Water Sparkplug

[Kinetix]

Hi, guys.
Aaron, thank you for your explanations and for the schematic. I need to study it more.
At this moment I tryed to avoid using inverters, variacs, bulbs. My oscilator is protected by being stopped when the cap fires. Works fine with no fuses or bulbs, but I must improve the discharge part.
Jetijs, I have had allmost the same experience as you with the sparks and gap length. At 1-3mm gap, plasma occurs. Bigger gap: no plasma, sound like the ignition coil fires, but no spark at all. If diodes string removed (disconnected from HV),I have nice, long, bright, regular spark, but nothing more. Maybe diodes leak somehow. Anyway, they have a little leak current (few tens of uA), and this could be the problem.
The diodes could seem fine being measured at low voltages, but could cease at higher voltages... Harder to test this...
Note that a 1mm air gap needs 1KV to be jumped.

gotoluc, I will try to use new diodes for tests, and will also try to add a second MOSFET to discharge the second cap (with LV). Let's hope it will work.
YouTube - mini plasma de 3mm. Here is what I have gained so far. If the paper were darker, the flash would be more visible... Sorry. The discharge is half CDI (4.7uF cap) and half plasma (another 4.7uF).
Gibs, could you post a little schematic?
gmeast, nice flash sparks!

All the best for all!

[smw1998a]

Water Sparkplug IV

Hello All,
I have just uploaded Water Sparkplug IV to youtube. Two weeks later than I expected.

All the best Lee....

[Gibs]

Hi Kinetix,
the circuit is so much simple that it does'nt need a schematic to be understood!

- 120 Volts at the primary of MOT.

- Secondary in parallel with a 2uF 2000 V cap... in parallel with the spark gap.

That's all !
It's similar to a Tesla coil driver circuit.

My spark gap is a two SS screws held together with little tie-wraps.
Space between gap is about .015"

Insert the spark gap completely in water, plug that in and you get loud bangs with squirt of water. Perfect if you want to take a shower.

[Kinetix]

Lee, have you tryed to increase de air spark gap? What happened?
Gibs, it may be as you said: simple, but could you tell me what MOT means? Thanks.

[gmeast]

spark gap

Hi,

I have been monitoring the actual gap dimension throughout my testing. The non-resistor plug I bought as new. I gapped the plug to .025" and then began testing. I just got through measuring the gap and it's still at .025" and the exact same "feel" on the gauge. Simply put, I'm at least convinced that there is NO disintegration of the electrode that might be tending to 'seed' the effect.

And of course, NO HEAT!

Peace,

Greg

[smw1998a]

Increasing the spark gap

Lee, have you tryed to increase de air spark gap? What happened?

Hello Kinetix,
Yes, in the video YouTube - Water Sparkplug III I failed to produce the effect across a 22mm gap while the standard discharge would cross at 22mm and more. With the frequency and voltage I was using (200v), the effect would cross 16mm maximum. Reducing frequency, thus increasing the charge on the capacitor (320v), I could increase this to 18/20mm but it was incredibly loud. I put this down to needing more voltage on the capacitor which is not what Jetijs's latest video would suggest. More investigation needed Luc's video regarding the diodes poses some interesting investigative possibilities too.

Regards Lee…

[smw1998a]

Heat and ware

Hi,

I have been monitoring the actual gap dimension throughout my testing. The non-resistor plug I bought as new. I gapped the plug to .025" and then began testing. I just got through measuring the gap and it's still at .025" and the exact same "feel" on the gauge. Simply put, I'm at least convinced that there is NO disintegration of the electrode that might be tending to 'seed' the effect.

And of course, NO HEAT!

Peace,

Greg

Hi Greg,
Although I have not felt any significant heat with my fingers after prolonged firing, I have often, but briefly, seen steam rise from the electrodes when spraying water. In fact, at the beginning of my latest video, you may be able to see this when I accidentally quench the effect with too much water. You Tubes compression may have masked it out though. Also, ware is evident on both the needle (stainless steel) and nail (mild steel) I used as electrodes. These will be far softer than the electrodes of a spark plug but IMO ware is inevitable with such a violent discharge. I do agree that disintegration is not seeding the effect. But, again, IMO the effect does cause disintegration of the electrodes.

Regards Lee….

[gmeast]

Lee, have you tryed to increase de air spark gap? What happened?
Gibs, it may be as you said: simple, but could you tell me what MOT means? Thanks.

I believe it means "Microwave Oven Transformer"

Peace,

Greg

[Kinetix]

Nice video recorded experiment, Lee!
Good for you to have that scope around. It's a very useful tool for this kind of tests.
What number of diode did you use and what number?
My oscilator runs at 33KHz, duty cycle 60% (I think), and I try to charge a 4.7uF capacitor at 340V. I wonder what would be the time to a complete charge? Yes, the scope would tell us the truth... Anyway, 48ms (as seen in your video) it's a way to much to use in a car ignition system. There is no time at high rpm to achieve that. I think that 1-2ms would be the best. But the value you've found it's being related to the frequency you used, I think.

I wonder if there is a software that turns the PC into a scope, using the sound card or another hardware...

All the best!

[gmeast]

Hi Greg,
Although I have not felt any significant heat with my fingers after prolonged firing, I have often, but briefly, seen steam rise from the electrodes when spraying water. In fact, at the beginning of my latest video, you may be able to see this when I accidentally quench the effect with too much water. You Tubes compression may have masked it out though. Also, ware is evident on both the needle (stainless steel) and nail (mild steel) I used as electrodes. These will be far softer than the electrodes of a spark plug but IMO ware is inevitable with such a violent discharge. I do agree that disintegration is not seeding the effect. But, again, IMO the effect does cause disintegration of the electrodes.

Regards Lee….

Hi Lee,

I'm sure there are a number of various simple and complex components involved in the observed effect. I'll try and find a way to inspect and photograph the surfaces of the plug's gap for erosion or pitting. If there is wear on my plug it's almost immeasurable. I noticed the nail head you are using is very rusty. That could account for some of the erosion. The possibility for damage increases with the reduction in surface area and mass of the electrodes. Even though there does not seem to be much heat imparted to the actual electrodes, I would guess that heat sinking would still be important.

Thanks for your comments. Peace,

Greg

[tstorey]

Lee's new video...effect analysis

Lee,

Thank you so much for new video.

You knocked it out of the park.

I agree that the Orangeish sparks may be indicative of electrode erosion.

As the effect at this time is defying analysis, conclusions on my part are total speculation.

I assume there is heat as the initial rush of ions hits the atmosphere.

I will assume there is heat on the tip of the electrode as a rush of ions would create atmospheric friction and thermal response of some type.

However, after that first fraction of a fraction of a second all bets seem to be off.

Are ions combining with free protons to create atomic hydrogen?

Are they creating other hydrogen isotopes?

This reaction is "small."

This reaction is incredibly fast. Is the speed of the reaction creating the "pop?" Is is the speed of the particulate hitting the atmosphere so fast that the sound waves can't keep up and we get a shock wave?

Is the "reaction" itself producing the shock wave and the resulting "pop". In other words are atomic particles "combining" and releasing energy resulting in the shock wave?

The addition of water is the addition of what?

Hydrogen bonds? Water is just water with a very stable structure. Why does the reaction augment with the addition of water? This is not electrolysis...is it? Is part of this reaction electrolyisis or the disassociation of H20 into H and H2 and 02? then what the heck happens?

You assume water is now a "fuel." look! we spray it at the effect and...it is combusting!

You throw shell unleaded on a fire and the fire gets bigger...we know that is combusting.

We are hitting the water with an arc...are we dissociating the H20 molecule? All of sudden we have hydrogen molecules or H atoms? Both?

Light emission is as bright as it gets, gentlemen. Stuff on Earth does not get much brighter than this effect. There are a lot of photons kicking a$$ here.

I think the challenge may be found in the following conclusion.

Several things are going on in this effect....and it it might be interesting to figure out the sequence.

It does not act like a plasma.
It is not thermal....or combustion like.
It is so quick we are challenged to measure a magnetic field

We are stuck with:

Cuckoo fast
For something so "small," very LOUD
Ridiculously bright/Full spectrum
For something so small, plenty of nearby "device interference"
Gets bigger with water vapor
Doesn't need much juice
Is easily duplicated with stuff from the local store
Seems to be happy blowing up fuel vapor in a lawnmower's combustion chamber
Seems to eat electrodes...a little.


Keep it coming. You guys are amazing.

Tom

[Aaron]

great vid

Great vid Lee! Very thorough as usual!

[Aaron]

Spark Gap

The bigger the gap I use the bigger the bang...that is the case when using large enough cap blasts.

The reason is this I think, if you have a small gap, that is a lower voltage necessary to jump it...with a bigger gap, the voltage can build higher before jumping the gap.

Does a bigger gap cause the spark on/off to be quicker than a smaller gap? If so, that might also contribute to the time compression.

I can use a stock gapped plug even with my 330uf/400v cap bank on the back side and 47uf/160v on the primary. With the stock gapped plug, the bursts are very small and contained in that gap.

I can use a plug where the ground strap is opened up quite a bit all the way to perpendicular and the bigger the gap, the bigger the bangs and the further the plasma bursts are ejected from it.

If I use a plug where there is no ground strap and it is totally circular...that gives huge bangs too.

With the bigger bangs, I get very big blasts with a lot of orange leading the blast...appears to be real thermal explosion and of course with water, the effect is bigger and louder.

[gotoluc]

@everyone,

I have an effect that I don't quite understand. My capacitor has excess voltage charges that happens from time to time. Maybe it is my limited electronics knowledge that makes this kind of strange. Anyways, please see if you can explain this. Have a look at this video: YouTube - Capacitor Voltage Charge Spikes test and let me know what you think. Please note that the coil I added is only raising the effect by about 15vdc more, so it is not that doing it. Without the coil the capacitor still get up to120vdc extra charges.

Thanks all for your help and time.

Luc

[tstorey]

Luc,

As you had mentioned "device interference" (although with a very different type of test) previously...could this "meter jump" be of that nature? Ie...it is still about 169 but the "effect" is causing an anomaly with the device itself?


Thanks,

T