s1r9a9m9 water fuel circuit

[Guest]

Good source of diodes

I found a good place for eveyone to get HV diodes at high amps, inside old microwave ovens. They range from about 10kV -15KV at about 1/2 an amp each!

Also if you don't have a few microwaves lying around contact your local microwave/TV repairs shop and order some spares.

As far as tubes are concerned Im no help there, but I do think that Tesla used tubes his high voltage setups

[K1w1]

improved circuit

@Aaron

That is some impressive result you have there. I don't see how gotolucs design could be made more efficient than that?

Can you explain a little more please?

From what I can see your circuit doesn't require more power to be pumped in to increase the intensity of the arc but it has the effect of increasing the intensity dramatically with a higher reserve to draw from.

Why do you think that gotolucs design without this addition may be able to get comparative results?

+1000v is pretty massive and it follows that it would be either more capable of getting higher intensity reactions from more water at the same time or able to get more juice out of the hydrogen that is split off even if it uses the same amount of water.

This seems to me to provide ideal scalability for high powered engines and maybe even run a bus, truck, train or plane with this circuit assuming the diodes were robust enough to handle the load.

[Aaron]

s1r9a9m9

Thanks for all the feedback on the diodes!

The ones I got from Peter are HV03-12....350ma/12kv microwave oven diodes. I found there are hv03-15's that are a little more beefier with higher reverse ratings.

I see data sheets from them and a bunch of sites requiring signup just to get quotes but no outright retail prices.

If going the high amp low volt route like S1R - then the 600v 60amp diodes are probably more easy to come by....and if going high voltage/low capacity route like Peter and I tried, need an ideal solution for diodes. I want to try inverter direct like Luc's diagram and make a real comparison.

Is there a complete diagram of S1R's method so far incorporating his relay/inverter/plug/coil and the 3 wire coil?

The hv/low capacity route we tried is definitely proven to the point of dead diodes and the effect kept climbing to that point.

If the secondary power input is about joules...the higher the better...Tesla would have preferred high voltage low capacity quick abrupt discharges instead of the inverter direct method.

I'll use whatever works and I'm sure anybody else would too.

On S1R's relay diagram...is he showing that he is actually making connections to the cores of the relay coils?

[Guest]

Ive sent s1r a pm and hopefully ill get him to talk to me
If I have any luck ill post diagrams here as soon as possible

[rickoff]

Aaron - Re S1r diagrams update.

S1r is working on assembling some diagrams and text to explain things, but it's not ready yet.

The 18 hp engine running on water in the 2 videos S1r made works by using the transformer, and the inverter shown in the video was not actually utilized. I think he may have set things up to use the inverter as with his El Camino setup, but perhaps blew the inverter and then came up with the transformer idea as a quickly thought out and put together alternative. If you look closely at the video, the wires appearing to go to the inverter actually pass beneath it. Just battery and charger supplying power - no AC in that circuit - just amperage and voltage boost by the step-up transformer.

Rick

[rickoff]

New S1r MegaTrans Transformer

Hi folks,

As you know, I posted that I would be remaking the S1r transformer in a beefier upgrade of the original design. I built that last night while taking high-res photos of each step, and now have the photos posted on my Windows Sky Drive for the convenience of anyone wanting to duplicate it. You can zoom in quite a bit without loss of quality, so it is easy to see the details and read the text.

The original design, although working for S1r's YouTube Videos, suffered from overheating, and also damaged his battery. This new design uses 10 and 12 gauge wire, whereas the original used 14 and 16 gauge. The new, larger wire sizes should help to eliminate overheating, and should still produce the same effect, though perhaps better due to lower resistance and reduced power losses from heating. The turns ratio of the coils is identical to the original transformer. If you do experiment with this transformer, be certain to provide for battery protection using diodes, an isolation transformer, or other means. Also, be sure to house the transformer in a protective enclosure to isolate it from human contact, and to shield it from other electrical and electronic components. Safety first! And please post your results in this thread if you do try it out. I will be using mine for a test on my 4 cycle, 5 hp Tecumseh snowblower engine after I build an enclosure and rig the circuit. That may take a few days, as I have some prior commitments that I must get out of the way first.

See the photos and complete instructions here, and read the last file - "S1r MegaTran Transformer" first, as it is the explanatory introductory overview document:
S1r MegaTrans Transformer - Windows Live SkyDrive

Happy experimenting, Rick

[rosco1]

S1r circuit

Hi everyone,

Last night a friend sent me this link:
Kiker Performance Product 1

The first thing I noticed was the 5 wraps of the main wire, as per what S1r uses in his circuit.

I'm thinking about using this approach, by simply adding the nails and covering the 12v power feed base by running a single continuous 12v through all the S1r's (4 per side) collectively, terminating at a HHO gen.

I don't want to use a thermo fan motor or a light at the end, for I view that approach as a pure waste of energy.

Given that I'll be running twin HHO gens, I can run the power feed for each gen through the S1r circuits on each side of the engine(V8), thus 1 HHO gen power feed will serve double duty, by doing it's thing to the S1r's on 1 side of the engine, and running the HHO gen itself.

Any thoughts?

Also, looking at the 5 coil wraps and recognising what they do, has anyone considered what would happen should this approach be applied to the power feed to a HHO gen?

Will the double duty 12v approach work for me? Or will all the extra little coils (7 turns and 13 turns, multiplied X 4 S1r's) applied at each S1r create a problem?

Regards.

[rickoff]

Further analysis of S1r transformer, and what it does

Hi Rosco and everyone,

My posting of the S1r "transformer" pdf, and more recent posting of the S1r MegaTran (my version of S1r's unit as upscaled to avoid overheating issues), were done by me as an attempt to get as many people as possible to build and test the exact design duplication of S1r's nail core coil, and thus prove beyond any doubt whether or not it works. Earlier attempts by others to detail the "transformer" windings and connections (most notably the XboxHacker diagram coil_setup.png - Windows Live SkyDrive and Alex Petty's later analysis Alex Petty hdcalex coil analysis.pdf - Windows Live SkyDrive were close, but both had the connections of the third coil reversed from what S1r's teardown video revealed. I didn't want to see people building the S1r "transformer" in a manner not consistent with the actual build, as that would be reason for S1r to say that their tests proved nothing since the construction was incorrect. Jetijs was the first to build and test the "transformer" based upon my pdf analysis document, and he had no positive result. I built and tested both the original and the upscaled MegaTran unit, and neither gave positive results when hooked up as S1r suggested. Many others have now reported that they also failed to achieve any positive results using the design. Okay, so does that prove that S1r's videos were a hoax? No, absolutely not. It only proves that S1r's "transformer" did not do what we thought it would do when hooked up as S1r suggested. His suggested hookup was based upon attempting to provide the least costly method possible for achieving the effect that we all want to reproduce, and actually his thoughts about utilizing constant current usage devices that are already being used anyways (radio, blower fan, lights, etc.), does make sense. If you read through my next post in this thread, I believe that the facts as explained therein will not only make a lot of sense to everyone, but will also show that S1r's YouTube videos were probably the real thing.

Best regards, Rickoff

[rickoff]

Here are the actual facts about S1r's circuit

Hi everyone,

I'm familiar with coils and transformers of many different types, but wondered from the getgo how S1r's unit could really work. There have been so many questions in my mind, and from others, about the S1r "transformer," and what that really did (if anything) in the circuit used by S1r to run his 18hp B&S generator engine on water, that I decided to go back to his Video#1, and make as thorough an analysis of the hookups as was possible, and I did learn a lot from doing that. The video moves around quite a bit, so is in and out of focus often, but there are frames I found that briefly do show the actual connections (external to the tin container that the "transformer was inside of). I just kept clicking the play/pause button to advance very slowly and find what I was looking for. Here's what I found:
1.) The spark plug has a brown wire connected to its base.
2.) The spark plug tip has two wires - a large white wire (perhaps 10 gauge) that leads to the tin "transformer" enclosure, and would be connected inside to the bare copper lead output from the 5 turn coil. The other wire at the tip is a black wire of similar size, but heads off in the direction of the battery. It would not be connected to the negative terminal of the battery, of course, as the jumper cable from the battery shows that the battery negative is grounded to the engine block, while the jumper cable positive clamp is used by the assistant to complete the positive connection at the starter. With the black wire running off the plug tip, down to the ground, and through the grass, it is impossible to see where the other end actually terminates. It is only logical, though, to assume that it is attached to a positive, low voltage, high amperage source.
3.) The high voltage (HV) output from the ignition coil goes into the tin enclosure, and would of course be connected to the input lead of the 5 turn coil. Okay, so let's say we can assume the 5 turn coil is definitely connected, and the HV passes through it and on to the spark plug tip. Now what about the other connections inside the tin?
4.) There are only three wires coming out of the tin: the large HV spark wire from the ignition coil, the white wire connected to the plug tip, and a brown wire. Hmmm, There should be 4 wires, according to Sir's hookup diagram, from his photo of the transformer: S1r step up transformer coil close-up.jpg - Windows Live SkyDrive So the hookup inside the tin container cannot be as S1r suggests. He suggests that one lead should come out of the tin and go to the battery positive terminal, while the 4th lead goes to engine ground through a constant current usage device such as a 60 watt lamp.
5.) Here's where it gets interesting. The brown wire, running out of the tin enclosure, appears at first glance to be the same wire connected to the base of the spark plug, and that would seem correct according to S1r's photo, minus a 60 watt lamp of course. So what is the purpose of the brown wire?
6.) Upon close examination, I was able to see that the brown wire does not run directly from the tin container to the spark plug base. While they are the same size and brown color, they are actually two separate wires which are divided off from a two-conductor cord. That can clearly be seen if you stop Video #1 at 0:50 on the timer. That cord runs over to the inverter, and is plugged into the inverter's 110V AC outlet. Okay, so one AC lead from the inverter goes to the plug base, and the other goes into the tin container, to an unknown connection point.
7.) Now what about the inverter? It appears that S1r intended to use it for the setup, but he later said that it wasn't actually connected. And if you follow the inverter-to-battery cables over to the battery, you see that the cable clamps are both lying on the ground there, at 1:08 and 1:09 elapsed time in the video. So, no AC current was sent through the brown wires. The only connection, provided at the inverter's AC plug, would be to the secondary coil winding inside the inverter. That winding, and the long length of the dual conductor brown cord, would only add resistance between the spark plug base, and whatever the brown lead is connected to inside the tin. So if the inverter isn't doing anything, and the 2nd and third coil windings of S1r's "transformer" are not completing a circuit, then where does the low voltage, high current enhancement come from?
8.) The low V, high A current actually comes from a battery charger hooked up to the old, yellow battery. The charger is connected, and you can hear the buzz from it being turned on at 1:32 of the video. The charger is an older Schauer model which has two output rates - one for charging at 10 amps, and another for starting an engine at 50 amps. You can't see the charger at the time he switches it on, so the actual amp rate he used is unknown, but is either 10 or 50 amps. It is interesting to note that Gotoluc says you should have 10 amps or more when using his bridge rectifier circuit for a DC low voltage, high current enhancement, and Capacitor 70 actually uses a 50 amp rectifier. Perhaps S1r was operating the charger at 50 amps, and this would explain why the yellow battery was damaged, and needed to be replaced by a new battery for the second video, since S1r was not using any protective device that could have prevented the battery damage. How, might you ask, was the LV, high current source added in to the spark circuit? As we know from watching Video #1, the charger is connected to the battery, and there is a negative jumper cable leading to a ground on the engine block. This effectively introduces the negative of the charger's LV, high amp circuit to the base of the spark plug, which is also ground connected. The positive connection, at the tip of the spark plug, comes through the black wire that was mentioned in #2.
9.) So you do have a constant current, LV, high amp potential applied to the spark plug, only not in the method suggested by S1r in his explanation of the "transformer" outputs. And when the HV pulse from the ignition coil passes through the 5 turn coil of the "transformer," and jumps the gap of the spark plug, the LV, High current from the charger follows it and enhances the spark. So then, what does the "transformer" actually do, if anything at all?
10.) If hooked up as S1r suggests, and if made as S1r made it, perhaps about 5 amps would be going through the "second coil" and "third coil" when initially activated, which really isn't enough draw according to Gotoluc or Capacitor70 to achieve the desired effect. Also, the wire heats up and causes greater resistance in the windings, and would get very hot - eventually burning off the insulation. So anyone experimenting with the nail core "transformer" would not realize the result they had hoped for. It did play a part in S1r's successful running of the engine, though, and here's what that part is:
11.) The long length of the "transformer's" bare copper wire, which is connected to the ignition coil and the spark plug tip, really has only one functional purpose. It is coiled, and it's leads bent back, to cause resistance that slows the passage of electrons, thus effectively retarding the spark timing somewhat, and this is a desired effect for a water explosion in the cylinder of an engine. So what about the other coils of the "transformer?"
12.) Coils of the "transformer's" 7-turn and 13 turn windings did absolutely nothing when used in S1r's video, because they were not connected to a completed circuit.

You see that I have used quotation marks whenever mentioning the "transformer," and that is because it really is not acting as a transformer at all, let alone the "step-up-transformer" that S1r suggests. The bottom line here is that S1r was able to run his B&S generator engine on water for the You Tube videos by producing a plasma spark comprised of low amperage, high voltage pulses coming from the ignition coil, combined with low voltage, high amperage (10 to 50 amps) as provided by the battery charger, which gives a constant current path. In reality, the working Capacitor 70 motorbike circuit, using water as fuel, is nearly identical to what S1r was doing with the B&S engine. See Capacitor70 working motorbike circuit.jpg - Windows Live SkyDrive Capacitor70 used the same technique as S1r, applying 50 amps of low voltage current across the spark plug, which followed the high voltage arc across the spark gap. The only real difference is that Cap70 used diodes to prevent the high and low voltage currents from wandering to any place in the circuit other than the spark plug tip. So Capacitor70's successful bench tests and running engine demonstrations do show that S1r's video representations of an engine running on water are probably quite authentic. Capacitor70 has now upgraded and bench tested an improved circuit, which uses a second spark plug as a switch to slow down the HV pulse slightly while high voltage capacitors (in the 7500 picofarad range) briefly charge and then discharge across the switching plug's gap to activate the primary winding of a toroidal step-up transformer. This step-up transformer really is functional, and steps the voltage output of the secondary's magnet wire windings up to nearly 3 times the HV seen at the primary winding, which would result in a spark voltage of 100kv or more. The secondary winding is in a series circuit with the low voltage 50 amps applied across the engine's spark plug. The isolating properties of the transformer effectively cancel the need for the multiple diodes used in Capacitor70's previous circuitry. Another thing this transformer accomplishes is to lengthen the duration of the spark, and that will probably be of advantage in a water fuel circuit. Most small engines use CDI ignition nowadays, and CDI alone - without the transformer, would provide a very brief duration spark. That's great for a high revving small engine, or a racing engine in an automobile, but not for water fuel sparks. The voltage boost from Cap70's transformer will certainly produce a more powerful plasma arc than was possible in his working motorbike S1r replication. Capacitor 70 is rebuilding his motorbike engine, and will apply the new circuit to it when ready. His circuit bench tested quite well, and he appears to be very happy with it.

I hope this post will serve to clear up the complexities and mysteries of the S1r water fueled engine videos, which I do believe to be authentic for the reasons stated herein. For future experimentation and applications of S1r technology, I suggest that you start with the improved design of Capacitor 70's latest circuit for best results. It is still the actual S1r method, as used in his videos, but simply made safer and better. See it at Capacitor70 latest circuit 7-17-08.jpg - Windows Live SkyDrive

Best wishes to all,

Rickoff

[rosco1]

Not discouraged just yet

Hi Rosco and everyone,

My posting of the S1r "transformer" pdf, and more recent posting of the S1r MegaTran (my version of S1r's unit as upscaled to avoid overheating issues), were done by me as an attempt to get as many people as possible to build and test the exact design duplication of S1r's nail core coil, and thus prove beyond any doubt whether or not it works. Earlier attempts by others to detail the "transformer" windings and connections (most notably the XboxHacker diagram coil_setup.png - Windows Live SkyDrive and Alex Petty's later analysis Alex Petty hdcalex coil analysis.pdf - Windows Live SkyDrive were close, but both had the connections of the third coil reversed from what S1r's teardown video revealed. I didn't want to see people building the S1r "transformer" in a manner not consistent with the actual build, as that would be reason for S1r to say that their tests proved nothing since the construction was incorrect. Jetijs was the first to build and test the "transformer" based upon my pdf analysis document, and he had no positive result. I built and tested both the original and the upscaled MegaTran unit, and neither gave positive results when hooked up as S1r suggested. Many others have now reported that they also failed to achieve any positive results using the design. Okay, so does that prove that S1r's videos were a hoax? No, absolutely not. It only proves that S1r's "transformer" did not do what we thought it would do when hooked up as S1r suggested. His suggested hookup was based upon attempting to provide the least costly method possible for achieving the effect that we all want to reproduce, and actually his thoughts about utilizing constant current usage devices that are already being used anyways (radio, blower fan, lights, etc.), does make sense. If you read through my next post in this thread, I believe that the facts as explained therein will not only make a lot of sense to everyone, but will also show that S1r's YouTube videos were probably the real thing.

Best regards, Rickoff

Hi Rick,

Please note the following, sourced from elsewhere:

"Quote"
Assuming the current travels from the coil pack to the spark plug, spark energy supplied from the coil encounters a self-induction winding about six inches from the spark plug. The coil generates a magnetic field that will travel down the wire to accompany the electric field also traveling down the wire toward the spark plug. The self-induction coil enhances the original value of henrys and at the same time spaces out the delivery of milliamps to the plug. The milliamps are what actually fire the mixture rather than voltage. Three energies are distributed within the wire in this fashion. These three energies move at slightly different velocities. The accompanying magnetic field creates three sparks across the gap."Unquote"


Could the apparent "failures to replicate", be simply due to the distance that the S1r circuit is placed in the line before the plug? If it's placed too close, or too far away, might that not affect the spark generated?

[damiencheryl]

question for Arron or Peter on curcuit

Hello all

My name is Damien Holyoak. I have been playing with the last few curcuits from some of your post for a bit. I started playing with using a relay setup resently but keeped burning out the diodes. As Arron and Peter have pointed out microwave diodes are needed. I dont mean to sound arrigent but i v been looking for the curcuit that Peter Linderman just showed on his video. As i scribed it i couldnt see everything properly as far as values for some items.

Iv been scanning the post for the last 2 weeks as new stuff from you blokes has come out but cant find the scamatic.
I havnt posted my results in the past as you blokes in the past have encountered the same probs and i have seen that some of you are very tallented on electronic curcuits as far as designing new ideas which iv enjoyed reading. I loved reading Cap 70 stuff in the past.

Just letting you all know that i have enjoyed reading all your post and found this forum and this subject great cause most of you blokes stayed on the topic which i love not like some of the other forums.

Cheers Damien

[Aaron]

schematics in zip file

Hi Damien,

In the Water Sparkplug thread I posted a link to a zip file with pics and schematics from Peter's demo video.

[rickoff]

Reply to Rosco

Hi Ross,

If the person who wrote the referenced quote in your #40 post was postulating as to what effect the S1r "transformer" produced in S1r's two YouTube videos, then the writer is somewhat mistaken. I know my post #39 seems a bit long, but if you read through it carefully you will clearly see that the "transformer" actually transformed nothing in the videos because the 2nd and third coils were not in a completed circuit. They did nothing. The main coil did have a limited function, and like the Kiker wires it retards the HV spark and lengthens the spark duration. Both those factors should be beneficial to a water explosion. It can also be beneficial in a gas engine which has CDI, since the CDI produced spark is often too brief to give a sufficient burn, which leads to wasted fuel and a foul exhaust. As you know, a normal blue spark is created using less than 1 ampere of current, but isn't powerful enough to create a plasma arc without being sufficiently enhanced. Sir's "transformer" did not provide that enhancement in his videos. Instead, it was the 10 to 50 amps provided by the battery charger being effectively connected across the spark plug, as well as to the battery. Now you could, as you suggest, operate one or two hydroxy boosters to produce a current of 10 to 50 amperes, and use that rather constant current for the LV, high current supply acoss the spark plug, using appropriate diodes to control the merge point at the tip of the plug. I know you plan to use the hydroxy to augment the plasma water explosion effect, and hopefully that will result in an engine that performs well without need of additional fuel sources. That would be great. Keep up the good work, Rosco.

Rick

[Aaron]

prolonging the spark

The main coil did have a limited function, and like the Kiker wires it retards the HV spark and lengthens the spark duration.

Rick, this is a powerful concept. I'm going to explore this until I have my optimum diode solution.

[rickoff]

Aaron: Diodes

Aaron, what are you looking to try next for your diode solution? Any real idea, or is that still kind of up in the air? I was looking at Jetijs's diagrams yesterday, any I'm sure the circuit will probably work out, but are 80 diodes really necessary?

I really liked your spark amplification idea. Have you drawn up a preliminary full circuit diagram for use in an automobile? I'd love to see that, if you have - just a barebones preliminary sketch.

Best, Rick