Ionization & Water Fuel

[Aaron]

Beautiful motor Tutanka...
YouTube - mammasat's Channel

Any diagrams or schematics?

I looked back at some posts. You mentioned copper tubes.
Are you using 2 concentric copper tubes? If so, what is
the gap?

-------------------------------------------------------------

ATTN: GET THIS DOC and read it and read all the posts in this thread
BEFORE posting any questions:

Here is a 3 page compilation of this thread. I condensed it into a couple
categories. It is short and sweet. It is INCOMPLETE. There are a few
things that need to be added that may or may not be apparent to get
a full working motor. But it will give the Nitrogen Hydroxide story and more.
How to Make Nitrogen Hydroxide
Version 1.0 - Jan 31, 2010

[tutanka]

Beautiful motor Tutanka...
YouTube - mammasat's Channel

Any diagrams or schematics?

I looked back at some posts. You mentioned copper tubes.
Are you using 2 concentric copper tubes? If so, what is
the gap?

HI,
About copper tubes.. you refer to GP?
About engine.. I cant divulgate anything... Sorry

[Aaron]

gp

Does ozone have anything to do with what you're doing?

[Aaron]

gp

Tutanka, gp as in the after cell processor of what to do with the
gas after it has been made?

[Aaron]

ionization

Tutanka, you are ionizing water vapor and adding it to hho.

[Aaron]

video

You're making hho somehow and are ionizing air and water mixture and
adding them together.

If you're not using copper concentric tubes to produce hho, then
you're using the copper tube for something else.

[tutanka]

Tutanka, you yanked your youtube vid. Why?

I have it copies, do you mind if I post it? Others have copies
too as it is easy to copy youtube vids.

You're making hho somehow and are ionizing air and water mixture and
adding them together.

If you're not using copper concentric tubes to produce hho, then
you're using the copper tube for something else.

I have open video for an friend and I have forget to close. Video isn't public, with request I can add friends to see that..

You wrote:

You're making hho somehow and are ionizing air and water mixture and
adding them together.

No, the procedure isn't correct.. as written you don't need more water ..

[Aaron]

gas processor

Hi Tutanka,

I'm talking about ionizing steam or moisture in a "gas processor" or maybe just
ionizing the air and mixing that with HHO.

You mention a copper pipe - is the processing of gas happening inside the
pipe then? Between plates or points?

[Aaron]

ionization

"HI Aaron,
First of all ... I'm an italian researcher and engineer and sorry I can't have an my thread, I have signed an NDA about that.. However I can explain my idea. Some peoples, including Sebosfato, don't consider that; all are oriented to create an great amount of gas but the gas formed with hydrogen is very volatile and have little molecules, after some tests on standard engines the same result is that gas is lost trought piston rings and valves if send normally trought manifold inlet. For that more companies like BMW was oriented to create direct injection of hydrogen in chambre of combustion. And you have to consider other important point, water gas interact a lot with metals parts inside engine, for that, to peoples orientend to use that gas, I suggest treatment of ceramization of cylinder, head of piston and chambre of combustion. However my studies are oriented to the creation of new molecular mixture that can be used normally inside standard engines. In part is the same concept of Meyer. If you analyze injector you found that in fact is an compact WFC minicell. Air treatment with GP, as previously written, is necessary to start the chain reaction for obtain thermal explosive energy. But method explained from h2opower for me isn't correct .. you have to anaylize the words " thermal explosive energy".. For h2opower only oxygen ionized and destabilized is necessary, mixed with water fog, to create thermal explosive energy.. For that I suggest to all peoples to demand an video that prove that first to spent other moneys for an doubt project."

Just read that,

I have the best oil additive in the world - the only undersurface lubricant
known to man - I'm not worried about wear and tear with water or
anything.

Anyway, "Air treatment with GP, as previously written, is necessary to start the chain reaction for obtain thermal explosive energy."

Yes! That is what I'm saying... ok, so you're using the GP to simply ionize
the air - or maybe not so simple.

So with HHO + ionized air = my preference is the plasma spark ignition.

With a lawnmower test Peter and I did, we started to move to steam
injection and we could advance timing.

Anyway, what is your opinion on the combination of hho and ionized air?

Are you ducting the ionized air before or after the carburetor butterfly?
I don't know if it makes a difference because when in the chamber under
compression, I'm guessing it would be homogenized.

[Aaron]

quality not quantity

p.s., I'm not interested in high volume hho. I'm interested in high QUALITY
water fuel.

[tutanka]

p.s., I'm not interested in high volume hho. I'm interested in high QUALITY
water fuel.

HI Aaron,
I know that

[Michael John Nunnerley]

Hi Alex and Aaron

This a little bit difficult to explain on a public forum as Alex has said, he is commited not to give an exposure and I am also under the official secrets act that I signed back when I worked for Marconi in England, once signed it is like a death warrent, it is with you all your life.

@ Aaron, Alex is working on a new engine which creates very high torque which is what is needed to run on this type of fuel. All I can say is as far as a jet engine is concerned, it works, but heat is needed to start the chain off. Now in a piston engine there are a lot of problems such as Alex has said with hydrogen leakage into other parts of the engine, so most of the fuel has to be made in the moment of use in the engine and not before

@ Alex, hope you do not mind me making this post as we both have an interest in this

Mike

[rosco1]

Aaron

"HI Aaron,
First of all ... I'm an italian researcher and engineer and sorry I can't have an my thread, I have signed an NDA about that.. However I can explain my idea. Some peoples, including Sebosfato, don't consider that; all are oriented to create an great amount of gas but the gas formed with hydrogen is very volatile and have little molecules, after some tests on standard engines the same result is that gas is lost trought piston rings and valves if send normally trought manifold inlet. For that more companies like BMW was oriented to create direct injection of hydrogen in chambre of combustion. And you have to consider other important point, water gas interact a lot with metals parts inside engine, for that, to peoples orientend to use that gas, I suggest treatment of ceramization of cylinder, head of piston and chambre of combustion. However my studies are oriented to the creation of new molecular mixture that can be used normally inside standard engines. In part is the same concept of Meyer. If you analyze injector you found that in fact is an compact WFC minicell. Air treatment with GP, as previously written, is necessary to start the chain reaction for obtain thermal explosive energy. But method explained from h2opower for me isn't correct .. you have to anaylize the words " thermal explosive energy".. For h2opower only oxygen ionized and destabilized is necessary, mixed with water fog, to create thermal explosive energy.. For that I suggest to all peoples to demand an video that prove that first to spent other moneys for an doubt project."

Just read that,

I have the best oil additive in the world - the only undersurface lubricant
known to man - I'm not worried about wear and tear with water or
anything.

Anyway, "Air treatment with GP, as previously written, is necessary to start the chain reaction for obtain thermal explosive energy."

Yes! That is what I'm saying... ok, so you're using the GP to simply ionize
the air - or maybe not so simple.

So with HHO + ionized air = my preference is the plasma spark ignition.

With a lawnmower test Peter and I did, we started to move to steam
injection and we could advance timing.

Anyway, what is your opinion on the combination of hho and ionized air?

Are you ducting the ionized air before or after the carburetor butterfly?
I don't know if it makes a difference because when in the chamber under
compression, I'm guessing it would be homogenized.

Aaron,

Please appreciate that Tutanka, as well as myself and another member of this forum, are under heavy NDA obligation, thus we are not at liberty to shed as much light on this topic as we'd like to.

You cover several tenets in your quest for information, on some you are correct, on some you are way off the mark.

This lubricating oil you mention, I can assure you it's not the magic panacea, for it only coats the substrate metals at the molecular level, thus is not the suitable protectant you seem to think it is. What, you don't think we don't use the best "metal conditioner" too?

This type of metal conditioner, while great, cannot alleviate all of the problems associated with metal to metal friction points once the lubricant is contaminated with water.

The answer is, do not let a reaction occur within the combustion chamber which causes this problem to occur, full stop.

Look for another way of delivering the "fuel", one which does not have that particular type of hydrogen separated from the other molecules apparent in the combustion chamber at the time of compression.

Introducing that particular type of hydrogen into any combustion chamber will bring on this water in the lube issue, as a large portion of it will always escape the seal between the piston and bore, unless certain steps are taken to thwart the problem from occurring from the outset, by that I mean, you can only deliver that type of hydrogen a certain way.

Tutanka has worked long and hard at addressing this issue, though I'm certain his achievements will not attract the acclaim they so duly deserve. Not right now anyway.

H20power seems to think he has Meyers tech sussed out completely. I can assure you he does not, and all of the sheep following him are in for one rude failure after another, should they attempt to proceed without accepting a few plain facts.

Meyer seeded his disclosures with ample false trails, thus if any follower chose the wrong trail, they were assuredly destined for failure. For some strange arrogant reason, H20power seems to think he's the only one to understand the principals of what Meyer was messing around with, and he also seems to feel that he has the right to crucify anyone with views at variance/odds to his.

Tutanka tried to impart this most significant point to H20power, yet was ridiculed and made to look like the fool on every occasion, even to the most recent post made by the H20power.

Blatant ignorance and bullheadedness on behalf of H20power has literally sown the seeds of his own failure, as history will show, that is, if he ever gets to the point of testing anything.

I tried to tell H20power that a simple language barrier was mostly to blame for his not understanding the sage words of Tutanka at that time, but alas, he did choose to ignore this advice, as did many others, to their detriment it seems.

Tutanka is no fool, as history will soon show. I've certainly never met a more tenacious and determined individual in all of my days. It's a true pleasure to work with this man.

I should add, there is another member of this forum working with us behind the scenes, and as much as I'd like to disclose his identity, the NDA prohibits me doing so. This other fellow is a master of his trade, thus his input has been immensely helpful as he's been able to turn simple ideas into reality with his advanced machining skills.

Aaron, you mention plasma, well, I am not at liberty to give over much detail, as I'm sure you can appreciate, but I can say this, plasma is a part of it, a big part in fact.

It's apparent that nobody else is quite as advanced as we are in this concept, thus it's pure folly for us to disclose any more details at this time.

Aaron, please feel free to PM me if you seek more info.

Can you also please delete the Tutanka thread now. It serves no valid purpose.

[Cherryman]

(Edit off topic)

[Tecstatic]

Aaron,

Please appreciate that Tutanka, as well as myself and another member of this forum, are under heavy NDA obligation, thus we are not at liberty to shed as much light on this topic as we'd like to.

You cover several tenets in your quest for information, on some you are correct, on some you are way off the mark.

This lubricating oil you mention, I can assure you it's not the magic panacea, for it only coats the substrate metals at the molecular level, thus is not the suitable protectant you seem to think it is. What, you don't think we don't use the best "metal conditioner" too?

This type of metal conditioner, while great, cannot alleviate all of the problems associated with metal to metal friction points once the lubricant is contaminated with water.

The answer is, do not let a reaction occur within the combustion chamber which causes this problem to occur, full stop.

Look for another way of delivering the "fuel", one which does not have that particular type of hydrogen separated from the other molecules apparent in the combustion chamber at the time of compression.

Introducing that particular type of hydrogen into any combustion chamber will bring on this water in the lube issue, as a large portion of it will always escape the seal between the piston and bore, unless certain steps are taken to thwart the problem from occurring from the outset, by that I mean, you can only deliver that type of hydrogen a certain way.

Tutanka has worked long and hard at addressing this issue, though I'm certain his achievements will not attract the acclaim they so duly deserve. Not right now anyway.

H20power seems to think he has Meyers tech sussed out completely. I can assure you he does not, and all of the sheep following him are in for one rude failure after another, should they attempt to proceed without accepting a few plain facts.

Meyer seeded his disclosures with ample false trails, thus if any follower chose the wrong trail, they were assuredly destined for failure. For some strange arrogant reason, H20power seems to think he's the only one to understand the principals of what Meyer was messing around with, and he also seems to feel that he has the right to crucify anyone with views at variance/odds to his.

Tutanka tried to impart this most significant point to H20power, yet was ridiculed and made to look like the fool on every occasion, even to the most recent post made by the H20power.

Blatant ignorance and bullheadedness on behalf of H20power has literally sown the seeds of his own failure, as history will show, that is, if he ever gets to the point of testing anything.

I tried to tell H20power that a simple language barrier was mostly to blame for his not understanding the sage words of Tutanka at that time, but alas, he did choose to ignore this advice, as did many others, to their detriment it seems.

Tutanka is no fool, as history will soon show. I've certainly never met a more tenacious and determined individual in all of my days. It's a true pleasure to work with this man.

I should add, there is another member of this forum working with us behind the scenes, and as much as I'd like to disclose his identity, the NDA prohibits me doing so. This other fellow is a master of his trade, thus his input has been immensely helpful as he's been able to turn simple ideas into reality with his advanced machining skills.

Aaron, you mention plasma, well, I am not at liberty to give over much detail, as I'm sure you can appreciate, but I can say this, plasma is a part of it, a big part in fact.

It's apparent that nobody else is quite as advanced as we are in this concept, thus it's pure folly for us to disclose any more details at this time.

Aaron, please feel free to PM me if you seek more info.

Can you also please delete the Tutanka thread now. It serves no valid purpose.

I disagree, this thread should not be deleted IMO.

It is perfectly OK to disagree with the method or direction to achieve the goals in this forum. IMO it is also OK to post that opinion once or twice.

But when it becomes numerous posts, they become distractions to the subject of a thread.

Those who apparently knows better should start their own thread, present their theories AND their working prototypes.

@Aaron
Thank you for making this illustrative example.

Then they will get all the audience they may want.

h20power said:
"At this point in the game I want to finish what I have started so if I fail I can learn from my mistakes."

H20power may be right, he may be wrong. But he has the right to work for his idea without numerous discouraging posts. I also think others has the right to help without being characterized as sheep.

What I see is a hard working person trying to do constructive work. I see a few others trying to help, but needing help with some basic electronics.

And more electronic skill would be helpful. If we all had the skills of DrStiffler, our goal was reached now.

I have no problem to use some hours to help. If this makes me a sheep, let it be. But please avoid such characterizations in the future, to me it is disrespectful.

But this thread should not be deleted. Let it stand as a monument over how much help can be expected from some members posting lots of advice in i.e. the thread h20power started. No one mentioned, no one forgotten.

Please note I have made no statement about your skills, the potential value of your work, and whether you are on the track to success or not.

Eric