Water Sparkplug

[Ahchoooo]

Spark Plug photos

Ahchoooo,

Not sure why your cap is getting hot. Diodes? Yes, one time they fizzled and popped like batter in a deep fryer, literally.

Those diodes were 12kv 350ma rating and we had 2 in series.

We were looking at some monster diodes but will be cheaper with Jetijs' diodes. 1000v 6amp. If they work as well as a 20-30kv/3-6amp rating, we'll use those for testing. For convenience later, I'll probably get a monster one just so it isn't as cumbersome.

The main difference between Capacitor 70's circuit and mine with the booster cap is that I'm using capacitive discharge on the primary of the ignition coil and he is just pulsing 12v into it.

Hi Aaron,

I tried pulsing the coil with a 12V, and no sparks. That is kind of strange because it should work since that is how it is done inside an engine. The only difference is that the pressure is different. May be that is why.

In the CDI mode, I tried using 4.7uF and 10uF for the primary capacitor, and both worked great. 10uF seems to be a little better with less miss firing at higher frequency.

I have attached 2 photos of my spark plugs. One is almost new (only had about 30 seconds of firing), and the other is after may be a total of 40+ minutes of firing. You can see the difference. I did enlarge the gap of the burnt plug to a wider one. The burning effect is also evident in the new plug after only about 30 seconds of firing. The heat generated apparently is extremely hot. How will it affect the engine? Will it burn a hole through the cylinder head? Will the high temp ignite water?

[Aaron]

can you post a diagram?

Ahchoooo,

Can you post the exact schematic you're using?

It isn't the temp that "burns" water, it is instant separation of the h/o...h towards ground and oxygen towards annode...then the waters gas burns...then it recombines back into water...or at least a good amount of it apparently does.

[Aaron]

Water Sparkplug Implosion Video

YouTube - Water Sparkplug HHO Implosion
Did this vid a couple weeks ago.

About a 4 inch tube over the threads on a plug.

[Ahchoooo]

my circuit

Ahchoooo,

Can you post the exact schematic you're using?

It isn't the temp that "burns" water, it is instant separation of the h/o...h towards ground and oxygen towards annode...then the waters gas burns...then it recombines back into water...or at least a good amount of it apparently does.

The circuit I used is the same as the hand-drawn one you posted, with the exception of the following:

1. I did not have a 120V 40W bulb coming from the variac to the full bridge. My variac was connected directly to the full bridge. I tried it with a bulb before, but no sparks even when the input voltage was over 150VDC. I don't know why.
2. My relay was triggered by an off-the-shelf signal generator.
3. I did not have the HV diode on the primary capacitor, only on the booster capacitor.

When the circuit was run, the voltage across the bridge reached a max of about 150VDC to achieve the most bang and flash. I did not attempt higher input voltage for fear of blowing the HV diodes. The spark frequency was adjusted anywhere from 1.5 Hz to close to 4 Hz. The variac voltage and the spark frequency were the only two variables I adjusted.

[Ahchoooo]

YouTube - Water Sparkplug HHO Implosion
Did this vid a couple weeks ago.

About a 4 inch tube over the threads on a plug.

Hi Aaron,

Thanks for the video. Both the explosion and implosion force seems to be pretty weak, if they did occur. Or, there was neither explosion nor implosion. Regardless, it is too weak to push any piston.

[Aaron]

supply questions

Those implosions and explosions were without any moisture added to the spark, which multiplies it quite a bit. That was with whatever moisture was in the air...not much. The spark does explode then implode. There are ways to prevent the implosion or lessen it so the explosion is stronger.

How many amps is your input supply? You might want a 100ohm resistor on one of the ac lines to the bridge instead of a bulb...that would limit the current draw to about 1 amp. That is way more than you need anyway.

Are you using a second supply to charge the booster cap with the HV diode?

[Ahchoooo]

limiting the input current

Those implosions and explosions were without any moisture added to the spark, which multiplies it quite a bit. That was with whatever moisture was in the air...not much. The spark does explode then implode. There are ways to prevent the implosion or lessen it so the explosion is stronger.

How many amps is your input supply? You might want a 100ohm resistor on one of the ac lines to the bridge instead of a bulb...that would limit the current draw to about 1 amp. That is way more than you need anyway.

Are you using a second supply to charge the booster cap with the HV diode?

Hi Aaron,

I use the same variac on both caps.

I tried a 100ohm resister on one of the AC lines to the bridge, and it limits the current to the bridge. If I set my variac output to about 110AC (my main is 220AC), the current should be around 1.1A. At that voltage, there were only a few bangs and a lot of misses. If I set my variac output to higher voltage, more bangs. Or, I would have to lower my firing rate to one firing per 2 seconds, then I got a bang on every firing.

Something puzzles me. I measured the resistance of my 25W light bulb, and the meter said 165ohm. Yet, if I calculate the wattage using W=V*V/R, I got 297 watts. I don't get it. What is going on?

Since my 100ohm resister was getting hot fast, I replaced it with the 25W light bulb (since it measured to be 163ohm). I noticed that the light bulb only lite up with there was a bang. When there was no bang, even there was a small spark, the light bulb did not lite up indicating the current flow was low, especially since I changed the primary capacitor to only 4.7uF. So the bang seems to be linked to the amount of charge in the booster capacitor. And the way to get the most bang is to:
1. increase the current flow to the booster cap
2. increase the capacitance of the booster cap
3. increase the voltage of the booster cap.

With the restricted current, the plug does not get as hot as before. After firing at 1Hz for 10 minutes, I can still touch the plug tip without problem.
I put a plastic tube over the plug tip, and put a piece of paper over the opening (just like what you did in your video). The pressure generated was very small. I put a small plastic top over the tube, and held the plug in a vertical position. The pressure generated managed to pop the cap up for about 4mm only.

[Jules Tresor]

wearing of plugs, by S1R

Hi, I found a message from S1r about the wearing of his plugs:

quote: Sat Jul 19, 2008 12:53 pm
Yahoo! Groups

Re: Plug wear out


The photo of the plug looks like one that came out of my Elcamino
after three months of driving. the water dose have a cooling effect
inside the cylinder. I have taken out plugs that were wore down twice
that amount, after four months, or 7,000 miles. The timeing being a-
tdc the piston is moving away from the flame front and the piston
looks very clean no burns. with gasoline the piston is passing tdc
and is at the flame front. you may have scorched the top of the
piston but not burned it yet.

Its slow getting the report together. and I'll make a note to put in
photos of used plugs from engines used in research.

S1R.

end of quote.

thanks for your generosity to all,
we will change the world !
MDG

[Aaron]

tweaking the system

It sounds like your cap isn't charging fast enough to get bangs quicker.

If your main is 220vac if you're careful you can probably just connect the 220vac main through a bridge to charge a cap. It wouldn't be adjustable, but the voltage would be very consistent. Use safety considerations. I'm not a professional electrician but that I'm mentioning is simply what I would do. At 220vac, I would guess your voltage in the cap would be almost 300v. And of course, I'd use a resistor before the bridge on one of the ac lines.

How many uf's is your primary cap again? If between 4uf and 10uf, you could use a little bigger. I use 47uf minimum on my primary. If the primary cap or cap bank is 350+v, charging it with the 220vac line through a bridge should be fine. If that is too much, you could put it through a voltage divider to drop it to keep in a lower range. ANYONE ELSE HAVE COMMENTS ON THIS?

Then, you can use the variac to charge the booster caps and have it separated from the primary cap. it would be connected through the ac line, but you would have a way to increase booster cap easily. I would use at least a few hundred uf's. 330uf+ would be good for boosters with the hv diode coming off the cap.

With the above setup, if you have diodes that can handle it, you should have a really strong system.

[Ahchoooo]

where is the S1R's sparkplug photo?

Hi, I found a message from S1r about the wearing of his plugs:

quote: Sat Jul 19, 2008 12:53 pm
Yahoo! Groups

Re: Plug wear out


The photo of the plug looks like one that came out of my Elcamino
after three months of driving. the water dose have a cooling effect
inside the cylinder. I have taken out plugs that were wore down twice
that amount, after four months, or 7,000 miles. The timeing being a-
tdc the piston is moving away from the flame front and the piston
looks very clean no burns. with gasoline the piston is passing tdc
and is at the flame front. you may have scorched the top of the
piston but not burned it yet.

Its slow getting the report together. and I'll make a note to put in
photos of used plugs from engines used in research.

S1R.

end of quote.

thanks for your generosity to all,
we will change the world !
MDG

Hi Stephenafreter,

I can't find the photo of S1R's spark plug. Can you post a copy here? I want to compare his with mine. Thanks.

[elias]

How many uf's is your primary cap again? If between 4uf and 10uf, you could use a little bigger. I use 47uf minimum on my primary. If the primary cap or cap bank is 350+v, charging it with the 220vac line through a bridge should be fine. If that is too much, you could put it through a voltage divider to drop it to keep in a lower range. ANYONE ELSE HAVE COMMENTS ON THIS?

A voltage divider seems to be fine, for just charging capacitors, but for fast charge a smaller resistor may be necessary. To avoid so much steady current loss a 5W Zener diode would be a good choice unless one doesn't want to use a POT to adjust the voltage. And I would also use a 10A Fuse to prevent SMOKE!

[gazzzwp]

Fast Frequency

Hi Guys

Looks like some of you are discovering what I suspected a few days ago from my own trials - that the effect is not reproducible at faster frequencies.

If there is a practical application for this phenomena it does not involve relay switching and large capacitors.

Why is the explosion caused by capacitor discharge? - is it simply the high discharge current given by the formula:

I = C x dv/dt

If I recall this means that when the voltage across a capacitor changes in an extremely short time (discharge) the resulting current can be quite high.

The current is almost being 'pumped' into the ignition coil from the capacitor.

How else then can the effect be replicated I wonder?

Sorry to think out loud.

[smw1998a]

Hello All
@gazzzwp
Looks like some of you are discovering what I suspected a few days ago from my own trials - that the effect is not reproducible at faster frequencies.

I disagree. Switching speed can be increased however, so will current draw. How far the frequency of the ignition coil can be pushed in this circuit is unclear. In a car using contact breakers, the time of induction is limiting factor in the operating frequency of the coil. In our circuit the time it takes to charge the capacitor is the limiting factor using solid state switching. The relay slows the circuit considerably.

Here is a link to my solid state experiment.

YouTube - Water Sparkplug II

Regards Lee...

[Aaron]

cdi's

CDI's ALREADY keep caps charged up fast enough for dumping to primary at ANY rpm. Frequency is not an issue.

[gotoluc]

YouTube - Water Sparkplug HHO Implosion
Did this vid a couple weeks ago.

About a 4 inch tube over the threads on a plug.

Great Video Aaron

Thanks

Luc