Water Sparkplug

[ashtweth]

Amazing work Guys as usual , wont be able to get to the Spark/Smack on the car till Tuesday/ Wednesday now but will update the PDF's for you guys mean time.

Yup the story of stuff and other solutions are summarized on this page, they only need HEMP production to make 50,000 products renewable instead of recycling the bad industry ones
Sustainable Development

[gmeast]

wires

Mike,

I agree with Greg and Luc and others... Great job !!!
These forums are usually 99% lurkers, and 1% doers.... It's great to see members building !!! ... We need a few to assist Jetijs on his builds, he's also been blazing his own trail too....

Greg, Mike,

Did you switch plugs wires to lower resistance ? or did you use stock ?

Regards,

Timm

Hi Timm,

Using racing wires ... solid wire about 1.3 ohms longest wire.

Greg

[gmeast]

Oss

Excellent simple circuit Greg,

To me this new circuit looks to be about the simplest multi plug circuit to date and I like simple solutions.

Thanks again for all this most excellent research and development and coming up with a simple solution.

Your dedication is a true example of Open Source Sharing (OSS)

May your life be blessed for your effort to help our World.

@everyone, you must all look at this video presentation and reflect as the message is real. We need to work together as we are doing here to fix what we have let them do to US.

Video Link: The Story of Stuff with Annie Leonard

Luc,

Most thanks,

Greg

[Jetijs]

Greg

Thank you a lot. This is exactly what I was going to use on my car. This is simple and easy.
Just another question, what do you use for the insulation transformer?
BTW, do you ever sleep?
Thanks,
Jetijs

[gmeast]

isolation transformer

Thank you a lot. This is exactly what I was going to use on my car. This is simple and easy.
Just another question, what do you use for the insulation transformer?
BTW, do you ever sleep?
Thanks,
Jetijs

Hi Jetijs,

"Sleep" What's that?

I use a standard plug-in isolation transformer for convenience. It is from the McMaster online catalog:

McMaster-Carr

The P/N is:
70245K71
Control Transformer with Plug & Connector 150 VA, 115V Input, 115V Output

Peace,

Greg

[ashtweth]

If one of our most prized engineers Greg doesn't sleep just like JET sorry Jetijs Then we have to make him aware of Ginko and Brahmi, Aaron will know about these herbs

They are essential anti oxidants for lack of sleep
take it from a vampire called Ash

[jstadwater]

Hello Everyone,

Thanks for all the kind and encouraging comments! It is a wonderful thing that we all are able to share in our efforts to better our own existence. I feel we all have bounded forward due to sharing experiences and testing to see what happens next. You guys are, by far, the best group of people I have ever had the opportunity to interact with. I mean that from the ! I even dream about this stuff at night, I figure I'll get all the sleep I need when I'm dead! I also should probably get some of those "lack of sleep" herbs from Aaron.

I will try to draw up a schematic today of my circuit, it's not good enough yet to install in a car I don't think. I still don't know about what ohms resistors to use, how fast the frequency needs to be, and all that stuff. So I still need help to get an installable unit. Here's the basic setup:

I have hooked up phone cord wire to the end of each spark plug so that when you snap the factory plug wire over the end, the phone wire makes good contact and is held in place by the plug wire. The other end of each phone cord wire is attached to a single HV microwave diode, and then onward to the + side of a 22uf capacitor. The cap is connected to a FWB supplied with 110VAC. From lack of having and/or knowing what type resistor to use, I am using a 100 watt light bulb on one leg of the AC coming into the FWB. The HEI V-8 distributor is using a completely factory setup, with the following modifications. The coil is housed in the top of the distributor cap, three wires come from the distributor's magnetic pickup & ignition module and NORMALLY plug into the cap where they make contact with 12VDC & trigger the coil....in time with the engine. I unplugged the distributor (3 wires) from the cap & coil so I could still use the factory 12VDC to power the pickup and the ignition module in a normal fashion. I then hooked the coil + up to the + of the capacitor powered by the 110VDC after the bridge. I still use the trigger wire (-) from the distributor to pulse the coil, in time with the engine. I tried, but did not have a relay that would close with the low voltage (-) signal wire of the distributor. The Crydom mosfet should fix that, I need to have that low V signal wire to trigger the mosfet and have it to dump the negative AND positive from the capacitor at once through the coil. As it is now, I am using 12VDC (-) from the battery to pulse the negative side of the coil, via the ignition module. The (+) side of the coil is connected to the capacitor with 110V+. I'm sure I"m not getting the full potential thru the coil with this arrangement. That's about it!

Congratulations out to Greg, awesome advances you've made with this application!!! Do me ONE favor Greg, DON'T EVER STOP!!!

I'm thinking about the frequency issue at higher rpm, since your circuit Greg, is stable for 5,000 rpm on a four cylinder, would that translate into 2,500 stable rpm for a V-8? Just got another idea..............................Mike

[gmeast]

2500 rpm

Hello Everyone,


I'm thinking about the frequency issue at higher rpm, since your circuit Greg, is stable for 5,000 rpm on a four cylinder, would that translate into 2,500 stable rpm for a V-8? Just got another idea..............................Mike

Hi Mike,

Thanks, and yes the stability revolves around how reliably and quickly you can charge and discharge the CDI Cap. Your assumption seems correct from my perspective.

Peace,

Greg

[insane4evr]

Hi Greg,

Will replacing the resistor with an inductor which acually is an ideal inductor in series with its copper wire resistance, improve the charge rate. The inductive portion will 'isolate' the 470 uF capacitor during the initial discharge of the lower value cap. The 470 uF will thus have higher charge left during a cycle. The resistive portion will still keep the charging current at the desired limit. This might raise the RPM/frequency limit.

Just thinking out loud.

[gmeast]

some info' on frequency re:VexUs

Hi all,

I wanted to post some information re: operationsl frequencies for VexUs. I ran the resistance of the current limiter R1 down to 125 ohms running in the circuit with the 22uf CDI Cap (C1). Then I captured a trace of the charge and discharge cycle in order to check reality against the theoretical. With these values a 1-Time Constant = RC = .000022 X 125 = .00275 sec or 2.75 ms.

The first photo is the raw trace. It floats above 0 - VDC because R1 is still passing current during the discharge cycle. The second photo is the raw trace translated downward and left to the origins and stretched right and left ... 'cause it's easier to read that way.

Even though the raw trace is actually floating up a little, we'll treat the second photo as a perfect curve just to see if we have any agreement with calculated values. 1RC is considered to be 0.63 of full voltage charge on any Cap. The photo shows about 160 VDC to be full charge so:

0.63 X 160 = 108. The second photo has a time scale of .001 sec (1ms) per division (horizontal). So if you go from 0,0 over 2.75 ms (from earlier) and then 'up' and you'll see that you cross the trace between 100 VDC and 110 VDC. This agreement at least instills some confidence that you can select a component and it will perform approximately as the numbers say it should.

Power for R1 would be 160V / 125 ohms = 1.28 A: Aave = 1.28 / 2 = .64 A.. At max speed it's about a 50% duty cycle, so = .64 A / 2 = .32 Amps. .32 A X 160 V = 51 Watts. There's also the current that flows during the discharge cycle so that needs to be added in. I'll think about what that should be.

The charge / discharge trace shown would be good for a 4-cylinder engine running from 'idle' to about 3,000 RPM. But you can drop R1 down to 55 ohms and it is theoretically good for 5,000 RPM (full effect). I'll be testing this soon. And I hope this post can help others understand these circuits.

Peace,

Greg

[jstadwater]

OK Greg, once again, AWESOME!!!

I just re-arranged the wiring on my V-8 HEI circuit to adopt your latest posted schematic. I have never seen a more stable plasma spark to this point!!! The "storage" 470uf cap at the FWB works great. After I unplug the 110V it still takes about 10 or 12 revs of the distributor (firing 8 plugs!) to get the spark back down to the "WIMPY" factory level, that proves it works for sure! Maybe we could even go bigger with the "storage" cap? I just got in a new set of marine spark plugs, with no "J" ground strap, I am getting ready to hook them up in a few minutes. Can't wait to see if there will be a better effect, hopefully will make me post another video! Since my HEI distributor is now hooked up totally factory, I don't think I have to worry about frying ignition modules, good news for sure. I am also wondering if swapping the resister with an inducter, as insane4evr mentioned, would stabilize the circuit for higher rpm, any thoughts anyone? I have another idea I might try as well, since the "effect" is now being created with no distributor mods, couldn't we just use two seperate "enhancer circuits"? Divide the cyliders in half, in reference to firing order, and have one "enhancer circuit" for each half? The only limitation is how fast we can charge the caps, the discharge is automatic when that particular cylinder fires. If that works, my V-8 would be stable at 5,000 rpm and the 4 cyl. would then be stable at 10,000 rpm, in theory. But then, what did we have but a theory when we first started building these circuits? I think this could work, even if it required a seperate "enhancement" for each cylinder. Most all newer vehicles have a seperate coil for each cylinder already, easy enough to tie into................and cheap enough too now that Greg fixed the whole deal for us all to replicate!!!! Be back in a minute, must check out these marine spark plugs............................................. ...Mike

[carbideTip]

Great work guys, WoW.. Thank You.

Is the points capacitor still in the distributor?

[gmeast]

inductor

Hi Greg,

Will replacing the resistor with an inductor which acually is an ideal inductor in series with its copper wire resistance, improve the charge rate. The inductive portion will 'isolate' the 470 uF capacitor during the initial discharge of the lower value cap. The 470 uF will thus have higher charge left during a cycle. The resistive portion will still keep the charging current at the desired limit. This might raise the RPM/frequency limit.

Just thinking out loud.

Hi insane4evr,

Help me put my head around your question. Functionally there is no harm in letting the big Cap 'bleed' a little through the limiter R1 during the discharge cycle because it ends up in the gap and as some heat at R1. The big Cap is acting as a DC power supply and the limiter R1 'forces' the CDI Cap (smaller Cap) to run out of juice and the arc to collapse.

Right now the flow is:

FWB keeps Big Cap charged
Big cap supplies ripple-free DC power to Limiter R1
Limiter R1 allows C1 (CDI Cap) to charge in allotted time.
Plug fires and creates path for C1 to flow through
C1 dumps across plug gap making plasma arc
Limiter R1 bleeds a little directly in the plug gap also
C1 runs out of juice and plasma arc collapses
Start over.

Where in this sequence would the inductor go and what would it do?

I can see that if an inductor could be set to resonate properly then it may (as you say) isolate the Big Cap so that the arc might be able to discharge down to 0 - VDC.

I kind of like the cushion because I think it provides some filtering from spikes that might damage electronics, ECM, etc. At the present there few variables in the circuit. Not enough is known about VexUs yet to be adding too many improvements. Right now I acknowledge it is running on energy differentials and not absolute energy 'packets' like in a pure CDI.

Thanks. Peace,

Greg

[gmeast]

Big Cap

OK Greg, once again, AWESOME!!!

I just re-arranged the wiring on my V-8 HEI circuit to adopt your latest posted schematic. I have never seen a more stable plasma spark to this point!!! The "storage" 470uf cap at the FWB works great. After I unplug the 110V it still takes about 10 or 12 revs of the distributor (firing 8 plugs!) to get the spark back down to the "WIMPY" factory level, that proves it works for sure!............................................. ................................
and cheap enough too now that Greg fixed the whole deal for us all to replicate!!!! Be back in a minute, must check out these marine spark plugs............................................. ...Mike

Hi Mike,

Long long ago Aaron posted a diagram showing what he called a 'backside cap'. Whenever I see a FWB I automatically put one in anyway. But Aaron deserves credit for recognizing the value of including them in these particular circuits and then sharing it. Many have benefited from his original post about this.

Peace,

Greg

[dllabarre]

Hi Mike,

Thanks, and yes the stability revolves around how reliably and quickly you can charge and discharge the CDI Cap. Your assumption seems correct from my perspective.

Greg

I love this forum!
Everything happens NOW!

Greg,

Question 1: Should the cap connected to the FWB always be 470uF 400V?

Question 2: What should I use for R1 and C1 on my 10HP single cylinder ICE?


Thank you,
DonL