Water Sparkplug

[Aaron]

Peter's video

Always a pleasure Peter! Thanks for posting that.

For the missing diagram in the video, it is in the zip file posted a few posts before this one.

[Aaron]

S1R's new thread

Hi Everyone,

If S1R's whole system is legit, we need to really keep tabs on the info as it surfaces so lets keep it all together in this new thread:
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...l-circuit.html

Any updates or anything else on his inverter/relay chopper circuit and this 3 coil nail transformer, please place them in that thread as well.

[rickoff]

Re: S1r9a9m9 thread

Hi folks,

I certainly don't mind if the thread is split, as Peter suggested, however I would like to make a few points known.

First of all, I looked at the the S1r9a9m9 post that Aaron has put up, and I don't think that ridiculing S1r is a good way to start the thread. Anyone opening the thread would tend to think that S1r's method, or the man himself, is just a joke. I won't take part in a thread like that one, so Aaron - please change it or delete it. I think we should show due respect to S1r. After all, it is because of his successful showing of an engine running on water that Gotoluc and Capacitor70 began their attempts at duplicating the circuitry shown in the S1r video. And if that had not happened, then this thread would not even exist.

Peter - don't get me wrong - I really have enormous respect and admiration for you, and for all the other participants in this thread, but I fail to see how S1r's circuitry is unrelated to the information and experimentation in this thread, especially when considering the facts stated above. The only reason why Gotoluc did not incorporate S1r's transformer in his replication circuit is because it could not be seen in S1r's two videos of the 18 hp engine running on water. It was enclosed within a round, metal container. Gotoluc reasoned that S1r was hiding something important, and certainly the transformer is important, but I believe that the metal container's purpose was to act as necessary shielding rather than concealment. My purpose in making my first post in this thread (page 3, #73) was to make everyone aware of the fact that S1r had released information, and a photo, of the transformer. I thought that would be important information for anyone attempting to replicate the Gotoluc or Capacitor70 circuits, which are both based upon attempts to replicate S1r's circuitry. People participating in the thread thanked me for the information, and encouraged me to post further updates, so that is what I have done. I really don't think that we are talking about two entirely different subjects, as you suggest. S1r has used both approaches successfully in running engines. In either process, the aim is to create a plasma arc that is powerful enough to explode water and keep an engine running. To do that you need both high voltage and boosted amperage. I think we would all agree on that, right? Using an inverter, as done originally by S1r, and later by Gotoluc, Capacitor70, and others, will boost the amperage. Likewise, a capacitor - placed before or after the coil - will intensify the arc. Aaron has demonstrated the capacitance effect before the coil, and Rosco has demonstrated the effect of capacitance after the coil. Both achieved good results, but admittedly not enough to do the job of running an engine on water. S1r's transformer is a simplified device that, according to S1r, develops an arc that is about 10 times as powerful as the one shown in Gotoluc's first video. How does this work? S1r explains, "small coil winding chokes HV spark, other coil boosts amps to HV as it is choked. In this way you can change the voltage to what ever you want it to be and also the amps as well. No new miracle in electronics, just common sense of power boosting. This also delays firing for the time needed for the piston to drop down from tdc." So there you have it. It certainly seems worthy of further investigation and experimentation, but if everyone still feels that it belongs elsewhere then I will refrain from posting any further updates. I certainly don't want to offend or confuse anyone, and I apologize if that has, in fact, been the case.

Jetijs - I compliment you for taking the time to build and attempt a test of the transformer. You do appear to have it wound and wired correctly, but there are 3 reasons I can think of that may be cause for failure:
1. The 10 watt bulb is not nearly enough of a current draw. S1r suggested using a 60 watt lamp, but even that may not be enough as he said that you want about a 15 ampere constant current draw through coil #2. So perhaps you could hook up an ammeter between the coil and the ground at the plug base to check that out and adjust accordingly.
2. If you are using an inverter in the circuit then it will cause the transformer to function improperly. According to S1r, "the inverter cant be used with this transformer. The supply of power is in at wave form and the inverter will only level the wave back down to the point where it will not work."
3. In one of your posts, I believe you stated that the ignition coil you were using featured a negative voltage from the HV output. That could be a problem, since this transformer is designed for use with a positive HV discharge.

To answer your question, Jetijs, yes I have built a transormer, and I am looking for a suitable, used, 4 cycle engine to test it on.

Boguslaw - you said the direction of the transformer's coil windings was not clear to you. Have you examined the 3 diagrams in my pdf? If so, I think that will answer any questions you may have. My purpose in making those diagrams was to make the direction and connection of each coil winding clearly understood. See it at:
S1r transformer analysis by Rickoff.pdf - Windows Live SkyDrive

Rosco - You asked, "What if you place the S1r circuit in line, between the coil and the distributor?"
I don't think that would work out very well, because the power increase would cause the distributor cap contacts, and the rotor, to burn out rather quickly. Using a separate transformer for each plug avoids that scenario, and the cost and time involved in making these transformers is just about nothing. Also, I should mention that diodes are not needed with this transformer, because there is no harmful feedback to the distributor or ignition coil.

Sorry for this being such a long post, but I wanted to tie up any loose ends before leaving this thread. As i said earlier, I apologize if any of my posts have confused, annoyed, or offended anyone. That definitely wasn't my intention.

Best regards to all, Rickoff

[Aaron]

S1R's thread

Rick,

S1R was not being ridiculed by any of my comments. My comment about his name is serious...is it any clue to who he is. Second, my joke about liking 1999 Rams as vehicles was simply a joke and shouldn't be taken out of context.

This is not ridiculing this person. S1R has provided no proof of an engine running on water but rather simply some videos that appear to be showing an engine running on water. Either way, since it *could* appear as an insult to some people that would see it that way, I removed the line about the 1999 Rams but not about the comments on his name, etc... because that simply just sticks out to me when seeing his name and was just an observation and nothing more.

If I thought he shouldn't be taken serious, I wouldn't have started the thread and anybody has the opportunity to start any thread they want anyway. I thanked you for posting the docs you did because I'm interested in what might be possible from S1R's info. I do respect your contribution to this forum and have learned a lot from you. I have no intent to go out of my way to ridicule anyone.

You are free to start a new thread on him based on all your findings if you find that preferable and I'll support it by moving the other posts there after you open it up.

In regards to S1R, there is still 0% proof that anything he is saying is true. I understand that it has not been dis-proven anyway, which is a much more difficult task if even possible, but nevertheless, based on everything S1R has given over the last few years, there has been 100% failure to replicate anything. If anyone has, there is no proof that I'm aware of.

Also, the letter S1R wrote about sending a letter to himself...that doesn't offer him any protection at all...for copyright to prove he wrote something at a certain time, but something that is posted in public domain already...there is nothing he can patent from it even though the says he went one step further.

Even if he did get a patent, if it is a real system, I'd be happy to pay a lot of money in order to run my car on water forever and if I have to change plugs every couple months like he claims, it would be well worth it. But of course anyone can build any patent for personal use without compensating the inventor as long as it is for non-commercial use. If S1R's method turns out to be legit, he deserves the Nobel Peace Prize more than any scientific award.

[Guest]

What frequency does this plug resonate?

I found this quote on keelynet...
Someone should really try this with a simple 555 or something

"Recently we learned that the Water Disrupting Spark Plug promoted around 1994 by Stan Meyers was in fact suggested to him by Dale Pond at a conference in Switzerland back in 1989. The idea was you should be able to use Keely's 42.8khz emitted from a spark plug to instantly dissociate the water molecule to hydrogen and oxygen which would then be exploded to drive the piston.

Meyer took this idea, claimed it as his own and never credited Dale with the idea. He cannot patent it because it was disclosed in a public place in the presence of witnesses. Needless to say, like all of Meyer's other claims, nothing has come of it.

This is a further indication of how certain people try to capitalize on others' ideas and are not to be trusted...hide your wallets. Check out Dale's SVPVril Website."

If you choose to carry out experiments in this area, please share your findings, whether failures or successes with us here at KeelyNet. Thanks!"

[**~Imhotep~**]

Hi Folks,

Here's the link to the YouTube clip on my replication of the Water Spark Circuit: YouTube - Peter Lindemann's Water Spark Plug Replication

Thanks, Aaron, for all your help!!!!!

Peter

great video, very easy to understand! i guess i will have to dust off my variac and use it again .i will be replicating your circuit this weekend and analyzing the effect. i can get a microwave diode out of my old stock but would 12 -1n4007's work instead? and no snubber is needed? brilliant work ,no pun intended.

[Peter Lindemann]

Simplification

great video, very easy to understand! i guess i will have to dust off my variac and use it again .i will be replicating your circuit this weekend and analyzing the effect. i can get a microwave diode out of my old stock but would 12 -1n4007's work instead? and no snubber is needed? brilliant work ,no pun intended.

Imhotep,

Glad you like it!! My circuit choices were about simplification. I was just trying to see what the functions of each component were in their simplest form. The first circuit that Aaron showed me used 10 1N4007's soldered in series. That worked great, so it should work for you, too. I just pulled out the old microwave power supply diodes because I happen to have them. The part number on the diode I used is the AMI2066.

Aaron's first model had a 160uf cap. Gotoluc had said that the cap size was irrelevant, so we tried a 1uf cap. That didn't work. It was just too small. So, we started to work our way back up. 47uf was the smallest cap we tried that worked well enough to demonstrate the effect convincingly.

The Variac is optional. Gotoluc has already shown the cap being charged straight from the wall with a FWB rectifier. The Variac allows the option of charging the cap to different voltages for studying the effect.

Aaron's unit fried two relays at my shop when we were testing it, so I decided to wire up a relay SOCKET so I could change relays easily if that happened to mine. The capacitor is connected to the movable wipers in the relay. The input power from the Variac is connected to the NC (normally closed) contacts, and the primary of the ignition coil is connected to the NO (normally open) contacts.

As for the snubbers on the relay contacts, we got rid of them. We started out charging the caps with an inverter, like Gotoluc did. That's when we welded the relay shut using Aaron's larger capacitor. So, we put snubbers across the contacts to save the relay, and that's when we FRIED THE INVERTER!!! As it turned out, capacitive snubbers across the relay contacts just direct coupled the high frequency of the spark back to the MOSFETs in the inverter. Two fried inverters in 5 minutes was the cost of that lesson! So, now I run a Variac and NO SNUBBERS.

So, the circuit I show is pretty "fool proof" because I was the fool who proofed it!

Peter

[Peter Lindemann]

I agree

Hi folks,


Peter - don't get me wrong - I really have enormous respect and admiration for you, and for all the other participants in this thread, but I fail to see how S1r's circuitry is unrelated to the information and experimentation in this thread, especially when considering the facts stated above. The only reason why Gotoluc did not incorporate S1r's transformer in his replication circuit is because it could not be seen in S1r's two videos of the 18 hp engine running on water. It was enclosed within a round, metal container. Gotoluc reasoned that S1r was hiding something important, and certainly the transformer is important, but I believe that the metal container's purpose was to act as necessary shielding rather than concealment. My purpose in making my first post in this thread (page 3, #73) was to make everyone aware of the fact that S1r had released information, and a photo, of the transformer. I thought that would be important information for anyone attempting to replicate the Gotoluc or Capacitor70 circuits, which are both based upon attempts to replicate S1r's circuitry. People participating in the thread thanked me for the information, and encouraged me to post further updates, so that is what I have done. I really don't think that we are talking about two entirely different subjects, as you suggest. S1r has used both approaches successfully in running engines. In either process, the aim is to create a plasma arc that is powerful enough to explode water and keep an engine running. To do that you need both high voltage and boosted amperage. I think we would all agree on that, right? Using an inverter, as done originally by S1r, and later by Gotoluc, Capacitor70, and others, will boost the amperage. Likewise, a capacitor - placed before or after the coil - will intensify the arc. Aaron has demonstrated the capacitance effect before the coil, and Rosco has demonstrated the effect of capacitance after the coil. Both achieved good results, but admittedly not enough to do the job of running an engine on water. S1r's transformer is a simplified device that, according to S1r, develops an arc that is about 10 times as powerful as the one shown in Gotoluc's first video. How does this work? S1r explains, "small coil winding chokes HV spark, other coil boosts amps to HV as it is choked. In this way you can change the voltage to what ever you want it to be and also the amps as well. No new miracle in electronics, just common sense of power boosting. This also delays firing for the time needed for the piston to drop down from tdc." So there you have it. It certainly seems worthy of further investigation and experimentation, but if everyone still feels that it belongs elsewhere then I will refrain from posting any further updates. I certainly don't want to offend or confuse anyone, and I apologize if that has, in fact, been the case.

As i said earlier, I apologize if any of my posts have confused, annoyed, or offended anyone. That definitely wasn't my intention.

Best regards to all, Rickoff

Rickoff,

All I suggested was to split the thread to reduce confusion as we MOVE FORWARD. The history of where this all comes from is clear and I am not disputing this. Your posts to clarify the S1R information have been excellent and I have downloaded and archived your posts.

But at this point, I must agree with Aaron. No one has been successful at replicating the S1R method yet, but many people have successfully duplicated the Gotoluc method. This is the reason I suggested splitting the thread. The S1R "nail coil" may well have merit and should be researched by anyone who is interested in it. I have never said anything other than that. All we are asking is that any future posts on that topic be moved to the new thread. This thread was started by Aaron to investigate the circuit proposed by Gotoluc.

The purpose of splitting the thread is to REDUCE CONFUSION, not to make any statement about the merit of the S1R method or your very informative posts on this subject.



Peter

[patmac]

Thanks Peter... I learned so much with your video.

Thanks Mr Peter.

I was trying to get a great discharge, with resonance on the spark plug with 555 osc, but I had no got it, HV diode was the great trick to got it.

Sorry by no send my videos I had no BroadBand here, I'm living in a rural zone from Suth America... Excuses.

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...attery-sg.html

http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...html#post22552

But I would want got radiant en ergy like E Gray with this experiment, not for burn wanter....

[harold]

coil direction

Peter, that is surely a thought provoking video. Switching both leads of the capacitor with the relay makes it crystal clear that something very intriguing is happening and no alternative charging routes of the coil are possible.

I was wanting to try and sketch out what may be happening with the magnetic fields of the coils in the spark-coil. I also want to try winding a coil without the iron core.

But I couldn't find any information on coil winding directions of the secondary and primary in a typical induction coil. Does anyone happen to know if they are wound in the same direction or opposing direction. I understand the primary is few turns of stout wire and the secondary many thousand of turns. I could of course destroy a spark-coil but thought I'd ask in case anyone happens to know for sure.

[**~Imhotep~**]

Imhotep,

Glad you like it!! My circuit choices were about simplification. I was just trying to see what the functions of each component were in their simplest form. The first circuit that Aaron showed me used 10 1N4007's soldered in series. That worked great, so it should work for you, too. I just pulled out the old microwave power supply diodes because I happen to have them. The part number on the diode I used is the AMI2066.

Aaron's first model had a 160uf cap. Gotoluc had said that the cap size was irrelevant, so we tried a 1uf cap. That didn't work. It was just too small. So, we started to work our way back up. 47uf was the smallest cap we tried that worked well enough to demonstrate the effect convincingly.

The Variac is optional. Gotoluc has already shown the cap being charged straight from the wall with a FWB rectifier. The Variac allows the option of charging the cap to different voltages for studying the effect.

Aaron's unit fried two relays at my shop when we were testing it, so I decided to wire up a relay SOCKET so I could change relays easily if that happened to mine. The capacitor is connected to the movable wipers in the relay. The input power from the Variac is connected to the NC (normally closed) contacts, and the primary of the ignition coil is connected to the NO (normally open) contacts.

As for the snubbers on the relay contacts, we got rid of them. We started out charging the caps with an inverter, like Gotoluc did. That's when we welded the relay shut using Aaron's larger capacitor. So, we put snubbers across the contacts to save the relay, and that's when we FRIED THE INVERTER!!! As it turned out, capacitive snubbers across the relay contacts just direct coupled the high frequency of the spark back to the MOSFETs in the inverter. Two fried inverters in 5 minutes was the cost of that lesson! So, now I run a Variac and NO SNUBBERS.

So, the circuit I show is pretty "fool proof" because I was the fool who proofed it!

Peter

thank you for the details, It seems very crystal clear and thanx for the sacrifices..lol. As i said i'll be replicating it this weekend because I am kinda spread thin, but i will enjoy studying the effects and will report any of my findings and any expansions.

[peper10]

just a question?

Hi everyone!!
As i read the tread,something go on my mind!!!!
When i see the diode Peter used on his circuit,i was wondering?????
Does anyone look for a microwave supply system??
I have look for informations and specs for microwave and it seems to have
pretty hi voltage...
I'm not the best for searching on internet,so,if someone is (talented)lol..in
Hi voltage microwave system,MAYBE,this person could bring imput about
any relation with the (water spark plug ignition system))....

peper10

[Peter Lindemann]

Replacement Parts...

Hi everyone!!
As i read the tread,something go on my mind!!!!
When i see the diode Peter used on his circuit,i was wondering?????
Does anyone look for a microwave supply system??
I have look for informations and specs for microwave and it seems to have
pretty hi voltage...
I'm not the best for searching on internet,so,if someone is (talented)lol..in
Hi voltage microwave system,MAYBE,this person could bring imput about
any relation with the (water spark plug ignition system))....

peper10

Peper10,

Sorry for the confusion. The AMI2066 is a "replacement part" for the power supply inside a Microwave Oven. It is NOT a diode that switches at "microwave" frequencies. A simple Google Search on the term "microwave oven replacement parts diodes" leads to this: Microwave Diode Replacement Kit - M3D71

This is roughly equivalent to the diode I used.

I hope this helps.

Peter

[Aaron]

isolated capacitor

Harold,

This video: YouTube - Water Sparkplug | Isolated Capacitor
was supposed to convey that idea. I posted it because there were posts in different forum(s) that kept insisting it was a low volt high current pulse from the power supply.

Still, they refuse to admit it has nothing to do with a high current pulse. I'm not interested in proving someone wrong, but I am interested in stopping disinformation in its tracks if possible. After posting this and continuing to see some insisting it is happening because of high current pulse makes me very suspicious of their motives.

Peter, that is surely a thought provoking video. Switching both leads of the capacitor with the relay makes it crystal clear that something very intriguing is happening and no alternative charging routes of the coil are possible.

[Aaron]

s1r9a9m9's thread

S1R9A9M9's new thread:
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...l-circuit.html
The last post in there was supposed to be the first post.

I couldn't move msgs from here into original thread so moved to new thread of identical name.

ANYTHING RELATED TO S1R9A9M9'S CIRCUITS, PLEASE POST IN THAT THREAD.