Stanley Meyer tec devices test and debugging suite

[Tecstatic]

Thanks

Now please make the mods in post # 1382

Then do the mods in my previous post, use RV7 to adjust to the center frequency.

Then you should see:

1. The pulse train at U4 pin 13
2. steady logic "0" at U8 pin 4
3. no light in D6

And this should be maintained, even though you dial RV7.

Please replace R15 to 4K7, and connect to U7 pin 11 instead of U8 pin 4.
Now D6 should indicate locked OK.

Eric

[Tecstatic]

Sorry, sorry

MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 4, being the only connection to U4 pin 4

Should have been

MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9

I must double check next time.

[bussi04]

Sorry, sorry

MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 4, being the only connection to U4 pin 4

Should have been

MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9

I must double check next time.

U8 pin 5 reconnected to U8 pin 6
Pin 2 of RV7 connected to VCC
U2 in circuit again
Set center frequency to 5600 hz
R15 = 4.7 KOhm
R15 cut off from U8 pin 4 and connected to U7 pin 11
C10 = 500 nF
C10 connected to pin3 of U6B
R14 = 100 KOhm
C11 = 30 nF
D5 in series with Resistor 1 KOhm
Inserted Resistor 1 KOhm between C11 and pin5/6 of U8
Added capacitor 100 nF between pin 14 (VCC) and pin 7 (GND) of U6
MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9

answer to Q1417#1:
U4 pin 4 152 kHz at duty 50% 5V SS
U4 pin 3 4764 hz duty 50% 4V SS
D6 on
U4 pin 5 (INH) constant 0V
U4 pin 2 5V SS rectangular
U4 pin1 5V SS variable frequency around 4763 hz duty 90%
U4 pin9 2 V with spikes down to 0.6V at around 4400 hz
u4 pin13 1.6V with rectangular rise to 5V duty 15%
u4 pin14 4764 hz duty 50% 4V SS rectangular
u4 pin16 VCC no spikes
u4 pin7 GND short spikes 0.4V SS

sorry for the delay, I had to repeat the measurement for pin 9.

[Tecstatic]

U8 pin 5 reconnected to U8 pin 6
Pin 2 of RV7 connected to VCC
U2 in circuit again
Set center frequency to 5600 hz
R15 = 4.7 KOhm
R15 cut off from U8 pin 4 and connected to U7 pin 11
C10 = 500 nF
C10 connected to pin3 of U6B
R14 = 100 KOhm
C11 = 30 nF
D5 in series with Resistor 1 KOhm
Inserted Resistor 1 KOhm between C11 and pin5/6 of U8
Added capacitor 100 nF between pin 14 (VCC) and pin 7 (GND) of U6
MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9

answer to Q1417#1:
U4 pin 4 152 kHz at duty 50% 5V SS
U4 pin 3 4764 hz duty 50% 4V SS
D6 on
U4 pin 5 (INH) constant 0V
U4 pin 2 5V SS rectangular
U4 pin1 5V SS variable frequency around 4763 hz duty 90%
U4 pin9 2 V with spikes down to 0.6V at around 4400 hz
u4 pin13 1.6V with rectangular rise to 5V duty 15%
u4 pin14 4764 hz duty 50% 4V SS rectangular
u4 pin16 VCC no spikes
u4 pin7 GND short spikes 0.4V SS

sorry for the delay, I had to repeat the measurement for pin 9.

Thanks,

I just realized that we use phase comparator 2 output to feed R12+13, C10.

Q1421#1: By SS do you mean Steady State ?

MOD 1421#1 Please make fixed resistors R12=400Kohm (or 390Kohm), R13=10kohm, C10=10nF Or what you need to make it work, but R13=10kohm is mandatory.
When running we should see a stable voltage on C10 near 2.5V with less than 20mV ripple assuming the center frequency is set right.

MOD 1421#2 Connect R12 to U4 pin 2 instead of U4 pin 13.

[bussi04]

Thanks,

I just realized that we use phase comparator 2 output to feed R12+13, C10.

Q1421#1: By SS do you mean Steady State ?
...

U8 pin 5 reconnected to U8 pin 6
Pin 2 of RV7 connected to VCC
U2 in circuit again
Set center frequency to 5600 hz
R15 = 4.7 KOhm
R15 cut off from U8 pin 4 and connected to U7 pin 11
C10 = 500 nF
C10 connected to pin3 of U6B
R14 = 100 KOhm
C11 = 30 nF
D5 in series with Resistor 1 KOhm
Inserted Resistor 1 KOhm between C11 and pin5/6 of U8
Added capacitor 100 nF between pin 14 (VCC) and pin 7 (GND) of U6
MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9

answer to Q1421#1: No SS = pp = peak to peak (lowes voltage to highest voltage)

now I do MOD1421

[bussi04]

Thanks,

I just realized that we use phase comparator 2 output to feed R12+13, C10.

Q1421#1: By SS do you mean Steady State ?

MOD 1421#1 Please make fixed resistors R12=400Kohm (or 390Kohm), R13=10kohm, C10=10nF Or what you need to make it work, but R13=10kohm is mandatory.
When running we should see a stable voltage on C10 near 2.5V with less than 20mV ripple assuming the center frequency is set right.

MOD 1421#2 Connect R12 to U4 pin 2 instead of U4 pin 13.

U8 pin 5 reconnected to U8 pin 6
Pin 2 of RV7 connected to VCC
U2 in circuit again
Set center frequency to 5600 hz
R15 = 4.7 KOhm
R15 cut off from U8 pin 4 and connected to U7 pin 11
C10 connected to pin3 of U6B
R14 = 100 KOhm
C11 = 30 nF
D5 in series with Resistor 1 KOhm
Inserted Resistor 1 KOhm between C11 and pin5/6 of U8
Added capacitor 100 nF between pin 14 (VCC) and pin 7 (GND) of U6
MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9
MOD 1421#1 R12=pot 390Kohm, R13=10kohm, C10= 10 nF - done
MOD 1421#2 Connect R12 to U4 pin 2 instead of U4 pin 13 – done
RV7 tuned to 2.5V - center frequency = 4600 hz

Answer to MOD1421#1: Voltage at C10 = 1.3V with 50mV ripple

[Tecstatic]

"Answer to MOD1421#1: Voltage at C10 = 1.3V with 50mV ripple"

At what frequency ?

Definition of the PhaseLockedLoop "locked" condition:

1. Phase difference between U4 pin14 and 3 are close to zero all the time.
2. C10 voltage is a DC voltage with low ripple voltage.
3. Frequency at U4 pin 4 is stable close to the "resonance" frequency of the tank circuit.
4. U4 pin 1 pulsing at VCO frequency, so D6 is on.

Q1425#1 Do you have the lock condition now. ?

[bussi04]

Addition to MOD1421#1

U8 pin 5 reconnected to U8 pin 6
Pin 2 of RV7 connected to VCC
U2 in circuit again
Set center frequency to 5600 hz
R15 = 4.7 KOhm
R15 cut off from U8 pin 4 and connected to U7 pin 11
C10 connected to pin3 of U6B
R14 = 100 KOhm
C11 = 30 nF
D5 in series with Resistor 1 KOhm
Inserted Resistor 1 KOhm between C11 and pin5/6 of U8
Added capacitor 100 nF between pin 14 (VCC) and pin 7 (GND) of U6
MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9
MOD 1421#1 R12=pot 390Kohm, R13=10kohm, C10= 10 nF - done
MOD 1421#2 Connect R12 to U4 pin 2 instead of U4 pin 13 – done
RV7 tuned to 2.5V - center frequency = 4600 hz

Answer to MOD1421#1: Voltage at C10 = 1.3V with 50mV ripple

addition at point C10-R13 the voltage is 2.5V with positive spikes up to 3.8V max at the falling edge of U4 pin3

[Tecstatic]

Hi Bussi.

I think we are quite close now.

May I suggest you take a copy of your project directory with diagram version 0.5.

In the diagram, rename the version to SM test 0.1 and make the diagram up to date, as I suspect my picture of the PCB you have is not right, especially around the R12, R13, C10 connections.

Then we can empty the MOD log when you have posted me the diagram only. You can delete .net and .brd from the project zip file to reduce the size.

Eric

[bussi04]

"Answer to MOD1421#1: Voltage at C10 = 1.3V with 50mV ripple"

At what frequency ?

Definition of the PhaseLockedLoop "locked" condition:

1. Phase difference between U4 pin14 and 3 are close to zero all the time.
2. C10 voltage is a DC voltage with low ripple voltage.
3. Frequency at U4 pin 4 is stable close to the "resonance" frequency of the tank circuit.
4. U4 pin 1 pulsing at VCO frequency, so D6 is on.

Q1425#1 Do you have the lock condition now. ?

U8 pin 5 reconnected to U8 pin 6
Pin 2 of RV7 connected to VCC
U2 in circuit again
Set center frequency to 5600 hz
R15 = 4.7 KOhm
R15 cut off from U8 pin 4 and connected to U7 pin 11
C10 connected to pin3 of U6B
R14 = 100 KOhm
C11 = 30 nF
D5 in series with Resistor 1 KOhm
Inserted Resistor 1 KOhm between C11 and pin5/6 of U8
Added capacitor 100 nF between pin 14 (VCC) and pin 7 (GND) of U6
MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9
MOD 1421#1 R12=pot 125Kohm (or 390Kohm), R13=10kohm, C10=500pF actually changed to 10 nF - done
When running we should see a stable voltage on C10 near 2.5V with less than 20mV ripple assuming the center frequency is set right.

MOD 1421#2 Connect R12 to U4 pin 2 instead of U4 pin 13 – done

At what frequency ?
Answer to MOD1421#1: Voltage at C10 = 1.3V with 0.5mV ripple at 4471 hz

Definition of the PhaseLockedLoop "locked" condition:

1. Phase difference between U4 pin14 and 3 are close to zero all the time – No, it turns after power on to 4492 hz, no change while turning RV7, but phase shift 0 would be at 6300 hz
2. C10 voltage is a DC voltage with low ripple voltage - yes
3. Frequency at U4 pin 4 is stable close to the "resonance" frequency of the tank circuit – yes if resonance frequency is 4600 hz and not 5600 hz as assumed yesterday due to primary/secondary resonance difference
4. U4 pin 1 pulsing at VCO frequency, so D6 is on – no U4 pin 1 pulsing at reduced frequency at Q5 of CD4024.

Answer to Q1425#1 Do you have the lock condition now. ? – not sure, but can´t change frequency using RV 7

[bussi04]

maybe we got it!

U8 pin 5 reconnected to U8 pin 6
Pin 2 of RV7 connected to VCC
U2 in circuit again
Set center frequency to 5600 hz
R15 = 4.7 KOhm
R15 cut off from U8 pin 4 and connected to U7 pin 11
C10 connected to pin3 of U6B
R14 = 100 KOhm
C11 = 30 nF
D5 in series with Resistor 1 KOhm
Inserted Resistor 1 KOhm between C11 and pin5/6 of U8
Added capacitor 100 nF between pin 14 (VCC) and pin 7 (GND) of U6
MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9
MOD 1421#1 R12=pot 125Kohm (or 390Kohm), R13=10kohm, C10=500pF actually changed to 10 nF - done
When running we should see a stable voltage on C10 near 2.5V with less than 20mV ripple assuming the center frequency is set right.

MOD 1421#2 Connect R12 to U4 pin 2 instead of U4 pin 13 – done

MOD1428#1: swap of feedback wires of tank circuit at P3-P4

OBS1428#1: phase shift 0, no reaction to turning RV7, D7 on

Let´s make another test to get sure!

[Tecstatic]

Lets have an updated diagram before we proceed. See my previous post (remember preview and scroll down before submitting a post as a time saver).

Do you have some spare 4046 ?

[bussi04]

lock in at 6600 hz

U8 pin 5 reconnected to U8 pin 6
Pin 2 of RV7 connected to VCC
U2 in circuit again
Set center frequency to 5600 hz
R15 = 4.7 KOhm
R15 cut off from U8 pin 4 and connected to U7 pin 11
C10 connected to pin3 of U6B
R14 = 100 KOhm
C11 = 30 nF
D5 in series with Resistor 1 KOhm
Inserted Resistor 1 KOhm between C11 and pin5/6 of U8
Added capacitor 100 nF between pin 14 (VCC) and pin 7 (GND) of U6
MOD 1415#1: Connect the wire going to U6 pin 3 to U4 pin 9, being the only connection to U4 pin 9
MOD 1421#1 R12=pot 125Kohm (or 390Kohm), R13=10kohm, C10=500pF actually changed to 10 nF - done
When running we should see a stable voltage on C10 near 2.5V with less than 20mV ripple assuming the center frequency is set right.

MOD 1421#2 Connect R12 to U4 pin 2 instead of U4 pin 13 – done

MOD1428#1: swap of feedback wires of tank circuit at P3-P4

OBS1428#2: lock in frequency 6600 hz

I repeat test suite of Q1425#1.

[bussi04]

Lets have an updated diagram before we proceed. See my previous post (remember preview and scroll down before submitting a post as a time saver).

Do you have some spare 4046 ?

yes, I have 2 more 4046 from Texas Instruments and one HEF4046.

Now I do the update of the scheme.

[Tecstatic]

From what I have seen so far, I think VIC replicators should take a look and get an understanding of what Armagdn03 shows in the oldest 5 videos.

Without that knowledge the PLL IC 4046 will IMO be a tough master to conquer.

Thanks Andrew for these very instructive videos:

YouTube - tortuga0303's Channel

Energy Propagation
Ressonant rise of Parallel LC (3)
Introduction to resonance
Resonance cont
pulse

Eric