Ionization & Water Fuel

[tutanka]

Aaron,
How much gas is dissolved in water? It's a very minute amount of the total gas that can be produce from that water Aaron and the higher the temps the less gases can be dissolved in water( the use of the Steam Resonator is to heat up the water remember?). That was a good try to say that Nitrogen is in the system of the Hydrogen Gas Gun, but you need to look up the solubility table of gases in aqueous solutions. There is a reason why you have to keep a soda pop cold. But this goes to show my point in that this is more of a lack of understanding of basic scientific principles, like for example; the solubility of gases in water, than anything else.

Listen I will leave you and the NDA team alone, I just wanted everyone to see with there own eyes that Meyers systems didn't have nitrogen in them. For even the one with the rocket retrofits has two tanks hooked up to the system, one full of oxygen and the other full of hydrogen, there is no third tank full of nitrogen in that system. Again this is for everyone else reading this thread to digest on their own. As you start to look at the work of Stanley Meyer see it for what it is and at first give the patent a real try before jumping ship. I work at my own pace and for most that pace is too slow for them. But the way I see it we all have are own work to do, but unlike this thread at the end of the ride you will get slapped with a NDA for results, and from my side you will get everything freely given to you with no strings attached. You can easily go ahead of me as I have a fixed budget to work from since I have already given the math and science that goes along with it. The controlling circuit was the last part that needed to be worked out so now that it done testing can begin. Remember to use the methods of science with your work so others can duplicate you findings as you pass on the freedom of energy independence to your fellow man. Take care and God Bless everyone for now it is a question of choice, and the final way you choose to go is totally up to you


h2opower.

H2OPOWER,
What is the sense to write words again?? Don't have sense if not to read you what you have written. You don't want consider that gas processor use air and that nitrogen is present inside in more quantities and that react, MAYBE NOT WITH PHOTONS, but surely with HV fields present inside. Maybe you live in an strange planet called H2OPLANET and only oxygen is present here but we live on an planet called Earth and here our ambient air contain 78% nitrogen and 21% oxygen.. and when enter in an strange tube nitrogen isn't cancelled magically.

[Aaron]

Hydrogen Gas Gun used Nitrogen

That was a good try to say that Nitrogen is in the system of the Hydrogen Gas Gun

I just wanted everyone to see with there own eyes that Meyers systems didn't have nitrogen in them.

I showed EXACTLY what Meyer is showing and doing in those patent
excerpts. People can see that with their own eyes and you tell them to see
something different.

Below is a HYDROGEN GAS GUN and in this patent, STAN MEYER says
the combustible mixture has AMBIENT AIR GASSES and he also goes on
to state that the AMBIENT AIR makes the combustion controllable.

Even if Meyer had at some point a system that didn't utilize nitrogen,
it is irrelevant. You're making it seem like it invalidates EVERY patent
that he clearly demonstrates mixing nitrogen with the mix and recycling
the exhaust. You think about that clearly and be intellectually honest
about it. Even this gas gun, which shows only water going into the inlet
in the visual diagram...the text reveals that nitrogen IS part of the process
whether you want to believe it or not.

You are telling people to see something about Meyer's patents that is NOT
true in the least bit, I'm showing it clearly with Meyer's own patents,
verbiage and visual diagrams all together. You cannot argue this and you
cannot tell people that see this that in fact, "nitrogen isn't part of the
process." You can hold up 4 fingers and tell me to see 5, but I guarantee
you that I'm going to see 4 and will tell you that I see 4, period.

Feel free to discount the nitrogen in your own Meyer thread. You obviously
disagree with the nitrogen concept as you have so clearly spelled out and
there is nothing else you can post in this thread that will explain that any
more so for the record, we can agree to disagree - as I leave this evidence
in Meyer's own words/diagrams/patents...

Just because the diagram doesn't show the nitrogen does NOT mean it
isn't there.

[Aaron]

Nitrogen Is Important

I will delete any further posts dismissing the NITROGEN importance in
the water fuel systems.

I am now suspicious of anyone going out of their way to try to convince
anyone that nitrogen is a waste of time or that it is not a part of Meyer's
process.

I posted the FACTS from Meyer's own patents, diagrams and text showing
that not only is nitrogen important, NITROGEN IS RESPONSIBLE FOR
CONTROLLING THE COMBUSTION PROCESS. It is in the gas gun system,
it is in his burners, it is in just about every patent I have read on Meyer.

If anyone is in doubt, look at the excerpts I posted. Nitrogen is an important
part of Meyer's system, period, end of story. This "nothing to see here folks"
mentality does not sit well with me and I have no tolerance for it or any
attempt at side tracking this thread with misinformation and misdirection.

Anyone can get the patents that I excerpted and get the full patent and
read it for your own eyes to see that what I have posted about Meyer's
patents and the nitrogen involvement is 100% ABSOLUTELY TRUE and
anything that is claimed contrary to that truth is 100% ABSOLUTELY FALSE.

It is a common sense exercise in logic.

In this thread, from this point on, discounting nitrogen here will not be
tolerated. Go post in other threads that support a non-nitrogen involved
process. Period, end of story.

[sebosfato]

Nitrogen is involved for sure but believe is not as important as the energy source. Nitrogen is in the air an in one or other way will react inside combustion chamber but without extra energy you can't excite the n2 or 02 or h2 because the energy you put in is less than or = to the energy will come out. I know it seems thermodynamic law conservative argumentation but is true. _Stan didn't broke any law. For Sure! while still doing his device works.


What to understand is in the following sequence and is easier to absorb if you think in this way:

1° of all Resonance Principle
why resonance, what is resonance?
2° energy source depends on the 1°
where the energy come from, how to transform it and make it work?
3° excite the gas depends on the 1° and 2°
How to raise the energy output per combustible volume?
4° mix with the retardant gas to have a fuel stable
how to have a stable fuel mixture for comparable to gasoline type of burn.

[tutanka]

Nitrogen is involved for sure but believe is not as important as the energy source. Nitrogen is in the air an in one or other way will react inside combustion chamber but without extra energy you can't excite the n2 or 02 or h2 because the energy you put in is less than or = to the energy will come out. I know it seems thermodynamic law conservative argumentation but is true. _Stan didn't broke any law. For Sure! while still doing his device works.


What to understand is in the following sequence and is easier to absorb if you think in this way:

1° of all Resonance Principle
why resonance, what is resonance?
2° energy source depends on the 1°
where the energy come from, how to transform it and make it work?
3° excite the gas depends on the 1° and 2°
How to raise the energy output per combustible volume?
4° mix with the retardant gas to have a fuel stable
how to have a stable fuel mixture for comparable to gasoline type of burn.

Sebosfato,
Read better the thread.. is explained.. however air processor is the unit that don't create only neutral ions (positive/negative) but also oxygen and nitrogen atomic.. Lord Reyleigh from tests have found when nitrogen is tranformed into active nitrogen or atomic nitrogen that condition is mantain for hours without energy source.. that help a lot us.. you need to use an plastic material low cost for transport ionized/atomic gases, that help a lot to retard change of state.. Meyer in fact mix new nitrogen molecule with hydrogen and oxygen for obtain thermal explosive energy

[everwiser]

To those not accepting nitrogen as important...

Please allow the discussion to continue without bogging it down. Some of us want to see where this leads without the distractions.

"Failure is merely a detour off of a dead end street..."

Thanks!

[Aaron]

express mail and patent app

Does anyone have or can anyone find a Stanley Meyer patent Application
#835,564 March 03, 1986?

This patent US4826581 references it and there are other references.

The Object of Invention of US4826581 says: "Electrically charged gas ions
of opposite electrical polarity are activated By Express Mail No. 26224690
on August 5, 1987 by electromagnetic wave energy and exposed to a high
temperature thermal zone."

What is this express mail deal?

Column 3, rows 35-45 or so in US4826581 says:
"Water molecules are broken down into hydrogen, oxygen and released
entrapped gas components by an electrical disassociation process and
apparatus such as shown in my co-pending application Ser. No. 835,564,
filed, March 3, 1986, which is incorporated herein by reference. The
released atomic gases and other gas components formerly trapped as
dissolved gases in water may be introduced to a successive stage..."

[Aaron]

One Minde's post

One Minde, I'm copying your post over here - I have to reread it to see
the details but it discusses ionization and the reactions needing nitrogen.

Thank you Aaron.
You have my support.

This is what I wrote some time back about the process. I am actually breaking a rule here by posting in this tread, don't expect me to do that many times ove rin teh future.

"If you look at the classical capacitor used in the WFC, he have borrowed some of the technology from that one and modified it slightly.

The first stage is that he ionizes ambient air, and this ambient air becomes positively charged – he removes electrons. He also uses returned water from the prior combustion as part of non-combustible gases, and this non-combustible gases contains N2 + H2O and maybe NO2 (but this must be measured). The combustion creates stable molecules.

Water + ionized gases + non-combustible gases is injected into the injector under pressur (125psi). There are nozzles in the injector, prior to the high voltage zone (plasma zone). The ejected water becomes only microns in size and will react quicly. The fine mist of water + ionized gases + non-combustible gases enters this high voltage field (strong electromagnetic field) and gets polarized and the electrons either get plucked off or elongated into an orbit further away (partiel ionization), and shortly there after or almost at the same time the ionized air also gets ejected inot this electromagnetic field. The ionized gas is starving since it have less electrons then it wants so it now pluck the “free” electron from hydrogen and the positive oxygen then becomes negatively charged or stable. This is a reaction where there is a creation of; atomic oxygen O+ + O- + H+ + H- + H2O + N2 is the reaction. But mostly atomic oxygen & atomic hydrogen + water + nitrogen is the reaction, there will be % of the other (ions) left over.

Whit this you create an unstable gas (molecules is in gas stages) and this highly unstable gas is energy rich (it have high energy potential). He mixes this highly potential gas with water so that the burn time is reduced. The ionized gas can only react as long as you have positive ions, when you have reached a stet where the positive ions is stable as atomic oxygen, it no longer reacts whit the water and ionize it, so only % of the reaction produces atomic fuel – the rest is ordinary water + nitrogen, and the water and nitrogen. The fuel is atomic gases which he mixes whit the water and nitrogen to slow the burn time, but the untreated water will be rapidly heated from compression and combustion phase and will also act as steam to aid in the combustion stroke since it expands when piston reduce the atmospheric pressure inside the combustion chamber.

There is a possibility that OH will form in % also, but this is difficult to calculate since everything will be in %, but surly, atomic oxygen & hydrogen + water + nitrogen IS the reaction."

NOW, go check that canadian patent on the injectors one more time - there you will see why Meyer ionized the oxygen...
__________________
- You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete -

[sebosfato]

Can you please than explain to me how can you ionize the n2 or generate your activated nitrogen without inputing energy?

I mean we all might have understood that in the world of physics for an action there is a reaction and vice versa. This is called thermodynamics principle.

Basically what i'm saying is that it doesn't matter if you use 30kv or 100kv the amount of ions generated will depend on the current. Faradays law.

ionization is quite the same thing of electrolysis, high voltage is needed to overcome the minimum potential to allow the current to flow.

Have you heard about ionization current or ion current on ionizers man?

I mean for example if you need at least 55 amps to electrolyze 1 mole of wATER, you would need to extract 55 amps of electrons to ionize 1 mole of any gas, lets say to take of 2 electrons per atom.

So again how do you explain this? I can understand if it is only a kind of acceleration of the gas in the fields but ionization i think not.

Thats also why i disagree with h20power on ionization.

Conceptually if you check what i'm saying is what theory says.

The ionization potential of a gas is the energy required to take apart electrons of its orbits. And = the energy it will release if the electrons recombine into the atom.

Accelerating the gas would just need the fields magnetic or electric and would seem to be more related with what are you saying....

Sorry if i don't drink that explanation that easy...

Best Regards my friend

[Aaron]

open systems

Sebosfato,

Chemical reactions violate the thermodynamics all the time. You are talking
about closed system equilibrium thermodynamics, they're irrelevant here.
Water is full of energy and it requires a small input to properly leverage
it. We do NOT have to pay for all the potential energy that is just sitting
there in water, it is free from nature. We only pay for the key that opens
the lock and lets it out.

All over 1.0 COP systems are clearly permissible by non-equilibrium
thermodynamics, which all violate conventional thermodynamics.

Many chemical reactions involve non-equilibrium reactions that are not
explainable by conventional thermodynamics.

Chemistry 1977
Ilya Prigogine - Nobel Lecture

"This process of development attained something of a conclusion in the early years of the present century, and thermodynamics began to be regarded as a branch of science whose evolution was essentially complete. However, it was subject to certain limitations. For the most part it could only deal with reversible processes, that is, processes occurring via states of equilibrium. Even an irreversible system as simple as the thermocouple, with its simultaneous conduction of heat and electricity, could not be satisfactorily treated until Onsager developed the reciprocity relations which earned him the 1968 Nobel Prize for Chemistry.

The reciprocity relations were a great step forward in the development of a thermodynamics of irreversible processes, but they presupposed a linear approximation. which can only be employed relatively close to equilibrium. Prigogine's great contribution lies in his successful development of a satisfactory theory of non-linear thermodynamics in states which are far removed from equilibrium. In doing so he has discovered phenomena and structures of completely new and completely unexpected types, with the result that this generalized, nonlinear and irreversible thermodynamics has already been given surprising applications in a wide variety of fields.


Prigogine has been particularly captivated by the problem of explaining how ordered structures - biological systems, for example - can develop from disorder. Even if Onsager's relations are utilized, the classical principles of equilibrium in thermodynamics still show that linear systems close to equilibrium always develop into states of disorder which are stable to perturbations and cannot explain the occurrence of ordered structures."

[h20power]

One Minde, I'm copying your post over here - I have to reread it to see
the details but it discusses ionization and the reactions needing nitrogen.

Thank you Aaron.
You have my support.

This is what I wrote some time back about the process. I am actually breaking a rule here by posting in this tread, don't expect me to do that many times ove rin teh future.

"If you look at the classical capacitor used in the WFC, he have borrowed some of the technology from that one and modified it slightly.

The first stage is that he ionizes ambient air, and this ambient air becomes positively charged – he removes electrons. He also uses returned water from the prior combustion as part of non-combustible gases, and this non-combustible gases contains N2 + H2O and maybe NO2 (but this must be measured). The combustion creates stable molecules.

Water + ionized gases + non-combustible gases is injected into the injector under pressur (125psi). There are nozzles in the injector, prior to the high voltage zone (plasma zone). The ejected water becomes only microns in size and will react quicly. The fine mist of water + ionized gases + non-combustible gases enters this high voltage field (strong electromagnetic field) and gets polarized and the electrons either get plucked off or elongated into an orbit further away (partiel ionization), and shortly there after or almost at the same time the ionized air also gets ejected inot this electromagnetic field. The ionized gas is starving since it have less electrons then it wants so it now pluck the “free” electron from hydrogen and the positive oxygen then becomes negatively charged or stable. This is a reaction where there is a creation of; atomic oxygen O+ + O- + H+ + H- + H2O + N2 is the reaction. But mostly atomic oxygen & atomic hydrogen + water + nitrogen is the reaction, there will be % of the other (ions) left over.

Whit this you create an unstable gas (molecules is in gas stages) and this highly unstable gas is energy rich (it have high energy potential). He mixes this highly potential gas with water so that the burn time is reduced. The ionized gas can only react as long as you have positive ions, when you have reached a stet where the positive ions is stable as atomic oxygen, it no longer reacts whit the water and ionize it, so only % of the reaction produces atomic fuel – the rest is ordinary water + nitrogen, and the water and nitrogen. The fuel is atomic gases which he mixes whit the water and nitrogen to slow the burn time, but the untreated water will be rapidly heated from compression and combustion phase and will also act as steam to aid in the combustion stroke since it expands when piston reduce the atmospheric pressure inside the combustion chamber.

There is a possibility that OH will form in % also, but this is difficult to calculate since everything will be in %, but surly, atomic oxygen & hydrogen + water + nitrogen IS the reaction."

NOW, go check that canadian patent on the injectors one more time - there you will see why Meyer ionized the oxygen...
__________________
- You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete -

But the question was about the "Hydrogen Gas Gun."


h2opower

[Aaron]

afterglow and plastic pipe

Lord Reyleigh from tests have found when nitrogen is tranformed into active nitrogen or atomic nitrogen that condition is mantain for hours without energy source.. that help a lot us..

you need to use an plastic material low cost for transport ionized/atomic gases, that help a lot to retard change of state.. Meyer in fact mix new nitrogen molecule with hydrogen and oxygen for obtain thermal explosive energy

The nitrogen "afterglow" effect is interesting and is what I was searching
for over a long time for another application. Much of the scientific material
on it have different ideas of why it maintains the glow for such a long time
but it seems, they simply do not know.

I think in its excited state it is tapping vacuum energy - virtual photon
potential from the quantum flux in 3d time/space. That is the only place
it could get its potential to sustain that afterglow.

So the plastic material is dielectric to maintain charge so it doesn't lose
or gain anything from outside pipe?

[sucahyo]

That circuit generate unipolar voltage wave, is dated 1980. I think Meyer use similar of that.. use every an capacitor, in fact Plasma circuit is the next generation and is IMPORTANT part of system because wthout that you CAN'T generate THERMAL EXPLOSIVE ENERGY,in all case you don't need only N2+ + 2OH- = N(OH)2.
Is important understand that point, hydrogen CAN'T mix with air outside from engine as air/gasoline. However now peoples understand that Meyer don't want generate oxygen destabilized with gas processor but other electrochemical mixture

Thanks.

That answer my curiosity. I have think that in order to make an ionizer the device must be unipolar. Because I think a bipolar will also create electrolysis too. Since your previous processure is bipolar, I am about to ask you this . With this it is clear that we have to use unipolar positive and negative. This is another big clue . I have seen suggestion to use a needle or many needle to increase wave. Did you use needle too?

Keep up the good work .

But this goes to show my point in that this is more of a lack of understanding of basic scientific principles, like for example; the solubility of gases in water, than anything else.

Ostwald process - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

HNO3 is soluble on water, in fact, it usually stored as liquid, sold in % of HNO3 in water. As you can see, it consist of Hydrogen, Oxygen and Nitrogen.

NH3 too (Solubility in water 1176 g/100 mL (0 °C); 702 g/100 mL (20 °C); 88 g/100 mL (100 °C)). And NH3 is unavoidable reaction in a catalytic converter, so there must be NH3 gas on gas recycled back.

HNO3 can be created from air directly with Haber process + Ostwald process, so it is possible to be done with HV/LED/UV/Heat applied to ambient air.

Below is a HYDROGEN GAS GUN and in this patent, STAN MEYER says the combustible mixture has AMBIENT AIR GASSES and he also goes on to state that the AMBIENT AIR makes the combustion controllable.

If Stanley Meyer Refer to a molecule consist of all that, then HNO3 is suitable. It is a "combustible "mixture".

The mention of storing it in water make me more convince that it is HNO3.

Can you please than explain to me how can you ionize the n2 or generate your activated nitrogen without inputing energy?

I think HV and microwave plasma that Tutanka mention is input energy. I think Tutanka do not use ionizer to electrolize water. So electrolysis rule do not apply. See the reaction from the wiki link I post above, what needed is heat and pressure. And I think HV proof to help it considerably that pressure is not required much. And heat and pressure specified in the reaction are for 95% result, which may not required for engine, because too much can make a disaster....


I think plasma plug is needed because in wiki HNO3 is not flammable (Flash point Non-flammable) although explosive (Being a powerful oxidizing agent, nitric acid reacts violently with many organic materials and the reactions may be explosive.). But NH3 do (Flash point flammable gas; Autoignition
temperature 651 °C; Explosive limits 15–28%)


copy paste from other thread:
Ammonia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Haber process - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Melting point: −77.73 °C (195.42 K)
Boiling point: −33.34 °C (239.81 K)
Solubility in water: 1176 g/100 mL (0 °C); 702 g/100 mL (20 °C); 88 g/100 mL (100 °C)
Flash point: flammable gas
Autoignition temperature: 651 °C
Explosive limits: 15–28%

Ammonia does not burn readily or sustain combustion, except under narrow fuel-to-air mixtures of 15-25% air. When mixed with oxygen, it burns with a pale yellowish-green flame. At high temperature and in the presence of a suitable catalyst, ammonia is decomposed into its constituent elements. Ignition occurs when chlorine is passed into ammonia, forming nitrogen and hydrogen chloride; if ammonia is present in excess, then the highly explosive nitrogen trichloride (NCl3) is also formed.

The ammonia molecule readily undergoes nitrogen inversion at room temperature; a useful analogy is an umbrella turning itself inside out in a strong wind. The energy barrier to this inversion is 24.7 kJ/mol, and the resonance frequency is 23.79 GHz, corresponding to microwave radiation of a wavelength of 1.260 cm (0 in). The absorption at this frequency was the first microwave spectrum to be observed.[17]

Combustion
The combustion of ammonia to nitrogen and water is exothermic:
4 NH3 + 3 O2 → 2 N2 + 6 H2O (g) (ΔHºr = –1267.20 kJ/mol)

The standard enthalpy change of combustion, ΔHºc, expressed per mole of ammonia and with condensation of the water formed, is –382.81 kJ/mol. Dinitrogen is the thermodynamic product of combustion: all nitrogen oxides are unstable with respect to nitrogen and oxygen, which is the principle behind the catalytic converter. However, nitrogen oxides can be formed as kinetic products in the presence of appropriate catalysts, a reaction of great industrial importance in the production of nitric acid:
4 NH3 + 5 O2 → 4 NO + 6 H2O

The combustion of ammonia in air is very difficult in the absence of a catalyst (such as platinum gauze), as the temperature of the flame is usually lower than the ignition temperature of the ammonia-air mixture. The flammable range of ammonia in air is 16–25%.[19]

As a fuel
Ammonia was used during World War II to power buses in Belgium, and in engine and solar energy applications prior to 1900. Liquid ammonia was used as the fuel of the rocket airplane, the X-15. Although not as powerful as other fuels, it left no soot in the reusable rocket engine and its density approximately matches the density of the oxidizer, liquid oxygen, which simplified the aircraft's design.

Before the start of World War I, most ammonia was obtained by the dry distillation[14] of nitrogenous vegetable and animal waste products, including camel dung, where it was distilled by the reduction of nitrous acid and nitrites with hydrogen; in addition, it was produced by the distillation of coal, and also by the decomposition of ammonium salts by alkaline hydroxides[15] such as quicklime, the salt most generally used being the chloride (sal-ammoniac)

Ammonia was first manufactured using the Haber process on an industrial scale in 1913 in BASF's Oppau plant in Germany. During World War I, production was shifted from fertilizer to explosives, particularly through the conversion of ammonia into a synthetic form of Chile saltpeter, which could then be changed into other substances for the production of gunpowder and high explosives (the Allies had access to large amounts of saltpeter from natural guano deposits in Chile that belonged almost totally to British industrials; Germany had to produce its own). It has been suggested that without this process, Germany would not have fought in the war,[6] or would have had to surrender years earlier.

As a vehicle fuel
Ammonia has been proposed as a practical alternative to fossil fuel for internal combustion engines.[41] The calorific value of ammonia is 22.5 MJ/kg (9690 BTU/lb) which is about half that of diesel. In a normal engine, in which the water vapour is not condensed, the calorific value of ammonia will be about 21% less than this figure. It can be used in existing engines with only minor modifications to carburettors/injectors.

To meet these demands, significant capital would be required to increase present production levels. Although the second most produced chemical, the scale of ammonia production is a small fraction of world petroleum usage. It could be manufactured from renewable energy sources, as well as coal or nuclear power. It is however significantly less efficient than batteries. The 60 MW Rjukan dam in Telemark, Norway produced ammonia via electrolysis of water for many years from 1913 producing fertilizer for much of Europe. If produced from coal, the CO2 can be readily sequestrated.[41][42] (the combustion products are nitrogen and water). In 1981 a Canadian company converted a 1981 Chevrolet Impala to operate using ammonia as fuel.[43][44]


Prior to the advent of cheap natural gas, hydrogen as a precursor to ammonia production was produced via the electrolysis of water or using the chloralkali process. The Vemork 60 MW hydroelectric plant in Norway, constructed in 1911, was used purely for plants using the Birkeland-Eyde process.

Despite the fact that 78.1% of the air we breathe is nitrogen, the gas is relatively unreactive because nitrogen molecules are held together by strong triple bonds. It was not until the early 20th century that this method was developed to harness the atmospheric abundance of nitrogen to create ammonia, which can then be oxidized to make the nitrates and nitrites essential for the production of nitrate fertilizer and explosives.

The first Haber–Bosch reaction chambers used osmium and uranium as catalysts. However, under Bosch's direction in 1909, the BASF researcher Alwin Mittasch discovered a much less expensive iron-based catalyst that is still used today.

In industrial practice, the iron catalyst is prepared by exposing a mass of magnetite, an iron oxide, to the hot hydrogen feedstock. This reduces some of the magnetite to metallic iron, removing oxygen in the process. However, the catalyst maintains most of its bulk volume during the reduction, and so the result is a highly porous material whose large surface area aids its effectiveness as a catalyst. Other minor components of the catalyst include calcium and aluminium oxides, which support the porous iron catalyst and help it maintain its surface area over time, and potassium, which increases the electron density of the catalyst and so improves its activity.

I think catalyst and air mixture is also important if the gas is NH3.

I think NH3 should be the goal, maybe deserve a new thread but let see the result of italian team first.

BTW, I feel like I repeating someone else word, someone that claim to have understood it. Sorry that I forget your name and where you post them.........

[Aaron]

nitrogen hydroxide

Nitrogen and Oxygen | TutorVista

"Nitrogen obtained from air contains traces of oxygen. To remove these, the nitrogen so obtained is passed over heated copper turnings when copper reacts with oxygen to form CuO."

I'm not implying get rid of oxygen.

But passing ambient air over heated copper helps to strip oxygen from
nitrogen - I guess this is useful only if we're trying to separate nitrogen
from oxygen, which doesn't seem to be a concern... just interesting nitrogen
info.

It is true that nitrogen normally isn't very soluable in water.

"Nitrogen gas is very sparingly soluble (almost insoluble) in water: 23 mL per litre of water at 0°C and 1 atm pressure."

However:

" Sir Humphry Davy in 1907 found that nitrogen will bond to electrolytic hydrogen in the presence of water when normal hydrogen won’t."

Nitrogen has the ability to bond to hydrogen directly in a wfc (electrolytic hydrogen)

It seems that whether it is bubbled in the bottom of the cell or simply added to warm
moisture leaving the cell, it will make Nitrogen Hydroxide.

[Aaron]

other points to consider?

Here are some items that may need to be considered in addition to the
things I posted in the document...

Meyer had the injectors at 125psi or something like that. Perhaps this
Nitrogen Hydroxide needs to be pressurized to the intake?

The polarity of ignition has to be considered. Not sure if there is a difference
if it is positive grounded or negative grounded.

Maybe the engine needs to be warmed up with gasoline first then switch
over to the N(OH)2. Otherwise it will be starting the engine cold on this
water fuel and heat is supposed to be crucial to the reaction.