding with (-) pole of capacitor (or battery).

From an "engineering point of view", a battery does not replace a cap. No electricity passes through a capacitor since there that small matter of the dielectric in the middle. Instead, a capacitor stores potential energy against the dielectic. A battery is a negative resistor.

Voltage and current would be in phased leaving the battery unlike the cap. My theory is hardly a theory. It is an electronics 101 description of the circuit "from an engineering point of view".

He is using 160 volts on the cap so you would need 18ea 9 volt batteries. 9 volt batteries are about 4 bucks each. $72.00 and you are all set. Let us know how that all works out.

Ever wondered why Meyer used 0V on his schematics? Three rail floating ground - notice that part where the people that built the circuit point out it does not work when connected to ground? I'm guessing that it has to do with the Bohr model of the atom, an atom absorbs light as it loses energy but then that would be just my "theory". :-)

[lighty]

@GotGas

Aaron hardly uses 156V for bouncing since it's hardly 3.5V left after a discharge. Also, if the analogy with Gray tube is correct then battery should (I didn't say it certainly would) be more than adequate for the task.

As for the battery not being able to do a capacitor task in certain configurations let's just say that at one point we used 9kV power source based on 9V batteries (yeah, that's about 1000 batteries stack). And you shouldn't base the price of batteries on exorbitant US prices.

[Aaron]

cap not batt

Lighty,

The battery wasn't discharged across the gap to the low voltage side. It was chopped through a coil to charge up a 3000v+ cap. In the Gray circuit, it was a cap that was discharged and not the battery.

[lighty]

@Aaron

I understand that capacitor was charged to several kV and then discharged across the spark gap. Now, on the other side of the gap there was permanent low voltage potential of the same polarity provided by another battery. So if the low voltage potential is needed in order to bounce back charge than I don't see any reason why it shouldn't be provided by battery instead of capacitor.

[Aaron]

battery and diode

Yes, it was a battery. You'll answer your own questions if you just meditate on all aspects of a diode.

[lighty]

@Aaron

Check your PM.

[rick123]

Spark Circuit

I started out using the switch. I had to wait about 4-6 seconds or I would just get a small spark. I went to a relay and it snapped every time-contunually! I tried a bunch of caps, the oil compactor works the best for me when i had the manual switch hooked up, but with the relay all capacitors perform the same. I sprayed a mist on it and got a pretty radical explosion. The hose in the picture is hooked to a copper pipe that had a couple of inches of water it, in witch I put a torch to it and created steam. This also created a much bigger SNAP!
I am going to start work on a weed waker motor. I have to learn how to make videos. Sorry about the big obtrusive pictures.

[gmeat]

[quote=rick123;22695]I started out using the switch. I had to wait about 4-6 seconds or I would just get a small spark. I went to a relay and it snapped every time-contunually! I tried a bunch of caps, the oil compactor works the best for me when i had the manual switch hooked up, but with the relay all capacitors perform the same. I sprayed a mist on it and got a pretty radical explosion. The hose in the picture is hooked to a copper pipe that had a couple of inches of water it, in witch I put a torch to it and created steam. This also created a much bigger SNAP!
I am going to start work on a weed waker motor. I have to learn how to make videos. Sorry about the big obtrusive pictures.


Hi Rick,

Where did you find that beefy looking cap lol.Be careful with that thing


-Gary

[rick123]

little more explanation: I replicated Lucs circuit. I also built callahans but am missing one of the transisters. In Lucs cicuit I am using a 40 amp 12vdc automotive relay. I got a 750 watt inverter. I shorted it out a few times with water, but i turn it off when the red overload light goes off and dry-out the water. this inverter seems to work pretty well. I had a microwave Diode and it is the only diode I am using. The camera capacitor Aaron was talking about works just as well as my oil compacitor with the relay. I opened the spark gap all the way and the snap/spark seems the same. I also removed the resistor from the plug and put copper in its place. I found many spark plugs will not allow you to remove resistor. rick