Water Sparkplug

[vzon17]

Possible idea for circuit simplification.

I like this board, I post an idea here and nobody says anything and then I see it here a couple months later from somebody else that is developing it. so here is another one for you guys.

I thought this up but have not tried it yet. I ordered a strobe tube to try it when it arrives. Its real simple connect a xenon strobe tube in series with a capacitor and the spark plug. then whet the ignition fires you get you regular spark which at the same time fires the xenon flash tube which then dumps the cap through the spark plug for the plasma effect. tube them becomes an open circuit so cap can be recharged again. maybe this could eliminate some circuit components. I will try it myself when I get the strobe tube.

could use a regular strobe charing ciruit to charge the cap just elimitate the trigger coil and use the car ignition in its place. One such circuit would sit with each spark plug.

[gmeast]

restored to stock

I have been selling stuff and just today I removed the Firestorm plugs from my Bug, re-enabled the automatic choke, re-timed, tuned and installed the stock jets, in preparation for selling it.

Now that it has been restored I must say that the difference between how it drove with the Firestorms vs how it runs stock is drastic! I can't tell you what a 'dog' it once again is.

Those plasma generating plugs had a huge impact ... ran lean, no choke needed, 40% better mileage, etc., and on, and on.

Someone should continue researching the Firestorm plugs!

Greg

[vzon17]

I have been selling stuff and just today I removed the Firestorm plugs from my Bug, re-enabled the automatic choke, re-timed, tuned and installed the stock jets, in preparation for selling it.

Now that it has been restored I must say that the difference between how it drove with the Firestorms vs how it runs stock is drastic! I can't tell you what a 'dog' it once again is.

Those plasma generating plugs had a huge impact ... ran lean, no choke needed, 40% better mileage, etc., and on, and on.

Someone should continue researching the Firestorm plugs!

Greg

Did you have those custom made or find a supplier?
I would be intersted in that. I purchased an RPG 4700 plasma ignition system, it does what the water spark plug circuit does bump a cap through the spark plug when the cap fires. I decided to buy one so I didn't have to bulid one from scratch. Using the firstorm plugs with that would be sweet.

[vzon17]

Sory if im off topic but i thought i really had to say this.

If you take a carful look at most of the water sparkplug schematics out there it seems very similar to Edwin Gray's "splitting the positive" conversion tube setup on his patent which in turn is similar in principal to Tesla's disruptive discharge circuit and even shares some small similarities with Avramenko's plug.

Youve got the high voltage transformers, the high voltage pulse caps, the arc gap, the unidirectional spiked pulses etc.

It just seems that each of these inventions incorporates different aspects of radiant phenomenae to me and that they're different ways of achieveing the same thing.

Actual quite on topic, if we are actually using pulse technology in an engine seems like all sorts of improvization and modifcations could be developed. maybe te the point where we have an engine running on energy pulled from the vaccum. Or teslas pulse technology.

[gmeast]

plugs

Did you have those custom made or find a supplier?
I would be intersted in that. I purchased an RPG 4700 plasma ignition system, it does what the water spark plug circuit does bump a cap through the spark plug when the cap fires. I decided to buy one so I didn't have to bulid one from scratch. Using the firstorm plugs with that would be sweet.

Custom made by Robin David from one of the forums. I'll sell you my nickel ones for $500.00 and the Beryllium-Copper ones for $300.00 ... I have 5 of those ... one never used.

[rosco1]

Lucky man

I purchased an RPG 4700 plasma ignition system,

I sadly missed the boat on purchasing one of the few units offered for sale, though I still desperately wish to acquire one to run my silver electrode Firestorms with.

Hopefully Aquapulser will begin responding to my requests and can get a suitable unit to me once they build some more.

You got one, and Robin got one, that accounts for 2 of the seven they told me they had available, so there are still 5 of that batch unaccounted for.

If anyone has purchased an RPG 4700, yet have no suitable plugs to fire, and are willing to assist further research on Firestorm, then perhaps they might consider sending the unit to me for testing purposes.

[vzon17]

Custom made by Robin David from one of the forums. I'll sell you my nickel ones for $500.00 and the Beryllium-Copper ones for $300.00 ... I have 5 of those ... one never used.

Well right now I'm cleaned out from buying parts. How many is that I have a 6 cylinder engine. mabye when I,m rich again I'll get ahold of you.

[vzon17]

I sadly missed the boat on purchasing one of the few units offered for sale, though I still desperately wish to acquire one to run my silver electrode Firestorms with.

Hopefully Aquapulser will begin responding to my requests and can get a suitable unit to me once they build some more.

You got one, and Robin got one, that accounts for 2 of the seven they told me they had available, so there are still 5 of that batch unaccounted for.

If anyone has purchased an RPG 4700, yet have no suitable plugs to fire, and are willing to assist further research on Firestorm, then perhaps they might consider sending the unit to me for testing purposes.

I guess I did get lucky then. used my last dough to get it.

Had an interesting idea for ignition. I was testing a neon sign transformer and connecting it across a spark plug, it was a 9000 volt neon sign transfromer.
Jumped the gap no problem. so I widend the gap on the plug still jumped. then I cut off the ground electrode completely and ground the metal case down clean. neon sign transformer still jumped the gap no problem. So I orderd some solid state relays that can handle 12 amps at 480 VAC and I am going to switch the neon sign transformer on and off with the relay activated by the points eventullay. If it works it may replace my ignition coil on my car. then I will cut off all the ground electrodes so the spark jumps from the center electrode across to the ground shell. I will see if the engine runs with that setup. If it does I was thinking to rectify the neon sign transformer so its putting out DC and then add some high voltage caps to boost the current. Almost there with plasma spark then if the caps are big enough.

Then next stage may be get a dedicated alternator and rewire the stator for maximium voltage and run it through some voltage doublers to get 3 or 400 volts output and charge a cap with that and use it as the power source for water spark plug circuit instead of an inverter. so I will have a dedicated alternator pumping up caps for the water sparkplug circuit and could also use some of the alternator high voltage output to feed a HOH genetaror as well.
Mad scinetist here. LOL
maybe on top of that add a water injection via ultrasonic fog.
well I can dream can't I ?

Probably just use the RPG 4700 for now though. gotta start somewhere.

[aljhoa]

Otto cycle depends on pressure buildup of Nitrogen/Steam and without it an engine with missing portions of a head gasket may not run.
Plasma-Nitrogen-Water interaction is supersonic thus blown head gasket or open valves are not a problem.

Also Plasma-Nitrogen-Water interaction gives real meaning to the right of “naked hands” see:
Jumping Marble in Plastic Tube
YouTube - Jumping Marble in Plastic Tube
Jumping Marble in Longer Plastic Tube
YouTube - Jumping Marble in Longer Plastic Tube
Arc blast pressure Calculator
P = 11.58 x Iarc / D0.9
Arc Blast Explosion

Note that several small supersonic pressure waves summate to produce higher torque during gases’ expansion in an engine. (It’s like having ”after burner” without fuel.)

The theorists' work is not in vein as it touched states and federal upper government levels. The following links open doors for Doubtful Enquiring Minds.
http://www.energeticforum.com/genera...html#post50209
http://www.energeticforum.com/genera...html#post55334

Al

[TRON]

Question To All...

Would a wider rotor tip on the end of the distributor rotor allow for a longer spark dwell from 6 BTDC to 15 ATDC ?

...Just need a coil that can spark continuously for the duration of time the rotor is passing under the cap conductor...

Might help those guys running older conventional distributor engines
Simply get a rotor for your distributor that has a wider tip (3/4") or make it wider and adjust the position of the cap/dist to start firing when the edge touches the cap electrode for that cylinder # 1 ( retard a bit)..

any comments?

[vzon17]

Would a wider rotor tip on the end of the distributor rotor allow for a longer spark dwell from 6 BTDC to 15 ATDC ?

...Just need a coil that can spark continuously for the duration of time the rotor is passing under the cap conductor...

Might help those guys running older conventional distributor engines
Simply get a rotor for your distributor that has a wider tip (3/4") or make it wider and adjust the position of the cap/dist to start firing when the edge touches the cap electrode for that cylinder # 1 ( retard a bit)..

any comments?

Yeah that would be a good thing. to 15 degrees is plenty at about 2000 rpm the piston is travelling faster that the gas burn and expansion anyway so going much further than that would be pointless. most power is applied from TDC to about 12 degrees and after that its just waste. So the idea is to get all combusiton finished by that time and then quenched. I think you get about 5 milliseconds to apply power. normal gas burns for about 25 miliseconds. for a real detailed description of the combustion process get the book called Super Gas saver secrets by Eagle research. Once that is revealed it makes it easier to boost up the efficiency of the process. Shorter burn, less fuel, fire put out by the time exhaust valves open. the HHO helps with that because t speeds up the combustion. Water helps with it as it helps put out the fire and create more expansion.

[vzon17]

Would a wider rotor tip on the end of the distributor rotor allow for a longer spark dwell from 6 BTDC to 15 ATDC ?

...Just need a coil that can spark continuously for the duration of time the rotor is passing under the cap conductor...

Might help those guys running older conventional distributor engines
Simply get a rotor for your distributor that has a wider tip (3/4") or make it wider and adjust the position of the cap/dist to start firing when the edge touches the cap electrode for that cylinder # 1 ( retard a bit)..

any comments?

not including the water spark plug circuit a neon sign transformer would put out AC highvoltage and you could hold the spark on as long as you want. With that longer distributer contact would not be neede as the arc would follow and sustain . it would be hard on the spark plug and bistributer though as it creates much heat. just a few seconds on the neon transforem and the spark plug is real hot already. Mabye lots of high voltage capacitor in the circuit would help that as it would be a much bluer spark.

[rosco1]

Rotor

Would a wider rotor tip on the end of the distributor rotor allow for a longer spark dwell from 6 BTDC to 15 ATDC ?

...Just need a coil that can spark continuously for the duration of time the rotor is passing under the cap conductor...

Might help those guys running older conventional distributor engines
Simply get a rotor for your distributor that has a wider tip (3/4") or make it wider and adjust the position of the cap/dist to start firing when the edge touches the cap electrode for that cylinder # 1 ( retard a bit)..

any comments?

I'm not seeing any issue with the actual length of the rotor tip as yet.

I am finding that the vacuum advance settings are way out of synch when running FireStorm, Kiker leads and HEI ignition alone, through a PS91 coil.

If I revert back to very high quality spiral core leads, the problem isn't anywhere near as apparent, though it has to be said, the power increase has thus fallen off to a degree as well.

Oh yeah, if running Kiker wires, ensure the thin wire is kept separate(insulated) from the main tube for the entire length of the lead, terminating only at the terminal at each end. If it makes contact anywhere in between, the gain isn't as great as what you'll get with a carefully insulated wire.

The issue of the vastly out of synch vacuum advance will require great care in trying to overcome it, thus making the overall power increase more apparent.

Exploiting the quirks is half the battle.

[TRON]

RE: Sparks

I'm not seeing any issue with the actual length of the rotor tip as yet.

I am finding that the vacuum advance settings are way out of synch when running FireStorm, Kiker leads and HEI ignition alone, through a PS91 coil.

If I revert back to very high quality spiral core leads, the problem isn't anywhere near as apparent, though it has to be said, the power increase has thus fallen off to a degree as well.

Oh yeah, if running Kiker wires, ensure the thin wire is kept separate(insulated) from the main tube for the entire length of the lead, terminating only at the terminal at each end. If it makes contact anywhere in between, the gain isn't as great as what you'll get with a carefully insulated wire.

The issue of the vastly out of synch vacuum advance will require great care in trying to overcome it, thus making the overall power increase more apparent.

Exploiting the quirks is half the battle.

The key may not be higher voltage and higher amps... but a longer duration high frequency pulse... the igh frequency at 50%duty cycle will cut the heat and current in half with the same voltage levels!

Also maybe a different cam grind is required to close valves and open valves faster, since hydrogen burns 2.5 time faster than gasoline (maybe more)...

[UncleFester]

I have been selling stuff and just today I removed the Firestorm plugs from my Bug, re-enabled the automatic choke, re-timed, tuned and installed the stock jets, in preparation for selling it.

Now that it has been restored I must say that the difference between how it drove with the Firestorms vs how it runs stock is drastic! I can't tell you what a 'dog' it once again is.

Those plasma generating plugs had a huge impact ... ran lean, no choke needed, 40% better mileage, etc., and on, and on.

Someone should continue researching the Firestorm plugs!

Greg

That is amazing. Wonder why our results were so poor even considering the amount of time and $200,000 in funding.

1. How many joules were placed across the plugs?

2. What ignition was being used?

3. Were these plugs machined from Beryllium copper with Boron silicate ceramics?

4. How many miles were driven using the Firestorm design plugs/ignition?

5. Were normal plugs with the resistor removed used to test the difference between the two plug designs?

Thanks.