Stanley Meyer Explained

[tutanka]

take into account that the GP is an electron gun

those 4 coils of wire at each end, 2 on one end and 2 on the other act as accelerators for the free electrons that tend to hang around due to the high static potential.

during the OFF pulse on the HV anode and kathode, you put in a 12VDC pulse to the LED's AND the COILS of wire to shoot the electrons into the Extraction Mesh Grid before they have a chance to re-stabilize the ambient air. that also happens to be the time period where the opto relay is closed for the path through the consuming device straight to battery+

then the next HV pulse starts again... etc

What happens when you wrap 4 coils of wire at the two ends of a toilet paper tube and insert a rod of iron inside... thats the direction that the electrons will travel...just like a solenoid plunger..

working on schematics and PC boards right now, figuring out the entire circuit with modern day parts to post soon...

And nitrogen molecular don't is used inside GP?? molecules don't react similarry to oxygen??

[bussi04]

component values part 2

C1 = 100 µF (for smoothing voltage, non critical value) and paralleel 0.1µF (for consuming ripple, non critical value)
C2 = 1000 µF (smoothening input voltage for A22=7808, non critical value)
C3 = 10-100 µF bipolar electrolyte (spikes of negative voltage expected when primary coil voltage is switched off by pulse train signal), parameters: impedance/resistance of primary coil, timing for voltage changes (higher capacity slows down voltage changes of variable primary input coil voltage)

For C4 and the resistor values I have to look into the OPAMP-book. Stay tuned!

A25 is a 1:1 amplifier from input voltage to output voltage = voltage follower (decoupling low amp input voltage).

VDD seems to be the voltage supply for the OPAMPS. Due to the 7808 voltage regulator (+8V regulated) the output voltages of the OPAMPs are presetted to change around a "virtual input ground" of the OPAMPs at +4V.

greetings,
bussi04

Looking at OPAMP A24 at Figure 4 it seems to be a differential amplifier: Operational amplifier - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

At the non-inverting input (+) there is a constant (adjustable) positive voltage.
At the inverting input (-) there is the (slowly) variable positive voltage from the voltage follower A25 from system control J. C4 seems to be a low-pass filter element (bu007) added to the differential amplifier (Introduction to Filters )

To get it right in bu006 there should be R1=R2 and R3=R4. The amplification factor without these resistors would be much too high. So the amp factor is determined (reduced) by relations R1/R3 and R2/R4.

So my best guess for C4 at Figure 4 is to start the circuit without C4 and to test the circuit dynamics in operation starting with the following caps: 10µF, 1µF, 100nF, 10nF,1nF, 100pF and to meter the circuit dynamics.

The relations of resistors at bu006 must be transposed at Figure 4 to (P3(fine adjust)+R2), R4, (R5+P4(fine adjust)+R6).

The value of R1 at Figure 4 depends on the behaviour of the Darlington Circuit Q4 Q5. Starting with R1=0 ohms gets an amp factor of 1, higher values get a higher amp factor.

For R3 at Figure 4 I would start with 1 MOhm.

Notice: A24 makes a signal inversion.

Greetings,
Bussi04

[h20power]

This is the darlington transitor I am looking at buying: 497-2541-5-ND from Digi-Key. For it matches the original the best, and my power supply might be a 24v 3amp or just battery powered. I will have to test the two power supplies out to see which one will run the engine the best through the full RPM range.

Thanks bussi04, Tron, and all the rest keeping the water for fuel technology going so everyone can have a chance at energy independence


h2opower.

[chasson321]

Agree

It still seems to me that there are two possible ways of making the GP work correctly.

Stan mentions in his patent that the Atoms are ionized and excited using electric fields to induce resonance into the electron, as well as photon absorbtion, which increases the electron energy in cascading steps.


But, on the other hand the Photoelectric effect and the Electron Avalanche seem to also be very plausable. After all, if anyone here does just a small amount of research on the topic you'll find the following to be true:

-Atoms can be excited by bombardment with electrons (Collision Excitation)
-The energy is transferred from the electrons to the atoms in discrete amounts.....

It also seems that the energy of the electron is related to it's velocity, which is in direct relation to the voltage...


Just some notes to think about....

HMS I agree with you on this point, and will go even one step farther in saying that there are probably even more ways to go about it. However, so that there will not be any confusion in this matter, I think it best that we let Meyer explain his process and proceed accordingly.

If someone has another way to go about this water for fuel endeavor, great! They should have their own thread. However, it should not be called Meyer's work if they cannot back it up. If it is their own work, then they should claim it. Let's not confuse things.

I appreciate your work and effort.

[CPU3rother]

Great Posts!

From my most recent research:

It seems the purpose of the Gas Processor is to create a "Electron Cascade".

On the LED's. I honestly don't believe their purpose is to excite the Oxygen atoms when they are in a high enough voltage field to bring the electrons all the way to ionization. To me it seems that they are used to increase the efficiency of the electron cascade that is taking place.

Photon Assisted Electron Cascade?

Chasson321, a few posts back you posted an interesting paper, there I found what I always believed, on page 3. The answer to question (#3c) was:



To me it seems once again we can find things that are similiar to Meyers Gas Processor. Like Photomultiplier Tubes (Gas Ionization Tubes) which create a Electron cascade which produces current, the current produced is used on a low voltage circuit and measured for a variety of purposes. (Interesting how very similiar it is to the GP as it has a different form of an Electron Extraction Circuit)

Photomultiplier - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Techniques for nuclear and particle ... - Google Books


On the second link it is explained that photomultipliers can use either a continuous voltage or a pulsed voltage.


And I'm sure as you all have seen the Gas Processor Circuit, if you understand it, you'll understand that the higher the voltage the engine sensing devices output (RPM, Laser Accelerator) the more electrons will be consumed in the Electron Extraction Circuit, controlling the amount of energy produced in the cylinders of the engine!

In one of my earlyer post I provided some links showing that It is posible to ionize Oxygen with just UV. I have some equipment that will ionize oxygen with just UV lamps. The lamps are simalar to ones onemind posted. I also have one that produces Hydroxyl from moisture in the air using only UV light.

Nice progress h2o

[HMS-776]

Just a note from Stan Meyers patent # 5,293,857 that I thought would help us all.


"the quantity of the fuel mixture introduced to the cylinder at the intake of the cycle is the same per cycle regardless of engine RPM."

Just noticed this and thought it was an important thing to remember as this means the injector duty cycle will always be the same regardless of engine RPM. Obviously as we know, it is the gas processor that creates the extra energy, and the absorbtion & consumption of electrons in the EEC is what controls that energy!

Once we get the Injector duty cycle right, it will never need to change!

[TRON]

figure 2 figured out

here are some files on Figure2. I have eliminated most parts by changing the logic of the detectors from inverter to buffer. (instead of output high when dark, we use output high when lit) this makes the optoschmitts self regulating for safety purposes. Stan decided to pair up 2 multiplexor's so that if A2 determined that one of the IR LEDs died, the whole system would shut down, this required him to BLOCK the light to send a +5VDC signal to A1. By changing the logic and blocking ALL except the one we want (with a window instead of a curtain on the accelerator) we don't need all the safety related parts. If one of the LEDs integrated into the HOA6994-T55 motion sensors dies, the signal at the window is simply not sent! so it has its own safety logic built in!

you can never have a runaway condition related to electronic component failure (unless the rotating arm falls off its pivot..).

see attached design docs
too bad there are only specific file types we can save to this forum

[bussi04]

...
too bad there are only specific file types we can save to this forum

hi Tron,

make a zip-file from whatever file format you want and include it in a word-document. upload the word document and

how do you include? not by cut&past but menu "insert > object > new > package > file > import > filename" in microsoft word.
so the code of the zip-file gets embedded in the doc-code and can be uploaded in the doc-container-file

hope that helps.

greetings,
bussi04

[Tecstatic]

hi Tron,

make a zip-file from whatever file format you want and include it in a word-document. upload the word document and

how do you include? not by cut&past but menu "insert > object > new > package > file > import > filename" in microsoft word.
so the code of the zip-file gets embedded in the doc-code and can be uploaded in the doc-container-file

hope that helps.

greetings,
bussi04

May I suggest avoiding the closed source document format .doc (MS-Word) and use a free format ( for free energy documentation )

Just make the zip file, eg. data.zip, then rename data.zip to data.jpg or one of the other allowed formats, and remember to tell us it has to be renamed back from .jpg to .zip.

..Or you just rename the original file if it is in a compact format already.

@h20power

The math I did on the diameter of the tube was based on the air intake needs of the engine:
vi = qi / Ai = qi / (π di2) = qi / (h) {( 2 * pi * radius * height)}

What about the mesh ? As a rough take the "open" area is 25% of the tube cross section area, and it also creates a lot of turbulence, so the pressure drop across the mesh can be more than you opted for, when the engine is running at max. RPM.

When using a metal mesh for protecting turbocharger inlets on racing engines, the mesh area is approx. 20 times larger than the area of the compressor inlet, and the mesh is also more "open". So maybe you have a "straw" at the mesh.

Eric

[h20power]

I guess I will have to find that out the old fasioned way through testing. Once the electronics are complete I should start engine testing soon afterwards, but my PC is down so I have to wait until it gets fixed before I can design anything using AutoCAD. I am awhere that it is going to give a presure drop just not sure how much. The engine I am retrofitting is a 2.0 VW a bit larger than Stans 1.6 but not by much and I am working with the vehicals fuel system for the full conversion. That cut a lot of electronics needed to be made as in Stans system, but also complecated matters as the systems wheren't designed for use for water. I have high hopes that I will get it working with my knowledge of automotive systems.

And I agree about avoiding MS Word for I don't even have it.

May I suggest avoiding the closed source document format .doc (MS-Word) and use a free format ( for free energy documentation )

Just make the zip file, eg. data.zip, then rename data.zip to data.jpg or one of the other allowed formats, and remember to tell us it has to be renamed back from .jpg to .zip.

..Or you just rename the original file if it is in a compact format already.

@h20power



What about the mesh ? As a rough take the "open" area is 25% of the tube cross section area, and it also creates a lot of turbulence, so the pressure drop across the mesh can be more than you opted for, when the engine is running at max. RPM.

When using a metal mesh for protecting turbocharger inlets on racing engines, the mesh area is approx. 20 times larger than the area of the compressor inlet, and the mesh is also more "open". So maybe you have a "straw" at the mesh.

Eric

[Tecstatic]

I guess I will have to find that out the old fasioned way through testing.

Even without a crystal ball I think you will find it is a straw, but if you arrange the mesh like on the upper right filter here:

K&N High Performance Air Filters, Oil Filters, & Air Intakes - Official K&N Engineering Site

You can increase the area much. The filter can be folded from a plain mesh as it is like a paper form for baking muffins. Have the "cone" point towards the air flow like in the KN filter.

Once the electronics are complete I should start engine testing soon afterwards, but my PC is down so I have to wait until it gets fixed before I can design anything using AutoCAD.

With the kind of work you do, let me advice you to have two PCs, one for your work, which is never connected to the Internet, and one more for surfing the net.

I am awhere that it is going to give a presure drop just not sure how much. The engine I am retrofitting is a 2.0 VW a bit larger than Stans 1.6 but not by much and I am working with the vehicals fuel system for the full conversion. That cut a lot of electronics needed to be made as in Stans system, but also complecated matters as the systems wheren't designed for use for water. I have high hopes that I will get it working with my knowledge of automotive systems.

I also have a VW.
I have been through some thinking on how to make modifications.

I think the most easy road to follow is to make the extra systems you need. If a system conflicts with the car computers, make a "simulator" of the actual conflicting/missing signals (eg. the Lambda signal), so the car computers are happy with what they see and stays in normal operating mode.

In this way the anti skidding, anti brake blockage and other systems works normally. I think this is important from a security point, as ripping out the standard computers voids these functions, and it is certainly no elementary job to make a new system, and even think of the necessary tests to reach the original security level of the car.

If your car is old so it does not have these systems, it does not hurt thinking a bit ahead so it is possible to fit on a new car also.

I have some non-car knowledge of the CAN bus (have made some CAN-bus devices), and I know a guy with lots of VW car computer experience (20 years+), so if you hit the wall with a specific problem, maybe I can help.

Eric

[h20power]

Thanks Eric,
The screen mesh I am using has a 100/.0045 grid very free flow infact the picture I show of the gas processor is looking right through the screen mesh grid. The cars is a 96' Jetta I got it just for the conversion from gas to water, so far with the car I have spent around $2100 total for the project. That's why I laughed at the one person asking for $2300 just for some sort of test equipment for that is the full cost of the whole project thus far.

I will set the fuel system for around 38/1 fuel ratio for starts and work from there. Since I am working with the cars existing fuel system I will need two circuits with varying voltage for unlike Meyers the fuel amount increases with RPMs so the injectors voltage must also increase as a result to process more fuel. I have a lot of work to do but I am confident for the mathmatical model I am following says it can work more than just Meyers way.


h2opower.

[Tecstatic]

I will set the fuel system for around 38/1 fuel ratio for starts and work from there. Since I am working with the cars existing fuel system I will need two circuits with varying voltage for unlike Meyers the fuel amount increases with RPMs so the injectors voltage must also increase as a result to process more fuel.

Please excuse me for my ignorance, as I have not read this whole long thread, but only peeked occasionally.

The two systems you talk about is that an original Jetta injector spaying water into the gas processor, and another sending air to another gas processor optimized for oxygen ?

Then adding the two together into the inlet ?

Or do you use it for sending the ingredients to a Stan type water injector ?

You say the voltage must increase with RPM, do you have proportional injectors ?

The injectors I have seen are pulsed devices, where the amount of fuel is delivered based on a constant difference pressure over the injector (difference pressure regulated by a mechanical regulator valve), and the length of the pulse to the injector coil.
This way the fuel pressure varies with manifold pressure, so the pressure drop over the injector is constant.

For the air, you could use eg. an analog Danfoss proportional air valve, you can get them in different sizes. With pressure sensors each side of the valve, a micro controller can calculate the control voltage in a given situation, as the feed pressure and the manifold pressure varies.

I wonder if you have done some tests of the concept just as a furnace, before going on to the more complicated engine injection controller.

Somewhere you mention the speed (max.frequency) of the LEDs is important, I have not done a test, but I will expect a bipolar drive of the LEDs can increase the frequency a bit.

Eric

[h20power]

I ask that if you would please read the whole thread as there is a lot of good information in it. I go over just how the water injectors work the voltage disociation of water, the importance of the gas processor, the electron extraction circuit, and more. Stanley Meyer's water for fuel technology is now out in the open for all to have.

If people say that will take too much time those people are not asking the right questions. For it matters not the time but where you will be after the time in question took to pass. For time will go on it is the infomation you will get in that time that will make a differance in your life.


h2opower.

[carbideTip]

Thank you for sharing your hard work H2. Someday we need to get together for a beer.

-CT